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[citation][nom]izmanq[/nom]i wish i could tell everyone not to buy new hard disk till the price back to normal, to teach those greedy bastards a bitter lesson.[/citation]
And sometimes you are forced to by a new drive when your old one crashed.
And sometimes you are forced to by a new drive when your old one crashed.
[citation][nom]de5_roy[/nom]not another one again. how many of these have come out including this one? 5, 6 or more may be. everyone keeps saying hdd shortage will persist for a long time. how about taking measures to lower ssd prices? if a company like intel can take steps to lower ultrabooks costs why not do the same with ssd?[/citation]
the bluray player cost a crap ton when it was new. sony put one in the ps3, and under cut the cost but a absolute crap ton to ensure that they won that war.
intel most likely timed some of the fat off their cpu line, and possibly under cut the cost, just to make sure amd wasn't a viable option, and people didn't get use to ultrabook = amd
now with ssd, there is about 21tb per waffer, and my math is based off of a new ssd that isnt priced to move (as in doesn't cost less than production)
i dont know how big ssd chips (the insides, not the plastic houses) are, if anyone does, tell me so i can adjust my math.
but because ssds are silicon based, and silicon costs about 50 grand a wafer, they are tied almost exclusively to how low the process they use is... at least till you get really high up there in ssd size, than its more about opportunists.
[citation][nom]CaedenV[/nom]even after they get production up in Feb/Mar it will take a few more months to catch up with demand, and then after demand is caught up with it will be a while before they recoup their repair costs and lost time. So it is not greed (necessarily), it is just how business works. Besides, they are supposed to be greedy. Greed combined with competition is what keeps quality high, prices low, and innovation coming.What I really would like to know is how this will effect the production of 4 and 6TB drives which are supposed to come out this year. Perhaps we will see a permanent shift of SSDs for system drives, and HDDs for data storage. Just stop producing anything smaller than 500GB.My bet is that most companies will be back to normal prices next fall because the companies less effected will want to bury and steal as many customers as possible from those who will take longer to recover.[/citation]
the manufactures can make a 10-20% hike in price, we wouldn't care. if a 100$ hdd now costs 120-130, its not that big of a difference, considering is a piece of hardware that is ususaly insured for 5 years and can have a life time longer than that... but the retail... they are selling them at 230+
[citation][nom]DaddyW123[/nom]You know what I see in HDD manufacturer's future? Waterproof buildings. Sure the water is up above the windows outside, and you have to take a boat to get to work and climb down from an access door on the roof - but dammit we're still making drives![/citation]
i want to see a buffer floor. a 5 foot floor that is just there to keep machines out from under water, and than another 5 feet of water proof/resistance, any more than that... well... they have more serious problems than if i can get a hdd or not
[citation][nom]keyanf[/nom]So they can't afford to replace the stock once they sell it!Brilliant!Your English is fine, your economics are what you should worry about.[/citation]
the harddrive cost on a whole sale end are barely elevated, but on a retail end, they are over 100% inflated.
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all this about supply and demand... i think people need to look at this realistically.
prebuilt machines are getting made, and have the storage, those people aren't upgrading storage when they get a new one, and we have hard drives to satisfy damn near everyone who could need one, not just want one. this isnt a product that once production ramps up we will see everyone buying one... it will be buissness as usual, just at lower prices again.
im doubting that these inflated prices can last much longer than 90-100% production, dont get me wrong they will be elevated, but not horrendously so.
the bluray player cost a crap ton when it was new. sony put one in the ps3, and under cut the cost but a absolute crap ton to ensure that they won that war.
intel most likely timed some of the fat off their cpu line, and possibly under cut the cost, just to make sure amd wasn't a viable option, and people didn't get use to ultrabook = amd
now with ssd, there is about 21tb per waffer, and my math is based off of a new ssd that isnt priced to move (as in doesn't cost less than production)
i dont know how big ssd chips (the insides, not the plastic houses) are, if anyone does, tell me so i can adjust my math.
but because ssds are silicon based, and silicon costs about 50 grand a wafer, they are tied almost exclusively to how low the process they use is... at least till you get really high up there in ssd size, than its more about opportunists.
[citation][nom]CaedenV[/nom]even after they get production up in Feb/Mar it will take a few more months to catch up with demand, and then after demand is caught up with it will be a while before they recoup their repair costs and lost time. So it is not greed (necessarily), it is just how business works. Besides, they are supposed to be greedy. Greed combined with competition is what keeps quality high, prices low, and innovation coming.What I really would like to know is how this will effect the production of 4 and 6TB drives which are supposed to come out this year. Perhaps we will see a permanent shift of SSDs for system drives, and HDDs for data storage. Just stop producing anything smaller than 500GB.My bet is that most companies will be back to normal prices next fall because the companies less effected will want to bury and steal as many customers as possible from those who will take longer to recover.[/citation]
the manufactures can make a 10-20% hike in price, we wouldn't care. if a 100$ hdd now costs 120-130, its not that big of a difference, considering is a piece of hardware that is ususaly insured for 5 years and can have a life time longer than that... but the retail... they are selling them at 230+
[citation][nom]DaddyW123[/nom]You know what I see in HDD manufacturer's future? Waterproof buildings. Sure the water is up above the windows outside, and you have to take a boat to get to work and climb down from an access door on the roof - but dammit we're still making drives![/citation]
i want to see a buffer floor. a 5 foot floor that is just there to keep machines out from under water, and than another 5 feet of water proof/resistance, any more than that... well... they have more serious problems than if i can get a hdd or not
[citation][nom]keyanf[/nom]So they can't afford to replace the stock once they sell it!Brilliant!Your English is fine, your economics are what you should worry about.[/citation]
the harddrive cost on a whole sale end are barely elevated, but on a retail end, they are over 100% inflated.
-----------------------
all this about supply and demand... i think people need to look at this realistically.
prebuilt machines are getting made, and have the storage, those people aren't upgrading storage when they get a new one, and we have hard drives to satisfy damn near everyone who could need one, not just want one. this isnt a product that once production ramps up we will see everyone buying one... it will be buissness as usual, just at lower prices again.
im doubting that these inflated prices can last much longer than 90-100% production, dont get me wrong they will be elevated, but not horrendously so.
[citation][nom]izmanq[/nom]i wish i could tell everyone not to buy new hard disk till the price back to normal, to teach those greedy bastards a bitter lesson.[/citation]
Surely a lot of people will do that, and hold off on upgrades until prices become more reasonable. But other people have no choice- if your hard drive fails and you need a new one, you are forced to spend whatever the sellers want. And people that want to buy new computers, they will have to pay the price. Some people might be able to put off their purchases until another time but other people won't be able to wait.
I was planning on building a new server for our office, I will wait.
Surely a lot of people will do that, and hold off on upgrades until prices become more reasonable. But other people have no choice- if your hard drive fails and you need a new one, you are forced to spend whatever the sellers want. And people that want to buy new computers, they will have to pay the price. Some people might be able to put off their purchases until another time but other people won't be able to wait.
I was planning on building a new server for our office, I will wait.
masterasia
Distinguished
- Feb 9, 2009
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Haven't bought a HDD in the past year, but I did buy about 5 SSDs. Still have a few WD 640 Blacks and Samsung F3 500GB sitting around. Maybe I should try putting them up on eBay.
I always have a healthy stack of spare HDDs in my house. I use them for backups and shuffling aroudn drive images.
Just built a server for my house that has a 30GB SSD for OS and then 4x 640 GB drives in RAID 10 for data. All older drives (circa 2009) but they work like champs. They are all the venerable WD6400AAKS model 😀
Just built a server for my house that has a 30GB SSD for OS and then 4x 640 GB drives in RAID 10 for data. All older drives (circa 2009) but they work like champs. They are all the venerable WD6400AAKS model 😀
intel4eva
Distinguished
- Oct 12, 2011
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They want to play the "buy outdated shit for outrageous prices" game? I will instead play the "reuse hard drive" game, the "buy a second, then third SSD for RAID" game, and finally the "my file server has enough free space to last me 2 years so lets see who cracks first" game.
What will happen is interesting. We've already seen Seagate announce their intent to milk this to the max (if you read between their lines). The first company to successfully ramp up production stands to corner the whole market, whereas traditionally a 1% increase in market share was a 5-year plan in this industry.
Unless the big players start price fixing, which I suspect might actually happen. Then we'll see if the law can be put into practice as intended, instead of encouraging patent trolling, or pushing regular folks into bankruptcy over downloading a handful of mp3s.
What will happen is interesting. We've already seen Seagate announce their intent to milk this to the max (if you read between their lines). The first company to successfully ramp up production stands to corner the whole market, whereas traditionally a 1% increase in market share was a 5-year plan in this industry.
Unless the big players start price fixing, which I suspect might actually happen. Then we'll see if the law can be put into practice as intended, instead of encouraging patent trolling, or pushing regular folks into bankruptcy over downloading a handful of mp3s.
intel4eva
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[citation][nom]jacekring[/nom]Didn't have any problems ordering my OCZ Agility 3 240g SSD...was in stock[/citation]
SSD prices and capacities are heading downward for the foreseeable future.
HDD prices are heading upward for the foreseeable future, for less and less capacity.
Now let's extend the timeline. AFAIK, the HDD makers are not related to the SSD makers. If the HDD guys allow SSDs to get too close, it's game over for them. Their entire industry can literally disappear just like that.
SSD prices and capacities are heading downward for the foreseeable future.
HDD prices are heading upward for the foreseeable future, for less and less capacity.
Now let's extend the timeline. AFAIK, the HDD makers are not related to the SSD makers. If the HDD guys allow SSDs to get too close, it's game over for them. Their entire industry can literally disappear just like that.
maxinexus
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- Jan 1, 2007
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Good news is that SSD are not as expensive these days...for you should pick up a pair and clean up your old drive. I'm sure at least half is filled with useless junk anyway 
Have 2 external 1TB and one additional 1TB on my rig and after cleaning up and deleting double backups have more than 2.5TB free.
Have 2 external 1TB and one additional 1TB on my rig and after cleaning up and deleting double backups have more than 2.5TB free.
Truth is that this shortage is Virtual. They have millions of hard drives on pallets waiting to be shipped, but being held back. Do they honestly expect us to believe that they don't have reserves in place to support this type of situation. Flood or not, they have millions of hard drives that are available to continue business as usual. It is obvious that GREED is the primary motivation for this price hike!
If they have shortages... why are the cost of hard drives on shelves being increased in price, and what about the increased price of refurb hard drives? If there is a shortage... only new hard drives from the manufacturer should be at the increased price!
When are people going to wake up to these obvious creative accounting techniques and stop buying their overpriced products.
If they have shortages... why are the cost of hard drives on shelves being increased in price, and what about the increased price of refurb hard drives? If there is a shortage... only new hard drives from the manufacturer should be at the increased price!
When are people going to wake up to these obvious creative accounting techniques and stop buying their overpriced products.
[citation][nom]de5_roy[/nom]not another one again. how many of these have come out including this one? 5, 6 or more may be. everyone keeps saying hdd shortage will persist for a long time. how about taking measures to lower ssd prices? if a company like intel can take steps to lower ultrabooks costs why not do the same with ssd?[/citation]
Oh look, somebody on Tom's Hardware complaining about SSD price. How unexpected.
Oh look, somebody on Tom's Hardware complaining about SSD price. How unexpected.
[citation][nom]gallidorn[/nom]Truth is that this shortage is Virtual. They have millions of hard drives on pallets waiting to be shipped, but being held back. Do they honestly expect us to believe that they don't have reserves in place to support this type of situation. Flood or not, they have millions of hard drives that are available to continue business as usual. It is obvious that GREED is the primary motivation for this price hike! If they have shortages... why are the cost of hard drives on shelves being increased in price, and what about the increased price of refurb hard drives? If there is a shortage... only new hard drives from the manufacturer should be at the increased price!When are people going to wake up to these obvious creative accounting techniques and stop buying their overpriced products.[/citation]
Never heard of supply and demand? You know, that market effect where reduced supply causes prices to increase? Like when major flooding shuts down production for months on end, that kind of supply reduction?
Never heard of supply and demand? You know, that market effect where reduced supply causes prices to increase? Like when major flooding shuts down production for months on end, that kind of supply reduction?
[citation][nom]keyanf[/nom]So they can't afford to replace the stock once they sell it!Brilliant!Your English is fine, your economics are what you should worry about.[/citation]
You know it should be a rule that when someone makes a post like this, insinuating that they know something the other person doesn't that they should explain what they know. Show what you know, explain what you mean or just shut up since you are doing nothing helpful.
You know it should be a rule that when someone makes a post like this, insinuating that they know something the other person doesn't that they should explain what they know. Show what you know, explain what you mean or just shut up since you are doing nothing helpful.
[citation][nom]willard[/nom]Never heard of supply and demand? You know, that market effect where reduced supply causes prices to increase? Like when major flooding shuts down production for months on end, that kind of supply reduction?[/citation]
Do you think the hard drives on the shelves or in computers is what is coming out of the manufacturing plants now? Take a look at the manufactured dates the next time you buy a hard drive and see if you are able to get something that was made within the past year.
They have reserves, just like oil companies have reserves, so if they wanted to keep prices down... they would use a portion of their reserve stock!!!
Do you think the hard drives on the shelves or in computers is what is coming out of the manufacturing plants now? Take a look at the manufactured dates the next time you buy a hard drive and see if you are able to get something that was made within the past year.
They have reserves, just like oil companies have reserves, so if they wanted to keep prices down... they would use a portion of their reserve stock!!!
noblerabbit
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- Oct 14, 2010
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the hard truth is that now Chinese / Asian manufacturers also have a foothold in the American Marketplace, and they can dictate the W5 on Supply and Demand on all components. BS Floods or not, buy when it's good, and don't buy when it's not. SSD drives will remain expensive until holographic or 3D storage technology finally surfaces for consumer 20 / 60 / 100TB storage mediums. Until then, suck it up folks, the prices of mechanical harddrives are here to stay, as did with the ailing floppy drive.
[citation][nom]gallidorn[/nom]Do you think the hard drives on the shelves or in computers is what is coming out of the manufacturing plants now? Take a look at the manufactured dates the next time you buy a hard drive and see if you are able to get something that was made within the past year.They have reserves, just like oil companies have reserves, so if they wanted to keep prices down... they would use a portion of their reserve stock!!![/citation]
You fail at supply and demand. Of course there are reserves, that's why we have drives at all. But the SUPPLY of them is reduced.
Go take an economics class before embarrassing yourself further.
You fail at supply and demand. Of course there are reserves, that's why we have drives at all. But the SUPPLY of them is reduced.
Go take an economics class before embarrassing yourself further.
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