Is Creative Labs getting out of the sound card business?

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boe

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Apr 27, 2004
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Seems like creative used to pop out new and improved sound cards just about every year. The XFI is pretty much damaged goods from all the reviews I've read - a very good start but not a finished card. I felt the same way about the audigy but then they released the audigy 2 and it took care of many of those concerns. They had rumors about the audigy 2 out at least 6 months before it was in our filthy little hands.

I've read nothing about the XFI2 and the XFI has been out a LONG time. I've read nothing about their efforts on a PCI Express card either. Years ago at Comdex they were spouting off about how much better their cards would be on the next PCI slot due to seperation/throughput/isolation. Right now they don't even have one in the rumor mill - actually I've seen nothing in the rumor mill.

I have read about a new MP3 player from Creative just about every 6 months though. I'm guessing they pulled everyone from their sound card department and are focused only on MP3 players now.

Creative used to make top notch sound cards that were always AT LEAST twice as good as what you could get on any motherboard - now they've rested for so long the gap is getting much closer. I'm wondering if ATI or nVidia might want to consider making premium gaming/HTPC cards.
 
Well, I'm not aware of any issues with the X-Fi cards myself. I have been using an X-Fi Fatality since December and it works flawlessly for me - games and encoding. The DVDs I play sound excellent. For me, it was a good investment.
 
Creative X-Fi 1 year ago (summer 2005)
*Audigy 4 Pro 1 1/2 years ago (2004)*
Audigy 2 ZS 3 years ago (2003)
Audigy 2 4 years ago (2002)
Audigy 6 years ago (2000)

Going by this product cycle, it looks like it should take at least 1 more year before an X-Fi replacement comes.

There was a 2 year lapse between the Audigy and Audigy 2, and a 3 year lapse before the Audigy 2 was outright replaced. So following the previous product cycles, anytime from 2007-2008 would be a realistic goal.
 
IMO, the X-Fi is still a great card with powerful DSP that has no peers (if you're into sound effects). It is, however, not the only kid on the block and is not the King Kong of sound cards that SoundBlasters used to be. Don't be mislead by what you read however. The X-Fi, IMO, is like the F-22 of consumer sound cards. How much an advantage its supposed stealth is...remains debatable in a world of Typhoons, F-15E's ultramaneuvable Migs. Is it the best? Maybe. Is it worth the high cost however? ...that is the debate people seem to have with the X-Fi. ...and it depends on how you define "the best".

...a loose and debatable comparison, but it kind of highlights the point. The X-Fi is nice but are its features necessary and worthy of its cost. I don't think Creative really needs to try to replace the X-Fi now in terms of its raw sound quality, and I believe they realize this. Heck, an X-Fi doesn't sound $100 better than an SB Live! IMO. The vast majority of customers are not ready for PCI-Express solutions, and thus the market doesn't call for it...yet, IMO.
 
Creative labs has is not getting out of the card business, technically the problem is that there's not too much space to grow to at this moment, they have been testing pci express slot based sound cards and it was a big flop, the cards weren't getting enough bandwich or power since most was going to video card, I think they are either working on pci express cards or waiting for game developers to start including x-ram so that when they make a new line they become a worthy feature. Personally don't think PCI express is too good for sound, but I could be wrong, thats what a lot of ppl thought about pci express graphic cards and look where we at now.
 
Halcyon,

While I don't think the X-FI is a bad, card, I don't think it is where it could be. The audigy wasn't a bad card either but the audigy2zs I have stands head an shoulders over it. But my card has occassional pops and crackles (yes I have the latest OS, Drivers, patches for all games, EVERYTHING). From what I hear this is so prevalent in the more advanced games for the X-FI I wouldn't consider putting one on my next PC. I've read several people have switched back from their X-FI to an audigy 2zs. That doesn't mean that EVERY app has issues with the XFI vs. the audigy but it is commonplace enough that it is a known issue. I think it is time for them to tweak the X-FI- not necessarily add more audio processing power but perhaps resolve all the cracks, pops, perhaps even add HDMI.
 
perhapes becos of the mp3 player war with apple hurt them financially. their stocks isnt' doin v.well for sometime

meanwhile i guess they are waiting for newgen hardware/software to mature so they can come out with something exciting.

their r too carried with their mp3 player line biz rather then sound card, lack of sound card competation i guess...even though mr sim invented the sound card....
 
You're reading far too much into a non-situation.

Why in hell would they jump out of the sound card business when Apple and Sony are leaders in the MP3 market, and other than their Zen players they don't make any products (excluding speakers) that are nearly as successful as their sound card range - a business that they have set the industry standard for....well, forever!
 
emm could it be comming out something special new hardware delaying for crossing over into the living room . super home entertainment... sound system so good until u can hear actors fart in the scene
 
i think your talking rubbish frankly and don't deem you worthy of serious discussion.
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I'm tired, that likely has something to do with my rubbish.
you do realize he was talking to boe, not you
 
creative is going through really tuff times.

after their shit quarter, they are disputing vs apple.


i tried to get a Creative Zen Vision from them, through an employee, and i waited 2 months then finally gave up
 
:lol: :lol: :lol: theres only so much they can do with audio right now.
until chips are made to take sampling frequencies higher,they are at a stalemate,why produce a new card with no improvements?.
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I would consider a card without any snap crackle or pop in many games a definite improvement. If done properly, a pci express card could be an improvement. One with an HDMI interface would be an improvement some might be interested in.
 
not every one gets the sound defects,if you didnt rma thats your bag.
I have owned an audigy 2 platinum for over 2 years and never had a problem.
yeah,added features would be good ,but does it justify a new card?
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So do you have an XFI? Have you played FEAR, Battlefield 2, WoW with it? Go to their support pages - well documented. Because the games (if any) you play don't have this issue doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I support many clients - one of them is a GAMING company. We got a few X-FI's and no longer use them on game demonstration systems because of this issue. This isn't about returning defective ones - this is a DESIGN FLAW. Do a google search - this is not an isolated issue but well documented. There is even an online petition regarding this. This occurs occassionally even with the Audigy 2zs but not nearly as often and is one of the better cards out ther so that is what I use for that client. I would like the processing power for more voices with the X-FI but we can't be demoing a game with what sounds like an old record playing in the background.
 
I play FEAR and Doom 3 with the X-FI and I've never had any issues with them. Perhaps people have had issues with the X-Fi and certain games but I have yet to experience anything that could be considered negative about the card. I've been using Creative cards since way back to the Sounblaster 16 days and they've always done well for me.

I agree with verndewd, if people had issues with the hardware and didn't rma it and just compained its on them.
 
what kind of percentages of failure are you suggesting?honestly i have never heard of this before,and i feel i have read a bit about it,and kept in touch with user reviews.
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I want to be clear - I'm not saying it happens continously in those games or that it happens in all games. It is a known issue in several games - does not happen (as far as I know) with CD playback, mp3 playback etc. Again I'd suggest you read the support forums for those games or just do a google search on snap or crackle or static and any of those game titles. Do a search for online petitions - I'm not making this stuff up. I've also tried it with various video cards and drivers, and motherboards, there is a design flaw in the card or the drivers as this does not happen as frequently with the Audigy 2.

So do you have an X-FI?
 
I play FEAR and Doom 3 with the X-FI and I've never had any issues with them. Perhaps people have had issues with the X-Fi and certain games but I have yet to experience anything that could be considered negative about the card. I've been using Creative cards since way back to the Sounblaster 16 days and they've always done well for me.

I agree with verndewd, if people had issues with the hardware and didn't rma it and just compained its on them.
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I'm not aware of crackle issues with the Doom3 engine although they do occur in FEAR. X-FI doesn't do this in all games - it does however if you turn up the audio features. If you leave it at the defaults you won't get them but then why would you pay for a fancy card if you are only using the basics? I've experimented with several systems and finally did a google search - this is inherent with the card or the drivers.

I can think of a place off the top of my head in FEAR if you want to test it - turn up the surround and audio features in FEAR. Go to facility where the guards are shooting you from the balcony - when you go up to the second floor where they were/are, you will find the crackle spot - only lasts a couple of seconds but is an example of what you will find in other spots and games with this issue. Since it occurs with several game engines it isn't just one bad game. I am not however aware of any in DOOM3, Quake4 and we've also tested the game PREY without any issues.
 
Halcyon,

While I don't think the X-FI is a bad, card, I don't think it is where it could be. The audigy wasn't a bad card either but the audigy2zs I have stands head an shoulders over it. But my card has occassional pops and crackles (yes I have the latest OS, Drivers, patches for all games, EVERYTHING). From what I hear this is so prevalent in the more advanced games for the X-FI I wouldn't consider putting one on my next PC. I've read several people have switched back from their X-FI to an audigy 2zs. That doesn't mean that EVERY app has issues with the XFI vs. the audigy but it is commonplace enough that it is a known issue. I think it is time for them to tweak the X-FI- not necessarily add more audio processing power but perhaps resolve all the cracks, pops, perhaps even add HDMI.
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Boe, you know you have a point about the X-Fi's snap-crackle-pop issue. Last evening between my fatigue and the Yellow Tail that didn't occur to me. I've had the issue, briefly, myself. Creative needs to pay some attention to it, either in drivers or hardware. ...but I still don't believe they're ready for the X-Fi's complete successor. Once they've eradicated the X-Fi's noise issue I wonder what they'll be able to come up with to entice people to replace their (expensive) X-Fi's with. I must admit, I've not heard any noise from the X-Fi I'm using for a long, long time, and when I did hear it was only momentarily, as if just long enough for me to be able to verify that it does indeed exist. I believe they should spend their efforts not on 24bit Crystalizer's and other gimics, but on sound quality that is so superior to the competition that it is non-debatable. ...like someone stated earlier, until new hardware is available to them, how much can they do besides fix bugs. The could release an X-Fi Mark II or something along those lines.
 
i think your talking rubbish frankly and don't deem you worthy of serious discussion.
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I'm tired, that likely has something to do with my rubbish.
you do realize he was talking to boe, not you

I did indeed think he was speaking to me. Even if not, rubbish does indeed find it way out of my keyboard...gotta watch that.
 
as long as xfi is making them money, they dont need to be in a hurry to release new sound cards, all my frnds were waiting till summer to pick up xfi cards, although they are all getting xtreme music versions
 
I dont know exactly what setup(s) you have tried running the X-Fi's in so this is just a suggestion/comment...

On Creative's website, they mention that they are researching why the card cracks and pops in certain games. They do have a work-around for it, either a) lower the sound quality (makes the bonus of having an X-Fi kind of useless, I know) or b) run it in a Dual-Channel RAM system.

I too experience the pop occasionally in BF2 and FEAR. My system does not do dual-channel ram but my friend's 939 socket does so I tried running it on his system, same everything but the socket and dual-channel ram. We didnt get any poping what so ever and we played BF2 for hours. It appears the card may not have the bandwidth required from a single-channel RAM setup, why? I have no idea... I wont claim to be an expert.

So, if you still got an X-Fi laying around, try it in a Dual-Channel setup, possibly even a DDR2 for the addt'l bandwidth and see what the results are. I am just going off of what little testing I have personally done and what Creative has said they have found out during their testing.

As far as Creative going out of the Sound Card business? Very unlikely. As far as consumer sound cards go, they are the king. I really cant think of a single company that can even get near to Creative's sound card levels pf quality and power unless you goto the professional series of cards. You cant expect the same development you see out of, say, CPU's and GPU's, in sound cards. Lets face it, there is no continual resolution increase need in sound, nor is there AF, AA, Bloom or HDR like options in sound cards so there is no point in yearly (or sooner) advances in sound cards like there is in the GFX world. Sound is something that can only get so good until there is a total re-vamp of how it is done. The only options they have to work with now would be add more voice channels (doubt it would improve anything as my speakers already get distorted running 128 channels) or add more X-Ram (what is there right now is not even used so why do this?).
 
Especially when the output medium in question are "PC Speakers."

Why soundcards don't have much to go for "perfectly (adequate)"--A good analogy is that there is no need to go from 16bit to 32bit color when the camera you use to take your wallpaper pics has horrible resolution.
 
I dont know exactly what setup(s) you have tried running the X-Fi's in so this is just a suggestion/comment...

On Creative's website, they mention that they are researching why the card cracks and pops in certain games. They do have a work-around for it, either a) lower the sound quality (makes the bonus of having an X-Fi kind of useless, I know) or b) run it in a Dual-Channel RAM system.

I too experience the pop occasionally in BF2 and FEAR. My system does not do dual-channel ram but my friend's 939 socket does so I tried running it on his system, same everything but the socket and dual-channel ram. We didnt get any poping what so ever and we played BF2 for hours. It appears the card may not have the bandwidth required from a single-channel RAM setup, why? I have no idea... I wont claim to be an expert.

So, if you still got an X-Fi laying around, try it in a Dual-Channel setup, possibly even a DDR2 for the addt'l bandwidth and see what the results are. I am just going off of what little testing I have personally done and what Creative has said they have found out during their testing.

As far as Creative going out of the Sound Card business? Very unlikely. As far as consumer sound cards go, they are the king. I really cant think of a single company that can even get near to Creative's sound card levels pf quality and power unless you goto the professional series of cards. You cant expect the same development you see out of, say, CPU's and GPU's, in sound cards. Lets face it, there is no continual resolution increase need in sound, nor is there AF, AA, Bloom or HDR like options in sound cards so there is no point in yearly (or sooner) advances in sound cards like there is in the GFX world. Sound is something that can only get so good until there is a total re-vamp of how it is done. The only options they have to work with now would be add more voice channels (doubt it would improve anything as my speakers already get distorted running 128 channels) or add more X-Ram (what is there right now is not even used so why do this?).
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That's an awesome post. Thanks for the thoughts. :)

Here's a link to the Creative topic you've mentioned, I believe:

http://forums.creative.com/creativelabs/board/message?board.id=soundblaster&message.id=61926
 
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