EQ2: Tradeskill economy being nerfed

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

The current patch message on the Test server says:


> - Four new crafting abilities have been discovered: apothecary,
> weaving, timbercraft, and geomancy. These skills allow all
> artisans to refine the materials and components needed to make
> final products. New recipe books can be found on merchants or
> scattered throughout Norrath which teach you how to use these
> skills. Artisans automatically gain 5 points per level in these
> skills.


In other words, they are giving up on the idea of interdependence
within the game's tradeskill economy: that sages in order to make
spell scrolls need components that are made by alchemists, and so
forth. Every tradeskilling class will now be able to make all its
own ingredients.

So the in-game economy goes from 3-dimensional to 2-dimensional,
and hence becomes much less interesting. I suppose players must
have complained that interdependence made successful tradeskilling
too dependent on other players. What a shame! EQ2's tradeskill
economy was developing in ways that promised real lasting
playvalue, but...oh well.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"Paul Botts" <pauldotbotts@gmailspamthis.dotcom> wrote in message
news:00ZOd.6002$hU7.4849@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...
> The current patch message on the Test server says:
>
>
> > - Four new crafting abilities have been discovered: apothecary,
> > weaving, timbercraft, and geomancy. These skills allow all
> > artisans to refine the materials and components needed to make
> > final products. New recipe books can be found on merchants or
> > scattered throughout Norrath which teach you how to use these
> > skills. Artisans automatically gain 5 points per level in these
> > skills.
>
>
> In other words, they are giving up on the idea of interdependence within
> the game's tradeskill economy: that sages in order to make spell scrolls
> need components that are made by alchemists, and so forth. Every
> tradeskilling class will now be able to make all its own ingredients.
>
> So the in-game economy goes from 3-dimensional to 2-dimensional, and hence
> becomes much less interesting. I suppose players must have complained that
> interdependence made successful tradeskilling too dependent on other
> players. What a shame! EQ2's tradeskill economy was developing in ways
> that promised real lasting playvalue, but...oh well.

The problem stems from not being able to purchase the needed components
(when you need them) for any amount of money. I know, you can bother other
players, friends or not, bug them to make the stuff so you can buy it. But
the more casual player does not want to go through all that.

This does not mean that the market for these components has changed much.
Many will still rather purchase the stuff than take the time to make it.

BTW, I do no tradeskills at all, ever, absolutely no time. However, I do
sell the stuff off for my wife.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

>> As a sage, I am stuck either waiting on friends or
>> dumping way too much money onto alchemists and
>> woodworkers in order to make anything at all.

>Here's the thing I wonder about: will you be able to
>make pristine ink as a sage? What exactly will an
>alchemist make now -- other than low-priced items
>(far below an equitable item) for people too lazy too
>make their own?

Alchemists have most to lose assuming anyone can now make washes and
inks. No one buys potions. Still, people don't like making interim
goods so there still be a market for it, just they can't charge as
much as before.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

Wolfie wrote:
> Graeme Faelban wrote:
>
> > As a sage, I am stuck either waiting on friends or
> > dumping way too much money onto alchemists and
> > woodworkers in order to make anything at all.
>
> Here's the thing I wonder about: will you be able to
> make pristine ink as a sage? What exactly will an
> alchemist make now -- other than low-priced items
> (far below an equitable item) for people too lazy too
> make their own?

Poisons and potions will most likely take off after the new patch.
They are finally adding a way to search for poisons on the broker, so
scouts can actually find them. I didn't notice (because poisons were
my main concern), but I would expect them to do the same for potions.
I just found out that somebody (alchemists?) make a healing potion a
few nights ago... I really could have used that when I would go out
soloing :/

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"Bruin" <bruinwarBLAH@BLAHexcite.com> wrote in
news:vfydnX5PDp9uC5HfRVn-sw@comcast.com:

>
> "Paul Botts" <pauldotbotts@gmailspamthis.dotcom> wrote in message
> news:00ZOd.6002$hU7.4849@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...
>> The current patch message on the Test server says:
>>
>>
>> > - Four new crafting abilities have been discovered: apothecary,
>> > weaving, timbercraft, and geomancy. These skills allow all artisans
>> > to refine the materials and components needed to make final
>> > products. New recipe books can be found on merchants or scattered
>> > throughout Norrath which teach you how to use these skills.
>> > Artisans automatically gain 5 points per level in these skills.
>>
>>
>> In other words, they are giving up on the idea of interdependence
>> within the game's tradeskill economy: that sages in order to make
>> spell scrolls need components that are made by alchemists, and so
>> forth. Every tradeskilling class will now be able to make all its own
>> ingredients.
>>
>> So the in-game economy goes from 3-dimensional to 2-dimensional, and
>> hence becomes much less interesting. I suppose players must have
>> complained that interdependence made successful tradeskilling too
>> dependent on other players. What a shame! EQ2's tradeskill economy
>> was developing in ways that promised real lasting playvalue, but...oh
>> well.
>
> The problem stems from not being able to purchase the needed
> components (when you need them) for any amount of money. I know, you
> can bother other players, friends or not, bug them to make the stuff
> so you can buy it. But the more casual player does not want to go
> through all that.
>
> This does not mean that the market for these components has changed
> much. Many will still rather purchase the stuff than take the time to
> make it.
>
> BTW, I do no tradeskills at all, ever, absolutely no time. However,
> I do sell the stuff off for my wife.
>

It's been a major problem, and a major headache for the few in our guild
that have the really needed skills, alchemists in particular. It's also
particularly bad for those tradeskills where you really have no way of
advancing other than totally relying on two other types of tradeskillers.
In my case, as a sage, I can basically make two things, patterns for
armor, and spells. For spells I need one each of an ink and paper. The
ink is made by an alchemist, the paper by a woodworker. For patterns, I
need thread (tailor) and paper (woodworker). That is it, there is
nothing else I can make. So, either I have to spend huge sums of money
on supplies to advance in tier 3+, only to have the items I make sit
around not selling for long periods of time (this is even priced below
everyone else selling them), or, I just bug friends to make me supplies,
which they do, but, I am far from the only one needing the supplies they
make.

My alt provisioner, on the other hand, needs noone else. He just grinds
away making food and drink, relying on noone else to make him anything at
all. If I were an alchemist, I could be making the tier 3 inks and
washes, resins, oils, solvents and selling them off to make money. As a
sage, I am stuck either waiting on friends or dumping way too much money
onto alchemists and woodworkers in order to make anything at all.

--
On Erollisi Marr in <Sanctuary of Marr>
Ancient Graeme Faelban, Barbarian Soothsayer of 70 seasons

On Steamfont in <Insanity Plea>
Graeme, 24 Dwarven Mystic, 22 Sage
Aviv, 12 Gnome Brawler, 19 Craftsman

 

[Wolfie]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

Graeme Faelban wrote:

> As a sage, I am stuck either waiting on friends or
> dumping way too much money onto alchemists and
> woodworkers in order to make anything at all.

Here's the thing I wonder about: will you be able to
make pristine ink as a sage? What exactly will an
alchemist make now -- other than low-priced items
(far below an equitable item) for people too lazy too
make their own?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"Wolfie" <dbgbdwolf@gte.net> wrote in news34Pd.14866$pc5.317
@tornado.tampabay.rr.com:

> Graeme Faelban wrote:
>
>> As a sage, I am stuck either waiting on friends or
>> dumping way too much money onto alchemists and woodworkers in order to
>> make anything at all.
>
> Here's the thing I wonder about: will you be able to
> make pristine ink as a sage? What exactly will an
> alchemist make now -- other than low-priced items
> (far below an equitable item) for people too lazy too
> make their own?
>

An alchemist will make things similar to what a sage makes. An alchemist
makes upgrades to melee class abilities, a sage makes upgrades to caster
spells. Why should the alchemist have the corner on the market for an
item that both he and I require to make similar final products?

--
On Erollisi Marr in <Sanctuary of Marr>
Ancient Graeme Faelban, Barbarian Soothsayer of 70 seasons

On Steamfont in <Insanity Plea>
Graeme, 24 Dwarven Mystic, 22 Sage
Aviv, 12 Gnome Brawler, 19 Craftsman

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"BombayMix" <bombaymix@altavista.co.uk> wrote in
news:1108139133.041723.179530@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:

>>> As a sage, I am stuck either waiting on friends or
>>> dumping way too much money onto alchemists and woodworkers in order
>>> to make anything at all.
>
>>Here's the thing I wonder about: will you be able to
>>make pristine ink as a sage? What exactly will an
>>alchemist make now -- other than low-priced items
>>(far below an equitable item) for people too lazy too make their own?
>
> Alchemists have most to lose assuming anyone can now make washes and
> inks. No one buys potions. Still, people don't like making interim
> goods so there still be a market for it, just they can't charge as
> much as before.
>

You are missing one important detail here, alchemists make upgrades to
melee special abilities, much like sages make upgrades to caster spells.
Both of those require the same ink as the primary intermediate step.

--
On Erollisi Marr in <Sanctuary of Marr>
Ancient Graeme Faelban, Barbarian Soothsayer of 70 seasons

On Steamfont in <Insanity Plea>
Graeme, 24 Dwarven Mystic, 22 Sage
Aviv, 12 Gnome Brawler, 19 Craftsman

 

[Panic]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"Graeme Faelban" <RichardRapier@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:Xns95FA81DEB9007richardrapiernetscap@130.133.1.4...
> "Wolfie" <dbgbdwolf@gte.net> wrote in news34Pd.14866$pc5.317
> @tornado.tampabay.rr.com:
>
>> Graeme Faelban wrote:
>>
>>> As a sage, I am stuck either waiting on friends or
>>> dumping way too much money onto alchemists and woodworkers in order to
>>> make anything at all.
>>
>> Here's the thing I wonder about: will you be able to
>> make pristine ink as a sage? What exactly will an
>> alchemist make now -- other than low-priced items
>> (far below an equitable item) for people too lazy too
>> make their own?
>>
>
> An alchemist will make things similar to what a sage makes. An alchemist
> makes upgrades to melee class abilities, a sage makes upgrades to caster
> spells. Why should the alchemist have the corner on the market for an
> item that both he and I require to make similar final products?

The economy wont change much, yes the prices will rise some in the
beginning, but the thing you are all missing is that it will cost someone
who is not specialized, say an armorer making studs, twice the fuel, hence
twice the cost to produce the item. People will still buy from their
regular sources, but you will have the option to make it yourself at an
increased cost.

The part that I think will hurt us is the tiered fuel. T5 fuels are 15s36c
each, a 15s 30c increase, so if you make for example a platemail chestpiece,
the cost would be prohibitive if you were to make all the combines yourself,
you will be much better off buying the components.

For one Plate chest: 38 fuel (16 X 2 for non armorer items + 6 for the
items you can make) is required, so 5g 83s 68c just for the fuel.
definitely cost prohibitive.

The only crafters unaffected by this will be provisioners since they have no
interdependency.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.everquest (More info?)

"Panic" <panic@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in
news:qJwPd.68051$qB6.63618@tornado.tampabay.rr.com:

>
> "Graeme Faelban" <RichardRapier@netscape.net> wrote in message
> news:Xns95FA81DEB9007richardrapiernetscap@130.133.1.4...
>> "Wolfie" <dbgbdwolf@gte.net> wrote in news34Pd.14866$pc5.317
>> @tornado.tampabay.rr.com:
>>
>>> Graeme Faelban wrote:
>>>
>>>> As a sage, I am stuck either waiting on friends or
>>>> dumping way too much money onto alchemists and woodworkers in order
>>>> to make anything at all.
>>>
>>> Here's the thing I wonder about: will you be able to
>>> make pristine ink as a sage? What exactly will an
>>> alchemist make now -- other than low-priced items
>>> (far below an equitable item) for people too lazy too
>>> make their own?
>>>
>>
>> An alchemist will make things similar to what a sage makes. An
>> alchemist makes upgrades to melee class abilities, a sage makes
>> upgrades to caster spells. Why should the alchemist have the corner
>> on the market for an item that both he and I require to make similar
>> final products?
>
> The economy wont change much, yes the prices will rise some in the
> beginning, but the thing you are all missing is that it will cost
> someone who is not specialized, say an armorer making studs, twice the
> fuel, hence twice the cost to produce the item. People will still buy
> from their regular sources, but you will have the option to make it
> yourself at an increased cost.
>
> The part that I think will hurt us is the tiered fuel. T5 fuels are
> 15s36c each, a 15s 30c increase, so if you make for example a
> platemail chestpiece, the cost would be prohibitive if you were to
> make all the combines yourself, you will be much better off buying the
> components.
>
> For one Plate chest: 38 fuel (16 X 2 for non armorer items + 6 for the
> items you can make) is required, so 5g 83s 68c just for the fuel.
> definitely cost prohibitive.
>
> The only crafters unaffected by this will be provisioners since they
> have no interdependency.
>

Alchemists can still get by just fine making what they made all along
with zero dependancy on others. Heck, they'll still be able to sell the
subcombines, they will just have to price them somewhere between the cost
for them to make them, and the cost for a nonalchemist to make them,
instead of pricing them ludicrously high. Mind you, with the new fuel
costs, that will still likely be ludicrously high. My level 12
brawler/21 provisioner is going to have a really rough time working
through tier 3 now, and tier 4 will be a nightmare when I get there I
expect.

--
On Erollisi Marr in <Sanctuary of Marr>
Ancient Graeme Faelban, Barbarian Soothsayer of 70 seasons

On Steamfont in <Insanity Plea>
Graeme, 24 Dwarven Mystic, 22 Sage
Aviv, 12 Gnome Brawler, 21 Craftsman