My ideal crpg.

G

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

If i could design a role playing game, the most important thing is that
combat would be turn based. I enjoy it more when i can plan my moves and
have to make decisions.

The graphics:
Since combat is turn based, frame rate isn't that important. That would
allow the engine to crank up the details. I would go for a view system
inspired by Betrayal at Krondor where only the characters move and not the
scenery. That would allow for insanely high poly counts, bump mapping ,
reflective materials and all the lighting effects required by the magic
spells.

Combat:
I would like turn based combat with a party of 5-6 characters. That way, you
can have specialised players that are more fun to develop than a single Jack
of all Trades.
Another thing i would like is the inclusion of fatigue. Knights of Legend
did it pretty well. Huge two handed swords or axes deal more damage but they
also tire the players faster, forcing him to rest if necessary. That would
give us a reason to keep the lighter, less powerful weapons. The same would
apply to armor. A full plate mail protects you better against penetration
but it restricts your mobility and tires you faster.

Magic:
I would go with different schools of magic with exclusive spells.
Necromancers could raise the dead, summon the undead and cause diseases.
Illusionists summon illusions that are more powerful than their real
counterparts but risk a chance of being dispelled if the target doesn't
believe them.
Summoner call in creatures to help fight with the party.
A sorcerer that manipulates the elements. (fire, lightning, ice)
The usual Cleric/healer.

Storyline:
I'm tired of mystical items that are necessary to defeat the ultimate evil.
How many time do you have to search for the "Spoon of Power" to defeat an
evil god? What if the enemy was normal instead?
Here's my idea:
The party is part of the country's army. It's peacetime and they are
assigned mundane tasks like kill the wolves that are attacking the
livestock, escort a merchant, etc.. Then, as bandits attacks get more
frequent, you get the job of finding their lair and killing their boss. His
death would be the trigger that starts the main storyline and end the
prologue.

As our heroes come back to their garrison, they learn that a neighbouring
country has launched a surprise attack and destroyed the King's main army.
Demoralised by his death, the rest of the army tries to buy some time while
his two sons raise new armies. Unfortunately, each son claims to be the
rightful heir and their armies start clashing. This prevents them from
reclaiming any of the occupied territories.

The party is sent to the frontlines and gets military oriented missions such
as:
Destroy a wooden bridge to slow down the enemy.
Hold a pass for a number of turns until reinforcements arrive.
Assassinate an enemy general that has established his headquarters in a
nearby village.
Fight battles with the enemy as part of a larger army.

Then, as winter arrives, the armies settle in their winter camps and prepare
for the spring campaign that will follow. While you wait, an envoy from the
eldest son wants to talk to you. He says that your actions against the enemy
have impressed the Prince and he wants you to help him reunite the kingdom
by killing his brother.

And i could go on...

Any thoughts?
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

"Groo the Wanderer" <jp2@vatican.com> wrote in
news:i6tOd.107930$3D5.1528695@weber.videotron.net:

> If i could design a role playing game, the most important thing is
> that combat would be turn based. I enjoy it more when i can plan my
> moves and have to make decisions.

There are many levels to game programming that fall between thinking
about it and developing a game from scratch in C.

Snagging a copy of a MUD and redesigning it can give alot of good
experience

going to SourceForge.net and finding an open source game along those
lines. Either join that team or use that as a base for something further

Doing MODs for a game that fits your requirements building on that games
structure

getting a "game engine" software that fits most of your requirements
covering how the game works, then creating the visual and storyline part
of the game

getting ahold of a games creation package such as DarkBasic

I just thouight Id mention those in case you were interested
Gandalf Parker
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Gandalf Parker wrote:
> "Groo the Wanderer" <jp2@vatican.com> wrote in
> news:i6tOd.107930$3D5.1528695@weber.videotron.net:
>
>
>>If i could design a role playing game, the most important thing is
>>that combat would be turn based. I enjoy it more when i can plan my
>>moves and have to make decisions.
>
>
> There are many levels to game programming that fall between thinking
> about it and developing a game from scratch in C.
>
> Snagging a copy of a MUD and redesigning it can give alot of good
> experience
>
> going to SourceForge.net and finding an open source game along those
> lines. Either join that team or use that as a base for something further
>
> Doing MODs for a game that fits your requirements building on that games
> structure
>
> getting a "game engine" software that fits most of your requirements
> covering how the game works, then creating the visual and storyline part
> of the game
>
> getting ahold of a games creation package such as DarkBasic
>
> I just thouight Id mention those in case you were interested

Let us not forget NWN and the pretty nice builder it comes with. The
scripting is easy(ish) and making a level is a snap...
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On that special day, Groo the Wanderer, (jp2@vatican.com) said...

> Demoralised by his death, the rest of the army tries to buy some time while
> his two sons raise new armies. Unfortunately, each son claims to be the
> rightful heir and their armies start clashing.

Roland and Archibald Ironfist? It's all been there...


Gabriele Neukam

Gabriele.Spamfighter.Neukam@t-online.de


--
Ah, Information. A property, too valuable these days, to give it away,
just so, at no cost.
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 2005-02-09, Groo the Wanderer <jp2@vatican.com> wrote:

> Combat:
> I would like turn based combat with a party of 5-6 characters. That way, you
> can have specialised players that are more fun to develop than a single Jack
> of all Trades.
> Another thing i would like is the inclusion of fatigue. Knights of Legend
> did it pretty well. Huge two handed swords or axes deal more damage but they
> also tire the players faster, forcing him to rest if necessary. That would
> give us a reason to keep the lighter, less powerful weapons. The same would
> apply to armor. A full plate mail protects you better against penetration
> but it restricts your mobility and tires you faster.

I don't like this. Too complex.

Limit availability of weapons/armour to balance and make some
class specific. I want to put the "best stuff" for each character
on and leave it at that. I don't want to go back and dig through
their backpacks to find a suitable weapon for each encounter. Not
unless this is done very infrequently (i.e. pulling out a mace to
kill some skeletons).

> Storyline:
> I'm tired of mystical items that are necessary to defeat the ultimate evil.
> How many time do you have to search for the "Spoon of Power" to defeat an
> evil god? What if the enemy was normal instead?

Where is the fun in that? They tried this in JA2 but it's not a
fantasy game. Your enemy has to be something really great and
formidable. A formidable foe makes an epic story.

> Here's my idea:

[snip story line]

>
> And i could go on...
>
> Any thoughts?

I would find it very boring unless you met a lot of memorable
characters. For one, why do I care about this King? Games like
PST, Fallout, KOTOR, Bloodlines, etc. had situations which made
things evocative enough that you cared.

I was reading the dev diaries for KOTOR2 and I found one thing
very telling. To put the story together the designers sat down
and came up with a handful of situations they wanted the player
to be in. Then they wrote the story to string those situations
together. I'm sure they were just climaxes they thought would be
cool. Try doing it that way?
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> wrote in news:NqSdnSoAeoJM4pffRVn-
hg@comcast.com:

> Let us not forget NWN and the pretty nice builder it comes with. The
> scripting is easy(ish) and making a level is a snap...
>

NWN falls somewhere between MODding a favorite game and a game engine.
But yes its worthy of mention.

If he hadnt said turn-based Id have mentioned Ultima Online also

Gandalf Parker
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Howdy,

Maybe some minor quibbles here and there but put it this way:

I would buy this game tomorrow!!! :)

Especially like the storyline as you essentially do all those things in any
RPG anyway but you would have
some story motivation...

Cheers
Eden
"Groo the Wanderer" <jp2@vatican.com> wrote in message
news:i6tOd.107930$3D5.1528695@weber.videotron.net...
> If i could design a role playing game, the most important thing is that
> combat would be turn based. I enjoy it more when i can plan my moves and
> have to make decisions.
>
> The graphics:
> Since combat is turn based, frame rate isn't that important. That would
> allow the engine to crank up the details. I would go for a view system
> inspired by Betrayal at Krondor where only the characters move and not the
> scenery. That would allow for insanely high poly counts, bump mapping ,
> reflective materials and all the lighting effects required by the magic
> spells.
>
> Combat:
> I would like turn based combat with a party of 5-6 characters. That way,
> you
> can have specialised players that are more fun to develop than a single
> Jack
> of all Trades.
> Another thing i would like is the inclusion of fatigue. Knights of Legend
> did it pretty well. Huge two handed swords or axes deal more damage but
> they
> also tire the players faster, forcing him to rest if necessary. That would
> give us a reason to keep the lighter, less powerful weapons. The same
> would
> apply to armor. A full plate mail protects you better against penetration
> but it restricts your mobility and tires you faster.
>
> Magic:
> I would go with different schools of magic with exclusive spells.
> Necromancers could raise the dead, summon the undead and cause diseases.
> Illusionists summon illusions that are more powerful than their real
> counterparts but risk a chance of being dispelled if the target doesn't
> believe them.
> Summoner call in creatures to help fight with the party.
> A sorcerer that manipulates the elements. (fire, lightning, ice)
> The usual Cleric/healer.
>
> Storyline:
> I'm tired of mystical items that are necessary to defeat the ultimate
> evil.
> How many time do you have to search for the "Spoon of Power" to defeat an
> evil god? What if the enemy was normal instead?
> Here's my idea:
> The party is part of the country's army. It's peacetime and they are
> assigned mundane tasks like kill the wolves that are attacking the
> livestock, escort a merchant, etc.. Then, as bandits attacks get more
> frequent, you get the job of finding their lair and killing their boss.
> His
> death would be the trigger that starts the main storyline and end the
> prologue.
>
> As our heroes come back to their garrison, they learn that a neighbouring
> country has launched a surprise attack and destroyed the King's main army.
> Demoralised by his death, the rest of the army tries to buy some time
> while
> his two sons raise new armies. Unfortunately, each son claims to be the
> rightful heir and their armies start clashing. This prevents them from
> reclaiming any of the occupied territories.
>
> The party is sent to the frontlines and gets military oriented missions
> such
> as:
> Destroy a wooden bridge to slow down the enemy.
> Hold a pass for a number of turns until reinforcements arrive.
> Assassinate an enemy general that has established his headquarters in a
> nearby village.
> Fight battles with the enemy as part of a larger army.
>
> Then, as winter arrives, the armies settle in their winter camps and
> prepare
> for the spring campaign that will follow. While you wait, an envoy from
> the
> eldest son wants to talk to you. He says that your actions against the
> enemy
> have impressed the Prince and he wants you to help him reunite the kingdom
> by killing his brother.
>
> And i could go on...
>
> Any thoughts?
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.794 / Virus Database: 538 - Release Date: 10/11/2004
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

shadows wrote:

>>Storyline:
>>I'm tired of mystical items that are necessary to defeat the ultimate evil.
>>How many time do you have to search for the "Spoon of Power" to defeat an
>>evil god? What if the enemy was normal instead?
> Where is the fun in that? They tried this in JA2 but it's not a
> fantasy game. Your enemy has to be something really great and
> formidable. A formidable foe makes an epic story.

I'm tired of the main quest starting out as:
1) A lone stranger, against all odds, must find and defeat the ultimate
evil. BUT, before he does he must find the +4 dingle berry of power and
meld it with the +5 harp of ass hair in the farting caldera.
2) A group of strangers, against all odds, must find and defeat the
ultimate evil. BUT, before they do they must find the +4 dingle berry
of power and meld it with the +5 harp of ass hair in the farting caldera.
3) The main quest, not yet reveled, is unraveled for the lone stranger.
During this unraveling the lone stranger must find the +4 dingle berry
of power and meld it with the +5 harp of ass hair in the farting caldera.

It would be nice to have a main quest where I don't have to find
specific items to kill the foozle. It would be nice to be a little more
free form, like Morrowind, but with a strong story like BG2.

> I would find it very boring unless you met a lot of memorable
> characters. For one, why do I care about this King? Games like
> PST, Fallout, KOTOR, Bloodlines, etc. had situations which made
> things evocative enough that you cared.

You cared in Bloodlines? I really didn't care about any of the
characters...

> I was reading the dev diaries for KOTOR2 and I found one thing
> very telling. To put the story together the designers sat down
> and came up with a handful of situations they wanted the player
> to be in. Then they wrote the story to string those situations
> together. I'm sure they were just climaxes they thought would be
> cool. Try doing it that way?

Seems like a good idea, but it also seems like a good way to leave out
the minor plot elements that make games like FO, BG2, and PST so
wonderful....
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 2005-02-10, James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> wrote:

> shadows wrote:

> I'm tired of the main quest starting out as:
> 1) A lone stranger, against all odds, must find and defeat the ultimate
> evil. BUT, before he does he must find the +4 dingle berry of power and
> meld it with the +5 harp of ass hair in the farting caldera.

It doesn't have to be an item but the main character needs to go
through some development before he is ready to face the
formidable foe. PST, Ultima IV, even VTM: Bloodlines all had
this. It wasn't an item. It was redemption, virtue, and
enlightenment.

Items were just a convenience and probably the result of simple
engines used back in the 8-bit days. It is easier to use an item
because you already have the code to track inventory.

> You cared in Bloodlines? I really didn't care about any of the
> characters...

There were some evocative moments but we're talking about the
undead here.
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

shadows wrote:

> On 2005-02-10, James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> wrote:
>>I'm tired of the main quest starting out as:
>>1) A lone stranger, against all odds, must find and defeat the ultimate
>>evil. BUT, before he does he must find the +4 dingle berry of power and
>>meld it with the +5 harp of ass hair in the farting caldera.
> It doesn't have to be an item but the main character needs to go
> through some development before he is ready to face the
> formidable foe. PST, Ultima IV, even VTM: Bloodlines all had
> this. It wasn't an item. It was redemption, virtue, and
> enlightenment.

True. However, many of these games seem to trite and typical, it is
hard to lose yourself in them. VTM:B didn't feel like it was a journey,
it felt too contrived and too forced to feel like you were moving down a
path as the story unfolded.

If we look at PST, it is a quest for something, but we aren't clear WHAT
until the end. The twists and the turns make it seem like the plot has
life.

The Ultimas were "alive." They had a different flavor too. It didn't
feel trite or on rails, it felt like you were really questing for something.

BG2 did a pretty good job, but the story was still powerup and kill the
foozle....while the story was interesting, it was clear what was going
to happen in the end.

> Items were just a convenience and probably the result of simple
> engines used back in the 8-bit days. It is easier to use an item
> because you already have the code to track inventory.

Agreed. I wish we'd see more story driven plots like PST...those have a
far more organic feel than the typical powerup and kill the foozle. You
want to be the hero, but the lone hero facing off against the lone
anti-hero is getting old.

>>You cared in Bloodlines? I really didn't care about any of the
>>characters...
> There were some evocative moments but we're talking about the
> undead here.

LOL
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

In article <Mt-dnXMpmsaBPZbfRVn-qg@comcast.com>,
James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> wrote:
>shadows wrote:
>
>> It doesn't have to be an item but the main character needs to go
>> through some development before he is ready to face the
>> formidable foe...
>
>The Ultimas were "alive." They had a different flavor too. It didn't
>feel trite or on rails, it felt like you were really questing for something.

Of course, Ultima V was very much based on finding the right item, as
anybody who found Lord British without bringing along the Sandlewood Box
discovered to their chagrin.

--
Kyle Haight
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Kyle Haight wrote:
>
> In article <Mt-dnXMpmsaBPZbfRVn-qg@comcast.com>,
> James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> wrote:
> >shadows wrote:
> >
> >> It doesn't have to be an item but the main character needs to go
> >> through some development before he is ready to face the
> >> formidable foe...
> >
> >The Ultimas were "alive." They had a different flavor too. It didn't
> >feel trite or on rails, it felt like you were really questing for something.
>
> Of course, Ultima V was very much based on finding the right item, as
> anybody who found Lord British without bringing along the Sandlewood Box
> discovered to their chagrin.

The funny thing about that, is that you can lie about having it
(when you have it you can say you don't), which is the only time
in that game that an NPC will believe one of your lies. I haven't
tried yet to see what happens if you get there without it and try
to claim you have it.


--KG
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 14:01:34 -0500, "Groo the Wanderer"
<jp2@vatican.com> wrote:

>If i could design a role playing game, the most important thing is that
>combat would be turn based. I enjoy it more when i can plan my moves and
>have to make decisions.

I like real-time combat that was in the Infinity Engine.
Micro-managing your party in detail becomes monotonous. Stopping
every turn to tell your fighter to go take a swipe with his sword
becomes quickly boring.

But at the same time something better integration of Area Effect
spells. If my Wizard is going to cast a fireball, I'd like for my
front-line not to walk into it. So a bit of more options with
tactical combat, without slowing the game down.


>
>The graphics:

Anything third person Isometric works. I don't require alot. I
rember a party based combat in 3D for Wizardry 8. Bleh!

>
>Combat:
>

Tactical Combat. Different enemies require different strategies.

>Magic:

Useful spells. I don't want to go have to find somewhere to rest
after casting magic missile 3 times. My magic user might not be able
to dish out the damage like the front line fighters, but spells that
are useful in tactical combat.

>Storyline:

I've saved the world a few times. Maybe I could just save the Hamlett
down around the brook....
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

freshie <freshie@newsguy.NOSPAM.com> looked up from reading the entrails
of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:

>On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 14:01:34 -0500, "Groo the Wanderer"
><jp2@vatican.com> wrote:
>>If i could design a role playing game, the most important thing is that
>>combat would be turn based. I enjoy it more when i can plan my moves and
>>have to make decisions.
>
>I like real-time combat that was in the Infinity Engine.
>Micro-managing your party in detail becomes monotonous. Stopping
>every turn to tell your fighter to go take a swipe with his sword
>becomes quickly boring.

I loved that Baldur's Gate had action scripts for the various classes
and even better that you could create your own.
That just typified that it was MY party and behaved the way I chose not
just according to how some programmer/story designer figured they
should, without me having to make every choice manually every time.

>But at the same time something better integration of Area Effect
>spells. If my Wizard is going to cast a fireball, I'd like for my
>front-line not to walk into it. So a bit of more options with
>tactical combat, without slowing the game down.

That always bugged me. I think every time I hit pause in BG was to stop
someone running into the line of fire.

Of course what we see more and more lately is that your party's spells
just don't affect each other which is another issue and breaks immersion
badly (for me at least.)

Xocyll
--
I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Xocyll wrote:

> freshie <freshie@newsguy.NOSPAM.com> looked up from reading the entrails
> of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:
>
>
>>On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 14:01:34 -0500, "Groo the Wanderer"
>><jp2@vatican.com> wrote:
>>
>>>If i could design a role playing game, the most important thing is that
>>>combat would be turn based. I enjoy it more when i can plan my moves and
>>>have to make decisions.
>>
>>I like real-time combat that was in the Infinity Engine.
>>Micro-managing your party in detail becomes monotonous. Stopping
>>every turn to tell your fighter to go take a swipe with his sword
>>becomes quickly boring.
>
>
> I loved that Baldur's Gate had action scripts for the various classes
> and even better that you could create your own.
> That just typified that it was MY party and behaved the way I chose not
> just according to how some programmer/story designer figured they
> should, without me having to make every choice manually every time.
>
>
>>But at the same time something better integration of Area Effect
>>spells. If my Wizard is going to cast a fireball, I'd like for my
>>front-line not to walk into it. So a bit of more options with
>>tactical combat, without slowing the game down.
>
>
> That always bugged me. I think every time I hit pause in BG was to stop
> someone running into the line of fire.
>
> Of course what we see more and more lately is that your party's spells
> just don't affect each other which is another issue and breaks immersion
> badly (for me at least.)

I wish your characters could see the range of effect and just NOT walk
there until the spell is finished or at least until I tell them to move
there.

I mean come on...I'm sure they know that the mage is casting a fireball,
how hard is it to stay out of the way for 1 second?
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 2005-02-14, James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> wrote:

> I wish your characters could see the range of effect and just NOT walk
> there until the spell is finished or at least until I tell them to move
> there.
>
> I mean come on...I'm sure they know that the mage is casting a fireball,
> how hard is it to stay out of the way for 1 second?

Most RPG engines (like the KOTOR one) don't have proper collision
detection. An FPS engine will though.
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

shadows wrote:

> On 2005-02-14, James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>>I wish your characters could see the range of effect and just NOT walk
>>there until the spell is finished or at least until I tell them to move
>>there.
>>
>>I mean come on...I'm sure they know that the mage is casting a fireball,
>> how hard is it to stay out of the way for 1 second?
>
>
> Most RPG engines (like the KOTOR one) don't have proper collision
> detection. An FPS engine will though.

My point is WHY don't they implement any kind of party protection scheme
that won't allow your party members to wander into a fireball or grenade
blast....
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Thusly James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> Spake Unto All:

>> Most RPG engines (like the KOTOR one) don't have proper collision
>> detection. An FPS engine will though.
>
>My point is WHY don't they implement any kind of party protection scheme
>that won't allow your party members to wander into a fireball or grenade
>blast....

FFS just turn off friendly fire damage and be done with it.


--
The US employs divide-and-conquer against EU
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2005-02/10/content_2567438.htm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3981499.stm
http://www.fsfinalword.com/archive/Divide_and_conquer.html

The US is no longer our ally: Federalize NOW!
 
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Mean_Chlorine wrote:
> Thusly James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> Spake Unto All:
>
>
>>>Most RPG engines (like the KOTOR one) don't have proper collision
>>>detection. An FPS engine will though.
>>
>>My point is WHY don't they implement any kind of party protection scheme
>>that won't allow your party members to wander into a fireball or grenade
>>blast....
>
>
> FFS just turn off friendly fire damage and be done with it.

LOL...'tis a fine idea ;-)
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> looked up from reading the
entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:

>Xocyll wrote:
>
>> freshie <freshie@newsguy.NOSPAM.com> looked up from reading the entrails
>> of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:
>>
>>
>>>On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 14:01:34 -0500, "Groo the Wanderer"
>>><jp2@vatican.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>If i could design a role playing game, the most important thing is that
>>>>combat would be turn based. I enjoy it more when i can plan my moves and
>>>>have to make decisions.
>>>
>>>I like real-time combat that was in the Infinity Engine.
>>>Micro-managing your party in detail becomes monotonous. Stopping
>>>every turn to tell your fighter to go take a swipe with his sword
>>>becomes quickly boring.
>>
>>
>> I loved that Baldur's Gate had action scripts for the various classes
>> and even better that you could create your own.
>> That just typified that it was MY party and behaved the way I chose not
>> just according to how some programmer/story designer figured they
>> should, without me having to make every choice manually every time.
>>
>>
>>>But at the same time something better integration of Area Effect
>>>spells. If my Wizard is going to cast a fireball, I'd like for my
>>>front-line not to walk into it. So a bit of more options with
>>>tactical combat, without slowing the game down.
>>
>>
>> That always bugged me. I think every time I hit pause in BG was to stop
>> someone running into the line of fire.
>>
>> Of course what we see more and more lately is that your party's spells
>> just don't affect each other which is another issue and breaks immersion
>> badly (for me at least.)
>
>I wish your characters could see the range of effect and just NOT walk
>there until the spell is finished or at least until I tell them to move
>there.
>
>I mean come on...I'm sure they know that the mage is casting a fireball,
> how hard is it to stay out of the way for 1 second?

I'm thinking that this was a level of calculations and complexity the
programmers didn't want to deal with.

Fighter gets initiative and charges in, mage starts his fireball a
second or two later.

Now the game either
1. fries the fighter
2. shoots off to the side hitting only some enemy but missing the
fighter
3. Stops the fighter and/or makes him retreat
4. Doesn't bother having party damage spells affect party members.


#4 is obviously the easiest and least effort path and only offends usenet purists, while #1 would cause all kinds of complaints since all the other D&D type games used #4.

I'd at least like to have a toggle between 1 and 4.

Ran into _exactly_ the same situation in P&P AD&D, where a my mage's
initiative role was so low I didn't get to attack in the first wave.

By the time I could attack, half the group and half the enemy had
already moved and were side by side, so I had to go for a #2 "off to the
side" solution for an aoe damager.

Xocyll
--
I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr