Question Memory compatibility problem with X99 and Core i7 6850K

[mac_angel]

EDIT: Can be closed, or left open for others that run into the same problem.
If you read the whole post, I have 4 sticks of Corsair Vengeance 8GB 3200 that are Samsung B-Die, and 4 sticks of GSkill 8GB 3200 that are Samsung D-Die. I was hoping to use the B-Die in my gaming system (Core i9 11900K) and overclocking, but only got as far as 3466. The GSkill and Samsung D-Die got to 3600, with tighter timings, and lower voltage. So, the Corsair, Samsung B-Die went into my server, X99, running Quad Channel. XMP didn't work, nor did manual settings. However, MSI's MemNow and selecting Samsung 3200 16,18,18,36 (the timings of the kit), did finally work. I think when I tried that earlier I was selecting Micron, confusing Corsair's other Vengeance kits with the same product number that can either come with Micron or Samsung chips. So, server seems to be running in quad channel @3200, and my gaming computer running at 3600 for a couple of days without issue.

Not sure if this should be posted in RAM, CPU, or motherboards. Shorter question/problem, followed by longer details.

I have 4 x 8GB GSkill DDR4 3200 (Samsung D-Die). I tried putting it into my MSI X99S MPower and it would not post when trying to run quad channel (slots 1, 3, 7, and 5). It would cycle through some posts codes, pausing briefly on (I think) 55, 60, and longer on 19, before cycling again. Couldn't get it to the BIOS. I also tried 1, 4, 8, and 5, same thing. I have tried with and without XMP, as well as using 2 sticks, going to the BIOS and manually changing the voltages and settings, including even trying MSI's MemNow. I can get it to run in dual channel with 1, 2, 6 and 5. This was trying with the latest 2 BIOS updates, too, MD2 and MC. I also have an MSI X99A SLI Plus (BIOS 1E). I can't remember why, but I replaced that with the MPower several years ago, but never threw it out (bit of an electronics hoarder). I tried the kit in that, but it does not have an LED for post codes. If I let it run with BIOS defaults, it works in quad mode and makes it to Windows running 2133. If I try XMP or any manual settings to run at 3200, it says overclocking failed and gets me back to the BIOS. I have been able to get 2666 on that board using MSI's built in overclock, as well as set it manually (I have tried 3200 and 3000, and swapping between both boards took me the whole day yesterday, so I settled on 2666 just to get it up and running since it's a big media server running for the entire household). RAM works, been running it in a different system. I also have two sets of Corsair 3200 with Samsung B-Die that I have tried with the same outcome. The GSkill was in my gaming rig, and one set of the Corsair was in the server. I got lucky with getting another set of Corsair that turned out to be Samsung's B-Die (it's a part number that can either be Micron D-Die, or sometimes Samsung B-Die), so I wanted to put the Corsair in my gaming computer and tinker with that, and run the GSkill in my server in quad channel mode.
I've tried overclocking the CPU to 1.375 (AIO 360 watercooler), SA and VCCIO to 1.15 trying to get 3000 or 3200. Only thing I haven't tried as of yet was to use Thaiphoon Burner, get all the timings from the chips, and input them all manually. After spending a day with trying all the other stuff, I figured I'd ask and see if others might have some suggestions first.

 

[Vic 40]

Hard to say, maybe the cpu just has a weak memory controller. The 2666mhz not fast enough for the server?

 

[mac_angel]

Hard to say, maybe the cpu just has a weak memory controller. The 2666mhz not fast enough for the server?

Yea, I was also wondering that, too. I did have it running in quad channel mode before, with two Quad kits, 4 x 4GB @3200 for the longest time, so still 32GB RAM. I've had the 6850K since it came out, and was originally my gaming computer back then. When I upgrade, I kind of trickle down my parts and it ended up as my server. One of the RAM sticks went bad, so I sent it in to Corsair. Through a 3 month battle, they refused to RMA a quad kit in return, instead sending me a dual channel kit, 2 x 8GB, saying it was comparable (Apparently Corsair doesn't know the difference between quad channel and dual channel, even though they sell the kits).
Anyway, kinda hard to say. I'd think it shouldn't be any different running 4 x 8GB Quad channel vs 8 x 4GB Quad channel.

 

[Vic 40]

No diference between "quad" channel and "dual" channel ram, just the amount of sticks in a set and that they are tested together as a working set, for the rest is ram just ram.

they only might gamble with the two sticks returned in the way that this kit might not play well with what you already have, you'd probably should have send the whole set to Corsair to get a whole set back.

 

[mac_angel]

No diference between "quad" channel and "dual" channel ram, just the amount of sticks in a set and that they are tested together as a working set, for the rest is ram just ram.

they only might gamble with the two sticks returned in the way that this kit might not play well with what you already have, you'd probably should have send the whole set to Corsair to get a whole set back.

I did send the whole kit to Corsair. They refused to send a quad kit back, saying the dual channel kit was "comparable" because it still equaled 16GB (2 x8gb vs 4 x 4GB).
I have tried the 4 sticks in dual channel mode and it works at 3200, but in quad channel, I get that error.

 

[Vic 40]

I did send the whole kit to Corsair.

Sorry, read that you send one stick back, need to up my game ...

They refused to send a quad kit back, saying the dual channel kit was "comparable" because it still equaled 16GB (2 x8gb vs 4 x 4GB).

Wel in amount they are right, but if someone, as you do, uses a quadchannel motherboard are they wrong.

Maybe remount the cpu cooler, maybe one corner is abit tight and why the memory contoller acts up. Make snug on all corners.

 

[mac_angel]

Sorry, read that you send one stick back, need to up my game ...



Wel in amount they are right, but if someone, as you do, uses a quadchannel motherboard are they wrong.

Maybe remount the cpu cooler, maybe one corner is abit tight and why the memory contoller acts up. Make snug on all corners.

yea, I've tried arguing with Corsair for 3 months, many times explaining that it was a quad channel kit, saying which CPU and motherboard it was for. They refused to acknowledge any of that.
And I kinda think reseating the CPU would have been covered in going back and forth between motherboards trying to troubleshoot it.

 

[Vic 40]

I kinda think reseating the CPU would have been covered in going back and forth between motherboards trying to troubleshoot it.

True, forgot that.

 

[Vic 40]

I've tried overclocking the CPU to 1.375 (AIO 360 watercooler), SA and VCCIO to 1.15 trying to get 3000 or 3200.

What if you do not overclock the cpu, but keep the SA voltage at 1.15V? Does that help with stability of the ram? Make sure the ram is at least at 1.35V.


There is a newer bios in the Support for X99 SLI Plus , but it is beta and comes with a warning attached, might want to think about it, but then again might be better to stay with that latest non beta bios and live with 2666mhz.

Talking about living with 2666mhz, can of course try and tighten timings with that speed.

 

[mac_angel]

What if you do not overclock the cpu, but keep the SA voltage at 1.15V? Does that help with stability of the ram? Make sure the ram is at least at 1.35V.


There is a newer bios in the Support for X99 SLI Plus , but it is beta and comes with a warning attached, might want to think about it, but then again might be better to stay with that latest non beta bios and live with 2666mhz.

Talking about living with 2666mhz, can of course try and tighten timings with that speed.

I started off with no overclocks, just trying XMP. I also tried MemNow, selecting 3200, manually setting to 3200, and increasing the ram to 1.35, 1.375, and 1.4. I wasn't overclocking the system before since it was just a media server, but when I was using it for gaming I was running it at 4.6GHz. I haven't tried just upping the SA. I've also pointed out that I've tried the last two BIOS's for both motherboards. The second to last were needed on both after Windows update 1903, the one that killed all overclocking.

Another odd/annoying problem is my gaming system, and either of the RAM. As I said, I had the Corsair stuff (the 2 x 8GB 3200) in my server before. Running Thaiphoon I found out it was Samsung's B-Die. So, pissed about Corsair refusing to send me a quad channel kit, happy that it was Samsung B-Die. Looking up the model number, Corsair uses either Micron or Samsung for that RAM, so you're not guarantied to get Samsung if you buy it. I found the same kit on Amazon for $105CAN on sale and bought it. It turned out to be Micron, got Amazon to let me exchange it. Second kit was Micron again, exchanged it once more and got Samsung (Love Amazon). So, put the Corsair in my gaming rig, Core i9 11900k, Asus Strix Z590-E Gaming WIFI. Started up, wanted me to go to the BIOS with the new RAM. Clicked on defaults and switched a couple of the regular settings that were needed and turned on XMP II. Started up fine, but trying to play Horizon Zero Dawn, it crashed - restarted on it's own. Defaults on the Asus board tries to overclock everything beyond Intel's built in ones. Tried tinkering around with it and thought while I was at it (and stuck tinkering with the server), I read a bunch on overclocking Samsung B-Die. Most say it can be run at 1.5v 24/7, and should easily be able to start with a 400MHz over XMP for the overclock. Doesn't seem so with my kit. Highest I was able to get to last night was 3466 with auto (loose) timings. I love how Asus has MemTest built into the BIOS. I'm not sure if it's still the case or not, but I know in the past bad memory overclocks can permanently mess up Windows installs. Corrupts it somehow where even if you go back to XMP or even stock, Windows will still crash regularly. Even trying the command line repairs and other repairs never work, but needing to reformat (I never tried the 'install in place' before, but I have a couple of times this year for other things and it works well). Anyway, I think that's what happened to my gaming rig, the RAM was unstable one of the many times I was tinkering, corrupted the OS because I even tried putting the G-Skill back in. Turned off all mobo boosts, put the limits on, and manually set it back to 3200 (with both GSkill and Corsair). The GSkill let me play a little longer, but only something like 20 minutes before crashing. The GSkill is Samsung D-Die.
Last night I started tinkering with the Corsair, using MemTest to see what I could get. As I said, highest I got was 3466 with loose timings. I tried 3600 and 3733 and got errors instantly. I called it quits and headed to bed, planning on continuing with it today. Sick AF though (no, not covid, lol). Ended up being up until after 4am from it, so not sure how mobile I'll be today. What I plan on trying is seeing what speed and timings I can get for the Corsair and GSkill in my gaming rig and stick with those, and put the others in my server. With my server it's either 3200 in dual channel mode, or 2666 in quad channel. Another odd problem I remembered at the beginning was when I first tried the GSkill in the X99S MPower with XMP was that it did start up, but Windows showed 16GB of RAM @ 3200 in the Device Manager, showing "2 of 8". But in HWInfo and CPUz, it showed that there were 4 sticks installed. I vaguely remember that happening several years ago, but unsure. I think I had to use TryMem to get it to run at the right speed, I just don't remember which kit of RAM that was for. I've had a LOT of systems over the years. My gaming rig last year was a Core i9 10940x, which I gave to my son when I picked up the 11900K and Asus Z590 board. I believe he's running the remaining 4 x 4GB 3200 Corsair quad kit that was paired with the kit I sent back.

 

[Vic 40]

Hope you can figure out what ram is best for what purpose, don't think i can help you much more with that. Think that the 2666mhz for quadchannel is likely a limit by cpu since 3200mhz in dualchannel works. Gotta wonder if pushing this is worth if for a server, might need excessive amounts of voltage for negligible gains.

 

[mac_angel]

Hope you can figure out what ram is best for what purpose, don't think i can help you much more with that. Think that the 2666mhz for quadchannel is likely a limit by cpu since 3200mhz in dualchannel works. Gotta wonder if pushing this is worth if for a server, might need excessive amounts of voltage for negligible gains.

I actually updated my post at the top. All good now.