- Status
the NYC Mayor Bill De Blasio, FBI NSA CIA and DOD are all onboard this particular case and are chomping at the bit to have apple thrown into contempt of court as well as the executives thrown in jail immediately.
"we're not asking apple to do anything illegal or that gives apple back door access, they have all asked apple to take this phone with an FBI observer for legality issues as this phone and it's contents are legal evidence back to where they made it and in-house crack/unlock it so that the phone doesn't wipe itself, and once it's unlocked the government will handle the rest."
"apple refused to install a feature that lets a stolen phone be wiped, when the iphones/ipads were getting stolen and the information on them was left there with out a way to wipe it and the public outrage got so enormous within 5 minutes apple installed an update into the cloud that allowed a stolen iphone/ipad to be remotely wiped"
quote taken straight from the FBI lawyer on good morning america this morning.
"there is a terrorist in new york who talked to this guy prior to his shutting off the cloud back up 1 month before his jihad.
they need to find this terrorist and this phone has the last KNOWN contact info/whereabouts of this terrorist."
"further more apple is lying when it says it can't as they already do know encrypted information on every single iphone/ipad as part of their marketing programming which it even allows merchants to have and decrypt when they install a cookie on any iphone/ipad such as location tracking and search terms and vocal queries and most importantly contacts."
and that's coming from a homosexual FBI Lawyer even. (government pulled out all the stops in trying to appease apple right down to tim cooks homosexuality)
the only thing stopping them from arresting every single apple employee who refuses to crack this phone is president O-BOMB-US.
i should think the good citizens of NYC would want this terrorist found and caught before some NYC marathon such as the upcoming womens half marathon or the kids half marathon gets bombed or something worse.
the person contacted by this san bernadino guy is a KNOWN al queda linked terrorist with a documented grudge to pull off a terrorist attack on american soil...and they know he's in new york and the trail is growing cold.
i will personal shoot tim cook on sight for treason if i see him and he does not comply. nathan hale isn't the only guy who died for his country and i will be damned if another 9/11 or san bernadino happens and some jackwad stood in the way and aided and abetted a known al queda jihadi terrorist and known al queda jihadi terrorist threat!
The Constitution of the United States
Article. I.
Section. 9.
The Privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion the public Safety may require it.
Article III.
Section. 3.
Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.
The Congress shall have Power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted.
the san bernadino terrorist is dead, the dead have no rights to privacy, the only right they have is to rest in peace and even that can be interrupted with a court order, the law was made to protect the living and the future generations, our posterity.
apple did not hesitate to comply when the chinese government " TOLD APPLE TO CRACK THIS APPLE DEVICE AND HAND OVER THE ENCRYPTION KEYS " Apple complied on the spot, the chinese official that made the demand had a firing squad standing just outside waiting in case there were any objections.
tim cook and the rest of the apple executives are about to be thrown in gitmo and apple will be seized unless they can pull off a miracle in the next week. at the very least all these government agencies have gone to congress with a draft resolution for a government authorized court order to ban apple products from import and a possible confiscation clause in the order.
in this particular case apple is 100% purely with out a doubt in the wrong given the agreement to appease apples public appearance demands.
apple is the one who made the stink public either on purpose to warn it's terrorist users or trying to false portray it is all about customers rights despite the U.K. and China already having mandated back door access and on demand support and the encryption keys if they wished to operate in those respective countries.
they broke with lightning speed when the chinese brought a firing squad with.
treason in the united states is also punishable with death and can be carried out by any officer of the united states military on a battlefield if deemed necessary.
you're either with us, or your against us. i have no regard for the Socialist states of europe or asia, they succumbed to known socialist the likes of hitler and stalin and mao, ho chi mihn and kim il sung. the axis powers won world war 2 in my book, they adopted socialism.
"we're not asking apple to do anything illegal or that gives apple back door access, they have all asked apple to take this phone with an FBI observer for legality issues as this phone and it's contents are legal evidence back to where they made it and in-house crack/unlock it so that the phone doesn't wipe itself, and once it's unlocked the government will handle the rest."
"apple refused to install a feature that lets a stolen phone be wiped, when the iphones/ipads were getting stolen and the information on them was left there with out a way to wipe it and the public outrage got so enormous within 5 minutes apple installed an update into the cloud that allowed a stolen iphone/ipad to be remotely wiped"
quote taken straight from the FBI lawyer on good morning america this morning.
"there is a terrorist in new york who talked to this guy prior to his shutting off the cloud back up 1 month before his jihad.
they need to find this terrorist and this phone has the last KNOWN contact info/whereabouts of this terrorist."
"further more apple is lying when it says it can't as they already do know encrypted information on every single iphone/ipad as part of their marketing programming which it even allows merchants to have and decrypt when they install a cookie on any iphone/ipad such as location tracking and search terms and vocal queries and most importantly contacts."
and that's coming from a homosexual FBI Lawyer even. (government pulled out all the stops in trying to appease apple right down to tim cooks homosexuality)
the only thing stopping them from arresting every single apple employee who refuses to crack this phone is president O-BOMB-US.
i should think the good citizens of NYC would want this terrorist found and caught before some NYC marathon such as the upcoming womens half marathon or the kids half marathon gets bombed or something worse.
the person contacted by this san bernadino guy is a KNOWN al queda linked terrorist with a documented grudge to pull off a terrorist attack on american soil...and they know he's in new york and the trail is growing cold.
i will personal shoot tim cook on sight for treason if i see him and he does not comply. nathan hale isn't the only guy who died for his country and i will be damned if another 9/11 or san bernadino happens and some jackwad stood in the way and aided and abetted a known al queda jihadi terrorist and known al queda jihadi terrorist threat!
The Constitution of the United States
Article. I.
Section. 9.
The Privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion the public Safety may require it.
Article III.
Section. 3.
Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.
The Congress shall have Power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted.
the san bernadino terrorist is dead, the dead have no rights to privacy, the only right they have is to rest in peace and even that can be interrupted with a court order, the law was made to protect the living and the future generations, our posterity.
apple did not hesitate to comply when the chinese government " TOLD APPLE TO CRACK THIS APPLE DEVICE AND HAND OVER THE ENCRYPTION KEYS " Apple complied on the spot, the chinese official that made the demand had a firing squad standing just outside waiting in case there were any objections.
tim cook and the rest of the apple executives are about to be thrown in gitmo and apple will be seized unless they can pull off a miracle in the next week. at the very least all these government agencies have gone to congress with a draft resolution for a government authorized court order to ban apple products from import and a possible confiscation clause in the order.
in this particular case apple is 100% purely with out a doubt in the wrong given the agreement to appease apples public appearance demands.
apple is the one who made the stink public either on purpose to warn it's terrorist users or trying to false portray it is all about customers rights despite the U.K. and China already having mandated back door access and on demand support and the encryption keys if they wished to operate in those respective countries.
they broke with lightning speed when the chinese brought a firing squad with.
treason in the united states is also punishable with death and can be carried out by any officer of the united states military on a battlefield if deemed necessary.
you're either with us, or your against us. i have no regard for the Socialist states of europe or asia, they succumbed to known socialist the likes of hitler and stalin and mao, ho chi mihn and kim il sung. the axis powers won world war 2 in my book, they adopted socialism.
skit75
Splendid
- Oct 7, 2008
- 2,682
- 1
- 21,460
Your kool-aid is strong f-14. If this phone indeed made contact with an alleged NY terrorist suspect, then the appropriate government agencies already have all the "meta data" needed via its current mass data collection programs, including voice, text, geo-locations and cell towers used during the call(s).... for both phones.
What gets me is all this ruckus is based upon rumor and advertising claims being espoused by Apple. People are not reading the court order, they are taking sides based upon which side they want to like even before knowing anything.
I have read the court order. It does not say what Apple claims it says. Apple is telling a massive lie on this thing.
NO, Apple has not been ordered to provide a backdoor.
NO, Apple has not been ordered to give the FBI modified software or any software.
NO, Apple is not incapable of doing this work. Apple has admitted to the FBI that it can in fact remove the security features as requested.
The court order and the Dept of Justice Motion to Compel which followed are specific on these points.
Apple may do the work entirely under its own roof with its own personnel.
Apple may withhold the resulting software from the FBI, never releasing it or the source code.
Apple has been asked to only write the software they use to be encoded for the specific phone's electronic ID. This to prevent the code from working on any other phone. Even so, Apple may keep the phone secure under their own rood. When finished, Apple may restore the normal operating system, revealing nothing to the FBI other than the data hidden by the dead murderer.
Apple has been encouraged by the court, by the FBI and by the US Attorney to suggest any ideas or conditions they wish to achieve the ordered work.
Apple is to be paid for doing the job.
Will no one else read this stuff?
The original court order.
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/2714001/SB-Shooter-Order-Compelling-Apple-Asst-iPhone.pdf
Interview with DoJ is here:
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-apple-fbi-motion-to-compel-20160219-story.html
DoJ Motion to Compel filed with the court:
http://documents.latimes.com/doj-motion-apple-comply-fbi/
I have read the court order. It does not say what Apple claims it says. Apple is telling a massive lie on this thing.
NO, Apple has not been ordered to provide a backdoor.
NO, Apple has not been ordered to give the FBI modified software or any software.
NO, Apple is not incapable of doing this work. Apple has admitted to the FBI that it can in fact remove the security features as requested.
The court order and the Dept of Justice Motion to Compel which followed are specific on these points.
Apple may do the work entirely under its own roof with its own personnel.
Apple may withhold the resulting software from the FBI, never releasing it or the source code.
Apple has been asked to only write the software they use to be encoded for the specific phone's electronic ID. This to prevent the code from working on any other phone. Even so, Apple may keep the phone secure under their own rood. When finished, Apple may restore the normal operating system, revealing nothing to the FBI other than the data hidden by the dead murderer.
Apple has been encouraged by the court, by the FBI and by the US Attorney to suggest any ideas or conditions they wish to achieve the ordered work.
Apple is to be paid for doing the job.
Will no one else read this stuff?
The original court order.
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/2714001/SB-Shooter-Order-Compelling-Apple-Asst-iPhone.pdf
Interview with DoJ is here:
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-apple-fbi-motion-to-compel-20160219-story.html
DoJ Motion to Compel filed with the court:
http://documents.latimes.com/doj-motion-apple-comply-fbi/
skit75
Splendid
- Oct 7, 2008
- 2,682
- 1
- 21,460
This isn't about Apple so much as it is setting a precedent, going forward for any company using encryption. Last Apple product I owned was was the Apple IIe. I could care less about what they are peddling today but am very glad they have the bankroll and legal team to be able to begin to illustrate, what this actually means.
These conversations need to happen and be decided by the public. Apple nor ANY government, should get to make this decision. Again.... not about the stupid phone which very likely has little to no new information on it that they don't already have.
These conversations need to happen and be decided by the public. Apple nor ANY government, should get to make this decision. Again.... not about the stupid phone which very likely has little to no new information on it that they don't already have.
Not so. There is considerable precedent and Supreme Court ruling saying Apple can be so compelled. There are well defined and strictly enforced rules set down by the Supreme Court. This kind of thing is not new, it has happened before.
Also, Apple is not being forced to do this for free. The law requires they submit a bill and be paid.
And thus begins the proverbial slippery slope.
http://gizmodo.com/justice-department-forcing-apple-to-unlock-about-12-oth-1760749507
http://gizmodo.com/justice-department-forcing-apple-to-unlock-about-12-oth-1760749507
I keep hearing this described in those terms. What does not make sense to me is how or why people perceive any of this as new or even uncommon. Citizenship is not only a collection of Rights, it is a collection of Duties and Responsibilities. The laws of this Republic have always recognized both aspects, Rights and Duties.
As such, it has always been the case and is constantly exercised at every level that Citizens with knowledge or ability to aid in a criminal investigation or prosecution may be compelled to do so. Countless search warrants in every imaginable situation have been generated. Corporations have been ordered to build things that did not exist, including in court ordered eavesdropping and wiretapping.
Apple has created a product that is attractive to lots of honest people. That's wonderful. Trouble is it is also attractive to the criminally minded. The people who comprise Apple management are then left with the same duties of Citizenship as anyone else. As you or I. Having the nearness to the problem and the ability to aid in the solution, Apple management has the duty to help.
Either that, or renounce their Citizenship and depart for some foreign lands.
Clearly this case seems pretty black and white to you, but in life, what truly is? The "duty to assist the Government" is always weighed against the potential risks and moral implications of doing so. What the Government is attempting to do is in effect to conscript Apple into doing something that entity feels is not right on the grounds that the potential risk to a large number of device owners is too great. it' not "slavery" as some have tried to express here, but it would be pretty hard to argue it is not conscription. Remember that even in cases of conscription in its ultimate form (the military draft), individuals may claim to be conscientious objectors.
The fact that such precedents regarding conscription exist in this country and not many others, along with the fact that we are free to openly discuss and argue these points are some of the reasons that I and many others on both sides of this issue love this country, and have no desire to live anywhere else. Perhaps instead of politely asking those who disagree with you to depart for foreign lands, you could try to understand that even those who disagree with you likely have the country's best interest at heart but may simply have a different set of priorities when they evaluate the situation.
Hardly black and white. That is why there has been so very much legislation and case law collecting over such topics from the first days to the current days. It is also why, if you study what has been requested, Apple's position rings false.
What is very clear is that few people are willing to read the court documents which Apple is complaining about. If they were willing to read them, and without partisan filters, they would find that Apple is telling lies. No backdoor request exists. No software to be provided to anyone. No violation of anyone's privacy now or later. The court order makes all that clear, the subsequent motion reiterates it. Apple has the protections for its intellectual property that Apple wanted PLUS an open invitation to suggest further changes.
Apple has long made its desires clear, to engineer itself out of the very duties and responsibilities that every American is born with. That is not simply a disagreement about how things are done it is a foundational refusal to comprehend a key facet of the very nature of Americanism.
Now, every American has the right to attempt to alter their system of laws. Were Apple trying to do that, were Apple proclaiming their true intentions here, it would be a very different story.
But Apple is not being honest. Apple is not admitting their often internally and in the trade journals position of not wanting to be subject to search warrants. Instead Apple is pretending they have been asked to do things they have not in truth been asked to do. Then claiming these things, that they have not been asked for, would injure millions of people.
It has become fashionable for many people, a real fad in fact, to instantly accept any anti-government statement so long as it fits a persons current political ideology. People of every ideological orientation have their issues on which they do this. Ignoring all data, all documentation, all statements by the key parties. They seize upon the claims of those who sound a political note that appeals to them and promptly exaggerate their sense of moral outrage.
Politicians, and sometimes business people, are naturals at spinning up false moral indignation.
What is very clear is that few people are willing to read the court documents which Apple is complaining about. If they were willing to read them, and without partisan filters, they would find that Apple is telling lies. No backdoor request exists. No software to be provided to anyone. No violation of anyone's privacy now or later. The court order makes all that clear, the subsequent motion reiterates it. Apple has the protections for its intellectual property that Apple wanted PLUS an open invitation to suggest further changes.
Apple has long made its desires clear, to engineer itself out of the very duties and responsibilities that every American is born with. That is not simply a disagreement about how things are done it is a foundational refusal to comprehend a key facet of the very nature of Americanism.
Now, every American has the right to attempt to alter their system of laws. Were Apple trying to do that, were Apple proclaiming their true intentions here, it would be a very different story.
But Apple is not being honest. Apple is not admitting their often internally and in the trade journals position of not wanting to be subject to search warrants. Instead Apple is pretending they have been asked to do things they have not in truth been asked to do. Then claiming these things, that they have not been asked for, would injure millions of people.
It has become fashionable for many people, a real fad in fact, to instantly accept any anti-government statement so long as it fits a persons current political ideology. People of every ideological orientation have their issues on which they do this. Ignoring all data, all documentation, all statements by the key parties. They seize upon the claims of those who sound a political note that appeals to them and promptly exaggerate their sense of moral outrage.
Politicians, and sometimes business people, are naturals at spinning up false moral indignation.
skit75
Splendid
- Oct 7, 2008
- 2,682
- 1
- 21,460
Page 2, lines 5-6 of the court order are requesting removal or bypass of the auto-erase feature, whether or not it has been enabled; and makes no specific reference to SUBJECT DEVICE, in this section. All other sections of the court order seem to make reference to SUBJECT DEVICE where applicable.
It reads like a blanket order so the authorities will never have to return to the courts, and do things the legal way. I am not a lawyer and my interpretation may be subject to bias but, I do know language used in these documents is extremely important, when setting precedents. This little tool, if ever let loose is what could make everyone's iphone vulnerable, not just to authorities but to hackers and other governments.
It reads like a blanket order so the authorities will never have to return to the courts, and do things the legal way. I am not a lawyer and my interpretation may be subject to bias but, I do know language used in these documents is extremely important, when setting precedents. This little tool, if ever let loose is what could make everyone's iphone vulnerable, not just to authorities but to hackers and other governments.
- Status
TRENDING THREADS
-
Question New build wont post Gigabyte B650M Gaming Plus wifi , AMD Ryzen 5 7600X CPU, 32GB T-Force RGB DDR5. Need help!
- Started by Notmiserable
- Replies: 26
-
Discussion PSU recommendations and power supply discussion thread - Tom's hardware- Started by Darkbreeze
- Replies: 2K
-
-
Discussion What's your favourite video game you've been playing?- Started by amdfangirl
- Replies: 4K
-
Question PRIME B650-PLUS wont recognize one RAM stick after latest BIOS update
- Started by Coilbone
- Replies: 0
-
Question Upgraded from a 1060 6GB to a 2070 Super, barely notice the difference in fps???- Started by MrFlyingstickman
- Replies: 19
-
Question Screen tearing with FreeSync and FPS Limits on My 165Hz Monitor
- Started by jesusmarin
- Replies: 0
Facebook
Twitter
Instagram