CPU shown as engineering sample?

[amdfangirl]

Gee, imma make a bet that engineering samples must sell for heaps!

I mean like how cool is it to have an ES chip?

 

[Randomacts]

I have had to deal with this before. Generally I'm willing to give someone the real thing, but only if they are only going to work with our investigations department.

If you tell me you want a new processor but don't want to get involved, it's not going to go to far.

Working together?

Pffft

Your never going to win over the intel / nivida fanbois like this.

 

[amdfangirl]

Working together?

Pffft

Your never going to win over the intel / nivida fanbois like this.

Then again, you can't win over fanbois.

They'll support whatever they want.

 

[thefrenchie]

I have had to deal with this before. Generally I'm willing to give someone the real thing, but only if they are only going to work with our investigations department.

If you tell me you want a new processor but don't want to get involved, it's not going to go to far.

If I'm honest, I'd rather have something that's a bit more reliable because it keeps resetting itself. I know the multi is unlocked so it isn't just a glitch but the CPU flits between saying it's an ES then saying it isn't.
I bought the CPU from a legit site, namely ebuyer.com who are a big company in the UK.
Seeing as you work for AMD, what would be the best way to get someone to look into the problem?

 

[jf-amd]

Engineering samples are potentially older steppings that could have issues in them - which might be why the processor is resetting itself.

Shoot me a PM with your name, address, phone and email along with the OPN (product part number) and the serial number.

I will get that over to investigations and they will contact you.

I can't say for sure (because I only deal with server parts) but generally if you provide us with all of the relevant info (including the receipt) we will replace it with the same part, but a final production part that won't have that problem.

 

[jf-amd]

Gee, imma make a bet that engineering samples must sell for heaps!

I mean like how cool is it to have an ES chip?

well, if it has bugs in it that were fixed with spins of the silicon it would be worth little

 

[amdfangirl]

Well, through manufacturing, most products go through development cycles.

Take Firefox for example, 4.0 is currently in beta. One of the reasons they release the beta is so extension developers can write code for the next-gen browser, allowing for extensions on launch day. Obviously, these aren't considered to be stable for cilent/consumer use, but good enough for testing/coding purposes.

In a similar way, AMD sends samples of CPUs to companies so they can integrate them into systems, try them out or to write optimised code for their next-generation processors. However, like Mozilla's Firefox, all the kinks of the new product haven't been worked out.

You see processor revisions from time to time, much in the same way Mozilla patches Firefox (abeit with lesser frequency). Newer AMD CPU steppings in the Phenom I fixed the infamous TLB (albeit with performance deficit) as well as the C3 stepping for the Phenom II and advancements on the 45nm node allowed them to make a Phenom that originally ran with a 125W TDP with the previous C2 revision at 95W with the C3.

With the ES chip, often they use steppings from before production, so in the Phenom II's case it might have been the precursor to C2.

ES chips are valueable because AMD, unlike Mozilla tends not to give out ES/beta products out to customers. They're unique and hard to find. Kinda like a trophy.

JF-AMD correct me if I'm wrong... I probably am.

 

[jf-amd]

So, here's the "birds and the bees" of how silicon is born.

There is a first rev, that is referred to as "early silicon." That is internal only and typically only a few dozen parts. These never leave our labs. The expectation is that there will only be a few functional cores per die, some of the cache won't work, and the clock speed is really low. This basically lets you test the functionality of the design.

The next rev is called "proto" because these are the prototype parts. Protos should be fully functional (but sometimes might not) and these go through our labs and then get handed out to a few select (ie. big) OEMs who happen to have really good programs for crunching silicon (sometimes a second and third set of eyes helps you find things.)

The next spin of silicon is EVT for early validation testing. This is now several hundred parts. These go through a few weeks of test and then after we have a certain amount of coverage and feel good about the health, they go out to all of our major OEM partners, board partners, etc.

The next release is DVT for design verification testing. DVTs are in the thousands and are generally considered "production quality." DVT should be exactly like final silicon. If there is any change that happens, it is typically only a few gates and definitely only a single layer at that point. A multi-layer change would require another round of DVT parts.

Then, after all of the tests are completed and the silicon passes, it is declared production silicon and we are able to sell it. We cannot sell any pre-production silicon, so there is a marking on the lid.

Between each round there could be a layer change (respin).

Most products don't change between EVT and DVT; Istanbul basically nailed the design on the first round of silicon, which is why it launched much earlier than expected.

So, getting DVT silicon is like getting a final production product. But getting EVT silicon is generally bad because there could be something that caused another silicon respin.

Software partners generally get DVT parts. Compiler partners typically get EVT and DVT parts, but the procedure will vary with some products, so it is not a hard rule.

 

[amdfangirl]

How are steppings made?

This is awfully fascinating stuff.

 

[thefrenchie]

I'm learning a lot. I never really realised what went into making a CPU.

 

[jf-amd]

There are between 8 and 12 layers on most chips. A stepping is when the circuits change. A minor stepping is generally a single layer changing. A major stepping is multiple layers changing.

 

[jf-amd]

Everything I said is public. Please do not imply that I am sharing inside information.

 

[amdfangirl]

i understand a I didn't mean anything to imply illegal activity...
just being grateful for the info you have shared and stated in a jokingly manner, or so I thought.
my apologies..

He's trying to tell you that you're awesome, JF.

 

[jf-amd]

Amd is it true that there's about 60 percent of working dies on a single wafer?

We never talk about yields.

 

[amdfangirl]

Is that something to do with speculators and stock investors?

 

[jf-amd]

There is a list of things that I can't comment on. Obviously anything confidential. But you have to add to that anything about anyone at the company, any company rules/policies/internal info, financial info (even public financial info), market share, partners' relationships/prodducts, etc.

When the fabs were part of AMD it fell under company info and now that they are part of GlobalFoundries is is part of partner info.

Yields would allow the market to make determinations about both profit and inventory, and those are two areas I would rather not have people associating my name with statements.

 

[jimmysmitty]

^Smart man. Its always best to leave the people choosen to take the heat such as CEOs to that.

Either way yields would be interesting info but not one I would talk about if I worked at AMD or Intel either.

 

[c2roth]

I just turned on my PC and low and behold the New Hardware Wizard in Windows 7 has popped up trying to figure out some new hardware that has been attached to the PC. I know that there is nothing new so I am perplexed. The title of the hardware device was 'AMD Engineering Sample'. Given 5 minutes with Google I end up on this thread.

I used to have an AMD Athlon II X4 640 Propus and now System Properties says: "AMD Engineering Sample 3.00 GHz".

I fired up trusty old CPU-Z (v1.56) and it says "AMD Phenom II 00 TWKR".

(Disclaimer: AMD Cool 'n' Quiet was enabled, hence the low core clock)

(Above was taken after a reboot and I disabled Cool 'n' Quiet)

Do I have one of these: http://www.tomshardware.com/picturestory/510-amd-phenom-twkr.html ??? Or is something totally else going on here?

Background info: I purchased this CPU on October 25 2010 from NewEgg.ca and strangly enough when I received the package with the CPU, the tiny green AMD box that the CPU came in was already open. The AMD sticker was intact but the other side of the top flap had been cut.

 

[jf-amd]

My guess is that if it ia a twkr that somehow the tools don't know how to read the CPUID.

If you think you received a problem CPU, PM me and I can put you in touch with our corporate investigations.

We will need all the data including OPN and serial # (on the top of the CPU, not the box) and some other data including where you got it from.

 

[c2roth]

My guess is that if it ia a twkr that somehow the tools don't know how to read the CPUID.

If you think you received a problem CPU, PM me and I can put you in touch with our corporate investigations.

We will need all the data including OPN and serial # (on the top of the CPU, not the box) and some other data including where you got it from.

Thank you for responding JF. I am considering taking my PC apart to facilitate this but it does mean downtime for me. My aftermarket heatsink can only be removed from the back of the motherboard and I do not have a cutout in my motherboard tray. It would only take a few hours but finding the time can be tough.

I don't believe in any way that the CPU I have is or will be a problem CPU. It operates as I expect it to and the temperatures are fine (40c under load).

I will let you know what my intentions are shortly.

 

[Jon_47]

Funny thing this has also happened to me this evening My once x2 ghz cpu is now a AMD Engineering sample 1.6ghz.....had the same win 7 update trying to figure out the cpu.....mine was also bought from Ebuyer......dam thing also seems to have go on a go slow.....

 

[fatsoferret]

An engineering sample or ES can be a pretty big deal to places like AMD or Intel. They almost always have traceable serial numbers, as they are loaned out under very strict terms of use.

In the past Intel have been known to offer nice exchanges for the return of any ES. You may like to try contacting AMD to see if they can verify exactly what it is. If they confirm it IS indeed an ES, they will likely want it back, and id assume offer you any AMD chip of your choice in return.

As for Intel CPU's, they usually had 'ES' or 'Engineering sample' on the heat spreader... which kinda gives it away.

i have 2 P4 engi samples and they both say "INTEL CLASSIFIED" on them

 

[mhokett]

i just had this happen to me today. I have an athlon X3 455 Rana that i've had unlocked for over 6 months as an phenom x4 B55. It's never had any issues until today. I bought the processor from newegg and the bax was sealed and showed as a 455rana. When i started teh computer today the drivers "updated" to show "AMD Engineering sample" just like c2roth's example above. Has anyone determined the cause of this and what the solution might be?