I hate accolades.

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With the invention of the accolade, I opine that CoH began walking down
the way of the EverQuest. Of course, every successful MMOG must become an
EverQuest, that is, it must contain so much timesinks that it can never be
completed. This almost goes without saying, as otherwise the players would
leave. Even so, I need not like it.

In this case, the game rewards players for acting blatantly out of
character. I'm OK with badges - you get them, or not, and display them,
or not. But people REALLY want those extra 5% of endurance and Crey
pistols or whatever. And so they come and mop up huge quantities of grey
(to them) mobs in Perez Park, and offer ridiculous sums of influence to be
part of an otherwise boring mission. Things they would not normally have
done, things that are out of character, things that are simply not heroic.

The problem is, of course, that if you don't do it you will not be all you
can be, and will be an inferior member of your team / supergroup.

I will get back to the "Arena" thing when I see it. I am not too
optimistic. While it could be a training tool to improve your combat
skills in a safe environment (like a training room, but of course without
such a reserved name), it is most likely designed to be an out of
character time sink again.

Is this the path we want to go? We could just as well be crafting
inspirations and enhancements. At least for some origins that could be in
character (spells, gizmos).

--
"When someone starts bragging about how much debt they have, it's not a
good sign." -G

 

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Magnus Itland wrote:
> With the invention of the accolade, I opine that CoH began walking
down
> the way of the EverQuest. Of course, every successful MMOG must
become an
> EverQuest, that is, it must contain so much timesinks that it can
never be
> completed. This almost goes without saying, as otherwise the players
would
> leave. Even so, I need not like it.
>
> In this case, the game rewards players for acting blatantly out of
> character. I'm OK with badges - you get them, or not, and display
them,
> or not. But people REALLY want those extra 5% of endurance and Crey
> pistols or whatever. And so they come and mop up huge quantities of
grey
> (to them) mobs in Perez Park, and offer ridiculous sums of influence
to be
> part of an otherwise boring mission. Things they would not normally
have
> done, things that are out of character, things that are simply not
heroic.
>

I like them. I got my first one night before last. It's nice to have
a goal other than the next level. Right now I'm scouring the streets
fighting tanks (glad they made bosses easier), which is pretty heroic.
Granted the 50 grey wolves I beat up to get my first accolade wasn't
heroic, but getting that badge earned message, and seeing the nice new
status icon showing for the increased mana was really cool when that
last wolf dropped.

The game doesn't have tradeskills or items to work for like others do,
so having accolades adds a little dimension. Of course I don't have
enough imagination to be a good RP, so it doesn't bother me to do
things OOC.

 

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On Wed, 02 Feb 2005 23:14:12 +0100, Magnus Itland <itlandm@online.no>
wrote:

>With the invention of the accolade, I opine that CoH began walking down
>the way of the EverQuest. Of course, every successful MMOG must become an
>EverQuest, that is, it must contain so much timesinks that it can never be
>completed. This almost goes without saying, as otherwise the players would
>leave. Even so, I need not like it.
>
>In this case, the game rewards players for acting blatantly out of
>character. I'm OK with badges - you get them, or not, and display them,
>or not. But people REALLY want those extra 5% of endurance and Crey
>pistols or whatever. And so they come and mop up huge quantities of grey
>(to them) mobs in Perez Park, and offer ridiculous sums of influence to be
>part of an otherwise boring mission. Things they would not normally have
>done, things that are out of character, things that are simply not heroic.
>
>The problem is, of course, that if you don't do it you will not be all you
>can be, and will be an inferior member of your team / supergroup.
>
>I will get back to the "Arena" thing when I see it. I am not too
>optimistic. While it could be a training tool to improve your combat
>skills in a safe environment (like a training room, but of course without
>such a reserved name), it is most likely designed to be an out of
>character time sink again.
>
>Is this the path we want to go? We could just as well be crafting
>inspirations and enhancements. At least for some origins that could be in
>character (spells, gizmos).

I just want something to spend my 6,000,000 influence on.....even if
it's a 2% increase to defense Flak Jacket at a Million a pop.

 

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In article <opsllb1ymwb52ai9@news.online.no>, Magnus Itland wrote:
> In this case, the game rewards players for acting blatantly out of
> character. I'm OK with badges - you get them, or not, and display them,
> or not. But people REALLY want those extra 5% of endurance and Crey
> pistols or whatever. And so they come and mop up huge quantities of grey
> (to them) mobs in Perez Park, and offer ridiculous sums of influence to be
> part of an otherwise boring mission. Things they would not normally have
> done, things that are out of character, things that are simply not heroic.

None of the villain types that you can do this to in Perez are worth
anything in terms of Accolades, except perhaps the "Lost Leaders" who
you need for the Vanguard Medal. What I suspect you're complaining about
are the people going after Hellion or Skull bosses. That gives you a
badge that has no in-game benefit.

It's a "collect-'em-all" thing - a time sink, nothing more.

For Spelunker, part of the problem is that a lot of people (including
me with my main) did the mission once when we were low level, but it
belonged to someone else so when badges came out we never got credit.
And since, quite frankly, having to go into the woods of Perez at that
level is a gigantic pain, most people avoided that mission before it
granted the badge, which means a committed altoholic could have multiple
characters without the badge. Should they be cut off from one of the
end-game rewards because they didn't want to do the "can anyone find the
mission door? please PLEASE tell me you have Recall Friend... no? why
are we here again...?" thing in Perez?

For everyone who PL'd past the low-level badges and is going back to beg
them, there's someone who simply missed them because they're an old
player and just wants the stupid badge they should already have because
they DID this already but NO they're stuck in FRICK'N PEREZ having to
wave giant wads of influence around to get that FRICK'N BLUE SHINY that
EVERYONE ELSE their level has mutter grumble...

> The problem is, of course, that if you don't do it you will not be all you
> can be, and will be an inferior member of your team / supergroup.

Quite ridiculous. They're helpful, but nothing more. You can expect to
get teased mildly about not having them, especially if you're only one
badge short or something, but I've yet to see a team go "omg you don't
have accolade? *boot*". No doubt they exist, of course.

> I will get back to the "Arena" thing when I see it. I am not too
> optimistic. While it could be a training tool to improve your combat
> skills in a safe environment (like a training room, but of course without
> such a reserved name), it is most likely designed to be an out of
> character time sink again.

Testing your might is never out of character for a mighty hero. Not that
I expect to spend much if any time inside the Arena, but this is just
being sour for no good reason.

> Is this the path we want to go? We could just as well be crafting
> inspirations and enhancements. At least for some origins that could be in
> character (spells, gizmos).

More things to do besides punching evil are good. I'm impressed that you
could take the position that there should be less things for people to
do, but I guess I shouldn't be, this being the Internet and all.

--
--- An' thou dost not get caught, do as thou wilt shall be the law ---
"Religion disperses like a fog, kingdoms perish, but the works of
scholars remain for an eternity." - Ulughbek

 

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"Magnus, Robot Fighter." <me@key.com> wrote:
> I just want something to spend my 6,000,000 influence on...

Sheesh, no kidding. I thought it was unusual and/or whining about how Inf
piles up after the low 30s... and here I am, 35+'d out, waiting for 37 so I
can 40-out (which will take maybe 2M)... with 3.5M in hand already. Yowza.
I'll probably be sitting on 5M at 37.

Time to drop some on alts and/or play games with newbie costume contests or
something.

I wonder if betting on arena fights will be allowed.

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 35 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M =-
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 16 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F =-
-= Duke Miasma: Level 8 Science Controller, Grav/Force, H =-
-= the Nonpareil: Level 7 Magic Defender, Emp/Rad, F =-
-= Mean Mr Mustard: Level 7 Natural Tanker, Inv/Stone, H =-

 

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sw <sw@eyrie.org> wrote:
> For Spelunker, part of the problem is that a lot of people (including
> me with my main) did the mission once when we were low level, but it
> belonged to someone else so when badges came out we never got credit.
> And since, quite frankly, having to go into the woods of Perez at that
> level is a gigantic pain, most people avoided that mission before it
> granted the badge, which means a committed altoholic could have
> multiple characters without the badge. Should they be cut off from one
> of the end-game rewards because they didn't want to do the "can anyone
> find the mission door? please PLEASE tell me you have Recall Friend...
> no? why are we here again...?" thing in Perez?

The enhanced maps are absolutely, totally invaluable for this.

http://www.vidiotmaps.com/coh

I got stuck in PP at 32 - that little keyhole down in the SE corner.
Spent nearly an hour finding the slot - no one would TP me, and nothing
could kill me. The maps are not an option for that zone, IMHO. And
they're damned useful everywhere else. Since you still have to unfog
them, I don't see them as cheating...

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 35 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M =-
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 16 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F =-
-= Duke Miasma: Level 8 Science Controller, Grav/Force, H =-
-= the Nonpareil: Level 7 Magic Defender, Emp/Rad, F =-
-= Mean Mr Mustard: Level 7 Natural Tanker, Inv/Stone, H =-

 

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Shenanigunner <nsp@nitrosyncretic.kom> looked up from reading the
entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:

>"Magnus, Robot Fighter." <me@key.com> wrote:
>> I just want something to spend my 6,000,000 influence on...
>
>Sheesh, no kidding. I thought it was unusual and/or whining about how Inf
>piles up after the low 30s... and here I am, 35+'d out, waiting for 37 so I
>can 40-out (which will take maybe 2M)... with 3.5M in hand already. Yowza.
>I'll probably be sitting on 5M at 37.

Of course the prices on your level 40 enhances are pretty steep, but
you'll still have a bunch left over.

The only reason I don't have huge amounts of inf left on Shadeling
really is that her costume(s) changed regularly as I got bored of a
particular look - I swear she's had at least 50 different costumes.

>Time to drop some on alts and/or play games with newbie costume contests or
>something.

I do this with alts - drop a million on them. Doing the "starving Hero"
thing wasn't exactly fun the first time, so there's no reason to go
through it again. One mil will pretty much cover the DO and first SO
purchases (as long as you don't try staying ++green.)
I drop it on them once i'm pretty sure i'll actually keep/play the
character. Wish I could use in-game mail to just send it to them
instead of having a 3rd party hold it.

>I wonder if betting on arena fights will be allowed.

Too easy to "fix" the fights.

Xocyll
--
I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr

 

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Magnus Itland <itlandm@online.no> wrote in
news😱psllb1ymwb52ai9@news.online.no:

> With the invention of the accolade, I opine that CoH began walking
> down the way of the EverQuest. Of course, every successful MMOG
> must become an EverQuest, that is, it must contain so much
> timesinks that it can never be completed. This almost goes without
> saying, as otherwise the players would leave. Even so, I need not
> like it.

No, you need not like it. That is one of the things that I like about
this game, is that the offer is there and it is up to the player to
decide if they want it or not.

As to every MMOG 'must become an Everquest', then why did Everquest 2
come out? If Everquest is the goal, then there should not have been
an Everquest 2.

>
> In this case, the game rewards players for acting blatantly out of
> character.

Out of character? Let me read further before I answer this.

> I'm OK with badges - you get them, or not, and display
> them, or not. But people REALLY want those extra 5% of endurance
> and Crey pistols or whatever. And so they come and mop up huge
> quantities of grey (to them) mobs in Perez Park, and offer
> ridiculous sums of influence to be part of an otherwise boring
> mission. Things they would not normally have done, things that
> are out of character, things that are simply not heroic.

Ah, I see. Well the thing is, is that most of the 'grey mobs' you
speak of are currently not worth anything towards an accolade.
Hellions, Skulls, Clocks, and the low end Circle of Thorns in Perez
Park do not contribute to an accolade. The Lost Leaders (Bosses)
might be grey in Perez, but there is not enough of them in PP to
justify hunting there, when there are more in the Sewers. As to the
CoT Mages, needed for the Archmage Accolade, Hollows is where they
are in plenty.

>
> The problem is, of course, that if you don't do it you will not be
> all you can be, and will be an inferior member of your team /
> supergroup.

I didn't get my 'Atlas Medallion' until I got the 100 Vamps and
Wolves that I needed, and that was in a mission in Brickstown at 36.
The Crey Pistol, I got that at 37 after doing the 100 Paragon
Protectors, and not a single one of them was less than 'conn yellow'.
I still have about 95 Fake Nemesis to get the 'Freedom Phalanx
Reserve' and the only real good place to hunt them is in Peregine
Isle, which would definatly not be grey to me at 38.

Why do I want these Accolades? Well, my char is a martial arts
regenerative natural scrapper. So the Atlas Medallion adds to my base
endurance, the Freedom Phalanx adds to my base Hit Points, and the
Crey Pistol gives me a range weapon that I can only use every 25
minutes (without hasten). Does that add to my team, these individual
abilities? Well, you hit a level 40 Terra Devouring Earth ArchVillian
with the Crey Pistol, and 2 minutes later she stomps you flat
(happened tonight....not pretty). {The only reason the entire team
didn't wipe, was that at the last moment, the level 50 that was
exemp'd went full strength and kept her off us until re could re-
group}.

>
> I will get back to the "Arena" thing when I see it. I am not too
> optimistic. While it could be a training tool to improve your
> combat skills in a safe environment (like a training room, but of
> course without such a reserved name), it is most likely designed
> to be an out of character time sink again.

And the 'Danger Room' from X-Men was a time sink? So far, anything
that earns my char prestige (influence) which I can use to enhance my
abilities is welcome. The write ups I have seen for the 'Arena'
suggests that there are rewards in that, without risks. You either
earn, or you go do something else. Unlike other PvP that I have seen
in newsgroups, where they can 'loot' your unconcious form.

>
> Is this the path we want to go? We could just as well be crafting
> inspirations and enhancements. At least for some origins that
> could be in character (spells, gizmos).
>

I do recall Statesman (as he is known on the boards) as saying that
they are not going to have crafting. Crafting to me is just another
way of improving a char that others may not have the ability to do.

And, even if they do something along the lines of crafting, the
origin background might not restrict some chars from some crafts that
others can.

My Natural Scrapper can use dual-origins that are also used my Magic
or Technology origins, but the Single Origins that I use are also
available to other origins, just as different names. My Single Origin
Accuracy enhancement is called Dragon Strike while a Magic is called
Insight of Grey and the tech's is called something to long to type.
But they all give the same benefit to each of the origins as the
others do.

So, looking at the way that enhancements are handled in CoH is, to
me, far better than anything I have seen or read about in other MMOG.

I think that is the longest reply to any post that I have made. But
it also explains why I play CoH and not some other MMOG, and I have
tried them.

 

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Xocyll <Xocyll@kingston.net> wrote:
>> I wonder if betting on arena fights will be allowed.

> Too easy to "fix" the fights.

I thought of third-party wagering after I hit send on that one - I meant
between the participants. "Punching for pink slips" would give new meaning
to "owning" someone...

--
-= Victory Server =-
-= Shenanigunner: Level 35 Natural Tanker, Fire/SS, M =-
-= Sgt Glory B: Level 16 Tech Blaster, Electric/Energy, F =-
-= Duke Miasma: Level 8 Science Controller, Grav/Force, H =-
-= the Nonpareil: Level 7 Magic Defender, Emp/Rad, F =-
-= Mean Mr Mustard: Level 7 Natural Tanker, Inv/Stone, H =-

 

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In article <dm040111mnj9gg9ck22tg82chq8k615ceh@4ax.com>, Xocyll wrote:
> I do this with alts - drop a million on them. Doing the "starving Hero"
> thing wasn't exactly fun the first time, so there's no reason to go
> through it again. One mil will pretty much cover the DO and first SO
> purchases (as long as you don't try staying ++green.)

In my SG (and with any newbies I decide to bootstrap), you get 100k at
level 12 to get you through the Dual Origin purchases, and 1m if you get
to level 22 for the Single Origin levels. I don't think anyone has gone
broke under this system.

I must have given out like 10m influence at this point, and I still have
30m banked... and not even to level 50 yet. Guess visiting the
enhancement stores regularly to sell pays off eventually.

--
--- An' thou dost not get caught, do as thou wilt shall be the law ---
"Religion disperses like a fog, kingdoms perish, but the works of
scholars remain for an eternity." - Ulughbek

 

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sw <sw@eyrie.org> looked up from reading the entrails of the porn
spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:

>In article <dm040111mnj9gg9ck22tg82chq8k615ceh@4ax.com>, Xocyll wrote:
>> I do this with alts - drop a million on them. Doing the "starving Hero"
>> thing wasn't exactly fun the first time, so there's no reason to go
>> through it again. One mil will pretty much cover the DO and first SO
>> purchases (as long as you don't try staying ++green.)
>
>In my SG (and with any newbies I decide to bootstrap), you get 100k at
>level 12 to get you through the Dual Origin purchases, and 1m if you get
>to level 22 for the Single Origin levels. I don't think anyone has gone
>broke under this system.

That sounds like a pretty good system actually, especially since it
minimizes the risk of wasted inf on toons that get abandoned in the
teens.

>I must have given out like 10m influence at this point, and I still have
>30m banked... and not even to level 50 yet. Guess visiting the
>enhancement stores regularly to sell pays off eventually.

I'm almost religious about running off and selling at the appropriate
stores as soon as my enhancement tray is full. Of course, since i'm
fighting solo mostly, there's no one to stop me leaving NOW to sell.

I(n the 40's I still kept and sold DOs, unless I was a long way from a
store (like the shard) and didn't want to leave just yet - then i'd
delete DOs and leave when I had a fulkl tray of SOs.

It's amazing how not combining and not selling to the wrong stores
and/or deleting "unwanted" enhances can make for fairly huge levels of
inf vs those who combine/delete/sell all at nearest store.

Xocyll
--
I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr

 

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On Fri, 04 Feb 2005 21:20:10 +0100, Magnus Itland <itlandm@online.no>
wrote:

>Oh, I'm well aware that the grey-con hunters are customers just as much as
>I am. I just happen to think it's a bad move to build in features that
>detract from the atmosphere they've spent so much time and energy to
>create in the first place. I think it is a poor investment and they would
>do better to think of their core customers.

And what's wrong with hunting gray cons? Can't you say it's detracting
from the atmosphere to have heroes passing up criminals because
they're "gray con" and, thus, don't give xp for the kill anymore?

--
Dark Tyger

Sympathy for the retailer:
http://www.actsofgord.com/index.html
"Door's to your left" -Gord
(I have no association with this site. Just thought it was funny as hell)

Protect free speech: http://stopfcc.com/

 

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"Dark Tyger" <darktiger@somewhere.net> wrote in message
news:3en701le8tdt417q07spnltaj29a5vvrvq@4ax.com...
| On Fri, 04 Feb 2005 21:20:10 +0100, Magnus Itland <itlandm@online.no>
| wrote:
|
| >Oh, I'm well aware that the grey-con hunters are customers just as much
as
| >I am. I just happen to think it's a bad move to build in features that
| >detract from the atmosphere they've spent so much time and energy to
| >create in the first place. I think it is a poor investment and they
would
| >do better to think of their core customers.
|
| And what's wrong with hunting gray cons? Can't you say it's detracting
| from the atmosphere to have heroes passing up criminals because
| they're "gray con" and, thus, don't give xp for the kill anymore?
|
| --
| Dark Tyger

Justice never sleeps when evil lurks in the night.

 

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On Fri, 04 Feb 2005 12:41:18 -0800, Dark Tyger <darktiger@somewhere.net>
wrote:

> And what's wrong with hunting gray cons? Can't you say it's detracting
> from the atmosphere to have heroes passing up criminals because
> they're "gray con" and, thus, don't give xp for the kill anymore?

In worlds with a high superhero density, there usually exists a tacit
agreement that the most powerful heroes concentrate on cosmic threats and
leave the purse snatchers to the less powerful heroes. Oh, there are
exceptions, and they can make good stories ... but that's because there
usually is a story behind it. You plum don't see Silver Surfer snatching a
bunch of villains before the nose of a younger hero, explaining "Sorry, I
need to defeat 200 of these". There is, or ought to be, a good story to
tell if you hunt villains that are helpless before you.

Now, I'm not saying all servers should be RP servers or anything. I just
don't think the devs should actively encourage things that go counter to
their original vision.

--
"When someone starts bragging about how much debt they have, it's not a
good sign." -G

 

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"Magnus Itland" <itlandm@online.no> wrote in message
news😱pslsj8cmmb52ai9@news.online.no...
> On Fri, 04 Feb 2005 12:41:18 -0800, Dark Tyger <darktiger@somewhere.net>
> wrote:
>
> > And what's wrong with hunting gray cons? Can't you say it's detracting
> > from the atmosphere to have heroes passing up criminals because
> > they're "gray con" and, thus, don't give xp for the kill anymore?
>
> In worlds with a high superhero density, there usually exists a tacit
> agreement that the most powerful heroes concentrate on cosmic threats and
> leave the purse snatchers to the less powerful heroes. Oh, there are
> exceptions, and they can make good stories ... but that's because there
> usually is a story behind it. You plum don't see Silver Surfer snatching a
> bunch of villains before the nose of a younger hero, explaining "Sorry, I
> need to defeat 200 of these". There is, or ought to be, a good story to
> tell if you hunt villains that are helpless before you.
>

Some big heroes do sweat the small stuff.

Superman has known to deal with his share of petty criminals. No matter
what level of scrapper you assign to the Batman, he doesn't turn a blind eye
to much either.

My characters with area-effects powers will usually toss out an area-attack
or two to drop some petty baddies they meet along the way. I won't if there
are small heroes engaging or close and only hit ones where there's a
civillian involved. Baddies keeping to themselves don't get the treatment.


--
John Trauger,
Vorlonagent

"Methane martini.
Shaken, not stirred."

"The very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common.
Instead of altering their views to fit the facts, they alter the facts to
fit their views
....which can be very uncomfortable if you happen to be one of the facts that
needs altering."
-The Doctor

 

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I'm only 10 but when I run through Atlas or Galaxy I still stop
muggings I see, specially if its an old lady involved. I leave
random gatherings of baddies alone and don't bother ones that have a
lower level hero around. I can one shot the grays and I feel bad NOT
helping so I take a few seconds to help "keep the peace".