Intel - stopping poor children from getting computers

[Zorg]

You miss the point. The One Laptop Per Laptop effort is not-for-profit. Not-for-profit companies only recoup enough to cover expenses.

Not-for-profit doesn't mean that no one is making money. I suggest that you check Google for the salaries of the people running these not-for-profit companies, I think that you would be appalled. I'm not saying that Negroponte isn't sincere but just because it's a non-profit company doesn't mean diddle squat.

Ok, Johnny-come-lately, of course people have to make a living, don't be stupid. You can't deny a man's right to earn a living, but I doubt Dr. Negroponte's lifestyle is anything like that of Paul Otellini or Craig Barrett. Please feel free to post some stats or links of the non-profit companies and the salaries, including OLPC. Apparently you didn't see where I stated "I'm not saying that Negroponte isn't sincere".What I was saying is that just because the organization is nonprofit doesn't mean that the Founder/CEO etc. isn't making a very nice living, not to mention the expense accounts etc. I'm not even saying that all nonprofits abuse salaries, all I said is that it would be naive to say "Not-for-profit companies only recoup enough to cover expenses." and thereby infer that no one could possibly have any personal financial motivation for starting such an organization. Again to be sure that you don't misunderstand me, (I can see how easy it is for you to do that) I am not saying that Mr. Negroponte doesn't have the most altruistic of intentions, he may. I am also not saying that he plans to abuse the nonprofit by taking exorbitant compensation. All I am saying is that these facts are not in evidence. A major point to consider when giving to charities is how much of each dollar actually gets to the people in need and how much gets eaten up in overhead. I also never said that he would be making anywhere the amount of money of the CEO's that you cited. You may ask why. Because that has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on the point that I was trying to make, or on anything for that matter. Since you are so confused by what I posted, here is a quote and a link. I know it's a couple years old, you'll just have to rough it.

CEO compensation has become such a hot-button topic that the Senate Finance Committee discussed excessive CEO pay during recent hearings on reforming America's nonprofit sector

2005 CEO Compensation Study
http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm/bay/content.view/catid/68/cpid/304.htm

 

[easyg]

I saw the show, too, and I am rather puzzled by Negroponte's ire. Take for instance that classroom in Mexico - Intel donated the laptops. They were free.

If kids get free laptops, then what's the problem? Isn't the program supposed to be One Laptop Per Child, not One Negroponte Laptop Per child.

Kids get laptops and he bitches. Kinda weird.

I got the impression that I was listening to a guy who is mainly concerned with protecting his turf. His whole attitude is monopolistic. A gigantic hypocrite.

 

[halbhh]

double deleted. why doesn't THG upgrade their hard drives/servers??

 

[halbhh]

Frankly, I'd trust Negroponte *much more* (!) if he is quite rich.

The richer, the better!!

And well-compensated!

 

[halbhh]

I saw the show, too, and I am rather puzzled by Negroponte's ire. Take for instance that classroom in Mexico - Intel donated the laptops. They were free.

If kids get free laptops, then what's the problem? Isn't the program supposed to be One Laptop Per Child, not One Negroponte Laptop per child.

Kids get laptops and he bitches. Kinda weird.

I got the impression that I was listening to guy who is mainly concerned with protecting his turf. He's whole attitude is monopolistic. A gigantic hypocrite.

Quite simple. He believes Intel is trying specifically to kill the OLPC project.

 

[Zorg]

Frankly, I'd trust Negroponte *much more* (!) if he is quite rich.

The richer, the better!!

And well-compensated!

Huh :?:

 

[ARM]

People don't seem to be understanding what the laptops are for. If the children become educated, they will grow into educated adults. Once the population becomes an educated workforce, the prospects of that nation rise. Conditions improve, crime is beaten back the people of the nation have hope in a future where their children will not have to be given laptops, but can learn in their own country's schools.

The worry about Intel is: what happens when OLPC is pushed out? Do Intel continue making a loss? Unlikely. They will either abandon the project, or jack the prices. The issue here is not who is making money, but what their intentions are.

About peoples' reaction to the Lord of War suggestion, WTF? It was a perfectly valid point. It's not like because it's Hollywood, it's automatically wrong "0mFgZ0r h011Yw00d aM t3h sVcKZ0r r0f1C0pT0R101z0R kTHxbA!".
Lord of War is really relevant here. You need to stop trying to score popularity points on internet forums and throw away those bottles of hand lotion.

 

[halbhh]

Frankly, I'd trust Negroponte *much more* (!) if he is quite rich.

The richer, the better!!

And well-compensated!

Huh :?:

Well, we're getting off topic some, but just consider whether very rich folks, like Bill Gates, Warren Buffet, etc., have benefited other people a lot..... Investigate the reasons some say they have been very beneficial. Perhaps it would help you lose the idea a benefactor must be poor. I think charity can come regardless of wealth level, but it's great from rich folks.

 

[Zorg]

About peoples' reaction to the Lord of War suggestion, WTF? It was a perfectly valid point. It's not like because it's Hollywood, it's automatically wrong "0mFgZ0r h011Yw00d aM t3h sVcKZ0r r0f1C0pT0R101z0R kTHxbA!".
Lord of War is really relevant here. You need to stop trying to score popularity points on internet forums and throw away those bottles of hand lotion.

I disagree, anyone that gets their understanding of politics, society, or anything else, from Hollywood is getting seriously short changed. But you rock on.

 

[chunkymonster]

You miss the point. The One Laptop Per Laptop effort is not-for-profit. Not-for-profit companies only recoup enough to cover expenses.

Not-for-profit doesn't mean that no one is making money. I suggest that you check Google for the salaries of the people running these not-for-profit companies, I think that you would be appalled. I'm not saying that Negroponte isn't sincere but just because it's a non-profit company doesn't mean diddle squat.

Ok, Johnny-come-lately, of course people have to make a living, don't be stupid. You can't deny a man's right to earn a living, but I doubt Dr. Negroponte's lifestyle is anything like that of Paul Otellini or Craig Barrett. Please feel free to post some stats or links of the non-profit companies and the salaries, including OLPC. Apparently you didn't see where I stated "I'm not saying that Negroponte isn't sincere".What I was saying is that just because the organization is nonprofit doesn't mean that the Founder/CEO etc. isn't making a very nice living, not to mention the expense accounts etc. I'm not even saying that all nonprofits abuse salaries, all I said is that it would be naive to say "Not-for-profit companies only recoup enough to cover expenses." and thereby infer that no one could possibly have any personal financial motivation for starting such an organization. Again to be sure that you don't misunderstand me, (I can see how easy it is for you to do that) I am not saying that Mr. Negroponte doesn't have the most altruistic of intentions, he may. I am also not saying that he plans to abuse the nonprofit by taking exorbitant compensation. All I am saying is that these facts are not in evidence. A major point to consider when giving to charities is how much of each dollar actually gets to the people in need and how much gets eaten up in overhead. I also never said that he would be making anywhere the amount of money of the CEO's that you cited. You may ask why. Because that has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on the point that I was trying to make, or on anything for that matter. Since you are so confused by what I posted, here is a quote and a link. I know it's a couple years old, you'll just have to rough it.

CEO compensation has become such a hot-button topic that the Senate Finance Committee discussed excessive CEO pay during recent hearings on reforming America's nonprofit sector

2005 CEO Compensation Study
http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm/bay/content.view/catid/68/cpid/304.htm

I'm glad you feel the need to "educate" me on the corruption of non-profits, but why introduce the subject of non-profits abusing finances if not to imply the non-profit, the OLPC, at the center of this discussion is in fact missappopriating funds. You may not intentionally be

...saying that Mr. Negroponte doesn't have the most altruistic of intentions, he may. I am also not saying that he plans to abuse the nonprofit by taking exorbitant compensation.

Especially since you also say

...these facts are not in evidence.

C'mon, get it together and take your $.02 sarcasm elswhere. :roll:

 

[1Tanker]

I think it's all BS. As if these kids (in third-world countries) need a computer....they need food, shelter, and medications/vaccinations. $130 would probably feed a kid for 6months-a year. :x :x

1tanker your are right

This is getting too paternalistic! It's not far from saying a fat computer user that eats cheap pizza and potato chips should not have a computer.

It's not up to us to set *their* priorities. It's up to them.
the best part of the OLCP initiative is just to offer a good option to these countries.

doesn't mean they won't have corruption, malnutrition, torture, rape, etc.So, if you see a drunken bum on the street, will you give him $5 or $10, or worry that he'll go and buy booze/drugs/cigarettes with it...and not give him money?

 

[BaronMatrix]

Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. Forget Intel, forget AMD, this isn't about them. This is about the children. They are the only ones we should be worrying about.

I'm thinking about the kids. Why have a major competition when a third party started the idea. Like I said the only thing different in ANY PC is te chipset and CPU. A standard board could be made to fit either companies processors.

That would be the best thing. I mean supose this new twist means it will take 3 more years before any kids get them?

Does't that hurt them?

 

[1Tanker]

I think it's all BS. As if these kids (in third-world countries) need a computer....they need food, shelter, and medications/vaccinations. $130 would probably feed a kid for 6months-a year. :x :x

1tanker your are right

This is getting too paternalistic! It's not far from saying a fat computer user that eats cheap pizza and potato chips should not have a computer.

It's not up to us to set *their* priorities. It's up to them.
the best part of the OLCP initiative is just to offer a good option to these countries.

doesn't mean they won't have corruption, malnutrition, torture, rape, etc.So, if you see a drunken bum on the street, will you give him $5 or $10, or worry that he'll go and buy booze/drugs/cigarettes with it...and not give him money?Ooops. 😳 😳

 

[chunkymonster]

Let me get this straight

Intel is getting laptops to children at the $100 mark, but they make a profit.

OLPC is getting laptops to children around $130-$170 and giving back some of it.

now for some math Intel + (OLPC + AMD) = competition

competition is good for whom?........the consumer


Like Intel, AMD is not going to be out done by its competition and may very well donate more resources, resulting in cheaper OLPC laptops.

I'm not defending Intel's reasons for undercutting OLPC, but pointing out (as many of you should already know) that competition is good. The only real bad guy here is going to be AMD if they pull out as to not challenge Intel on yet another front. And how likely is that? And if OLPC is concerned about not being able to compete, maybe they should shift their focus to providing internet connectivity, thus providing a way to work with Intel who has the real resources to make this happen.

Just my 2 cents

If Intel was undercutting HP, Dell, Toshiba, or Panasonic to deliver low cost laptops to 3rd world countries it would be a totally different story. But in this case, Intel is undercutting a non-profit organization...that's just messed up. Get it now?

 

[dasickninja]

No, Negroponte can still get his laptops out. Therefore competition is not hurting him at all unless Intel is destroying their factories or labs.

 

[halbhh]

[ .....So, if you see a drunken bum on the street, will you give him $5 or $10, or worry that he'll go and buy booze/drugs/cigarettes with it...and not give him money? quote]

myself, I choose to give to an organization (e.g.-salvation army) to help out the ..... drunken person in the street. ("bum" isn't really a necessary insult, it's bad enough for him already)

 

[1Tanker]

[ .....So, if you see a drunken bum on the street, will you give him $5 or $10, or worry that he'll go and buy booze/drugs/cigarettes with it...and not give him money? quote]

myself, I choose to give to an organization (e.g.-salvation army) to help out the ..... drunken person in the street. ("bum" isn't really a necessary insult, it's bad enough for him already)

For the tax write-off? 😀

 

[Zorg]

Actually, I don't care whether any free laptops are given out or whether Intel helps or hurts this effort. And when I say don't care I mean not at all. I was simply responding to your initial comment because it was clear that you had no idea what you were talking about

Not-for-profit companies only recoup enough to cover expenses.

and that was in response to a post that stated

I was thinking the same thing. Sounds like he wants to be the one in the limelight. Or he's catching some major kickbacks from people to do it and is worrying about his honeydew pot drying out.

You don't know whether Negroponte has a personal financial stake in this endeavor so don't act like you do. It's the "expenses" that would be in question. I am not implying anything, I am just pointing out that it is naive to make the statement that you made above. Apparently you only read enough of my post to formulate your response.

 

[computerKlok]

computerKlok wrote:


If Intel was undercutting HP, Dell, Toshiba, or Panasonic to deliver low cost laptops to 3rd world countries it would be a totally different story. But in this case, Intel is undercutting a non-profit organization...that's just messed up. Get it now?

so you're saying that its ok for corporations to under cut one another and you reap the benefits, but if a corporation under cuts a non-profit and that market can get benefits its messed up? And before you say it, this is true because competition is good for the consumer it always is. Yes its bad for the non-profit, and obvouisly bad for Intel (coming solely from the response i've seen here).

Plus does it matter why (solely in business aspects this doesn't work for actual people) as long as these kids get a chance to improve their life?

 

[halbhh]

No, Negroponte can still get his laptops out. Therefore competition is not hurting him at all unless Intel is destroying their factories or labs.

He wants to get them to the lowest cost possible, which means he needs the biggest production runs possible to lower per unit cost.

Intel will only help out the original concept if it does really big distribution itself, so that the resulting number of laptops is as large as the total for the OLPC was going to be (instead of say in only 1 or 2 countries at a lower number). Since Intel would be below cost (as I understand without details), then that would indeed be charity.

What I don't want to see myself: Intel kills the OLPC by taking a good part of the share in a couple of prime countries only, but does not offer that cheap laptop widely, thus resulting in a lower overall number around the world total, since the OLPC numbers would become less doable.

 

[halbhh]

[ .....So, if you see a drunken bum on the street, will you give him $5 or $10, or worry that he'll go and buy booze/drugs/cigarettes with it...and not give him money? quote]

myself, I choose to give to an organization (e.g.-salvation army) to help out the ..... drunken person in the street. ("bum" isn't really a necessary insult, it's bad enough for him already)

For the tax write-off? 😀

Well, I'm not rich enough actually to give enough to get much tax write off, especially since we don't have a mortage at the moment (no mortgage tax deduction). But I like to try to find an effective charity when I do give (that leverages the dollars).

 

[Zorg]

Fix your quote it appears that you are stating that. Chunkymonster has a fairytale view of nonprofits and their employees, just accept it.

 

[computerKlok]

Intel is ruthlessly going after untapped market. They dont care one iota about Negrponte's purity of vision.

its good business, i don't agree with it, but if you don't like it move to cuba where there is no free market. every thing in your life (assuming your not from a communist country) is a result of this same thing. small independ companies/non-profits getting shut down their dreams smashed by larger companies/corporations who can make it fast, "better" but provide us with the benefits of competition. for example image a world with out Apple. Billy boy would have us still using windows 3.1 because there is no reason to keep improving his product. business is ruthless end of story

 

[1Tanker]

Intel is ruthlessly going after untapped market. They dont care one iota about Negrponte's purity of vision.

its good business, i don't agree with it, but if you don't like it move to cuba where there is no free market. every thing in your life (assuming your not from a communist country) is a result of this same thing. small independ companies/non-profits getting shut down their dreams smashed by larger companies/corporations who can make it fast, "better" but provide us with the benefits of competition. for example image a world with out Apple. Billy boy would have us still using windows 3.1 because there is no reason to keep improving his product. business is ruthless end of story

The lack of a federally regulated leash on Intel will create something we all dont like. The SEC needs to promote some amendments in law. Intels megalomaniacle vision for itself in the future will pain us all if they succeed. Its far healthier for all of us if AMD becomes as large as Intel and Intel is forced to petition for a role in such programs.The only way that's going to happen, is if Intel comes out with a Netburst-2 😀

 

[computerKlok]

The lack of a federally regulated leash on Intel will create something we all dont like. The SEC needs to promote some amendments in law. Intels megalomaniacle vision for itself in the future will pain us all if they succeed. Its far healthier for all of us if AMD becomes as large as Intel and Intel is forced to petition for a role in such programs.

so you're saying its time for the government to step in and say who can sale what to whom? Whats next? Curfews because more crime happens at night? I stated earlier that AMD needs to really back this project for their own benefit and for the benefit of the world at large.