News Intel 10th Gen Desktop CPU Rivals AMD Ryzen 9 3900X In Early Benchmark Results

[jimmysmitty]

a new gen vs an old gen cpu.
its power draw is likely higher.
its gonna have the Intel tax.
Its MB will be ofc also have intel tax.

also lets not forget...its likely stock ram tuning....ryzen gets benefit from fine tuning your clocks and the IF more so than actually OC'ing the cpu.

Zen 2 was just released. Not sure how you would count it as "old gen". And on a technical level the 10900K would be an older gen than even Ryzen since its just improvements on Skylake and the 14nm process and is 5 years old vs Zen which is only 3 years old.

 

[Giroro]

I wonder if AMD releases a new high end processor to counter the i9-10900KF.
Imagine what could be possible if, some day in the future, AMD finally finds a way to fit more than 12 cores into a single CPU socket....

 

[InvalidError]

I wonder if AMD releases a new high end processor to counter the i9-10900KF.

That would be the 3900X and 3950X AMD launched nearly a year ago or the 4000-series equivalents likely to launch at the end of the year unless delayed into 2021 by all the stuff going on right now.

 

[spongiemaster]

And the Ryzen 3900X isn't by that standard? Two extra cores and PCIe 4.0 for cheaper and less power. Seems like a more workstation-y CPU than the i9 to me.

The platform the CPU is on indicates the intended market. You can use a raspberry pi as a server. It will work, but anything but the most rudimentary uses, it's a bad idea. You can use Epyc CPU's for gaming. They work, but again, it's a bad idea. Threadripper is AMD's workstation platform. Depending on needs, a 3900x would be fine, but that's not the target for that platform. Intel's 10900x is targetted at the workstation market. The X299 platform is almost 3 years old now and still has advantages over the the current X570 for workstation applications. PCI 4.0 is not really an advantage because the market doesn't move with AMD, it moves with Intel. Until Intel rolls out server/HEDT 4.0 platforms, the market will continue to see a dearth of 4.0 peripherals.

 

[cryoburner]

The platform the CPU is on indicates the intended market. You can use a raspberry pi as a server. It will work, but anything but the most rudimentary uses, it's a bad idea. You can use Epyc CPU's for gaming. They work, but again, it's a bad idea.

This is a terrible comparison. For most workstation tasks, heavily-threaded or otherwise, something like a 3900X or 3950X will perform the job just as well if not better than many "workstation" processors, including the previous-year's Threadrippers. I rather doubt AMD is targeting general desktop use and games as the primary market for their 12 and 16-core processors at this point. These are pretty much workstation processors, or at least something filling the gap between AMD's mainstream and HEDT platforms.

 

[Arbie]

Typical Tom's sophistry. Pick only the points on which Intel is competitive and go back and forth on those to create the appearance of even-handedness. Avoid even mentioning - much less discussing - major negatives such as power draw. To match the AMD performance the Intel chip is going to glow. But not a single word about that!

This is why people lose faith in your journalism: because of articles like this which can only be explained by either stunning technical ignorance OR sell-out. So which is it?

Here's another of the same ilk:
https://www.tomshardware.com/features/amd-ryzen-9-3950x-vs-intel-core-i9-9900k
In that article, the fact that Ryzen's sophisticated boost automatically clocks each chip to near its limits is cast as a negative (poor manual overclocking !!) which then cancels out the Ryzen advantage in multi-thread !! So the grossly inferior Intel chip seems just as good overall. Presented as responsible tech journalism... breathtaking.

But, as I noted there, throwing out bogus "face-off" articles like these will at least keep you in good graces with the giant. They'll see that you're doing the best you can for them. So review samples and any other "meet comp" bennies will keep coming.

 

[Arbie]

Zen 2 was just released. Not sure how you would count it as "old gen". And on a technical level the 10900K would be an older gen than even Ryzen since its just improvements on Skylake and the 14nm process and is 5 years old vs Zen which is only 3 years old.

How to muddy the water. The Ryzen 3900 came out last July and was widely available 6-7 months ago. The Intel chip isn't even out yet. That's what the OP was saying. Yet you make the situation seem to be the reverse! Why?

 

[TerryLaze]

Typical Tom's sophistry. Pick only the points on which Intel is competitive and go back and forth on those to create the appearance of even-handedness. Avoid even mentioning - much less discussing - major negatives such as power draw. To match the AMD performance the Intel chip is going to glow. But not a single word about that!

Dude calm down! This is a single leak of a single CPU,it's not like Toms had the opportunity to choose something else let alone do any sort of power draw testing on something they didn't even had in their hands.

This is why people lose faith in your journalism: because of articles like this which can only be explained by either stunning technical ignorance OR sell-out. So which is it?

Yes which one of those DO you fall into?!
You can't even tell if an article is a review or just a story about a leak.

Here's another of the same ilk:
https://www.tomshardware.com/features/amd-ryzen-9-3950x-vs-intel-core-i9-9900k
In that article, the fact that Ryzen's sophisticated boost automatically clocks each chip to near its limits is cast as a negative (poor manual overclocking !!) which then cancels out the Ryzen advantage in multi-thread !!

Intel has an just as sophisticated boost that automatically clocks each chip to near its limits,the difference is that on top of that the 9900k can hold all cores at 4.7Ghz easily with MCE while ryzen runs at around 3.6Ghz average with only one core being able to boost high,this is what then cancels out the Ryzen advantage in multi-thread !!.

View: https://youtu.be/3LesYlfhv3o?t=408

But, as I noted there, throwing out bogus "face-off" articles like these will at least keep you in good graces with the giant. They'll see that you're doing the best you can for them. So review samples and any other "meet comp" bennies will keep coming.

Put on your tin foil hat or something,take a breath nobody is trying to drill into your brain.

 

[st379]

Intel has an just as sophisticated boost that automatically clocks each chip to near its limits,the difference is that on top of that the 9900k can hold all cores at 4.7Ghz easily with MCE while ryzen runs at around 3.6Ghz average with only one core being able to boost high,this is what then cancels out the Ryzen advantage in multi-thread !!.

Really? So 9900k is better in multi thread? lol are you sure you know what you are talking about? In some benchmarks the 3950x has more than 2 times the performance.
In Heavily threaded benchmarks it even destroy Intel HEDT cpu. I have no idea what heavily threaded benchmarks did you check.
People with water cooling and PBO got their cpu to 4.1 ghz all cores without manual overclocking.
Where the 3.6 ghz all cores boost? Internal benchmark in your mind that you make?

 

[chaz69]

I wonder what cooling he used. Last time Intel forgot to mention it was industrial chiller.

* slowly puts LN2 in pocket

 

[travsb1984]

I hope AMD does a thin bin product with Zen3. Intel and Nvidia are the masters of halo products of which everything else is compared. Take the 9900KS it was around for a few months and is now gone. Intel got what they wanted out of the product having it on every review site and chart. I have a feeling this is going to be similar high priced, low volume thin binned product.

Yup, the old leprechaun product that sits atop all the benchmark spreadsheets but is never to be seen in the wild... I try to ignore the scores of products I don't intend to buy these days anyways. In the past todays $500 part was next years $200 part, but sadly that's rarely the case any more...

 

[st379]

* slowly puts LN2 in pocket

Lol... better hide it behind a desk. You do not want LN2 touching your skin.

 

[jimmysmitty]

How to muddy the water. The Ryzen 3900 came out last July and was widely available 6-7 months ago. The Intel chip isn't even out yet. That's what the OP was saying. Yet you make the situation seem to be the reverse! Why?

Does not negate the point though. From a technical standpoint, the 10900K is an older generation technology. The only one newer than Zen 2 would be Tiger Lake in laptops which is a new uArch and not based on the same Skylake design from 2015.

 

[Arbie]

You can't even tell if an article is a review or just a story about a leak.

More sophistry.

Review or report on a leak doesn't matter - the standards are the same. A Tom's headline followed by an uncritical discussion of what's known will obviously leave the impression that "AMD should be worried because Intel has a 3900X contender coming". You know this; Tom's knows this; and Intel knows this. It happens too often to be a mistake.

Folks who don't know enough to notice what's omitted will be misled. And those are exactly the people Tom's should be helping.

Instead we get biased reports, reviews, and comparisons, defended by muddy-the-water virtuosos. These argue that the tech savvy won't be misled because they know the score anyway... or something... doesn't matter as long as it seems to make a case. And that's just in the forum.

Meanwhile the headline is there and the damage done.

 

[spongiemaster]

This is a terrible comparison. For most workstation tasks, heavily-threaded or otherwise, something like a 3900X or 3950X will perform the job just as well if not better than many "workstation" processors, including the previous-year's Threadrippers. I rather doubt AMD is targeting general desktop use and games as the primary market for their 12 and 16-core processors at this point. These are pretty much workstation processors, or at least something filling the gap between AMD's mainstream and HEDT platforms.

You buy the system based on the applications you plan to run on them. Some benefit from more cores, some benefit from higher clock speeds. Intel and AMD design platforms with intended target audiences. That doesn't mean you can't use non-targetted options. Not sure why this is such a controversial idea to you.

 

[InvalidError]

The only one newer than Zen 2 would be Tiger Lake in laptops which is a new uArch and not based on the same Skylake design from 2015.

Except Tiger Lake (Willow Cove) isn't the only newer Intel architecture on the market since Skylake. Ice Lake (Sunny Cove) is currently the newest architecture available.

As for "not being based on Skylake", if you look at a block diagram from Nehalem (first-gen i-series) and compare to Sunny Cove, they are nearly identical apart from resources getting shuffled and resized as process technology allowed and software models dictated. Pretty much the same goes for AMD. They don't re-invent the whole thing with each "new" architecture, only the bits that yield the greatest benefits based on available process gains and updated software models.

Intel is tapped out on what it can achieve on 14nm, so 14nm isn't getting any new architectures. There is that hypothetical Tiger Lake back-port which I suspect will be primarily intended at addressing hardware vulnerabilities, not increased overall performance. You will likely need to wait for Alder Lake (possibly using Golden Cove) for that.

 

[jimmysmitty]

Except Tiger Lake (Willow Cove) isn't the only newer Intel architecture on the market since Skylake. Ice Lake (Sunny Cove) is currently the newest architecture available.

As for "not being based on Skylake", if you look at a block diagram from Nehalem (first-gen i-series) and compare to Sunny Cove, they are nearly identical apart from resources getting shuffled and resized as process technology allowed and software models dictated. Pretty much the same goes for AMD. They don't re-invent the whole thing with each "new" architecture, only the bits that yield the greatest benefits based on available process gains and updated software models.

Intel is tapped out on what it can achieve on 14nm, so 14nm isn't getting any new architectures. There is that hypothetical Tiger Lake back-port which I suspect will be primarily intended at addressing hardware vulnerabilities, not increased overall performance. You will likely need to wait for Alder Lake (possibly using Golden Cove) for that.

I understand that but Ice Lake/Tiger Lake is the first major change to the uArch since Skylake. Comet Lake is pretty much Skylake with improvements. Ice Lake made some major changes.

Never said either reinvented the wheel. Just that from a technical stand point Comet Lake is an older generation uArch than Zen which was a major change from Bulldozer.

 

[Bamda]

I am not even close to getting another Intel until they upgrade to PCIe 4.0 specification and add more PCIe Lanes. Sorry, but I want an updated CPU for the new decade, not an old rehashed CPU from the previous decade.

 

[chaz69]

Yup, the old leprechaun product that sits atop all the benchmark spreadsheets but is never to be seen in the wild... I try to ignore the scores of products I don't intend to buy these days anyways. In the past todays $500 part was next years $200 part, but sadly that's rarely the case any more...

I have a 9900ks sitting right behind me just awaiting a different psu, i received a thermaltake grand toughpower12oow along with it. Unfortunately they apparently suicide upon startup.

 

[InvalidError]

I have a 9900ks sitting right behind me just awaiting a different psu

Good for you. For the most part though, it has always been a limited availability item and may already have been discontinued to prevent it from overlapping with the 10700k.