[Build Log] Mini-ITX PC - Middle School

[DonkeyOatie]

I would get the cheaper i3. They will all perform basically the same.

Body part amputation is an important one. I wish they made car parts body part amputation proof. I have had some close calls there :lol:

I have no personal experience there, so I rely on the specs and benchmarks and my experiences elsewhere, The benchmarks show a 20% advantage for the hD4600. However, I respect your views tiny voices, so I drilled down further. One of my (many) annoying habits is the reluctance to follow opinion without evidence. I discovered that the HD4400 benchmark was done with a ULV 15W CPU, so the turbo boost was completely nerfed. So, if I were building this today, I'd be using the i3 4150. It costs 0.02 more than the 4130 for an extra 100Mhz of clock; definitely two cents worth.

Like many other parts here, I would be buying the cheapest best at the time, and taking advantage of any deals. Given a choice, I would aim to keep the price point at $400 without OS and make things a little better rather than drop the cost more.

 

[zeyuanfu]

I would get the cheaper i3. They will all perform basically the same.

Body part amputation is an important one. I wish they made car parts body part amputation proof. I have had some close calls there :lol:

OP said he/she wanted to game on the integrated graphics, and the 4330 has HD 4600, if I`m not mistaken.
It also has 1 MB more cache, but I don`t really know if it helps you get more frames in Minecraft

 

[Novuake]

I would get the cheaper i3. They will all perform basically the same.

Body part amputation is an important one. I wish they made car parts body part amputation proof. I have had some close calls there :lol:

OP said he/she wanted to game on the integrated graphics, and the 4330 has HD 4600, if I`m not mistaken.
It also has 1 MB more cache, but I don`t really know if it helps you get more frames in Minecraft

It does not, as I have mentioned, RAM and CPU clock rate are the major factors in Minecraft.

A Core2Quad + 8GB of RAM @ 3GHz performs almiost just as well as a Core I3 at 3GHz with 8GB of RAM.

Better graphics also has no effect on minecraft. Unless you move from integrated to dedicated VRAM, then there is a slight improvement in minimum FPS, not really that significant though

 

[zeyuanfu]

Actually, no. I can play Minecraft with a few mods at 30-40 FPS with 2 GB of DDR2 RAM and a crap 2007-2010 laptop CPU...
The 4330 will probably get 60-70 FPS as it has better graphics.
It's like playing Watch_Dogs with either a 270X and a 290.

 

[Novuake]

Actually, no. I can play Minecraft with a few mods at 30-40 FPS with 2 GB of DDR2 RAM and a crap 2007-2010 laptop CPU...
The 4330 will probably get 60-70 FPS as it has better graphics.
It's like playing Watch_Dogs with either a 270X and a 290.

I do not think you understand what I am trying to say :
Boils down to :

Better graphics does not help minecraft. I can run it on my integrated HD4000 I5 3570K at pretty much the same graphics and FPS as I can with my dual HD7950s( or one of them, since minecraft does not play well with Crossfire)

More cache does not help minecraft.

RAM does impact minecraft.
CPU clockrate does impact minecraft.

And yes, a laptop CPU has lower clock rate while the I3 has a decently higher clock. (the 4130 is already significant) So it WILL perform better, but not because of better integrated graphics.

 

[tiny voices]

Actually, no. I can play Minecraft with a few mods at 30-40 FPS with 2 GB of DDR2 RAM and a crap 2007-2010 laptop CPU...
The 4330 will probably get 60-70 FPS as it has better graphics.
It's like playing Watch_Dogs with either a 270X and a 290.

I do not think you understand what I am trying to say :
Boils down to :

Better graphics does not help minecraft. I can run it on my integrated HD4000 I5 3570K at pretty much the same graphics and FPS as I can with my dual HD7950s( or one of them, since minecraft does not play well with Crossfire)

More cache does not help minecraft.

RAM does impact minecraft.
CPU clockrate does impact minecraft.

And yes, a laptop CPU has lower clock rate while the I3 has a decently higher clock. (the 4130 is already significant) So it WILL perform better, but not because of better integrated graphics.

100% agree. The difference between my 660ti SLI in MC and the Integrated graphics (hd4000) is only like 10-20fps, but my overclock from 3.4 to 4.5ghz gets me 30-40fps no matter what graphics I'm using.

You can't forget that MC is nothing more than a Java runtime environment. What does java care about? Clock speed and RAM speed. Ram speed less so, but still will make some difference.

 

[Novuake]

You actually get yours happy with an overclock, when I run it I need to remove my overclock completely. It just refuses to run for any length of time.

And yes, my OC is completely stable in every other situation. 😀

 

[tiny voices]

I had some issues with it as well. I was at 4.8ghz completely stable in everything, but MC crashes with anything over 4.5, so that is where I stay now.

 

[Novuake]

I had some issues with it as well. I was at 4.8ghz completely stable in everything, but MC crashes with anything over 4.5, so that is where I stay now.

Hmmm guess I will try the same, since an overclock helps me a lot in Guild Wars 2(my most played game) and restarting and changing profiles just to run MC has made me less prone to actually play the game.

 

[tiny voices]

Oh man, GW2. The worst coded game in recent history. :lol:

Usually overclocking is regarded as a hobby and doesn't yield and noticeable performance.....but no in GW2. Lol

 

[Novuake]

Oh man, GW2. The worst coded game in recent history. :lol:

Usually overclocking is regarded as a hobby and doesn't yield and noticeable performance.....but no in GW2. Lol

Haha tell me about it. Stock 3570K vs 4.7GHz means the difference between 20something(sometimes dipping below 20FPS) FPS and 40something FPS when running around in a 150 man zerg in World v World.

So yeah, that overclock is significant.

But it seems we are diverting this thread. Back on track... Although the OP is not very worried about discussing random stuff.

 

[DonkeyOatie]

No, I'm not worried much. I've noticed on this board fewer discussion threads than I'm used to (moderating an international fantasy board, before health issues knocked me out), so I'm good with constructive discussion and I think this whole 'what environment works with what CPU' and visa versa is a good thing and we've shared useful information.

I guess I'll sort of moderate the thread to nudge things on track. It's my plan, when this build is complete, to copy out all the relevant stuff and make a new thread with only that, for general information, and keep this thread for more discussion of my student's builds, if I can ever get them to do something but talk big.

I have a non-functional Dell tower from school that we will take apart and see if we can identify the failed component(s)

 

[zeyuanfu]

Actually, no. I can play Minecraft with a few mods at 30-40 FPS with 2 GB of DDR2 RAM and a crap 2007-2010 laptop CPU...
The 4330 will probably get 60-70 FPS as it has better graphics.
It's like playing Watch_Dogs with either a 270X and a 290.

I do not think you understand what I am trying to say :
Boils down to :

Better graphics does not help minecraft. I can run it on my integrated HD4000 I5 3570K at pretty much the same graphics and FPS as I can with my dual HD7950s( or one of them, since minecraft does not play well with Crossfire)

More cache does not help minecraft.

RAM does impact minecraft.
CPU clockrate does impact minecraft.

And yes, a laptop CPU has lower clock rate while the I3 has a decently higher clock. (the 4130 is already significant) So it WILL perform better, but not because of better integrated graphics.

100% agree. The difference between my 660ti SLI in MC and the Integrated graphics (hd4000) is only like 10-20fps, but my overclock from 3.4 to 4.5ghz gets me 30-40fps no matter what graphics I'm using.

You can't forget that MC is nothing more than a Java runtime environment. What does java care about? Clock speed and RAM speed. Ram speed less so, but still will make some difference.

Oh, forgot Minecraft was just a Java program...

 

[tiny voices]

Yep, just a simple Java runtime script. This is why making mods is SO easy.

well....until Microsoft ruins the game.

 

[zeyuanfu]

Yeah, I've heard talks about Microsoft making it:
1, Only for PC (that'll considerably boost Windows sales)
2, Maybe in C++ or not open-source

Apparently, C++ runs faster than Java...

 

[tiny voices]

If they change it to C++ the game will die. People will not play it as it will have no user mod support. They are most certainly not making it Pc only. They have stated many times they are making it more mobile and console friendly.

I have spoken with with my group of MC friends which includes Jeb and the general consensus is that the game is pretty much dead if microsoft changes anything past the 1.8 update. Everyone just hopes they leave it alone and mess with mobile and Console stuff without changing the PC game. Even if it never gets another update and we play 1.8 forever, that will be better than them changing the game.

 

[zeyuanfu]

Oh, wouldn't a 1.9 version be better?

 

[tiny voices]

No because it will be made by microsoft and everyone fears that it will be garbage.

You need to remember that even though Mojang still makes minecraft, all the members quit and now mojang is made up of MS employees. Minecraft will NEVER be the same game unfortunately.

 

[zeyuanfu]

Ohh., I get it...
It's funny how after OP said that his/her students were playing Minecraft, we started a discussion about Microsoft

 

[DonkeyOatie]

Doesn't everything come down to a discussion of Microsoft in the end? 🙁

 

[zeyuanfu]

Yeah, they are the makers of Windows...

Need any more help?

 

[DonkeyOatie]

Not at the moment. But on Monday, we put the CPU and cooler on the Motherboard.......................................

It was an excellent discussion about Minecraft though.

 

[Novuake]

Not at the moment. But on Monday, we put the CPU and cooler on the Motherboard.......................................

It was an excellent discussion about Minecraft though.

Haha always a pleasure.

Frustratingly addictive game, often don't sleep and go to work hellishly tired because of it.

 

[zeyuanfu]

It's especially fun if you mod it.

 

[DonkeyOatie]

Addictive to my students. I've never even looked at it.