More to Thouroughbred than just a die shrink ?!

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No, but somebody started that rumor circulating in the news, it got back to AMD investors, who began to feel a little uneasy about the competition. Anyway, you can't blame 9-11, the recession started way back in about 2000. It was breifly interupted by a tech stock rally, and then as sales of technology slowed a second time, took on it's force. Clinton kept making upbeet statements to slow it down until he left office. Then sudenly about the day Bush took office they finally anounced the recession, how nice for Bush.

What's the frequency, Kenneth?
 
Think about it, would it have hurt our economy during the good times? No. In fact, such problems are normally GOOD for our economy, because of two things-the clean up and replacement of structures, and increased patriotism. Osama knew what he was doing, waiting for a weak point to try to rub an open wound.

What's the frequency, Kenneth?
 
lol.

i can explain my sig, it has a sens & indeed this is very confusing for you because i have understood everything you said even in American, American SLang, Australian, Australian SLang, Old English & maybe anothers ...

i can also understand expressions, proverbs, idioms, aphorisms, acronyms & now i can also understand meaningfully your jokes or your cutting expressions ...

but you cant do the reverse i.e. understand my meanings. :)
i know, i understand this could surprise you.
but this is my fault. i have used <i>BabelFish</i> too long & too much.

i hope this post has a sens before i post it otherwise i should have to re-enter it to post it again.

is there yet any sens ?

<i>little sarcastic comment:
*tap tap tap*
there there! doggy.
wanna bickie?
hehe.
</i>


<i>if <b>you know</b> <font color=white>you don't know<font color=black>, the way could be more easy ...<font color=red>
 
"sense", not "sens".
Maybe that should be 'scents', as in Labdog's posts <i>stink</i>. Heh heh.

Okay, bad pun. I know. Slap me silly.

Seriously though, back to Thoroughbred: I doubt AMD would put SSE2 or x86-64 into it because these <i>are</i> some of the major selling points of ClawHammer. (Or at least, I doubt that they would release a chip with these enabled.) If AMD released TBreds with either of these, then the desire to purchase a CHammer would be significantly reduced.

I might expect something like Barton's cache already built into Thoroughbred, but disabled though. (Much like P3-Celerons are.) This would allow AMD to switch to Barton with the core internals already tested by producing a few without the second half of the cache disabled, so then all they really would have to worry about is SOI for Barton.

I also expect something like AMD probably testing some better data pre-fecth/branch-prediction/etc. algorithms in TBred. After all, the Hammers supposedly kick the AXP's butt in this respect, so it is quite possible that AMD is squeezing some of the juice from the fruits of that research into TBred.

So I would really hope that AMD is putting something more than just a die shrink into TBred because they've certainly spent enough time and R&D lately to have at least <i>something</i> different. Whether or not we actually see that something different (because they may disable it before shipping, depending on what it is) is entirely another story.

As for AMD racing against Intel, well, the Athlons just won't cut it for much longer in the speed race. I think AMD is aware of this, which is why ClawHammer is coming out this year. (Instead of taking more time with it and releasing CHammer and SHammer/Opteron next year at the same time.) They aren't racing simply because their horse has already run itself ragged, and they're just unable to compete until they pick up a fresh remount. Once they switch to the new Hammer cores though, hopefully things will start to look up again.

<font color=red>Bob knew he was screwed when he saw the label actually read 'Tactile Nuclear Device'.</font color=red>
 
i dont understand very well why i have some errors when i click on your link www.geocities.com/arah_the_great in line 0 ?
 
That would be because Geocities sucks. Heh heh.

They force every page to load a stupid Java applet 'banner'. However, their 'banner' code is often flawed, or worse, often won't even load correctly. (It gets especially confused when you use frames, which I do, because it tries to load in several frames at once.)

So if you get a Java code error message (such as the one that you listed) and you see no advertisement banner on my page (usually Geocities puts it in the upper-right corner) then that means it was the Geocities banner not working properly and <i>not</i> any of my code.

However, if you do see advertisements on my pages in the form of a Geocities/Yahoo banner, and you still get the error message, then it might actually be my code. (I doubt it would be my code though, as I personally use a very minimal amount of Java scripting and no Java applets, so there is very little of my code to get screwed up.)

One of these days I might even update my pages and put a message about how much the Geocities banner sucks on my page. Heh heh. Then again, considering how little inspiration I've had to update my pages lately, that day might be far in the distance.

<font color=red>Bob knew he was screwed when he saw the label actually read 'Tactile Nuclear Device'.</font color=red>
 
you understood my typo.
maybe i did some progress...


<i>if <b>you know</b> <font color=white>you don't know<font color=black>, the way could be more easy ...<font color=red>
 
About 100.01% sure, give or take a margin of 0.01%. It was doing it to me before I ever even put <i>any</i> Java of my own on my pages. Pure HTML and graphics don't generate code execution errors, so it couldn't have been my code then. I've hardly added any Java since, so I'm still certain that it is Geocities. If I ever start writing Java applets, I might become less certain. Until then though, I stand at 100.01%, give or take 0.01%.

Ever since Yahoo consumated with Geocities, the free web host has gone to hell in a handbasket. I'd move to somewhere else, but every time I do, that somewhere else either changes their policy to be just as bad as Geocities or else they shut down entirely. I just go so tired of modifying links and re-FTPing that I gave up on the whole sorted affair of free web hosting and left the sleeping dog lying at Geocities.

It sucks, but since I don't pay anything for the hosting, I can live with it. It goes to prove that you really do get what you pay for. Pay shasta, get shafted.

<font color=red>Bob knew he was screwed when he saw the label actually read 'Tactile Nuclear Device'.</font color=red><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by slvr_phoenix on 04/30/02 01:56 PM.</EM></FONT></P>
 
I doubt AMD would put SSE2 or x86-64 into it because these are some of the major selling points of ClawHammer. (Or at least, I doubt that they would release a chip with these enabled.)
I completely agree that T-bred will probably not have any enhancements over Palomino - Just the die shrink. AMD have stated this several times (but we'll see at the "official" launch). Oh, and once again, T-bred is on schedule - Q2-02. Still, I am waiting anxiously.

This would allow AMD to switch to Barton with the core internals already tested by producing a few without the second half of the cache disabled, so then all they really would have to worry about is SOI for Barton.
Barton is where I believe AMD is doing the enhancements - AMD has already stated that they have dropped the SOI for Barton - Clawhammer will be the first shipping SOI chip. Pure Speculation says that Barton SOI was dropped in favor of adding enhancements to T-Bred. What enhancements: 512kB L2 cache, SSE2, x86-64, deeper pipeline (in order of likelyhood)? Who knows? What we do know is that Barton will be a different, .13, non-SOI core.

If the thought I thought I thought had been the thought I thought, I wouldn't have thought so much.
 
Barton is where I believe AMD is doing the enhancements - AMD has already stated that they have dropped the SOI for Barton - Clawhammer will be the first shipping SOI chip. Pure Speculation says that Barton SOI was dropped in favor of adding enhancements to T-Bred. What enhancements: 512kB L2 cache, SSE2, x86-64, deeper pipeline (in order of likelyhood)? Who knows? What we do know is that Barton will be a different, .13, non-SOI core.

Heres my take on the non barton soi, believe it or not it is probably cheaper for amd to make barton with 512k cache on bulk silicon, than to make it with 256k on soi silicon, soi silicon is more expensive than bulk(I have heard 3x as expensive, but my fab didnt use soi so IM not sure).

Thus while they both probably give near equal performance, a 512k cache bulk barton costs amd less money to produce.

Thats my take, comments?

:wink: The Cash Left In My Pocket,The BEST Benchmark :wink:
 
Lol you seem to be looking for someone to counter you so that you can demonstrate proving them false!

No but from what I have heard, Tbred might have enhancements, small ones that still increase IPC over Palomino, it could be better prefetch, or anything or that sort. As long as it does increase over Palomino, the order of competition goes on.

--
Thunderbirds in wintertime, Northwoods in summertime! :lol:
 
You're right, words on screen are too much powerful.
The way I would mean it, is that AMD probably would have less interest in something that most enjoys is MHZ. On Intel's side, they would do anything they deem to enjoy selling it, besides how is saying that they will sell high prices biased against them when it has always been that way? Same thing for enjoying false marketting on the product? Although AMD does that with the PR anyway, there are occasions when it works well.


--
Thunderbirds in wintertime, Northwoods in summertime! :lol: