Build Advice Building a new mid-range PC ?

[r3dshift]

Hello lads,

I am finally considering getting building a new PC after almost 10 years. I don't play games that often any more, but when I do, I want them to run stable at 1080p@60Hz (that's what my current display [DELL U2311H] supports, and I do not intend to replace it yet) on max. settings. Other that that, the only power-hungry app I use is Lightroom. I will move up to 1440p@120Hz in the future when the current monitor goes tits up, but this is currently irrelevant.

I have two candidate configurations; my first question is whether the EUR 250 extra is worth it in case of the second rig:

1)
Gigabyte A520M S2H
AMD Ryzen 5 5600X
G.Skill Aegis 16 GB 3000MHz DDR4
512GB ADATA m.2 SSD
Chieftec Smart GPS 700W
MSI GeForce RTX 4060 Ventus Black 8GB OC
Zalman N5 OF case

(Should I also need a CPU cooler, or will the stock suffice?)

2)
Gigabyte B450 AORUS Elite V2
AMD Ryzen 7 5700X or 5800X
Be quiet! Pure Rock 2 cooler
Corsair Vengeance 2x16GB 3000MHz DDR4
MSI GeForce RTX 4060 Ventus Black 8GB OC
1TB WD Blue m.2
Seasonic Focus GX 750W
AeroCool Aero One Eclipse case

Basically, I am aiming for a (top) mid-range AMD AM4 platform. Now, I am completely out of the loop when it comes to current hardware, so I would like some advice.

What mobo should I choose? I do not need anything fancy (I think the one in config 2 above is overkill), not even Bluetooth or wifi. I need 4-6 USB ports, and m.2 compatibility, of course. I prefer Gigabyte, as I have had no problems with this brand so far.

GPU: I was initially considering the RTX 3060 because of the 192 bit bus and 12 GB VRAM, but having read up on the two GPUs, it seems to me that the 4060 actually performs a bit better despite it sporting only 8 GB VRAM, plus it features DLSS 3 and frame generation. And both cards are virtually at the same price, so why not go for the newer hardware.

PSU: I want something reliable and quiet. I suppose anything around 650 Watts will do, right? Any recommended brands, please? Also, a modular design would be nice if it is not absurdly more expensive than the regular cable setup.


The above are pre-built rigs, but any component can be swapped out for a myriad of others to end up with a custom PC. I could not care less about brands, but I want to avoid any that are problematic. I want to remain around the EUR 1000 price range.

Additional requirements: I want the PC to run cool and silent. This is partly why I am inclined to go for the AeroCool case.

Any input would be appreciated, cheers!

 

[thestryker]

You don't want either of those motherboards with that GPU because they'll only do PCIe 3.0, and the GPU is PCIe 4.0, but the important part being it has cut down lanes which makes revision matter, so if looking at AM5 you'd want a B550 based motherboard.

The memory for Zen 3 CPUs really needs to be 3600 to maximize CPU performance and the minor price premium should be well worth it.

Generally speaking an inexpensive tower cooler will be enough of an improvement to make it worthwhile to get something other than the stock cooler.

GPU wise the only reason to go with the 3060 over 4060 would be if something you were doing used the extra VRAM but that's the only reason.

If you're looking at longevity I think spending the extra money to get an AM5 system with a decent motherboard is likely a better choice than buying AM4 at this point. You'll potentially have upgrade options, but you'll also have much better overall hardware support going forward if you plan on keeping the system for a long time.

Without knowing where you'd be buying from/what country you're in it's pretty hard to make specific component recommendations given how weird regional pricing can be.

 

[r3dshift]

Cheers for your reply. I am located in HU, and will be getting the hardware from here. Please, do not worry about regional pricing, just feel free to post your recommendations, and I will work out the rest. If you – or anyone else – could provide 2–3 options for mobos and PSUs, I should be able to find and buy at least one of them.

I wasn't really looking at AM5, as the last info I got (almost 2 years ago now, lol) is that it is not worth it in terms of price/performance, and was told that AM4 is actually way more economical.

Having now taken a quick look at the AM5 mobos, the only available ones are the A and B 620/650 types. And the CPUs are a LOT more expensive than the AM4 ones.

Regarding DDR4 RAM, I have just found 3600MHz ones, such as the Kingston FURY Beast 32GB. However, according to the CPU specifications, they only support RAMs up to 3200MHz...

 

[TeamRed2024]

I wasn't really looking at AM5, as the last info I got (almost 2 years ago now, lol) is that it is not worth it in terms of price/performance, and was told that AM4 is actually way more economical.

Having now taken a quick look at the AM5 mobos, the only available ones are the A and B 620/650 types. And the CPUs are a LOT more expensive than the AM4 ones.

They are also a lot better in terms of performance... and with AM5 you will have an upgrade path and DDR5 memory.

If you are on a super tight budget AM4 is the obvious choice... but otherwise it doesn't make much sense to go with a dead platform.

 

[r3dshift]

They are also a lot better in terms of performance... and with AM5 you will have an upgrade path and DDR5 memory.

If you are on a super tight budget AM4 is the obvious choice... but otherwise it doesn't make much sense to go with a dead platform.

I understand, but like I wrote above, I am not an avid gamer any more, so I see no point in getting a high-end system, especially at today's hardware prices. Buying an AM5 rig over an AM4 one would mean at least EUR 300 extra. The RAM and the CPU specifically cost double their AM4 counterparts. I am not willing to pay that much.

 

[TeamRed2024]

If you're looking at longevity I think spending the extra money to get an AM5 system with a decent motherboard is likely a better choice than buying AM4 at this point. You'll potentially have upgrade options, but you'll also have much better overall hardware support going forward if you plan on keeping the system for a long time.

Pretty much the point I was trying to make. EUR 300 extra would definitely be worth it for me for the upgrade options and hardware support down the road... but to each their own.

 

[TeamRed2024]

I do not even want to switch to Win 11. I sometimes use Win 10, but only if I have to, as it is a crap OS compared to 7. And 11 is the crappiest of them all.

Ok... now I get it. Good luck with that AM4 W7 build.

 

[thestryker]

Windows 7 is not a viable choice for even AM4 so if you don't want to move up to 10/11 or go Linux don't bother building a new system. Look for something used that might actually support it properly I believe the last Intel to natively support 7 was 6th generation.

If you're going to accept the reality of moving on from an ancient operating system you shouldn't be using here's a couple of builds I put together using PCPartPicker:

AM5:
PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor (80490.00Ft @ Alza)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Freezer 36 CPU Cooler (12690.00Ft @ Alza)
Motherboard: ASRock B650M-HDV/M.2 Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard (51690.00Ft @ Alza)
Memory: G.Skill Flare X5 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL30 Memory (47590.00Ft @ Alza)
Storage: Crucial P3 Plus 500 GB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (16390.00Ft @ Alza)
Video Card: Gainward Python II GeForce RTX 4060 8 GB Video Card (119490.00Ft @ Alza)
Case: Montech AIR 1000 LITE ATX Mid Tower Case (23090.00Ft @ Alza)
Power Supply: Cooler Master MWE GOLD 750 V2 FULL MODULAR 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (42690.00Ft @ Alza)
Total: 394120.00Ft
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2024-09-02 01:06 CEST+0200

AM4:
PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 5800X 3.8 GHz 8-Core Processor (64090.00Ft @ Alza)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Freezer 36 CPU Cooler (12690.00Ft @ Alza)
Motherboard: Gigabyte B550M DS3H Micro ATX AM4 Motherboard (35990.00Ft @ Alza)
Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws V 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3600 CL16 Memory (37590.00Ft @ Alza)
Storage: Crucial P3 Plus 500 GB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (16390.00Ft @ Alza)
Video Card: Gainward Python II GeForce RTX 4060 8 GB Video Card (119490.00Ft @ Alza)
Case: Montech AIR 1000 LITE ATX Mid Tower Case (23090.00Ft @ Alza)
Power Supply: Cooler Master MWE GOLD 750 V2 FULL MODULAR 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (42690.00Ft @ Alza)
Total: 352020.00Ft
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2024-09-02 00:56 CEST+0200

I basically made choices designed to optimize cost without sacrificing too much quality wise since that seemed to be most important to you. In the case of the AM5 setup the 7600 will be faster than the 5800X in everything but workloads that maximize thread usage, but even in that case it won't be much slower.

 

[r3dshift]

I don't quite understand why some of you got the notion that I wanna install Win7 on the new rig. Of course not, I never said that, I'm not an idiot.

@thestryker: thanks a lot for your recommended setups, I will take a thorough look tomorrow. Despite what the link above says, though, the (AM5) Ryzen 5 7600 has 6 cores, not 8.

 

[Lucky_SLS]

If you go 8600G, it can be even cheaper. Swapped for a better mobo and PSU:

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 8600G 4.3 GHz 6-Core Processor (48390.00Ft @ Alza)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Freezer 36 CO CPU Cooler (11990.00Ft @ Alza)
Motherboard: Gigabyte B650 EAGLE AX ATX AM5 Motherboard (64990.00Ft @ Alza)
Memory: G.Skill Flare X5 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL30 Memory (47590.00Ft @ Alza)
Storage: Crucial P3 Plus 500 GB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (16390.00Ft @ Alza)
Video Card: Gainward Python II GeForce RTX 4060 8 GB Video Card (113490.00Ft @ Alza)
Case: Deepcool CC560 V2 ATX Mid Tower Case (20190.00Ft @ Alza)
Power Supply: ADATA XPG Core Reactor II 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (41990.00Ft @ Alza)
Total: 365020.00Ft
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2024-09-02 22:14 CEST+0200

 

[r3dshift]

Cheers!

Why is the Ryzen 5 8600G so cheap, though? Compared to other AM5 CPUs. Is it vastly inferior to those?

I know google is my friend (not...), but I do not have time to dig into the topic and read up on reviews.

 

[thestryker]

Half the L3 cache, has PCIe 4.0 instead of 5.0 (not particularly important), has fewer PCIe lanes (slightly important because you're limited to 8 lanes, but irrelevant for chosen video card) and slower than the regular counterparts. The only thing you really gain (aside from lower price) is better integrated graphics.

https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/cpus/amd-ryzen-5-8600g-cpu-review

 

[r3dshift]

Cheers!

So, in general, the "G" in the designation of AMD CPUs stands for "(integrated) graphics", then?

 

[thestryker]

Cheers!

So, in general, the "G" in the designation of AMD CPUs stands for "(integrated) graphics", then?

Yeah the G Zen SKUs originally were to signify graphics because their desktop CPUs didn't have integrated graphics at all. They kept the naming scheme after the Zen 4 launch where all of the CPUs have integrated graphics (F SKUs do not). These CPUs are referred to as APUs as they're mobile chips repurposed for the desktop platforms.

 

[r3dshift]

Two more questions:

1) Is it better to get 2x16GB RAM instead of a single 32GB stick? If so, why? Is it only because if one stick fails, you are still lfet with at least half the RAM? Or is it the dual channel capability that matters?

2) Isn't a 750W PSU overkill in my case? I mean, PC parts picker predicted a total consumption of 400+ Watts. I should think 600–650W should be more than sufficient. Apart from one of the configs above, I will put in a SATA-III SSD and HDD, and that's it.

 

[thestryker]

1) Is it better to get 2x16GB RAM instead of a single 32GB stick? If so, why? Is it only because if one stick fails, you are still lfet with at least half the RAM? Or is it the dual channel capability that matters?

Yes it's better because of dual channel mode allowing the memory bus to run 128-bit instead of 64-bit providing double the memory bandwidth.

2) Isn't a 750W PSU overkill in my case? I mean, PC parts picker predicted a total consumption of 400+ Watts. I should think 600–650W should be more than sufficient. Apart from one of the configs above, I will put in a SATA-III SSD and HDD, and that's it.

Unfortunately lower wattage power supplies are becoming fewer and far between which makes a lot of them either poor quality or poor value. If you can find a good 650W PSU it'd definitely be fine, but when I was looking there was nothing that fit the bill of being decent quality and price in that wattage.

 

[r3dshift]

Which are the more or less reliable PSU manufacturers these days? And should I really aim for 80+ Gold certificate?

 

[thestryker]

Unfortunately PSU manufacturers all have good and bad models so there isn't a solid answer. My last 4 PSUs have been EVGA/Seasonic and I'd suggest Seasonic, but their good/current ones carry price premiums. The 80+ ratings by themselves don't necessarily means a whole lot, but most worthwhile PSUs are gold rated.

Hardware Busters is my favorite current PSU review site: https://hwbusters.com/best_picks/best-atxv3-pcie5-ready-psus-picks-hardware-busters/

Not a perfect list by any means, but their A and B are solid recommendations: https://cultists.network/140/psu-tier-list/

 

[r3dshift]

Thank you so much for all the helpful info!

 

[r3dshift]

Update: I've decided to bite the bullet and go for an AM5 system. This is what I've come up with; although it slightly exceeds my initial budget of EUR 1000, I am satisifed with it on paper. Any thoughts/advice?

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600X (100-100000593WOF)
CPU cooler: Be quiet! Pure Rock 2 Silver (BK006)
Mobo: GIGABYTE B650M S2H
RAM: G.Skill Flare X5 2x16GB 6000MHz DDR5 (F5-6000J3636F16GX2-FX5)
VGA: GIGABYTE RTX 4060 Windforce OC 8G 8GB GDDR6 (GV-N4060WF2OC-8GD)
SSD: Western Digital Blue 1TB SN580 M.2 NVMe (WDS100T3B0E)
PSU: Seasonic G12 GC 650W ATX (G12-GC-650)
Case: ZALMAN N5 OF

 

[Lucky_SLS]

Update: I've decided to bite the bullet and go for an AM5 system. This is what I've come up with; although it slightly exceeds my initial budget of EUR 1000, I am satisifed with it on paper. Any thoughts/advice?

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600X (100-100000593WOF)
CPU cooler: Be quiet! Pure Rock 2 Silver (BK006)
Mobo: GIGABYTE B650M S2H
RAM: G.Skill Flare X5 2x16GB 6000MHz DDR5 (F5-6000J3636F16GX2-FX5)
VGA: GIGABYTE RTX 4060 Windforce OC 8G 8GB GDDR6 (GV-N4060WF2OC-8GD)
SSD: Western Digital Blue 1TB SN580 M.2 NVMe (WDS100T3B0E)
PSU: Seasonic G12 GC 650W ATX (G12-GC-650)
Case: ZALMAN N5 OF

You need to fine tune your build a bit more:

You can go Ryzen 7600 with its included cooler, if its is cheaper, and skip the air cooler.

The ram you chose is CL36 kit. You need CL30 for ryzen.

I would go for a bit higher tier mobo. Like the Aorus elite, Asus Tuf plus or Asrock riptide. The model i have suggested have 12 phase VRM design and decent I/O ports.

The SSD you have chosen does not have a DRAM cache, meaning if it gets to 75% capacity the drive will become slow. Look for good model here :
https://www.tomshardware.com/features/ssd-benchmarks-hierarchy

The PSU chosen is a very old design, it is mediocre at best now. @thestryker shared HWbuster's list above. Choose a 750/850 W PSU from that list.

 

[r3dshift]

Will the non-X 7600 CPU be cool enough with the default cooler, though?

Why do I need CL30 RAM?

Mobo: what is VRM and why do I need it? I don't want any extra fluff on my board. BTW, the models you suggested above are 1.5x – 2x more expensive than what I chose, so that's a hard pass.

PSU: I don't care if it's mediocre, it should do its job and preferably be quiet. 750 Watts is terrible overkill, not to mention 850.

By the way, I've opted for the Zalman I3 case, not the N5, as it has 4 fans installed by default, and room for a total of 7 if need be.

 

[thestryker]

Will the non-X 7600 CPU be cool enough with the default cooler, though?

The 7600 has a lower TDP which means less heat is being put out no matter what the temperature shows. The performance difference between it and the 7600X is tiny so the choice between them should be whichever is cheaper (you can use 65W Eco mode on the 7600X). The cooler you've selected is also rather old and not particularly competitive with newer options in the same price range.

Why do I need CL30 on the RAM?

lower latency = better CPU performance

Mobo: what is VRM D) and why do I need it? I don't want any extra fluff on my board.

Power delivery for the components and CPU. This is a place you do not want to cut corners on and a handful of low end boards do. This causes them to run very hot and potentially limit CPU performance. All of the motherboards previously linked do not have this problem.

PSU: I don't care if it's mediocre, it should do its job and preferably be quiet. 750 Watts is terrible overkill, not to mention 850.

You should care because it doesn't have a modern design with current power protections. It will likely also run hotter than a current PSU would as well. Cutting corners on a power supply is a great way to cause yourself problems down the road. You certainly don't need to buy something top of the line, but something with a modern design that is decent is the way to go even if that means higher capacity than you need.

 

[Lucky_SLS]

If the budget is tight, you can explore Intel i5 12400 and B660 DDR4 build.

The Intel 15th gen Bartlett lake will use LGA 1700, so the 15th gen CPUs should be compatible with your mobo if you update the BIOS.

 

[r3dshift]

I'll go for the "pedestrian" 7600 CPU, then. Any data on whether the stock cooler is sufficient?

I'll think about the RAM, thanks for the info. Same goes for the SSD, although I hardly ever go to the 25% free limit.

Mobo: I will consider this too, but once again, going for a better mobo as suggested above would strain the budget consderably, and I don't wanna get wound up in this loop. Edit: I've just read further back ,and the ASRock B650M-HDV m.2 is indeed affordable. I don't mind going for that, although I would have liked a Gigabyte mobo, as I've had nor problems with them ever, for over 25 years now.

PSU: the models on the list are not available in the store I'll be getting my rig from. Would this be a decent alternative: Seasonic Focus GX 750W PSU (FOCUS-GX-750) ?

I could link you the store website, but it's in HU only, so I don't presume you wanna bother.