Familiar ability: Speak with Animals of Its Kind

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

>From the SRD:

"Speak with Animals of Its Kind (Ex): If the master is 7th level or
higher, a familiar can communicate with animals of approximately the
same kind as itself (including dire varieties): bats with bats, rats
with rodents, cats with felines, hawks and owls and ravens with birds,
lizards and snakes with reptiles, toads with amphibians, weasels with
similar creatures (weasels, minks, polecats, ermines, skunks,
wolverines, and badgers). Such communication is limited by the
intelligence of the conversing creatures."

Am I to understand that a bat familiar can't converse with other bats
until its master is level 7? Even a normal bat can communicate with
other bats. How come a low-level familiar can't?

Laszlo

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

chaoslight@gmail.com wrote:
>> From the SRD:
>
> "Speak with Animals of Its Kind (Ex): If the master is 7th level or
> higher, a familiar can communicate with animals of approximately the
> same kind as itself (including dire varieties): bats with bats, rats
> with rodents, cats with felines, hawks and owls and ravens with birds,
> lizards and snakes with reptiles, toads with amphibians, weasels with
> similar creatures (weasels, minks, polecats, ermines, skunks,
> wolverines, and badgers). Such communication is limited by the
> intelligence of the conversing creatures."
>
> Am I to understand that a bat familiar can't converse with other bats
> until its master is level 7? Even a normal bat can communicate with
> other bats. How come a low-level familiar can't?

A normal bat can communicate with other bats, but hold something you could
reasonably define as a conversation? Probably not.

This ability is basically granting the familiar a limited Speak With Animals
ability, allowing it a greater range of conversation than would normally be
available to an animal.

--
Mark.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Mark Blunden wrote:
> chaoslight@gmail.com wrote:
> >> From the SRD:
> >
> > "Speak with Animals of Its Kind (Ex): If the master is 7th level or
> > higher, a familiar can communicate with animals of approximately the
> > same kind as itself (including dire varieties): bats with bats, rats
> > with rodents, cats with felines, hawks and owls and ravens with birds,
> > lizards and snakes with reptiles, toads with amphibians, weasels with
> > similar creatures (weasels, minks, polecats, ermines, skunks,
> > wolverines, and badgers). Such communication is limited by the
> > intelligence of the conversing creatures."
> >
> > Am I to understand that a bat familiar can't converse with other bats
> > until its master is level 7? Even a normal bat can communicate with
> > other bats. How come a low-level familiar can't?
>
> A normal bat can communicate with other bats, but hold something you could
> reasonably define as a conversation? Probably not.
>
> This ability is basically granting the familiar a limited Speak With Animals
> ability, allowing it a greater range of conversation than would normally be
> available to an animal.

Okay, then what does this mean: "Such communication is limited by the
intelligence of the conversing creatures."

Based on that line, they _still_ wouldn't be able to hold a
conversation, any more than bats normally could.

Laszlo

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

chaoslight@gmail.com <chaoslight@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Mark Blunden wrote:
>> chaoslight@gmail.com wrote:
>> >> From the SRD:
>> >
>> > "Speak with Animals of Its Kind (Ex): If the master is 7th level or
>> > higher, a familiar can communicate with animals of approximately the
>> > same kind as itself (including dire varieties): bats with bats, rats
>> > with rodents, cats with felines, hawks and owls and ravens with birds,
>> > lizards and snakes with reptiles, toads with amphibians, weasels with
>> > similar creatures (weasels, minks, polecats, ermines, skunks,
>> > wolverines, and badgers). Such communication is limited by the
>> > intelligence of the conversing creatures."
>> >
>> > Am I to understand that a bat familiar can't converse with other bats
>> > until its master is level 7? Even a normal bat can communicate with
>> > other bats. How come a low-level familiar can't?
>>
>> A normal bat can communicate with other bats, but hold something you could
>> reasonably define as a conversation? Probably not.
>>
>> This ability is basically granting the familiar a limited Speak With Animals
>> ability, allowing it a greater range of conversation than would normally be
>> available to an animal.
>
> Okay, then what does this mean: "Such communication is limited by the
> intelligence of the conversing creatures."
>
> Based on that line, they _still_ wouldn't be able to hold a
> conversation, any more than bats normally could.

Given that the ability includes other species and dire varieties of the
creatures, it doesn't mean the familiar can't communicate with others of
its own species normally.

That is, a cat familiar gains the ability to chat with lions, tigers,
dire varieties of both, and so on, in addition to being able to chat
with normal moggies.

There's no conflict here. There are more types of cats extant in most
campaigns (given that it includes the great cats and whatnot) than there
are types of bats, and you're more likely to run into different cat
types than different bat types. That just means that the familiar
ability can be expected to be more useful in a cat familiar than a bat
familiar.


Keith
--
Keith Davies "Trying to sway him from his current kook-
keith.davies@kjdavies.org rant with facts is like trying to create
keith.davies@gmail.com a vacuum in a room by pushing the air
http://www.kjdavies.org/ out with your hands." -- Matt Frisch

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.dnd (More info?)

Keith Davies wrote:
> chaoslight@gmail.com <chaoslight@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Mark Blunden wrote:
> >> chaoslight@gmail.com wrote:
> >> >> From the SRD:
> >> >
> >> > "Speak with Animals of Its Kind (Ex): If the master is 7th level or
> >> > higher, a familiar can communicate with animals of approximately the
> >> > same kind as itself (including dire varieties): bats with bats, rats
> >> > with rodents, cats with felines, hawks and owls and ravens with birds,
> >> > lizards and snakes with reptiles, toads with amphibians, weasels with
> >> > similar creatures (weasels, minks, polecats, ermines, skunks,
> >> > wolverines, and badgers). Such communication is limited by the
> >> > intelligence of the conversing creatures."
> >> >
> >> > Am I to understand that a bat familiar can't converse with other bats
> >> > until its master is level 7? Even a normal bat can communicate with
> >> > other bats. How come a low-level familiar can't?
> >>
> >> A normal bat can communicate with other bats, but hold something you could
> >> reasonably define as a conversation? Probably not.
> >>
> >> This ability is basically granting the familiar a limited Speak With Animals
> >> ability, allowing it a greater range of conversation than would normally be
> >> available to an animal.
> >
> > Okay, then what does this mean: "Such communication is limited by the
> > intelligence of the conversing creatures."
> >
> > Based on that line, they _still_ wouldn't be able to hold a
> > conversation, any more than bats normally could.
>
> Given that the ability includes other species and dire varieties of the
> creatures, it doesn't mean the familiar can't communicate with others of
> its own species normally.
>
> That is, a cat familiar gains the ability to chat with lions, tigers,
> dire varieties of both, and so on, in addition to being able to chat
> with normal moggies.
>
> There's no conflict here. There are more types of cats extant in most
> campaigns (given that it includes the great cats and whatnot) than there
> are types of bats, and you're more likely to run into different cat
> types than different bat types. That just means that the familiar
> ability can be expected to be more useful in a cat familiar than a bat
> familiar.

I suppose. That's probably how I'm going to rule it. Still seems
strange that that would be a 7th level familiar ability.

Laszlo