News Intel hit with lawsuit over $32 billion loss, shareholders complain company hid problems

[Alvar "Miles" Udell]

It's an extension of the previously announced proposed shareholder suit that was seeking a lead plaintiff, among other suits. They'll likely end up getting bundled into this one if the courts find they have merit, likely since there's been two major events that caused big slides (foundry earnings revision which caused a 25% drop and then the Q2 earnings which caused another 33% drop), then 5 years from now after appeals have been exhausted shareholders will get $5 a share and lawyers will get $15, which will be either be paltry since Intel will be worth $200+ as a successful foundry, or meaningless with Intel declaring Chapter 11.

https://www.tomshardware.com/tech-i...th-class-action-lawsuit-over-foundry-revenues

Disclosure: I own Intel stock and am qualified to be a part of that suit.

 

[ManDaddio]

This seems to be a good time for NVIDIA to come in and make an offer.
AMD and Intel was allowed to have GPUs and CPUs. Regulators would hypocrites if they blocked it.

 

[NinoPino]

Nvidia is basically a monopoly and they manufacture at the same location as AMD.

nVidia volumes are low compared to total TSMC capacity. TSMC build Apple, Qualcomm, AMD and now Intel.

If Intel implodes, ...

Probably will not.

...AMD will be able to set their price and buy TSMC fabs..

Science fiction.

...(or pay them for exclusive use/ increased fab construction)

A new fab needs many years.

Either way intel's struggles are not a good thing for the industry.

May be yes, if Intel stay in the second place for some years, we can finally see some real innovation in the personal computing.

 

[tamalero]

Nvidia is basically a monopoly and they manufacture at the same location as AMD.

If Intel implodes, AMD will be able to set their price and buy TSMC fabs.. (or pay them for exclusive use/ increased fab construction)

Either way intel's struggles are not a good thing for the industry.

Everyone needs cpus.. Not everyone needs video cards.. specially datacenter ones.

Comparison does not match.

 

[hotaru251]

Sears, Bear Sterns, RCA, Westinghouse, GE, Kodak, Blockbuster, Pan Am... not all of these are gone... but none of them are what they once were.

and all of them together arent even 1/4 of Intel.

could bankrupt them all multiple times over and Intel would still be able to exist.

I said their issues were unlikely to lead to collapse... but it is not impossible. Intel has been in the downturn for nearly a decade now...

its literally not possible from something as small as this (and yes it looks big but in long run its small..heck look at AMD who was in a much worse place and they bounced back better than before)

Intel has multiple ways to shed weight should it EVER get to that point.
they could cut the gpu section, sell off assets it wouldnt need, etc.


also Intel hasn't. Only time Intel started downhill was after Zen (and it was really Zen2 when it actually started to matter) & hasnt been decade sicne then.
They stagnated sure, but thats not downturn.
& value as a company was (until this 32B loss) always higher than it had been back in 2014 (and if we use Jan value even further back than that)

People seriously don't know how large Intel is...

 

[hotaru251]

nVidia volumes are low compared to total TSMC capacity. TSMC build Apple, Qualcomm, AMD and now Intel.

while true.... Nvidia is the #2 behind apple.

 

[Thunder64]

and all of them together arent even 1/4 of Intel.

could bankrupt them all multiple times over and Intel would still be able to exist.

its literally not possible from something as small as this (and yes it looks big but in long run its small..heck look at AMD who was in a much worse place and they bounced back better than before)

Intel has multiple ways to shed weight should it EVER get to that point.
they could cut the gpu section, sell off assets it wouldnt need, etc.


also Intel hasn't. Only time Intel started downhill was after Zen (and it was really Zen2 when it actually started to matter) & hasnt been decade sicne then.
They stagnated sure, but thats not downturn.
& value as a company was (until this 32B loss) always higher than it had been back in 2014 (and if we use Jan value even further back than that)

People seriously don't know how large Intel is...

I'm guessing you are on the younger side. GE was once the most valuable company in the world. Also, Intel has faltered prior to Zen, though never this badly.

https://www.voronoiapp.com/markets/General-Electric-Was-Once-the-Most-Valuable-Company-in-the-US-469

 

[TJ Hooker]

Intel stock at $20, Nvidia could buy them with their loose change…

Not quite, Nvidia has ~$30B in cash, Intel market cap is ~$87B.

 

[TheGTV]

Toms:


Reuters (source):



Math is hard.

It's a lot easier than you might think.

 

[Reality_checker]

How did this article get accepted?

 

[NinoPino]

<<Deleted post>>

Bad day ?

 

[watzupken]

Nvidia is basically a monopoly and they manufacture at the same location as AMD.

If Intel implodes, AMD will be able to set their price and buy TSMC fabs.. (or pay them for exclusive use/ increased fab construction)

Either way intel's struggles are not a good thing for the industry.

I think you failed to account for ARM that is coming in as a very competent competitor. Qualcomm is not the only one eyeing the PC market because its likely that Mediatek may also enter this segment in the coming year.

In any case, I think Intel painted an overly rosy picture over the years, and this lawsuit against them is not unexpected. One can always look back and find all the bullish news from Intel painting an "all is looking great" picture, though the financial results are not that great. Now with them spilling issues like Meteor Lake yield issues, chip oxidation, using other competitors foundry fully, etc, these are serious problems all exposed in a single quarter. Just this past quarter, Intel have annoyed their board partners (when Intel accused them of not following their power guidelines), customers (knowing and ignoring Raptor Lake issues), and investors.

 

[thesyndrome]

and I'm not saying they will be able to supply the market.

But intel is in danger of being split up, or unlikely but possible out right collapse if Lunar/Arrow Lake have issues or the extent of the lawsuits throw enough mud.

AMD without any real direct competition in the CPU market will be disastrous for many many reasons... not only that they cannot actually supply the needed number of processors.

I think it feels like an obvious route for Qualcomm right now to look into expanding their CPU's into the desktop sector, Windows on ARM isn't perfect right now, but it has potential to improve and the launch wasn't disastrous; from watching reviews it seemed like the biggest drawback was the iGPU for gaming, which is solved in a desktop with a normal GPU, and also some programs that don't have native ARM support run slower through the x86 emulator, but this can likely be optimised (or possibly more programs will receive native ARM support due to it's rising popularity).

I just have a feeling that we might see a future where it's Qualcomm vs AMD as the new competition if Intel can't pull it together, hell we might even see Nvidia try to step up to consumer CPU's if Intel dies, they already have CPU's for datacenters, and seeing the power vaccuum left in the market by Intel's departure might make them think it's a good spot to fill to diversify their profit portfolio.

I don't think we'll ever enter a true AMD monopoly for CPU's, someone will see the gap in the market and know to take advantage of it.

 

[SunMaster]

How did this article get accepted?

Why shouldn't it?

 

[gg83]

.... I really thought about putting a short call on INTL back at the end of July.... alas...

So much mud is going to be thrown at Intel over the next few months. Lunar lake and Arrow lake need to be flat out a amazing.

I do not want an AMD monopoly...

I really think it will soon be time to buy a bunch of Intel stocks. With the dividend getting suspended, allegedly, Intel might be able to focus on innovation again instead of appeasing shareholders.

 

[Loadedaxe]

Bad day ?

Ikr, I gather he is not happy about the expense of the olympics.

 

[tamalero]

AMD spun off their own fabs years ago. On paper now they are a designer of chips, but not a manufactor. Intel on the other hand is having fabs but battles with tech advancements compared to TSMC. It's this that will f up intel for some time to come.

This is actually interesting, because.. the AMD's foundries were a gigantic weight for AMD even after they were separated.
With AMD being forced to buy Global Foundries outdated chips for random stuff.

 

[stuff and nonesense]

I think it feels like an obvious route for Qualcomm right now to look into expanding their CPU's into the desktop sector, Windows on ARM isn't perfect right now, but it has potential to improve and the launch wasn't disastrous; from watching reviews it seemed like the biggest drawback was the iGPU for gaming, which is solved in a desktop with a normal GPU, and also some programs that don't have native ARM support run slower through the x86 emulator, but this can likely be optimised (or possibly more programs will receive native ARM support due to it's rising popularity).

I just have a feeling that we might see a future where it's Qualcomm vs AMD as the new competition if Intel can't pull it together, hell we might even see Nvidia try to step up to consumer CPU's if Intel dies, they already have CPU's for datacenters, and seeing the power vaccuum left in the market by Intel's departure might make them think it's a good spot to fill to diversify their profit portfolio.

I don't think we'll ever enter a true AMD monopoly for CPU's, someone will see the gap in the market and know to take advantage of it.

The sheer weight of AMD 64 programs, native AMD 64 means that ARM has a long way to go. Emulation has an overhead.

Devs need to program for or at least compile for ARM.. then the fur flies.

Doing so would be a knock at the door, users at that time would need to make a choice.

 

[stuff and nonesense]

AMD spun off their own fabs years ago. On paper now they are a designer of chips, but not a manufactor. Intel on the other hand is having fabs but battles with tech advancements compared to TSMC. It's this that will f up intel for some time to come.

I remember seeing an article saying that intel were “next on the list” for the latest lithography machines. Using these properly would bring parity.

That’s on intel.

 

[td47]

Toms:


Reuters (source):



Math is hard.

I skim read the article and missed that stupid "99% drop" comment. Tom's hardware need to peer review these articles before publishing them!

 

[dalek1234]

....

Either way intel's struggles are not a good thing for the industry.

But they are very good if you are and AMD shareholder.