[SOLVED] Need some advise concerning Legacy+UEFI

[CitizenSmith]

Hi All
Could do with some advise about Legacy and UEFI
I'm running on the following:
B450 GAMING PRO CARBON AC with latest Bios
AMD Ryzen 5 3600
32 GB ram
Windows 10 pro
NVIDIA GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER

Can someone advise me here I am experiencing longer than should be post time
and after reading many comments I think that it might be connected to legacy in some way as disabling it seemed to work for someone others however I don't want to disable it as I believe this disables the use of usb keyboard and mouse in the bios which is obviously a problem when trying to edit bios as I only have use of usb keyboard and mouse.
what is the difference between Legacy+UEFI or Only UEFI I tried to select UEFI but after saving it just keeps loading back to bios so I gather i have installed it on Legacy? not that I can remember having a choice in the matter when I was installing the OS but any way I do believe it is possible to convert drive over to UEFI but my question is, is that wise am I better leaving as is and what one is better if any!.
thanks for any info you could give on the subject as i'm a bit in the dark as you can see!
Regards
Daz

 

[CitizenSmith]

I used a small program which is demanded by my online banking call Trusteer rapport which i just uninstalled after seeing it in boot log so thought that could be slowing things but that did nothing I even removed all traces from registry I can't see any trace left in boot log

 

[drea.drechsler]

Have you disabled Fast Boot Startup?

 

[CitizenSmith]

Have you disabled Fast Boot?

yer one of the first things i did after searching for solution

 

[drea.drechsler]

yer one of the first things i did after searching for solution

Sorry...mistyped. Fast Boot is an option in some BIOS's, Fast Startup is an option in Windows

Also...does the delay occur getting to the BIOS splash screen, getting to the 'spinner' or getting to the desktop?

 

[CitizenSmith]

Sorry...mistyped. Fast Boot is an option in some BIOS's, Fast Startup is an option in Windows

looked through bios just a short time ago to see if I had missed anything and am sure there is no such option in bios for that MSI B450 GAMING PRO CARBON board i was surprised when i went in there when i first got it as it is pretty basic for a hyped up gaming board!

 

[drea.drechsler]

looked through bios just a short time ago to see if I had missed anything and am sure there is no such option in bios for that MSI B450 GAMING PRO CARBON board i was surprised when i went in there when i first got it as it is pretty basic for a hyped up gaming board!

'Gaming' motherboard just means a decorated motherboard with LED lighting, non-functional plastic shields and "racing" stripes on customized heatsinks.

Does the delay occur getting to the BIOS splash screen, getting to the 'spinner' or getting to the desktop?

 

[CitizenSmith]

'Gaming' motherboard just means a decorated motherboard with LED lighting, non-functional plastic shields and "racing" stripes on customized heatsinks.

Does the delay occur getting to the BIOS splash screen, getting to the 'spinner' or getting to the desktop?

no pretty quick to get to msi logo but then starts the spinning circle and that stays like it for about 30 seconds

 

[drea.drechsler]

I don't know if you've done this or if it's been asked: have you tried resetting CMOS. Save your BIOS 'overclocking' profile so you can quickly recover it later, then reset CMOS.

 

[drea.drechsler]

no pretty quick to get to msi logo but then starts the spinning circle and that stays like it for about 30 seconds

OK...then it sounds like it's getting through POST fast enough, then Windows is slowing down as it loads up.

 

[CitizenSmith]

I don't know if you've done this or if it's been asked: have you tried resetting CMOS. Save your BIOS 'overclocking' profile so you can quickly recover it later, then reset CMOS.

Funny you should say that I was reading some comments earlier and they mentioned resetting cmos but I thought that might ah heck up my updated bios so i left alone that won't effect the updated bios will it? I ask because in the past I used Gigabyte boards all the time as they had a handy dual bios back up utility so if one became corrupted you could reload other and flash the corrupted one but like phone roms not sure if resetting will effect newly updated bios

 

[drea.drechsler]

Funny you should say that I was reading some comments earlier and they mentioned resetting cmos but I thought that might ah heck up my updated bios so i left alone that won't effect the updated bios will it? I ask because in the past I used Gigabyte boards all the time as they had a handy dual bios back up utility so if one became corrupted you could reload other and flash the corrupted one but like phone roms not sure if resetting will effect newly updated bios

No, it doesn't affect BIOS itself just customized settings you may have made that are slowing down POST. But since you're getting to the splash screen quickly POST is concluding quickly and so I don't think that will help.

So that leaves the slow-down in Windows. We already established that your Windows installation is corrupted since you couldn't disable CSM and start up Secure Boot without some fiddling with it. Most likely, there's more corruption in there. Here's a MS guide to troubleshooting boot problems:

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/client-management/advanced-troubleshooting-boot-problems

As you can tell, troubleshooting at this point may be involved and require pouring through the Event Log and registry. I'd suggest doing a repair install with in-place upgrade. Here's a link to instructions:

https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/16397-repair-install-windows-10-place-upgrade.html

Done as they say it does not remove installed well behaved apps nor mess with your settings. If that doesn't work, a clean install will be necessary.

 

[CitizenSmith]

Funny you should say that I was reading some comments earlier and they mentioned resetting cmos but I thought that might ah heck up my updated bios so i left alone that won't effect the updated bios will it? I ask because in the past I used Gigabyte boards all the time as they had a handy dual bios back up utility so if one became corrupted you could reload other and flash the corrupted one but like phone roms not sure if resetting will effect newly updated bios

OK...then it sounds like it's getting through POST fast enough, then Windows is slowing down as it loads up.

I thought the msi loading circle was teh post process and the windows starts when you see the image of a window are you saying the post screen is before the msi appears

 

[drea.drechsler]

I thought the msi loading circle was teh post process and the windows starts when you see the image of a window are you saying the post screen is before the msi appears

No...the loading circle is Window's doing it's startup process. Getting to and through the motherboard splash screen is the POST process. You can disable the splash screen in BIOS settings and see a bit more as the POST progresses, but it slows that down a tad. It also doesn't display very long to read it.

 

[CitizenSmith]

No, it doesn't affect BIOS itself just customized settings you may have made that are slowing down POST. But since you're getting to the splash screen quickly POST is concluding quickly and so I don't think that will help.

So that leaves the slow-down in Windows. We already established that your Windows installation is corrupted since you couldn't disable CSM and start up Secure Boot without some fiddling with it Event Log. Most likely, there's more corruption in there. Here's a MS guide to troubleshooting boot problems:

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/client-management/advanced-troubleshooting-boot-problems

As you can tell, troubleshooting at this point may be involved and require pouring through the Event Log and registry. I'd suggest doing a repair install with in-place upgrade. Here's a link to instructions:

https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/16397-repair-install-windows-10-place-upgrade.html

Done as they say it does not remove installed well behaved apps nor mess with your settings. If that doesn't work, a clean install will be necessary.

You are aware i converted over to UEFI I only had that problem when I was in CSM mode selecting UEFI just kept booting back to bios i had to convert drive over before it would accept UEFI tab and then boot into windows without problem

 

[CitizenSmith]

No...the loading circle is Window's doing it's startup process. Getting to and through the motherboard splash screen is the POST process. You can disable the splash screen in BIOS settings and see a bit more as the POST progresses, but it slows that down a tad. It also doesn't display very long to read it.

Oh Ok then maybe Ill look at the repair install as a possible fix anythings worth a try at this stage if there is a possibility in saving a complete reinstall of everything.

 

[kerberos_20]

since its slow at windows loading, and boot logs doesnt give u any time stamps
u may want to check loading times alternative way

before u start, download Windows 10 SDK

Windows SDK - Windows app development

The Windows SDK for Windows 11 contains headers, libraries, and tools you can use when you create apps that run on Windows.

developer.microsoft.com

make sure that performance toolkit is selected under redistributables, nothing else is needed from SDK
it will download WPT to your user defined folder
fopen that folder manually and inside installers folder u will find WPTx64-x86_en-us.msi
install it by opening it

now open command promp and run this command:
xbootmgr -trace boot -traceFlags BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER -resultPath C:\TEMP

u can replace C:\temp with any other folder u wish to save logs to

for analysing those logs u use this command:
xperf /tti -i boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.etl -o summary_boot.xml -a boot

which will create summary_boot.xml file with enough info

 

[CitizenSmith]

No...the loading circle is Window's doing it's startup process. Getting to and through the motherboard splash screen is the POST process. You can disable the splash screen in BIOS settings and see a bit more as the POST progresses, but it slows that down a tad. It also doesn't display very long to read it.

Ok leave that with me and I'll look over the link you sent thanks so much for all the time your giving extremely appreciated buddy

 

[CitizenSmith]

since its slow at windows loading, and boot logs doesnt give u any time stamps
u may want to check loading times alternative way

before u start, download Windows 10 SDK

Windows SDK - Windows app development

The Windows SDK for Windows 11 contains headers, libraries, and tools you can use when you create apps that run on Windows.

developer.microsoft.com

now open command promp and run this command:
xbootmgr -trace boot -traceFlags BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER -resultPath C:\TEMP

u can replace C:\temp with any other folder u wish to save logs to

for analysing those logs u use this command:
xperf /tti -i boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.etl -o summary_boot.xml -a boot

which will create summary_boot.xml file with enough info

Ill try that now thanks

 

[CitizenSmith]

since its slow at windows loading, and boot logs doesnt give u any time stamps
u may want to check loading times alternative way

before u start, download Windows 10 SDK

Windows SDK - Windows app development

The Windows SDK for Windows 11 contains headers, libraries, and tools you can use when you create apps that run on Windows.

developer.microsoft.com

make sure that performance toolkit is selected under redistributables, nothing else is needed from SDK

now open command promp and run this command:
xbootmgr -trace boot -traceFlags BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER -resultPath C:\TEMP

u can replace C:\temp with any other folder u wish to save logs to

for analysing those logs u use this command:
xperf /tti -i boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.etl -o summary_boot.xml -a boot

which will create summary_boot.xml file with enough info

I must mention that there are many people with this issue this maybe an msi issue with that board as this board had an update to accept 3rd gen Ryzens when i purchased this board the first thing i had to do was flash the bios in the blind otherwise it would not accept Ryzen 5 amd I thinkit was only able to see ryzen 3

 

[CitizenSmith]

OK done xbootmgrlog
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.485] Performance Analyzer Power Transition Performance Testing Utility (Microsoft® Windows® Performance Analyzer) Version 10.0.18362 - © 2019 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.486] Detected Win8 physical (ReadyBoot) prefetcher; the SysMain service is auto-started.
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.486] Registering for auto-run with a 120000 msec delay...
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.494] Completed auto-run change.
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.520] Starting trace...
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.680] Enabled boot logging to 'C:\TEMP\boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1_km_premerge.etl'
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.680] Warning: could not read Superfetch ServiceFlags (00000002).

[2020/04/12-13:14:02.751] Performance Analyzer Power Transition Performance Testing Utility (Microsoft® Windows® Performance Analyzer) Version 10.0.18362 - © 2019 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
[2020/04/12-13:14:02.752] Detected Win8 physical (ReadyBoot) prefetcher; the SysMain service is auto-started.
[2020/04/12-13:14:02.768] Stopping trace...
[2020/04/12-13:14:03.401] Stopped kernel logger.
[2020/04/12-13:14:03.433] Stopped user-mode logger.
[2020/04/12-13:14:03.436] The trace you are capturing "C:\TEMP\boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.etl" may contain personally identifiable information, including but not necessarily limited to paths to files accessed, paths to registry accessed and process names. Exact information depends on the events that were logged. Please be aware of this when sharing out this trace with other people.
[2020/04/12-13:14:09.836] Merged ETL file to 'C:\TEMP\boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.etl'
[2020/04/12-13:14:09.856] Waiting for prefetcher...
[2020/04/12-13:14:09.856] Requesting Win8 ReadyBoot boot plan recalculation...
[2020/04/12-13:14:09.857] Warning: Could not request Win8 ReadyBoot plan recalculation (0x00000015). Retrying in 10 seconds.
[2020/04/12-13:14:19.859] Warning: Could not request Win8 ReadyBoot plan recalculation (0x00000015). Retrying in 10 seconds.
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.864] Skipped Win8 ReadyBoot boot plan recalculation (ReadyBoot is inactive).
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.864] Saving prefetcher data...
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.866] Failed to save prefetcher data (C:\WINDOWS\prefetch\layout.ini) in cab archive (stage 1, error 0)
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.866] Failed to save prefetcher data (C:\WINDOWS\prefetch\ReadyBoot\ReadyBoot.etl.old) in cab archive (stage 1, error 0)
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.866] Saved prefetcher data from C:\WINDOWS\prefetch\AgCx*.db in cab archive.
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.870] Saved prefetcher data from C:\WINDOWS\prefetch\*.ebd in cab archive.
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.957] Saved prefetcher data from C:\WINDOWS\prefetch\*.7db in cab archive.
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.959] Saved prefetcher data from C:\TEMP\boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.ppf.newPlan in cab archive
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.964] Unregistering auto-run...
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.967] Completed auto-run change.

and when i go to analyse the log i got this
C:\WINDOWS\system32>xperf /tti -i boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.etl -o summary_boot.xml -a boot

xperf: error: boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.etl: Unknown (0x8000ffff).

 

[CitizenSmith]

OK done xbootmgrlog
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.485] Performance Analyzer Power Transition Performance Testing Utility (Microsoft® Windows® Performance Analyzer) Version 10.0.18362 - © 2019 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.486] Detected Win8 physical (ReadyBoot) prefetcher; the SysMain service is auto-started.
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.486] Registering for auto-run with a 120000 msec delay...
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.494] Completed auto-run change.
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.520] Starting trace...
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.680] Enabled boot logging to 'C:\TEMP\boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1_km_premerge.etl'
[2020/04/12-13:12:21.680] Warning: could not read Superfetch ServiceFlags (00000002).

[2020/04/12-13:14:02.751] Performance Analyzer Power Transition Performance Testing Utility (Microsoft® Windows® Performance Analyzer) Version 10.0.18362 - © 2019 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
[2020/04/12-13:14:02.752] Detected Win8 physical (ReadyBoot) prefetcher; the SysMain service is auto-started.
[2020/04/12-13:14:02.768] Stopping trace...
[2020/04/12-13:14:03.401] Stopped kernel logger.
[2020/04/12-13:14:03.433] Stopped user-mode logger.
[2020/04/12-13:14:03.436] The trace you are capturing "C:\TEMP\boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.etl" may contain personally identifiable information, including but not necessarily limited to paths to files accessed, paths to registry accessed and process names. Exact information depends on the events that were logged. Please be aware of this when sharing out this trace with other people.
[2020/04/12-13:14:09.836] Merged ETL file to 'C:\TEMP\boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.etl'
[2020/04/12-13:14:09.856] Waiting for prefetcher...
[2020/04/12-13:14:09.856] Requesting Win8 ReadyBoot boot plan recalculation...
[2020/04/12-13:14:09.857] Warning: Could not request Win8 ReadyBoot plan recalculation (0x00000015). Retrying in 10 seconds.
[2020/04/12-13:14:19.859] Warning: Could not request Win8 ReadyBoot plan recalculation (0x00000015). Retrying in 10 seconds.
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.864] Skipped Win8 ReadyBoot boot plan recalculation (ReadyBoot is inactive).
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.864] Saving prefetcher data...
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.866] Failed to save prefetcher data (C:\WINDOWS\prefetch\layout.ini) in cab archive (stage 1, error 0)
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.866] Failed to save prefetcher data (C:\WINDOWS\prefetch\ReadyBoot\ReadyBoot.etl.old) in cab archive (stage 1, error 0)
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.866] Saved prefetcher data from C:\WINDOWS\prefetch\AgCx*.db in cab archive.
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.870] Saved prefetcher data from C:\WINDOWS\prefetch\*.ebd in cab archive.
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.957] Saved prefetcher data from C:\WINDOWS\prefetch\*.7db in cab archive.
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.959] Saved prefetcher data from C:\TEMP\boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.ppf.newPlan in cab archive
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.964] Unregistering auto-run...
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.967] Completed auto-run change.

and when go to analyse it i get this.
C:\WINDOWS\system32>xperf /tti -i boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.etl -o summary_boot.xml -a boot
xperf: error: boot_BASE+CSWITCH+DRIVERS+POWER_1.etl: Unknown (0x8000ffff).

I also checked in performance and readyboot is disabled I'm trying to enable it now to see if that helps.
Also really hard to find any info on readyboot! is it the same as readyboost!

 

[drea.drechsler]

OK done xbootmgrlog
...
[2020/04/12-13:14:09.857] Warning: Could not request Win8 ReadyBoot plan recalculation (0x00000015). Retrying in 10 seconds.
[2020/04/12-13:14:19.859] Warning: Could not request Win8 ReadyBoot plan recalculation (0x00000015). Retrying in 10 seconds.
[2020/04/12-13:14:29.864] Skipped Win8 ReadyBoot boot plan recalculation (ReadyBoot is inactive).
...

I've not used this before so not sure....but it looks like there's 20 seconds of your 30 second delay right there.

Try disabling Prefetch service - t's now called SysMain - in services.msc. You can re-enable it it does nothing for you.

 

[kerberos_20]

for xperf command, u need to be in that log folder, not in system32
cd c:\temp to get there if u not used another folder

 

[CitizenSmith]

I've not used this before so not sure....but it looks like there's 20 seconds of your 30 second delay right there.

Try disabling Prefetch service - t's now called SysMain - in services.msc. You can re-enable it it does nothing for you.

done that just gonna reboot and see if any difference

 

[kerberos_20]

I've not used this before so not sure....but it looks like there's 20 seconds of your 30 second delay right there.

Try disabling Prefetch service - t's now called SysMain - in services.msc. You can re-enable it it does nothing for you.

its readyboot not readyboost, but nice catch

readyboot u can disable if u open performance monitor (win+r -> perfom)
on left side click on data collector set -> startup event trace seassions
and there u can disable readyboot