[SOLVED] I think microsoft is lying about tpm requirements

[Sapnil]

I have a particularly old cpu with tpm 1.2 which according to microsoft cannot run core isolation. but when i enable core isolation it works completely fine. i think microsoft is trying to force people to buy new devices for upgrading to windows 11.

 

[USAFRet]

I have a particularly old cpu with tpm 1.2 which according to microsoft cannot run core isolation. but when i enable core isolation it works completely fine. i think microsoft is trying to force people to buy new devices for upgrading to windows 11.

What does Microsoft get out of people buying new hardware?

Even if that were true, people don't buy new hardware just to run a new OS.

 

[Colif]

MS were asking makers to include tpm in win 10 hardware for 6 years now, but they didn't. They enfirced it in11 but the only people who suffered were the users on hardware that should have had the features but didn't as hardware markers ignored MS. New hardware willl have it going forward as they can't blame MS now.

MS doesn't gain but it sure is pushing OEM laptops on their website for buying win 11, and the pause in releasing win 11 USB means more people who want it (for some reason) have to buy an OEM PC with it on it now. Sure, the stalling on win 11 USB might be to sell old Win 10 USB, since you can use that key to upgrade to 11. I don't know.

Even if that were true, people don't buy new hardware just to run a new OS.

maybe not on PC but they sure do on Apple and Mobiles.

 

[USAFRet]

maybe not on PC but they sure do on Apple and Mobiles.

Well, you are talking about Apple people...lol

But even there, its not just the new version of iOS, but the next version of the iPhone hardware as well.

And of course the manufacturer purposely subverting old versions to nudge you to buy new.

 

[USAFRet]

Sure, the stalling on win 11 USB might be to sell old Win 10 USB, since you can use that key to upgrade to 11.

Just yesterday, I upgraded a vanilla Win 11 Home install to Win 11 Pro, with a Windows 8 license I obtained almost a decade ago.

 

[Colif]

I doubt they won't sell win 11 licenses, its just a matter of time. They can't assume everyone has one.

 

[USAFRet]

I doubt they won't sell win 11 licenses, its just a matter of time. They can't assume everyone has one.

Oh, they will.
But that is no different than selling Win 10 licenses.

If you're building up a new PC, you need a license either way. $0 difference.

 

[Colif]

Oh, they will.
But that is no different than selling Win 10 licenses.

If you're building up a new PC, you need a license either way. $0 difference.

Almost like win 10 and 11, no difference.

 

[Colif]

i wonder how many people who NEEDED win 11 when it first was announced have woken up to fact its almost the same as win 10 with just a few visual tweeks, and that running around like a headless chicken for a few months to get it really wasn't worth the time.

I still do wish it had something new I actually used. Windows Terminal is nice but you can get that in Win 10.

 

[punkncat]

Up till now, making that comparison between Apple/Mobile and PC just wasn't valid. MS rarely enforced any level of aged obsolescence on anything even close to modern. If you didn't mind the speed issue you can go install W10 on a Core2Duo machine (and older) and that's starting to be what, 12-14 years back?

Try to do that with Apple or Mobile.

 

[Colif]

win 10 was special, it was an attempt to condense the number of OS they had to support by letting almost anyone install it on PC, obviously they not as concerned about that now 6 years later. Windows 10 did what it was designed to do, the number of purists on win 7 and 8 must be way lower now.

 

[Sapnil]

What does Microsoft get out of people buying new hardware?

Even if that were true, people don't buy new hardware just to run a new OS.

you need new motherboards for newer versions of tpm and the discrete modules dont have so much compatibility. And people do need new hardware for running new os as win 11 graphics requirements was dx 12 which many people with older pcs like me may have trouble running. I had to get an gpu to run win 11. Microsoft could have some tie-ups with manufacturers and earn an extra bit of money out of it.

 

[Colif]

My GTX 960 from 6 years ago was DX12, its hardly a new feature of GPU.
GTX 660 range GPU were DX 12. And they are 10 years old.
AMD is less clear but there were a few back in 2015 - https://solidlystated.com/hardware/list-of-directx-12-and-directx-11-compatible-video-cards/
How old was your GPU that you needed to upgrade it to run WIn 11?

You need a mb from last 4 years or so. There are a few that don't pass and a few older ones that do.

undoubtedly making something just from letting other makers have their laptops/PC on the site you use to buy Win 11 now, and the deals for having it on new PC.

Its also a way for OEM to sell new PC to a market that didn't really need them. Lots of current PC can run win 11 but the owners wouldn't know it and wouldn't know to update bios or turn on features. That alone will push up sales. MS and OEM win.

 

[hotaru.hino]

I have a particularly old cpu with tpm 1.2 which according to microsoft cannot run core isolation. but when i enable core isolation it works completely fine. i think microsoft is trying to force people to buy new devices for upgrading to windows 11.

Microsoft also stated they would be supporting Windows 10 until 2025. There's no real reason to upgrade to Windows 11 any time soon. And by the time 2025 rolls around, the oldest CPU that Microsoft officially supports for Windows 11 would be 8 years old and Intel has long since discontinued. There's also nothing stopping you from continuing to use Windows 10 after that point, other than that you'll have an increasingly insecure system as time goes on and the OS goes without patches.

If anything, system builders don't really have any motivation to sell you anything better for as long as they can. Case in point, back in the second half of 2006, system builders were still selling computers with 256MB of RAM as the base model. I had a midrange gaming PC in 2003 that 512MB. Even today, there are system builders trying to sell you computers with CPUs that can handle two threads and 4GB of RAM in single channel memory. This might've passed for a decent computer 10 years ago, but today? You're better off wiping Windows off it and throwing on Linux with an xfce desktop environment.

And people do need new hardware for running new os as win 11 graphics requirements was dx 12 which many people with older pcs like me may have trouble running. I had to get an gpu to run win 11. Microsoft could have some tie-ups with manufacturers and earn an extra bit of money out of it.

Most GPUs made in the past 9 years support DirectX 12, even if they were marketed as DirectX 11 GPUs at the time. The basic requirement for DirectX 12 compatibility is all of the DirectX 11 features. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct3D#Direct3D_12_levels

 

[USAFRet]

And people do need new hardware for running new os as win 11 graphics requirements was dx 12 which many people with older pcs like me may have trouble running.

But there is no real need or requirement to run Win 11 at all...
Not for several years to come.

 

[Sapnil]

My GTX 960 from 6 years ago was DX12, its hardly a new feature of GPU. GTX 660 range GPU were DX 12. And they are 10 years old. AMD is less clear but there were a few back in 2015 - https://solidlystated.com/hardware/list-of-directx-12-and-directx-11-compatible-video-cards/ How old was your GPU that you needed to upgrade it to run WIn 11? You need a mb from last 4 years or so. There are a few that don't pass and a few older ones that do. undoubtedly making something just from letting other makers have their laptops/PC on the site you use to buy Win 11 now, and the deals for having it on new PC. Its also a way for OEM to sell new PC to a market that didn't really need them. Lots of current PC can run win 11 but the owners wouldn't know it and wouldn't know to update bios or turn on features. That alone will push up sales. MS and OEM win. Well, I had an igpu with dx 11 and I had to get the gt 710

 

[hotaru.hino]

Well, I had an igpu with dx 11 and I had to get the gt 710

The drivers also have to have a DX12 path for the GPU, even if it's DX11 compliant. The first GPU to receive DX12 support from Intel were those in the 4th gen CPUs. Except Intel recently removed support for those due to a security vulnerability.

In any case, I'm sure Windows 11 could run a Core i7-920 from back in the day just fine. And you might ask "why doesn't Microsoft just let us install the OS on whatever can run it?" Because Microsoft wants to push a standard feature set and it just so happened this feature set works best with TPM 2.0. Keep in mind that Microsoft's biggest customer isn't really the consumers, despite Windows being on a vast majority of personal computers. Their biggest customer, i.e., the people who give Microsoft most of their revenue, are businesses. And the whole security thing I would argue was more to help build confidence to businesses (especially ones that rely heavily on remote and cloud) that the security is solid.

Also, Microsoft doesn't want to support hardware that isn't supported by the manufacturers themselves. Intel discontinued support for Kaby Lake last year. AMD doesn't support anything before Ryzen. If you want to ask what the big deal is, the OS talks intimately with the hardware. If there's any issues and Microsoft can pinpoint it to a hardware problem, they're pretty much out of luck because the manufacturers won't support them (at least maybe, not without a hefty cost).

Of course, it's easy to point the finger and beat down Microsoft because their OS is the thing you look at first.