Question Game loading times with M.2 Gen 3 to 4 versus 5 ?

[Hardergamer]

Hi, I've just built a 9800x3d MSI X870E TH, and wondering what changing from a 4th gen WD SN850x to a high-end 4x 5th gen will do on game loading times? I know everyone keeps saying you won't notice it, but then why are the loading times so much slower on my 3thd gen Samsung 980, and Samsung MZVKV5 drives in a 14700kf build and a 3thd gen Crucial CT1000p in a 5800x3d? both take about 1 minute to load The Last of Us pt1, and the SN850x in the 9800x3d build takes just 3 seconds! it's that fast that the circle timer doesn't even show at all!

And it's not just the newer PC, as I've wiped the CT1000p and installed it into the second 5th-gen slot and moved the games over using Steam, and TLoU p1 is just as slow, and it's not just TLoU pt1 , or pt2, It's SOF, RDR 2, FC6 RE4, and the worst of all is moded FO-TO2W or FO4 in places like downtown Boston, were it takes anywhere from 1 to 2+ minutes to load on the 3thd gen's and around 30-60 seconds on the 4th gen, and only when installed into the X870E/9800x3d build, I also I have put the SN850x in the GA-Z790 board and It's just a tad slower than the X870E board with the same drive, but still much faster than the other 2 drives, and the GA-B450 board it about the same with any of the drives in, and it is not heat as all have heat sinks, and it's also not GPU shaders.

If I've seen massive speed gains moving from 3 to 4th gen, will I see a bit more going to 4x 5th gen? even 5-10 seconds will be a help.

Thanks all.

 

[evermorex76]

Do they appear as x2 in DiskInfo again? I don't see how any of these drivers are "out of date". Windows just uses standard drivers for stuff like ATA/ATAPI/SATA and has for many many years. There have been no dedicated Intel/AMD drivers for those for a long time (except when using Intel RST/RAID or AMD RAID). And how would MS Storage Spaces Controller be "unknown" and not automatically installed? It's part of the OS! Unless it's due to using the IoT version. You may just be causing your own problems by using that.

I generally suggest installing at least CPU and chipset drivers directly from AMD or Intel, when available (network controller, sound, etc. are also better that way). Motherboard makers never have the latest versions, and they don't customize those drivers in any significant way if at all to make it necessary to use their version.

 

[Hardergamer]

Before I start, I want to let you know I'm unwell and have not eaten a meal in over a year, I'm fed by tube, and with my meds I'm sleeping for days at a time, so please bear with me.

To answer your questions evermorex76, I did what you asked and looked in "device manager" and the unknown device name started with "ATA/ATAPI" so I googled the full name and it took me to the MSI website and found this to be a problem if you don't install the full MSI control centre with all the AI stuff/programs, and they recommended installing all of it, it had a link to the full chipset drivers, which I then installed, and the missing drivers went away, and "MS Storage Spaces Controller NVM" apeard along next to 3x "Standard NVM Express Controller"

This driver was missing in Windows 10 pro and normal Windows 11 also, and after I instaled the chipset drivers MSI control centre asked me to instal the rest of their crap, So I did as they said and installed 12 more programs like AI, storage control, display centre, MSI display kit, Mystic Light, Super Chatging +, User Scenario, Cooling Wizard, Game Highlights, AI LAN, Smart Image, True Color, System Diagnosis which most of it was not showing in the control centre before.

This seemed to fix the problem with the M.2 drive speeds but after some testing, I noticed my FPS is lower in X4 (which is the only reason I built this PC) and 5-6% lower in TLoU pt2.

After some restarts, the slow M.2 drive problem came back, and sometimes much slower too, so bad in fact the Gen 3 drives would run at 1x PCIe speed and only 300mhz in CDMark, then after some restarts later, they would be working ok again... So, I did some googling and this problem is very common with the MSI x870e boards, (and some ASUS boards) With some only having problems with Gen 3 MVMe drives, and some get the problem in the Gen 5 slots and others in any slot, and USB4 triggers this problem, but others have it using any USB port, or even when not using any at all, but there are hundreds of pages of this problem on MSI/Reddit and FB. So I've messaged MSI and am waiting for a reply, but the only fix I can think of is buying more Gen 4 drives, as I've not had a problem with either of mine.

https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?threads/pcie-bug-with-m2_1-slot-on-x870e-tomahawk.409663/

https://www.reddit.com/r/MSI_Gaming...p&utm_name=ioscss&utm_source=share&utm_term=1

 

[evermorex76]

That's a bizarre issue. However the described issue in those threads is that the drives are running at Gen1 x4 (I only read a few pages), while your issue has been the drives running at Gen3 x2. Of course the ones in those threads were using Gen4 or Gen5 drives, and maybe the effect on Gen3 drives is different, which makes it even weirder in my mind. The Reddit thread even says in the last edit that it's a Gen4 drive having problems while a Gen3 drive works fine.

I bet the issue comes down to the sharing of lanes with the USB4 chipset. The intended configuration with the X870E was for the USB4 controller to get PCIe lanes from the chipset, not the CPU, because the ASMedia 4242 is only a Gen4 chipset. Maybe they're using a PCIe switch to allow for bifurcation of the x4 port from the CPU and the switch chip is the culprit. They all buy the same basic firmware from the same company (AMI for CPU and chipset support) and mostly just enable or disable options to match a particular board's features. Having to also add in functionality for the switch chip is the only way I can imagine they could have screwed up the firmware so badly, or perhaps they used a buggy chip.

Doing it the way they have, limiting the USB4 chipset to x2 and it being Gen4, they also bottlenecked those ports since that's only 32Gbps. You can't get the full 40Gbps even theoretically.