Intel Core i7-975 Extreme And i7-950 Reviewed

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[citation][nom]The Third Level[/nom]Also people seem to forget that Phenom II is not a direct challenger to the i7 anyway.[/citation]

It's also AMD's fastest offering right now, and therefore belongs in the comparison (in this author's humble opinion). The information is there for those who want it--if you don't like the comparison, try not to look at those numbers ;-)
 
Razz,

If you have a hardware store, and really do sell stuff, I feel so bad for your customers. But, I really doubt you do.

Oh, and thanks for proving the author's point that there are you whackos that think the Phenom II is faster. For everyone who said he was making it, let me introduce you to razzb3d. He's proof they are out there, and if he's telling the truth, selling hardware 🙁 .
 
On gaming, the I7 shines only on SLI/Crossfire (and something on overclocking).

I miss the SLI/Crossfire tests, but I'm checking tomshardware daily. :)

 
[citation][nom]marraco[/nom]On gaming, the I7 shines only on SLI/Crossfire (and something on overclocking).I miss the SLI/Crossfire tests, but I'm checking tomshardware daily.[/citation]

Thanks Marraco, feel free to speak up with anything you'd like to see--we're here to provide the information you guys want and need, after all.
 
Again... ta152h... if you don't plan to invest more than 400$ on GPU, buying a i7 will be a huge waste of money.

In short, if you don't plan to put at least two 4870X2 in CF or two 285 in SLI, you will not get any gain in performance. For that matter alone I cannot recommend any i7 platform to any gamers, since we don't have the budget to drive any nuclear plant in our house for the sole pleasure of playing Crysis at max setting at 1080p.
 
Redgarl,

Do you really think the only thing computers are used for are games? Run a big compile and you'll know why fast processors are very important.

Besides that, all I commented on was the design of the i7 being vastly superior to the Phenom II. Where did I say people should buy the very expensive i7s for games? I wouldn't presume to know what's best for everyone and made no judgment in that way.

You on the other hand, seem to make the judgment. For some people playing games, the i7 will be a perfect solution. AMD processors are very well priced,, but that's not because they are inexpensive to make, but because AMD sells them for what they can. Where the rubber meets the road though, AMD solutions can make a lot of sense.

From a design perspective, I never liked the inelegant K7 design, and I still do not. It's too "worst-case" in the design, and uses brute force instead to making intelligent trade-offs by understanding what a common workflow is. It's got an overly powerful x87 unit, despite the fact it's essentially useless now, and still supports 3D Now!, which was always essentially useless since it was not supported much. On top of this, the AGUs and ALUs being part of the same port strikes me as inefficient, and I've never been too crazy about exclusive cache arrangements that they still cling too, despite the fact that making the L3 inclusive would eliminated a lot of snooping traffic. On top of this, they still have inferior scheduling with regards to memory reads and writes. Intel calls it 'memory disambiguation', AMD calls it "we don't have it, because we believe in worst case situations, and the memory read 'might' be wrong if the write is not fully understood before we do it'. Intel just does it, and if it turns out it's wrong, they redo it. This happens roughly 2% of the time, so the other 98% you get a benefit. But, nope, it's not worse case, which seems to be their design philosophy.

To reiterate, I never said no one should buy AMD processors. They are smart enough to price them so they are competitive, and with the 790GX, make a very attractive platform for integrated graphics solutions. I just said the Phenom II is a bad design compared to the i7, which is about as controversial as saying the world is round, except for the fact people have some weird attachment to CPU companies. Probably someone needs to make a pill for that, since it belongs squarely under the category of pathology.
 
Let us also not forget that THG's i7 965 is not a retail chip - it's a sample given to them by Intel pre-release. Performance, as always, will vary...

Also, I cannot agree more with those of you who have stated that from a price/performance standpoint, i7's are not worth buying. Even if I had an unlimited budget, I seriously doubt I would buy one right now. Minimal performance gains for (insert random integer) times the cost? I think not.
 
[citation][nom]cangelini[/nom]The i7's disadvantage in Far Cry 2 is well-known. That it gets beat in HAWX is something we only discovered this time around. In everything else, it's the faster CPU.[/citation]

Please do a check and tell us readers whether i7 runs Far Cry 2 in Turbo mode or not. Far Cry 2, alone with GTA4, can utilize up to 4 cores.
 
Hi Chaos,

If Turbo mode is enabled, and Far Cry is using 2, 3, or 4 cores, it will indeed run at 3.46 GHz. I can almost guarantee at no point will it be running with only one active thread, thereby hitting 3.6 GHz.

Hope this helps!
Chris
 
[citation][nom]marraco[/nom]On gaming, the I7 shines only on SLI/Crossfire (and something on overclocking).I miss the SLI/Crossfire tests, but I'm checking tomshardware daily.[/citation]

I doubt that i7 runs FC2 in turbo mode. There is no way two cores can beat four physical cores of K10.5 or Core 2 in thread-optimized programs. Not even two Nehalem cores. SLI and CF may force i7 to run in normal mode with extra demand for bandwidth. Also, HyperThreading is useless for gaming. Better turn it off. I hope that Tom's will do the check for all the question above.
 
i always thought of the 940 as that useless waste of money CPU(even the 965 kinda but the 975 looks alot better). why bring an update to it?!?

just go get a 920 and OC it 😉 thats where the value is hiding
 
[citation][nom]rambo117[/nom]even the 965 kinda but the 975 looks alot better[/citation]
How so? It's just a few more Mhz that you could easily attain with overclocking, and a guarantee you'll get D0 stepping.

[citation][nom]rambo117[/nom]why bring an update to it?!?just go get a 920 and OC it thats where the value is hiding[/citation]
Because people will buy it.

You and I aren't affected, because we wouldn't fall for that. But some people are willing to pay more for a guarantee (and the fact that the warranty isn't voided).
 
quite agree. the way i see the CPU landscape now, it is like design a good server/professional chip and it will suffice for desktop and mobile applications.
amd had the good decision to integrate the memory controller, hypertransport, and make a native quad core early on. it made the Opteron very good compared to intel's past and current Xeon though those technologies were quite overkill for the desktop that time.

now, those are now in the i7 and luckily, gave a lot of available performance. i just feel bad for AMD for not having a close fight with the i7 even knowing their architecture and die size is not far from each other.
Is it probably due to intel's SSE?

[citation][nom]WheelsOfConfusion[/nom]The Phenom II is a bad design? What? It's a excellent design. It's neck-and-neck with the Core 2's best offerings and priced competitively against them. Is the Core 2 a "bad design?" The problem is that this came about a year too late, after the original Phenom's massive let-down, and now has to be seen as competing with Intel's newest top-of-the-line chips, even if they're priced into a completely different league. [/citation]
 
[citation][nom]coolxtreme[/nom]can someone tell me what is AA and AF and how to enable them.[/citation]
Anti-Aliasing and Anisotropic Filtering, and in the video options of the game of your choice.
 
It'snot really clear if the Phenom had different memory settings than the Corei7.
I would love to see a phenom 2x4 black edition with best mobo and ram being tested against a Corei7. 3GB of RAM and 32bit edition of windows. the 64bit version of windows (support for more ram) may not give accurate benchmarks for home users using the 32bit version.

What interests me most is the performance per watt on both systems! Much more than performance. I'm sure the Corei7 could be faster in most programs, but benches ON 32BIT WINDOWS would be preferred.. Thank you.
 
Most of the gaming benches are limited to the graphics card.
I would suggest you redo them with a more powerful graphics card like the Radeon 4970 or 4870x2 (in crossfire setup or something).
There's not much we can learn from the gaming graphs.
 
But that recommendation only extends as far as the Core i7-920. At $562 and $999, the 950 and 975 Extreme launching today don’t warrant the step up if you’re an enthusiast undeterred by the thought of Bclk-based overclocking.

Agree fully!
You better buy 2x Corei7 920, in case you screw up with one,than paying one 950! Or better buy 3x 920 than 1x 975.
 
Yes, if you are going to do gaming benchmarks on CPU tests, please use more powerful GPUs. We can't learn anything from your graphs.

Why not use 3X 285, or 2X 4870x2?! Then we might see some CPU scaling.
 
for gaming the phenom is the best choice, its trade blows with the core i7 and is alot cheaper, and really how much slower is the phenom in application bechmarks, if you cant wait a few extra seconds to save thousands of dollars then maybe you need to spend money on a shrink NOT a core i7 :)
 
People don't buy CPU's from AMD only because they are cheaper. The proof is in market slice of each CPU maker. For those who forgot: Intel 78% - AMD 22%. And Dubai Group own now 20% from AMD. Over 2 Years in the future the name will be: AMDubai.
 
i wonder if farcry 2 is seeing 8 cores because of hyperthreading and scaling to use them all? if so, the overhead in managing 8 threads may out weigh to small benefit of hyperthreading and actually cause a slowdown?
hyperthreading is generally only useful for proper parallel processing, where threads never need to wait or talk to each other, this is why you see the best improvement when running multiple apps, rather than 1 with multiple threads.
 
as with all high end cpu's, the intel core i7 will be held back from
it's full potential with hdd's and can only reach it's full potential
with ssd's since a computer is only as fast as it's slowest part.
 
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