IDE storage prices tumbling?

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I have not been keeping a close watch on the price of IDE hard disks here in
the UK but I took a look at prices recently and they seem to have fallen a
lot.

I know it's all "faster and cheaper" with a lot of computer equipment but it
seems that HDDs have really taken a big drop.

I am looking at paying no more than £60 (about $105) for a 160 GB hard drive
from a reputable manufacturer (WD, Seagate, Samsung) including all taxes.

Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?

Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?
 
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Davis Rorgh wrote:

> I have not been keeping a close watch on the price of IDE hard disks here
> in the UK but I took a look at prices recently and they seem to have
> fallen a lot.
>
> I know it's all "faster and cheaper" with a lot of computer equipment but
> it seems that HDDs have really taken a big drop.
>
> I am looking at paying no more than £60 (about $105) for a 160 GB hard
> drive from a reputable manufacturer (WD, Seagate, Samsung) including all
> taxes.
>
> Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?
>
> Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?

I think it's due to the slow introduction of newer drives at the high end of
the market.

--
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Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
 
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In article <Xns956779E996897AF39@127.0.0.1>, jo@nomail.com says...
> I have not been keeping a close watch on the price of IDE hard disks here in
> the UK but I took a look at prices recently and they seem to have fallen a
> lot.
>
> I know it's all "faster and cheaper" with a lot of computer equipment but it
> seems that HDDs have really taken a big drop.
>
> I am looking at paying no more than £60 (about $105) for a 160 GB hard drive
> from a reputable manufacturer (WD, Seagate, Samsung) including all taxes.
>
> Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?
>
> Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?

There are many factors. Part of it is that computer sales didn't rise
quite as much as forcast, so there is a bit of oversupply. Also, the
shrinking number, but much bigger, computer system manufacturers (Dell,
HP, etc..) are putting more and more pressure on the drive manufacturers
to cut costs.

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> Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?
>
> Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?

They were holding at about $1 per GB for a while (little more for smaller
drives), and recently look to be about $0.80 per GB. SATA could be part of
the reason, but even SATA drives went down recently too.

My only complaint about the bigger drives is they don't offer much advantage
in speed. The fact that going from 7200 to 10000 RPM (about a 50% increase
in speed) doubles your sales price is an indication that they've hit a wall.
I don't know what to expect but unless they can up the bus speed (SATA 300
or even 600) and have every drive contain an internal RAID or something
there's not much reason to buy new hard drives these days.

Actually it seems like a lot of component technology is hitting the wall
these days. One exception I think is flash drives. They're up to 2 GB now
(maybe 4 GB). That's pretty impressive considering that 6 years ago you
were lucky if your internal hard drive was that size.
 

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"Davis Rorgh" <jo@nomail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns956779E996897AF39@127.0.0.1...
> I have not been keeping a close watch on the price of IDE hard disks here
in
> the UK but I took a look at prices recently and they seem to have fallen a
> lot.
>
> I know it's all "faster and cheaper" with a lot of computer equipment but
it
> seems that HDDs have really taken a big drop.
>
> I am looking at paying no more than £60 (about $105) for a 160 GB hard
drive
> from a reputable manufacturer (WD, Seagate, Samsung) including all taxes.
>
> Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?
>
> Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?

Have you noticed the 40Gb hdd's are getting more difficult to find at the
big box stores and have almost doubled in price to ~$80 USD.

I agree with a comment in the thread - flash memory appears destined to take
over for <5 Gb applications.
 

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David Besack wrote:
>>Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?
>>
>>Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?
>
>
> They were holding at about $1 per GB for a while (little more for smaller
> drives), and recently look to be about $0.80 per GB.

Is that Australian dollars? Lately Fry's seems routinely to have drives
in the U.S. 50 cents/GB ballpark, often without rebates.

SATA could be part of
> the reason, but even SATA drives went down recently too.
>
> My only complaint about the bigger drives is they don't offer much advantage
> in speed. The fact that going from 7200 to 10000 RPM (about a 50% increase
> in speed) doubles your sales price is an indication that they've hit a wall.
> I don't know what to expect but unless they can up the bus speed (SATA 300
> or even 600) and have every drive contain an internal RAID or something
> there's not much reason to buy new hard drives these days.
>
> Actually it seems like a lot of component technology is hitting the wall
> these days. One exception I think is flash drives. They're up to 2 GB now
> (maybe 4 GB). That's pretty impressive considering that 6 years ago you
> were lucky if your internal hard drive was that size.
>
>


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In article <414B084E.30001@prodigy.net>, abujlehc@prodigy.net says...
> David Besack wrote:
> >>Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?
> >>
> >>Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?
> >
> >
> > They were holding at about $1 per GB for a while (little more for smaller
> > drives), and recently look to be about $0.80 per GB.
>
> Is that Australian dollars? Lately Fry's seems routinely to have drives
> in the U.S. 50 cents/GB ballpark, often without rebates.

I just bought a 120G Seagate ST3120026A (8M buffer) from Best Buy.
Price is US$109.99, but there is $50 in rebates. That gives about
$0.50/G.

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In article <EBE2d.30070$aW5.25337@fed1read07>, someone@spamfree.com
says...
>
> "Davis Rorgh" <jo@nomail.com> wrote in message
> news:Xns956779E996897AF39@127.0.0.1...
> > I have not been keeping a close watch on the price of IDE hard disks here
> in
> > the UK but I took a look at prices recently and they seem to have fallen a
> > lot.
> >
> > I know it's all "faster and cheaper" with a lot of computer equipment but
> it
> > seems that HDDs have really taken a big drop.
> >
> > I am looking at paying no more than £60 (about $105) for a 160 GB hard
> drive
> > from a reputable manufacturer (WD, Seagate, Samsung) including all taxes.
> >
> > Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?
> >
> > Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?
>
> Have you noticed the 40Gb hdd's are getting more difficult to find at the
> big box stores and have almost doubled in price to ~$80 USD.

Small capacities are becoming the domain of tiny drives like laptop
2.5" or smaller. The very tiny (under 10G) is turning to Flash.

It's simple supply/demand. Nobody wants only 40G in a 3.5" drive
anymore, so manufacturers are phasing them out. Everybody wants those
monstrous 250G+ things to store all their illegal copies of music,
movies and porn.

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Fri, 17 Sep 2004 11:08:38 -0400: written by "David Besack"
<daveREMOVEbesack@mac.com>:

>these days. One exception I think is flash drives. They're up to 2 GB now
>(maybe 4 GB).

Definitely 4GB. I saw a flyer at work for some place called usbmall.com
that had the 4GB listed.

WAY EXPENSIVE though. They had it for like $800 if I remember
correctly. !?!?! Sorry, I don't need it *that* bad.
 
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David Besack wrote:

> My only complaint about the bigger drives is they don't offer much advantage
> in speed. The fact that going from 7200 to 10000 RPM (about a 50% increase
> in speed) doubles your sales price is an indication that they've hit a wall.
> I don't know what to expect but unless they can up the bus speed (SATA 300
> or even 600) and have every drive contain an internal RAID or something
> there's not much reason to buy new hard drives these days.

Increasing the bus speed isn't useful for a single drive. The fastest
drives in existence barely peak at 100Mb/sec, AFAIR. The bus speed
business is more marketing hype than anything else.

The phrase "internal RAID" is something of an oxymoron. The "A" in RAID
stands for "array" so obviously you've got a collection of disks. The
only form of RAID that theoretically delivers significant performance
improvements is the striped variant, and you pay the price of losing a
lot more data if one drive fails.

> Actually it seems like a lot of component technology is hitting the wall
> these days. One exception I think is flash drives. They're up to 2 GB now
> (maybe 4 GB). That's pretty impressive considering that 6 years ago you
> were lucky if your internal hard drive was that size.

It's a question of focus. Hard drives being sold in mass-produced
consumer desktop machines are being sold on size and low price, not on
performance. Disks that are tuned for optimal performance tend to be
sought only by enthusiasts or those building high-end
workstations/low-end servers, thus they are more specialized and more
expensive.

--

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"David Besack" <daveREMOVEbesack@mac.com> wrote in message news:cieulm$bmh5$1@netnews.upenn.edu
> > Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?
> >
> > Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?
>
> They were holding at about $1 per GB for a while (little more for smaller
> drives), and recently look to be about $0.80 per GB. SATA could be part of
> the reason, but even SATA drives went down recently too.
>
> My only complaint about the bigger drives is they don't offer much advantage
> in speed. The fact that going from 7200 to 10000 RPM (about a 50% increase
> in speed) doubles your sales price is an indication that they've hit a wall.
> I don't know what to expect but unless they can up the bus speed (SATA 300
> or even 600) and have every drive contain an internal RAID or something
> there's not much reason to buy new hard drives these days.
>
> Actually it seems like a lot of component technology is hitting the wall
> these days. One exception I think is flash drives. They're up to 2 GB now
> (maybe 4 GB).

> That's pretty impressive considering that 6 years ago you
> were lucky if your internal hard drive was that size.

Try 9-10 years back.
 
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David Besack wrote:
>
> > Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?
> >
> > Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?
>
> They were holding at about $1 per GB for a while (little more for smaller
> drives), and recently look to be about $0.80 per GB. SATA could be part of
> the reason, but even SATA drives went down recently too.
>
> My only complaint about the bigger drives is they don't offer much advantage
> in speed. The fact that going from 7200 to 10000 RPM (about a 50% increase
> in speed) doubles your sales price is an indication that they've hit a wall.
> I don't know what to expect but unless they can up the bus speed (SATA 300
> or even 600) and have every drive contain an internal RAID or something
> there's not much reason to buy new hard drives these days.

You need a fast drive and you need a large drive, but not necessarily at the
same time. A small fast drive (~40 GB) and a large slower drive will do nicely.
The larger the data volume, the more permanent it tends to be.

> Actually it seems like a lot of component technology is hitting the wall
> these days. One exception I think is flash drives. They're up to 2 GB now
> (maybe 4 GB). That's pretty impressive considering that 6 years ago you
> were lucky if your internal hard drive was that size.

Flash and hard drives aren't really in the same business. They only overlap
at the fringe where costs are still high.
 
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"Davis Rorgh" <jo@nomail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns956779E996897AF39@127.0.0.1...

SNIP!

Please don't crosspost. People replying don't notice and as a result
inappropriate stuff gets posted to some of the groups - e.g. the uk groups
are not really interested in discussions of the price of hard disks and
vendors in the US.

NB - this is deliberately crossposted as per the original as I don't know
which group(s) the OP may be reading to follow this thread.

Tony
 
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TMack wrote:

>
> "Davis Rorgh" <jo@nomail.com> wrote in message
> news:Xns956779E996897AF39@127.0.0.1...
>
> SNIP!
>
> Please don't crosspost.

Pleas DO crosspost when it is appropriate, which, in this case, it appears
to have been. If he did not crosspost then several different people would
probably waste their time telling him things that someone has already said
adequately because they would not know that he had posted the same question
in multiple places or that it had already been answered.

> People replying don't notice and as a result
> inappropriate stuff gets posted to some of the groups - e.g. the uk groups
> are not really interested in discussions of the price of hard disks and
> vendors in the US.

However, since he stated specifically that he is in the UK that concern does
not apply now, does it? What do you do, look for crossposting and whine
before you read the content?

> NB - this is deliberately crossposted as per the original as I don't know
> which group(s) the OP may be reading to follow this thread.

> Tony

--
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Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
 
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"J. Clarke" wrote:
>
> TMack wrote:
>
> >
> > "Davis Rorgh" <jo@nomail.com> wrote in message
> > news:Xns956779E996897AF39@127.0.0.1...
> >
> > SNIP!
> >
> > Please don't crosspost.
>
> Pleas DO crosspost when it is appropriate, which, in this case, it appears
> to have been. If he did not crosspost then several different people would
> probably waste their time telling him things that someone has already said
> adequately because they would not know that he had posted the same question
> in multiple places or that it had already been answered.

Everybody have their own opinion about cross posting. Personally, I hate it
since it is usually used for broadcasting rather than intelligent discussion.
Typically, the OP 'hit and run', i.e. never enter the subsequent discussion.
 
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"someone" <someone@spamfree.com> wrote in message
news:EBE2d.30070$aW5.25337@fed1read07...
>
> "Davis Rorgh" <jo@nomail.com> wrote in message
> news:Xns956779E996897AF39@127.0.0.1...
> > I have not been keeping a close watch on the price of IDE hard disks
here
> in
> > the UK but I took a look at prices recently and they seem to have fallen
a
> > lot.
> >
> > I know it's all "faster and cheaper" with a lot of computer equipment
but
> it
> > seems that HDDs have really taken a big drop.
> >
> > I am looking at paying no more than £60 (about $105) for a 160 GB hard
> drive
> > from a reputable manufacturer (WD, Seagate, Samsung) including all
taxes.
> >
> > Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?
> >
> > Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?
>
> Have you noticed the 40Gb hdd's are getting more difficult to find at the
> big box stores and have almost doubled in price to ~$80 USD.
>
> I agree with a comment in the thread - flash memory appears destined to
take
> over for <5 Gb applications.
>
Hmmm - Thats an interesting comment.

If the size of affordable flash memory catches up with the minimum size of
an installed OS,
you could put you OS on a flash drive and data on an IDE dirves. Instant on!
and fast!
Anbody doing this yet?
 
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Terry Wilson wrote:

> "someone" <someone@spamfree.com> wrote in message
> news:EBE2d.30070$aW5.25337@fed1read07...
>
>>"Davis Rorgh" <jo@nomail.com> wrote in message
>>news:Xns956779E996897AF39@127.0.0.1...
>>
>>>I have not been keeping a close watch on the price of IDE hard disks
>
> here
>
>>in
>>
>>>the UK but I took a look at prices recently and they seem to have fallen
>
> a
>
>>>lot.
>>>
>>>I know it's all "faster and cheaper" with a lot of computer equipment
>
> but
>
>>it
>>
>>>seems that HDDs have really taken a big drop.
>>>
>>>I am looking at paying no more than £60 (about $105) for a 160 GB hard
>>
>>drive
>>
>>>from a reputable manufacturer (WD, Seagate, Samsung) including all
>
> taxes.
>
>>>Have IDE HDD prices fallen more than normal?
>>>
>>>Is this because of theintroduction of SATA?
>>
>>Have you noticed the 40Gb hdd's are getting more difficult to find at the
>>big box stores and have almost doubled in price to ~$80 USD.
>>
>>I agree with a comment in the thread - flash memory appears destined to
>
> take
>
>>over for <5 Gb applications.
>>
>
> Hmmm - Thats an interesting comment.
>
> If the size of affordable flash memory catches up with the minimum size of
> an installed OS,
> you could put you OS on a flash drive and data on an IDE dirves. Instant on!
> and fast!
> Anbody doing this yet?
>
>

Flash drives are not quite as fast as you may think.

Here's a place that has flash drives large enough...

http://www.dpie.com/storage/at2550.html

Note the Read Transfer Rate is 9.5 MBytes/sec, sustained. That doesn't
compare real well to the sustained read rate of modern hard drives.

What does compare very well is the almost 0, specifically .1ms, 'seek'
times as there's nothing mechanical to move around 'seeking'.
 
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David Maynard wrote:
> Terry Wilson wrote:
>
>> "someone" <someone@spamfree.com> wrote in message
>> news:EBE2d.30070$aW5.25337@fed1read07...
>>
>>> "Davis Rorgh" <jo@nomail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:Xns956779E996897AF39@127.0.0.1...
>>>
>>> I agree with a comment in the thread - flash memory appears
>>> destined to take over for <5 Gb applications.
>>>
>>
>> Hmmm - Thats an interesting comment.
>>
>> If the size of affordable flash memory catches up with the minimum
>> size of an installed OS,
>> you could put you OS on a flash drive and data on an IDE dirves.
>> Instant on! and fast!
>> Anbody doing this yet?
>>
>>
>
> Flash drives are not quite as fast as you may think.
>
> Here's a place that has flash drives large enough...
>
> http://www.dpie.com/storage/at2550.html
>
> Note the Read Transfer Rate is 9.5 MBytes/sec, sustained. That doesn't
> compare real well to the sustained read rate of modern hard drives.
>
> What does compare very well is the almost 0, specifically .1ms, 'seek'
> times as there's nothing mechanical to move around 'seeking'.

...and the lack of any noise whatsoever, and much more resistant to
physical shock.

Remember flash memory has limited write-cycles though, so its not suitable
for your page file !

CF-IDE adaptors are cheap, then just choose the size of CompactFlash
card required.
--
Mike
 
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Mike Redrobe wrote:

> David Maynard wrote:
>
>>Terry Wilson wrote:
>>
>>
>>>"someone" <someone@spamfree.com> wrote in message
>>>news:EBE2d.30070$aW5.25337@fed1read07...
>>>
>>>
>>>>"Davis Rorgh" <jo@nomail.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:Xns956779E996897AF39@127.0.0.1...
>>>>
>>>>I agree with a comment in the thread - flash memory appears
>>>>destined to take over for <5 Gb applications.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Hmmm - Thats an interesting comment.
>>>
>>>If the size of affordable flash memory catches up with the minimum
>>>size of an installed OS,
>>>you could put you OS on a flash drive and data on an IDE dirves.
>>>Instant on! and fast!
>>>Anbody doing this yet?
>>>
>>>
>>
>>Flash drives are not quite as fast as you may think.
>>
>>Here's a place that has flash drives large enough...
>>
>>http://www.dpie.com/storage/at2550.html
>>
>>Note the Read Transfer Rate is 9.5 MBytes/sec, sustained. That doesn't
>>compare real well to the sustained read rate of modern hard drives.
>>
>>What does compare very well is the almost 0, specifically .1ms, 'seek'
>>times as there's nothing mechanical to move around 'seeking'.
>
>
> ..and the lack of any noise whatsoever, and much more resistant to
> physical shock.

True, and nice features, but not very relevant to the poster's comment
about "Instant on! and fast!"

>
> Remember flash memory has limited write-cycles though, so its not suitable
> for your page file !
>
> CF-IDE adaptors are cheap, then just choose the size of CompactFlash
> card required.
 
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Johannes H Andersen wrote:

>
>
> "J. Clarke" wrote:
>>
>> TMack wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > "Davis Rorgh" <jo@nomail.com> wrote in message
>> > news:Xns956779E996897AF39@127.0.0.1...
>> >
>> > SNIP!
>> >
>> > Please don't crosspost.
>>
>> Pleas DO crosspost when it is appropriate, which, in this case, it
>> appears
>> to have been. If he did not crosspost then several different people
>> would probably waste their time telling him things that someone has
>> already said adequately because they would not know that he had posted
>> the same question in multiple places or that it had already been
>> answered.
>
> Everybody have their own opinion about cross posting. Personally, I hate
> it since it is usually used for broadcasting rather than intelligent
> discussion. Typically, the OP 'hit and run', i.e. never enter the
> subsequent discussion.

Crossposting is a tool, like any other tool, and can be used properly or
improperly. Railing at those who use it properly does not serve any
purpose other than creating the kind of crossposted disturbance that you
were seeking to avoid.


--
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Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
 
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"Folkert Rienstra" <see_reply-to@myweb.nl> wrote:

>> Actually it seems like a lot of component technology is hitting the wall
>> these days. One exception I think is flash drives. They're up to 2 GB now
>> (maybe 4 GB).
>
>> That's pretty impressive considering that 6 years ago you
>> were lucky if your internal hard drive was that size.
>
>Try 9-10 years back.

10 years ago, the biggest IDE drive you could get was a 1G, and most
PC's were still being sold with 540MB and smaller drives. I know this
is correct, because I bought a PC (Dell P90) almost exactly 10 years
ago, and 1G was definitely "the king". 8)
 
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In article <k56uk0l6d5dqrmosdu0780t7j4ihiemg36@4ax.com>, Chrisv wrote:
> 10 years ago, the biggest IDE drive you could get was a 1G, and
> most PC's were still being sold with 540MB and smaller drives. this
> I know is correct, because I bought a PC (Dell P90) almost exactly
> 10 years ago, and 1G was definitely "the king". 8)

We tend to buy mid-market and from my records I have

1992 130MB £264 (all+VAT)
1994 540MB £209
1996 1GB £119

My first ever disk drive was a 5.25" FD on a BBC: £400!

--
Tony Bryer SDA UK 'Software to build on' http://www.sda.co.uk
 
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On 20/09/2004 Tony Bryer wrote:

> In article <k56uk0l6d5dqrmosdu0780t7j4ihiemg36@4ax.com>, Chrisv wrote:
> > 10 years ago, the biggest IDE drive you could get was a 1G, and
> > most PC's were still being sold with 540MB and smaller drives. this
> > I know is correct, because I bought a PC (Dell P90) almost exactly
> > 10 years ago, and 1G was definitely "the king". 8)
>
> We tend to buy mid-market and from my records I have
>
> 1992 130MB £264 (all+VAT)
> 1994 540MB £209
> 1996 1GB £119
>
> My first ever disk drive was a 5.25" FD on a BBC: £400!

Bought from Viglen when they worked out of a shed in a back street
somewhere? Plus of course the Watford DFs, a handful of chips in a
brown paper bag and a photo copied instruction sheet.

I blew the whole of my first ever Xmas bonus on those bits!

--
Jeff Gaines - Damerham Hampshire UK
Posted with XanaNews 1.16.4.6
http://www.wilsonc.demon.co.uk/d7xananews.htm
 

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"Tony Bryer" <tonyb@delme.sda.co.uk> wrote in message
news:VA.00002bf1.00271a7c@delme.sda.co.uk...
> In article <k56uk0l6d5dqrmosdu0780t7j4ihiemg36@4ax.com>, Chrisv wrote:
> > 10 years ago, the biggest IDE drive you could get was a 1G, and
> > most PC's were still being sold with 540MB and smaller drives. this
> > I know is correct, because I bought a PC (Dell P90) almost exactly
> > 10 years ago, and 1G was definitely "the king". 8)
>
> We tend to buy mid-market and from my records I have
>
> 1992 130MB £264 (all+VAT)
> 1994 540MB £209
> 1996 1GB £119
>
> My first ever disk drive was a 5.25" FD on a BBC: £400!
>
> --
> Tony Bryer SDA UK 'Software to build on' http://www.sda.co.uk
>

I've still got invoices from 1996

Sept. 1996
850Mb Seagate's - £84 + vat
1G Quantum Fireball's - £103 + vat

Nov. 97
2.6Gb Fujitsu's - £104 + vat
 
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"chrisv" <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote in message news:k56uk0l6d5dqrmosdu0780t7j4ihiemg36@4ax.com
> "Folkert Rienstra" <see_reply-to@myweb.nl> wrote:
>
> > > Actually it seems like a lot of component technology is hitting the wall
> > > these days. One exception I think is flash drives. They're up to 2 GB now
> > > (maybe 4 GB).
> >
> > > That's pretty impressive considering that 6 years ago you
> > > were lucky if your internal hard drive was that size.
> >
> > Try 9-10 years back.
>
> 10 years ago, the biggest IDE drive you could get was a 1G, and most
> PC's were still being sold with 540MB and smaller drives. I know this
> is correct, because I bought a PC (Dell P90) almost exactly 10 years
> ago, and 1G was definitely "the king". 8)

Well, that is wy I said "9-10 years" ago. ;-)

IBM introduced the DFHS model in 1993-94.
It was available in 1, 2 and 4GB eventually.

I went from the assumption that IDE drives are usually bigger than
SCSI drives but that assumption may be wrong re 10 years back.
Figure that.
IDE/ATA was in it's infant years back then and probably considered toys.
 

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