Need 500W Power supply to push GeForce GTX 1080 Card

[jontramos]

Hello! At work I have several Dell Precision 3620 workstations that I would like to upgrade the graphics cards to GeForce GTX 1080, which will help our designers with 3D rendering. I have come to learn that those cards require a 500Watt power supply, but the Dell Precision 3620 towers only have 365W PSU.

I was planning on upgrading the PSU to 500+Watt, but I am being told by Dell that they do not make one that will work with this case. And I am reading on forums that this model Dell has proprietary power connectors...

Does anyone have any advice on how to upgrade the PSU? Or am I out of luck?

Thanks in advance,
Jon

 

[vapour]

It is possible the case is too narrow for normal PSU or you need to cut off some to fit in. New case + new PSU is an option. Can you provide a link to the case? Or take a photo of case inside/back end and post here.

 

[jankerson]

Yeah, Dell is right.

I think you would be fine going with GTX 1060's, that way would won't have to upgrade the PSU's.

 

[jankerson]

It is possible the case is too narrow for normal PSU or you need to cut off some to fit in. New case + new PSU is an option. Can you provide a link to the case? Or take a photo of case inside/back end and post here.

It's not just that it's the proprietary MB PSU connections.


The Servers and workstations like that are different than the cheap low end ones.

 

[dark_lord69]

I used to work for Dell as a warranty service technician.

Your case size is fine as long as you don't have the smaller form factor.

The Dell rep was telling you the truth.
The motherboard power connections are proprietary. (unlike any other)

You'd have to get a different motherboard to go with a new PSU.
OR
get a low end video card that won't need a PSU upgrade.

Dell makes it hard intentionally so you can't just buy a cheap PC with a good CPU and slap in an awesome video card.
They don't allow awesome video cards until you pay a shockingly higher price and they increase everything else. (That you don't actually need) to jack the price into outer space.

HEY DELL!!
How about an i5 with a GTX 1060 at a reasonable price...
LOL nope, good video card means i7, more ram and a bunch of other junk that people need just so they can jack the price super high.

 

[jankerson]

I used to work for Dell as a warranty service technician.

Your case size is fine as long as you don't have the smaller form factor.

The Dell rep was telling you the truth.
The motherboard power connections are proprietary. (unlike any other)

You'd have to get a different motherboard to go with a new PSU.
OR
get a low end video card that won't need a PSU upgrade.

Dell makes it hard intentionally so you can't just buy a cheap PC with a good CPU and slap in an awesome video card.
They don't allow awesome video cards until you pay a shockingly higher price and they increase everything else. (That you don't actually need) to jack the price into outer space.

HEY DELL!!
How about an i5 with a GTX 1060 at a reasonable price...
LOL nope, good video card means i7, more ram and a bunch of other junk that people need just so they can jack the price super high.

That and all of those refurb machines that keep showing up around the forums....

I just shake my head every time I see one, especially those SFF machines....

 

[madmatt30]

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01A210HKO

Confirmed working with the 3620 & a normal atx psu will fit in the case upto 150mm deep.

Something like the corsair cx550 would be a good fit.

 

[vapour]

So here is a picture of the mb, let me know if this is not the mb:

https://imgur.com/a/doGJU

use matt's 24 pin to 8 pin and only left is 4 pin p2 connection. Do any of you know the voltage for p2? Can we find a converter too?

 

[vapour]

Never mind, find myself, get something like this in the link: http://www.playtool.com/pages/psuconnectors/connectors.html#atx12v4

 

[madmatt30]

@vapour - p2 is standard 12v atx power - all modern psu's already have one.

Only converter necessary is the 24 pin to 8 pin.

The only reason for that connection is because these boards only require 12v power , all conversion to 3.3v & 5v for usb,ram & drives is done by the board itself rather than the psu.

For this reason it makes sense to buy a dc-dc regulated unit as they will offer 99-100% of their rated power on the 12v rail alone.

 

[vapour]

@ Madmatt

good to know, I am just worried the old mb has different voltage standard and no info on that mb...

@ OP

Matt's answer is the clear winner here, good luck and come back if you have any more questions. For 500+, I recommend Seasonic 520 M12II for budget, Seasonic Focus point/EVGA supernova G2 550 for one of the best quality.

 

[jankerson]

They are not old, they have 6th Gen XEON's or i5/I7 CPUS.

The 520W M12II isn't DC-DC, and it's a 480W on the 12V.

Only the newer M12II 750 and above are, there was a 650W M12II (SS-650AM) that was, but that was discontinued.

The problem with the Focus is they might be too small to fit correctly.

The Seasonic G-550W is full size and should be fine, I would recommend that or the Corsair TX550M.

 

[madmatt30]

IN fairness to dell they do sell these systems pretty much at build cost with a windows license & 3 year rtb warranties.
Businesses buying in bulk lots get even better deals than that.

You have to consider that when buying one,the proprietary board & psu matches the proprietary cases & the optical & storage drives.
It makes manufacturing costs cheaper & also cuts on build times.

3 cables from the psu ,job done, storage drives are powered straight from the board too,del have been repurposing cases right back from 2012 until now,they have this kind of stuff bulk manufactured in the hundreds of thousands.

The crux comes on upgrades,some of the dell psu's dont even have sata/molex cables so you want to add a hard drive ,ssd etc ??
Buy it from dell at twice the price,vice versa gpu's , a dell branded quadro will cost $600 as opposed to the $300 it will cost from a retailer.

The 8 pin connector will work ( I & a friend used to custom make these by the bucketload ,$3 in parts, $20 in sales) which is why Im aware of the board specs.

Be aware ,adding a standard psu ,using the 8 pin adapter ,& adding a non specified non-dell approved gpu will absolutely void the warranty 100%.

Id have no qualms about doing it though if it were me.

AS said,makes sense to buy a dc-dc unit,a group regulated unit will work but its pointless as you lose 5-10% on the cross conversion to 3.3 & 5v rails which are not needed at all.

Focus gold would be fine.

I'd want a 550w dc-dc unit to run a 1080 personally & I would also be wary of model because these dell cases do not have good cooling options.

 

[jontramos]

Lots of info here. I am doing my best to parse.

So far I am being told that the Dell PSU cannot be upgraded without some kind of adapter for the wiring. I am not a wiring wizard, so I am hoping someone (@Grandmaster) can confirm that the adapters suggested above will work with my setup.

Here are pics of the inside of my case in case that helps:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z0b3i903n2sgbpn/2017-12-06%2013.25.26.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/2q9ofqimo8wjcfb/2017-12-06%2013.26.07.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/uu3sn7a4whgwm9x/2017-12-06%2013.25.36.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/umtw2xalozikowq/2017-12-06%2013.26.10.jpg?dl=0


I wouldn't go so far as to say this is a cheap computer, its a Core i7-6700K @ 4ghz, with 16GB RAM, and a 4GB Firepro W5100 video card, 256 GB SSD. Its a fast machine, but unfortunately its sluggish when using my 3D rendering software. My plan was to upgrade the video card, & system RAM to help it run more smoothly.

Here is the system requirements for the architectural rendering software:
https://lumion.com/system-requirements.html


@Ancient, you suggested going with the GTX 1060, which would be at the lower end of the system 3D rendering requirements... but doable. However, it looks like even the 1060 requires 400Watt PSU, and mine only has 365W. Do you think it would work? I do have a SSD and could do without the optical drive... which might help keep power consumption low? Thoughts?

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/products/10series/geforce-gtx-1060/

Thanks again
- Jon

 

[jankerson]

I dealt with thousands of Dell Office machines back when I was in the field, they can be interesting.

 

[jankerson]

Lots of info here. I am doing my best to parse.

So far I am being told that the Dell PSU cannot be upgraded without some kind of adapter for the wiring. I am not a wiring wizard, so I am hoping someone (@Grandmaster) can confirm that the adapters suggested above will work with my setup.

Here are pics of the inside of my case in case that helps:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z0b3i903n2sgbpn/2017-12-06%2013.25.26.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/2q9ofqimo8wjcfb/2017-12-06%2013.26.07.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/uu3sn7a4whgwm9x/2017-12-06%2013.25.36.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/umtw2xalozikowq/2017-12-06%2013.26.10.jpg?dl=0


I wouldn't go so far as to say this is a cheap computer, its a Core i7-6700K @ 4ghz, with 16GB RAM, and a 4GB Firepro W5100 video card, 256 GB SSD. Its a fast machine, but unfortunately its sluggish when using my 3D rendering software. My plan was to upgrade the video card, & system RAM to help it run more smoothly.

Here is the system requirements for the architectural rendering software:
https://lumion.com/system-requirements.html


@Ancient, you suggested going with the GTX 1060, which would be at the lower end of the system 3D rendering requirements... but doable. However, it looks like even the 1060 requires 400Watt PSU, and mine only has 365W. Do you think it would work? I do have a SSD and could do without the optical drive... which might help keep power consumption low? Thoughts?

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/products/10series/geforce-gtx-1060/

Thanks again
- Jon

Yes, the Dell PSU will handle a GTX 1060 no problem.

They only draw like 120w.

A GTX 1080 however can draw over 215w depending on the card.

I was just giving you the lower cost option here, like around $280 per unit instead of around $700 per unit (GPU and PSU).

 

[madmatt30]

Lots of info here. I am doing my best to parse.

So far I am being told that the Dell PSU cannot be upgraded without some kind of adapter for the wiring. I am not a wiring wizard, so I am hoping someone (@Grandmaster) can confirm that the adapters suggested above will work with my setup.

Here are pics of the inside of my case in case that helps:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z0b3i903n2sgbpn/2017-12-06%2013.25.26.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/2q9ofqimo8wjcfb/2017-12-06%2013.26.07.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/uu3sn7a4whgwm9x/2017-12-06%2013.25.36.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/umtw2xalozikowq/2017-12-06%2013.26.10.jpg?dl=0


I wouldn't go so far as to say this is a cheap computer, its a Core i7-6700K @ 4ghz, with 16GB RAM, and a 4GB Firepro W5100 video card, 256 GB SSD. Its a fast machine, but unfortunately its sluggish when using my 3D rendering software. My plan was to upgrade the video card, & system RAM to help it run more smoothly.

Here is the system requirements for the architectural rendering software:
https://lumion.com/system-requirements.html


@Ancient, you suggested going with the GTX 1060, which would be at the lower end of the system 3D rendering requirements... but doable. However, it looks like even the 1060 requires 400Watt PSU, and mine only has 365W. Do you think it would work? I do have a SSD and could do without the optical drive... which might help keep power consumption low? Thoughts?

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/products/10series/geforce-gtx-1060/

Thanks again
- Jon

just the 24 pin to 8 pin connector I listed is required,1070/1070ti/1080 all good gpu choices.

A good 550w+ dc-dc regulated psu.

All you need.

 

[vapour]

Plenty room, I will actually prefer smaller focus point, the orientation of psu and exhaust is weird and more room may be needed to plug in those cables. I suggest you follow Matt's suggestion above, just keep in mind it will void your warranty

 

[jankerson]

Plenty room, I will actually prefer smaller focus point, the orientation of psu and exhaust is weird and more room may be needed to plug in those cables. I suggest you follow Matt's suggestion above, just keep in mind it will void your warranty

I ment the PSU is TOO SMALL, might not work with case.

They take a standard ATX size PSU.

The Focus is smaller, and the case is a top mounted PSU so it has to fit correctly.

 

[spdragoo]

http://i.dell.com/sites/doccontent/shared-content/data-sheets/en/Documents/Dell_Precision_Tower_3000_Series_3620mt_Spec_Sheet.pdf

One thing to consider on that spec sheet is that you might be OK with the given 365W PSU. Not sure how OEM PSUs normally rank, but the 36W is at least rated 80 Plus Gold, so I would imagine it would at least compare well to a standard 80 Plus Bronze, if not 80 Plus Silver.

Why is that OK? Because the spec sheet says that these workstations can handle GPUs that draw "up to 150W". Of the listed GPUs, the 2 truly high-end ones are the nVidia Quadro M4000 (120W TDP, comparable to the mainstream GTX 970) & the AMD FirePro W7100 ("< 150W TDP", comparable to the R9 380). Granted, they're not equals of the GTX 1080...but you could always go with one of those mainstream GPUs instead. If you wanted something newer, the GTX 1060 previously mentioned is comparable to the GTX 970, while running slightly cooler (120W)...but with the 150W limit you could probably go up to a GTX 1070 (roughly equivalent to nVidia's Quadro P4000, 150W TDP). At most, you might have to invest in some Molex-to-PCie connector adapters, but otherwise you'd probably be OK.

 

[madmatt30]

http://i.dell.com/sites/doccontent/shared-content/data-sheets/en/Documents/Dell_Precision_Tower_3000_Series_3620mt_Spec_Sheet.pdf

One thing to consider on that spec sheet is that you might be OK with the given 365W PSU. Not sure how OEM PSUs normally rank, but the 36W is at least rated 80 Plus Gold, so I would imagine it would at least compare well to a standard 80 Plus Bronze, if not 80 Plus Silver.

Why is that OK? Because the spec sheet says that these workstations can handle GPUs that draw "up to 150W". Of the listed GPUs, the 2 truly high-end ones are the nVidia Quadro M4000 (120W TDP, comparable to the mainstream GTX 970) & the AMD FirePro W7100 ("< 150W TDP", comparable to the R9 380). Granted, they're not equals of the GTX 1080...but you could always go with one of those mainstream GPUs instead. If you wanted something newer, the GTX 1060 previously mentioned is comparable to the GTX 970, while running slightly cooler (120W)...but with the 150W limit you could probably go up to a GTX 1070 (roughly equivalent to nVidia's Quadro P4000, 150W TDP). At most, you might have to invest in some Molex-to-PCie connector adapters, but otherwise you'd probably be OK.

The issue here is both those cards cost more than a 1080 & psu combined because theyre workstation class cards.
Which sounds fine but looking at specs on the software he's using a 1080 ( & even a 1070) will utterly blitz them on render speeds.

 

[jontramos]

Thanks you all so much. Sending you some digital high-fives for this info.

I am going to try out the GeForce GTX 1060 and see if it plays nice with my software & PSU. Its the lower cost option, and less effort to try. If it doesn't work, I will try out the 500w PSU with adapter cables and GTX 1080.

Thanks for all your help!
Jon

 

[madmatt30]

Make sure you pick a model with a 6 pin power plug (some are 8 pin)

 

[spdragoo]

http://i.dell.com/sites/doccontent/shared-content/data-sheets/en/Documents/Dell_Precision_Tower_3000_Series_3620mt_Spec_Sheet.pdf

One thing to consider on that spec sheet is that you might be OK with the given 365W PSU. Not sure how OEM PSUs normally rank, but the 36W is at least rated 80 Plus Gold, so I would imagine it would at least compare well to a standard 80 Plus Bronze, if not 80 Plus Silver.

Why is that OK? Because the spec sheet says that these workstations can handle GPUs that draw "up to 150W". Of the listed GPUs, the 2 truly high-end ones are the nVidia Quadro M4000 (120W TDP, comparable to the mainstream GTX 970) & the AMD FirePro W7100 ("< 150W TDP", comparable to the R9 380). Granted, they're not equals of the GTX 1080...but you could always go with one of those mainstream GPUs instead. If you wanted something newer, the GTX 1060 previously mentioned is comparable to the GTX 970, while running slightly cooler (120W)...but with the 150W limit you could probably go up to a GTX 1070 (roughly equivalent to nVidia's Quadro P4000, 150W TDP). At most, you might have to invest in some Molex-to-PCie connector adapters, but otherwise you'd probably be OK.

The issue here is both those cards cost more than a 1080 & psu combined because theyre workstation class cards.
Which sounds fine but looking at specs on the software he's using a 1080 ( & even a 1070) will utterly blitz them on render speeds.

Oh, no, I wasn't recommending he get those particular workstation GPUs...just pointing out to him that Dell has them on the officially supported list (i.e. they'll work with the stock OEM PSU), so switching over to the equivalent mainstream/gaming GPUs (or more powerful ones) should be possible without getting a new PSU.

 

[madmatt30]

^ if his psu is what im thinking of it doesn't actually have sata or molex cables , just a proprietary 8 pin , a 4 pin atx 12v , & a 6 pin pci express cable.

& optical / storage drives powered from a 5 pin board header.