KDM Power Supplies are good

[computermonkey]

I see a lot of people bash KDM power supplies but I don't think it's warranted.
I've used bad power supplies - I had tried "solid gear" power supplies in multiple computers, and in each case they caused weird problems like freezing and crashing, strange sounds from hard drives (probably pushing uneven current), and symptoms like touching the case causing the computer to turn off.

On the other hand the KDM power supplies that I replaced these units with have been rock solid and those problems have disappeared, on multiple units.

That and:
(1) It is a US based company that puts their name on the product. Companies don't do that liability wise unless you are pretty sure you're selling a solid product.
(2) They have over 50000 sales on ebay, with positive feedback. You wouldn't stay in business that long on any marketplace selling junk.

Personally I think it's brand snobbery, like saying it has to be Antec/SeaSonic/Corsair etc or it's junk. Just not true in reality.

 

[extreme_noob]

This isn't a question; this is a statement...

However, JonnyGuru, who is among the best PSU reviewers, said that it's pretty low in terms of PSU quality on his forums. Not sure which unit you have, but apparently their bronze units are from Leadman, which is a complete junk OEM. Just because there's 50,000 sales on ebay and positive feedback, doesn't mean it's a good company or power supply. The EVGA N1, which is a really crap unit, has 1600 ratings averaging out at about 4.5 stars. What you were using before was probably really terrible (what even is solid gear), and this is just less terrible.

Another indication of quality is anodization. It costs cents to do, so it's not a good sign when a company skips out to save those couple cents. Not selling on amazon or newegg is sketchy as well. There aren't any legitimate (non ebay) reviews on KDM PSUs at all, besides discussions on forums from seven years ago calling it crap. If it was crap seven years ago, it's definitely terrible now.

Also, what do you mean by putting their name on the product? Almost every other company puts a sticker with the brand name on the PSU in big lettering.

Very few people actually say "Buy only X brand of PSU" because it's just wrong. They all make different quality PSUs, and there are some good and some bad. You shouldn't say that one brand is across the board good or across the board bad at all.

 

[anotherdrew]

The power supply ...

It doesn't make your computer faster
It doesn't look that cool
It doesn't make a lot of noise (well, we hope it doesn't)

So what does it matter? The power supply is like an insurance plan you hope to never use. How good of an insurance plan you want is up to you, but I think the test of the plan is to look at the warranty ... how good do they think their stuff is?

Yes, a cheap power supply might serve you well for many years ... and then again it might not. Do you want to roll those dice?

 

[computermonkey]

Just because there's 50,000 sales on ebay and positive feedback, doesn't mean it's a good company or power supply. The EVGA N1, which is a really crap unit, has 1600 ratings averaging out at about 4.5 stars. What you were using before was probably really terrible (what even is solid gear), and this is just less terrible.

Another indication of quality is anodization. It costs cents to do, so it's not a good sign when a company skips out to save those couple cents. Not selling on amazon or newegg is sketchy as well. There aren't any legitimate (non ebay) reviews on KDM PSUs at all, besides discussions on forums from seven years ago calling it crap. If it was crap seven years ago, it's definitely terrible now.

Also, what do you mean by putting their name on the product? Almost every other company puts a sticker with the brand name on the PSU in big lettering.

Couldn't disagree with you more on the Amazon vs eBay thing. Almost every eBay seller I buy from provides excellent service and ships fast whereas amazon sellers are horrible in my experience.
That and amazon has a huge problem with fake "US" sellers that eBay doesn't.

The reason the 50,000 feedback matter, if you know how eBay works, is that their is no way eBay allows you to continue selling if you have hundreds of bad customer experiences. You will quickly get suspended and kicked off. So it would only take a handful of cases in which peoples motherboard fries or their house burns down from a shoddy PSU to put them out of business on eBay.
I speak from experience since I sell mobile phone products myself on eBay so I know how little tolerance eBay has with quality metrics. People get kicked off with less than 10 bad transactions - you see it all the time on ebay forums. There is no way KDM would still be on eBay with that many transactions unless a huge number of people are happy.

With the company name- If you are a US company and you brand your product to your name (called private labeling the product) than you are legally taking responsibility and liability for the product. There are many products sold from china with generic non-company names, and there is no one you could go after for damages because those companies don't exist. KDM, being a US company, could easily get sued for damages if they sell junk that causes damages.

Anodization - is that the shiny metal style? Mine have that but I'm not sure I really consider it important.

 

[extreme_noob]

Oh. It's back.

Couldn't disagree with you more on the Amazon vs eBay thing. Almost every eBay seller I buy from provides excellent service and ships fast whereas amazon sellers are horrible in my experience.
That and amazon has a huge problem with fake "US" sellers that eBay doesn't.

My point was that almost every trustworthy company sells units on Amazon and Newegg. The fact that they are only selling on ebay and some smaller vendors is sketchy. And what? Amazon sellers don't ship fast? Again, most trustworthy companies can have their units shipped to you in a couple days if you buy from Amazon or Newegg. There are quite a few ebay sellers who will take a while to ship. It all depends on the seller, not the website.

Aaaand it's gone again (?)

 

[extreme_noob]

As for your point about reviews: I wouldn't be surprised if the people buying the unit didn't follow up when it died because they didn't really care.

As for your name brand point: Very few people actually buy no name units from China, so I don't know why having the company name on the unit is anything special. Every major manufacturer does it. Even many Chinese units do.

Finally, my point about anodization was that if a company decides to save the cents it costs to anodize a unit, it's not a good sign.

 

[computermonkey]

This isn't a question; this is a statement...

However, JonnyGuru, who is among the best PSU reviewers, said that it's pretty low in terms of PSU quality on his forums. Not sure which unit you have, but apparently their bronze units are from Leadman, which is a complete junk OEM.

Very few people actually say "Buy only X brand of PSU" because it's just wrong. They all make different quality PSUs, and there are some good and some bad. You shouldn't say that one brand is across the board good or across the board bad at all.

OEM isn't necessarily junk though. Pre-built computers use OEM products and they last for years without issues.
I would be curious to read the post from JonnyGuru on the PSU's if you have a link?
You have a good point on the across the board thing - but I guess from what I see people do seem to judge KDM per product but the whole brand.. which is what I was making a case against in this thread since so far (knock on wood) my experience has been good.

 

[computermonkey]

Yes, a cheap power supply might serve you well for many years ... and then again it might not. Do you want to roll those dice?

That is the question I guess. The only power supply brand that I saw huge problems with so far is "solid gear" and I saw the problems quickly on multiple systems.
But i've also used CoolMax PSUs for years without issues. I've been building PCs since 2k and have only had a few die, and in each case they didn't take any hardware with them.
So I think people over-rate the PSU on how risky it is to use an average one.

Maybe it's different if your building hugely expensive gaming rigs, but if you're building average business machines I think OEM power supplies are largely fine.
Just my opinion though.

 

[extreme_noob]

OEM isn't necessarily junk though. Pre-built computers use OEM products and they last for years without issues.
I would be curious to read the post from JonnyGuru on the PSU's if you have a link?
You have a good point on the across the board thing - but I guess from what I see people do seem to judge KDM per product but the whole brand.. which is what I was making a case against in this thread since so far (knock on wood) my experience has been good.

I'm talking about the Leadman OEM specifically. Major PSU companies (aside from Seasonic and Superflower, who sell their own units) buy units from an OEM and basically but their name and branding on it. These different OEMs differ in quality, of course. There's SGX, HEC, Andyson, Seasonic, and Superflower, to name a few. Leadman makes really crappy units.
There are a couple brief replies from JonnyGuru on forum pages, however he doesn't go into much detail. http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?16513-KDM http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-15843.html
Additionally, here is a link to another post on his forums, with replies from Oklahoma Wolf, who does all PSU testing for the JonnyGuru website at this point: https://www.overclockers.com/forums...-KDM-PSU-s?s=5df541a73eb1098850c748d895e489e2
http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?7215-Hey-a-Leadman-just-blew-up Hard to find much on Leadman stuff, probably because no one buys them. But here's a link to something I guess

That is the question I guess. The only power supply brand that I saw huge problems with so far is "solid gear" and I saw the problems quickly on multiple systems.
But i've also used CoolMax PSUs for years without issues. I've been building PCs since 2k and have only had a few die, and in each case they didn't take any hardware with them.
So I think people over-rate the PSU on how risky it is to use an average one.

Maybe it's different if your building hugely expensive gaming rigs, but if you're building average business machines I think OEM power supplies are largely fine.
Just my opinion though.

So you're only putting these in business machines? That would explain a lot. Those don't put as much wattage load on the PSUs, probably 150W at the max, and units like these are more acceptable. I guess that would explain the good ebay reviews as well.

 

[computermonkey]

So you're only putting these in business machines? That would explain a lot. Those don't put as much wattage load on the PSUs, probably 150W at the max, and units like these are more acceptable. I guess that would explain the good ebay reviews as well.

Thanks for the links - I'll read up on them.
Yeah i'm not a big gamer so it's mostly business for me.
They make a lot of OEM replacement parts for branded desktop computers, like HPs - so I would imagine a lot of the clients are either home users or business.

 

[extreme_noob]

Thanks for the links - I'll read up on them.
Yeah i'm not a big gamer so it's mostly business for me.
Not sure if that is true for everyone else buying from them though.

Yeah. Context is important, and I kinda assumed you were actually using these for higher end machines. It's probably true for most others since there is a sort of "Don't cheap out on PSU/Don't buy bare metal looking units" culture among people building gaming PCs to the point where almost everyone wouldn't dare put one of these in their gaming machines.
For desktop uses, these should do perfectly fine. There isn't enough load to really stress it to the point of damage/destruction.

 

[computermonkey]

The fact that they are only selling on ebay and some smaller vendors is sketchy. And what? Amazon sellers don't ship fast? Again, most trustworthy companies can have their units shipped to you in a couple days if you buy from Amazon or Newegg. There are quite a few ebay sellers who will take a while to ship. It all depends on the seller, not the website.

Yep my experience has been mostly bad on Amazon and good on eBay.
And I have insider knowledge on the quality metrics that ebay puts on sellers vs amazon.
Amazon doesn't really punish you the same degree if you don't perform.
I've ordered tons of stuff on ebay and almost all of it ships within 1-2 days (because of the quality metrics that will get you suspended by not doing so) .
But Amazon orders i have had plenty sit around for more than 2-4 days before shipping, which is why I don't order there hardly anymore.

Also Amazon has a huge Chinese counterfeit problem which they haven't really put a handle on.
The problem doesn't exist on eBay since they require you to have a paypal account with a confirmed checking account attached to it.
Whereas amazon allows you to setup a seller account and post 80,000 counterfeit products in an hour, with no validation.

You should really give ebay a try - Amazon is the shady one.

 

[computermonkey]

Regarding this that I saw on one of the links:
Looks like a bunch of Athena Power and Topower stuff?

The psu i'm using does look a lot like one of the ones on the Athena Power site. But it's strange that the one I purchased was cheaper than the one sold direct from Athena Power. I would think that generally resellers would have to mark up their prices compared to the manufacturer selling direct, which makes me wonder if KDM is actually the one making it. KDM does say they do manufacture some units on their site.

 

[g-unit1111]

Also Amazon has a huge Chinese counterfeit problem which they haven't really put a handle on.
The problem doesn't exist on eBay since they require you to have a paypal account with a confirmed checking account attached to it.
Whereas amazon allows you to setup a seller account and post 80,000 counterfeit products in an hour, with no validation.

That is completely wrong. eBay absolutely has a problem selling cheap counterfeit junk and they've been busted multiple times for it. It was especially prevalent back when the graphics card shortage happened two years ago and people were trying to sell fake 1080TIs that were actually 950s, that were being sold for outrageous markups because of the shortage brought on by bitcoin mining..

Have you actually read the feedback to see what they are saying or are you just going by the numbers? If you are, you should go back and look at what people are actually saying about these products. Just because a product has a high feedback rating doesn't always necessarily mean that it's good.

 

[Darkbreeze]

Couldn't disagree with you more on the Amazon vs eBay thing. Almost every eBay seller I buy from provides excellent service and ships fast whereas amazon sellers are horrible in my experience.
That and amazon has a huge problem with fake "US" sellers that eBay doesn't.

They both have this problem.

The reason the 50,000 feedback matter, if you know how eBay works, is that their is no way eBay allows you to continue selling if you have hundreds of bad customer experiences. You will quickly get suspended and kicked off. So it would only take a handful of cases in which peoples motherboard fries or their house burns down from a shoddy PSU to put them out of business on eBay.
I speak from experience since I sell mobile phone products myself on eBay so I know how little tolerance eBay has with quality metrics. People get kicked off with less than 10 bad transactions - you see it all the time on ebay forums. There is no way KDM would still be on eBay with that many transactions unless a huge number of people are happy.

Both Amazon and Ebay have hundreds and thousands of positive feedbacks that are based on stupidity, like whether the damn thing even ARRIVED, at ALL, or if it looked nice, or if the system simply managed to power on after it was installed. No sane or reasonably intelligent person would EVER believe that having a high number of positive feedback scores or reviews on Amazon, Newegg or Ebay means ANYTHING, at all. Other than in cases where a clear problem is repeatedly pointed out about a product by many reviewers, those reviews should not be taken with a grain of salt, but rather, should be not taken at all. Generally on Ebay the feedback is for the seller, not the product, and their actual reviews at the bottom of each product page, much the same as Amazon, are more often than not not even FOR that product.

Additionally, the entirety of the opinions in the linked thread below, plus the general consensus across the web AND that of myself and JonnyGuru as well (Whom I do not place myself anywhere near the same category as when it comes to opinions of this nature. Just to be clear), fully represent the reality of using KDM power supplies. They are pure garbage. Plain and simple. You'll note, that even ko888 who might be one of the most knowledgeable people on this or any forum when it comes to power supplies, even agrees that anything made by Leadman should be completely avoided and if you know anything about ko888 you would know that even when everybody else says a unit is junk he often declines to agree unless there is VERY clear evidence to the contrary. I assure you, they are garbage.

Kdm power supply?

Hey everybody i was just wondering if anybody has any experience with kdm power supplys. I am currently putting together a budget gaming pc and was wondering if they were any good. Here is a link...

forums.tomshardware.com

Anodization - is that the shiny metal style? Mine have that but I'm not sure I really consider it important.

It's not. It's for looks. Only. Plenty of firebombs power supplies made by Cooler master, Thermaltake, Raidmax, and Aerocool, among others, that look very nice but are also nothing more than a waste of the materials used to create them.

 

[Rogue Leader]

Regarding this that I saw on one of the links:
Looks like a bunch of Athena Power and Topower stuff?

The psu i'm using does look a lot like one of the ones on the Athena Power site. But it's strange that the one I purchased was cheaper than the one sold direct from Athena Power. I would think that generally resellers would have to mark up their prices compared to the manufacturer selling direct, which makes me wonder if KDM is actually the one making it. KDM does say they do manufacture some units on their site.

There is no way KDM is manufacturing PSUs on site and selling them cheaper. Not in the US, not a chance. They are simply a reseller, and have one of the OEM's over in China building PSUs to their spec. The spec they use may even be worse than Athena Power and Topower, hence the price difference, we don't really know. Suffice to say in many office systems they will survive, because they will rarely if ever be driven within a sniff of their max power.

I don't know how in the world you can take seriously a company with a website that looks like it came from Geocities in 1994. They are simply using the fact they are an American company to push off the same Chinese junk that many of the low end OEMs sell without the American made pretense.

 

[Deleted member 217926]

Ko888 who is one of our more knowledgeable power supply guys thinks they're made by Leadman. Which = junk tier.

Kdm power supply?

Hey everybody i was just wondering if anybody has any experience with kdm power supplys. I am currently putting together a budget gaming pc and was wondering if they were any good. Here is a link...

forums.tomshardware.com

Also in that thread - guy bought 2 of them. 1 died energetically in an hour.

 

[computermonkey]

I don't know how in the world you can take seriously a company with a website that looks like it came from Geocities in 1994. They are simply using the fact they are an American company to push off the same Chinese junk that many of the low end OEMs sell without the American made pretense.

Geocities was great - I wish it still existed. Do I care if the website provides useful information vs looks fancy? The first option.
Iv'e done business with distributors that have crappy websites but have good products. The fact that you can't imagine otherwise is just brand snobbishness.

 

[computermonkey]

Ko888 who is one of our more knowledgeable power supply guys thinks they're made by Leadman. Which = junk tier.

Kdm power supply?

Hey everybody i was just wondering if anybody has any experience with kdm power supplys. I am currently putting together a budget gaming pc and was wondering if they were any good. Here is a link...

forums.tomshardware.com

Also in that thread - guy bought 2 of them. 1 died energetically in an hour.

Well I have several, all which solved previous problems and are still running strong. Considering there is tons of threads on here which EVGA and Corsair and other fancy brand names crash and burn despite 80 Plus and more certification, might indicate these brands are not as good as you think they are.
Maybe i'm not the one that needs to consider the reality.

 

[extreme_noob]

Iv'e done business with distributors that have crappy websites but have good products. The fact that you can't imagine otherwise is just brand snobbishness.

It isn't "brand snobbishness". The fact that the company didn't put any money into their website shows that they are trying to increase profit margins every so slightly, which is the same reason why I said the lack of anodization was not a good sign. Doesn't mean that it is a bad company necessarily, it just definitely isn't an indication of a good one. And while they may perhaps be a good company, they are selling a crap product, as mentioned above many times.

 

[DSzymborski]

I see a lot of people bash KDM power supplies but I don't think it's warranted.
I've used bad power supplies - I had tried "solid gear" power supplies in multiple computers, and in each case they caused weird problems like freezing and crashing, strange sounds from hard drives (probably pushing uneven current), and symptoms like touching the case causing the computer to turn off.

On the other hand the KDM power supplies that I replaced these units with have been rock solid and those problems have disappeared, on multiple units.

That and:
(1) It is a US based company that puts their name on the product. Companies don't do that liability wise unless you are pretty sure you're selling a solid product.
(2) They have over 50000 sales on ebay, with positive feedback. You wouldn't stay in business that long on any marketplace selling junk.

Personally I think it's brand snobbery, like saying it has to be Antec/SeaSonic/Corsair etc or it's junk. Just not true in reality.

I'm sure you have your charts of voltage regulation, ripple, and a component analysis describing the internal parts and the topology used, but you accidentally hit "post reply" early.

 

[computermonkey]

It isn't "brand snobbishness". The fact that the company didn't put any money into their website shows that they are trying to increase profit margins every so slightly, which is the same reason why I said the lack of anodization was not a good sign. Doesn't mean that it is a bad company necessarily, it just definitely isn't an indication of a good one. And while they may perhaps be a good company, they are selling a crap product, as mentioned above many times.

I respect your opinion but don't agree. I'm a seller in a different industry but you could say my own website isn't fancy. The truth is 99% of sales come from marketplaces today and you get almost no ROI on fancy sites because google has killed SEO.
In my case I list products on eBay and .Bonanza. and my listing system just happens to indirectly list on a crappy website offered by Bonanza.. Considering the website has almost no traffic I really don't care.
It exists to say i'm in business and the real sales come from marketplaces. Does that mean my products are bad? Nope.

And as I mentioned, I do business with other companies in the same boat who have great products.
So it is brand snobbishness, from my point of view.

 

[schmuckley]

The power supply ...

It doesn't make your computer faster
It doesn't look that cool
It doesn't make a lot of noise (well, we hope it doesn't)

So what does it matter? The power supply is like an insurance plan you hope to never use. How good of an insurance plan you want is up to you, but I think the test of the plan is to look at the warranty ... how good do they think their stuff is?

Yes, a cheap power supply might serve you well for many years ... and then again it might not. Do you want to roll those dice?

It matters a lot if you push the limits.

 

[schmuckley]

Yeah...I ain't buying one of those.
Ofc I'm good on Power Supply until the next lightning strike.
Then there's the backup Antec, after that I need another.

 

[computermonkey]

That is completely wrong. eBay absolutely has a problem selling cheap counterfeit junk and they've been busted multiple times for it.

Not completely wrong - maybe I overstated how good eBay is but Amazon is worse and I have experience with it that you might be lacking, as a seller.