New Nvidia GeForce 8800GT Surprises

[Kamrooz]

Don't count on a replacement for the GTX anytime soon. And I doubt the new GTS will arrive until something challenges the GTX/Ultra for top spot, or they start making more G92s than the GT sells on its own.

Right now they're in their perfect position to move old G80s and have unmet demand for the G92. Once that changes, then we'll likely see the splash of new SKUs.

Agreed, with the steps currently taken, nvidia will be fattening their pockets even further. We can all hope for a high end soon. But the biggest fact to keep in mind is the performance of the 8800 GT. We all know how demanding Crysis is...Considering the price performance ratio for the 8800 GT, it was the perfect solution. Unless the R670 can put a dent into the 8800 GT's sales and offer better performance, I don't see much happening in terms of a new high end. Interesting though how well the 8800 GT suits most users...IMO the perfect release to coincide with crysis considering how demanding the game is. If nvidia didn't launch the 8800 GT...There would be a lot of unhappy customers brewing from Crysis buyers.

I'm curious to see some benchmarks for a new GTS based on this 65nm process/architecture.. But for the moment, considering the market, I doubt a new high end will arise within this year. Probably late q1 or early/mid Q2...But we'll have to see how everything unfolds with the r670 till then.

Honestly though..I might nab two of these 8800 GT's for my next rig. Considering the price, it should be definitely worth it. This is indeed rare though, I'm normally against SLI unless you use 1920 or higher resolutions...But considering two GT's turn out to be roughly the same price as a GTX...It should be more beneficial to nab two 8800 GT's. But I'd have to look at a more detailed review to see if it's worth it. Especially considering I'm going to be on a FW900 Sony monitor (<3 CRT). Won't be forced to high resolutions, so it might be worth it to nab a GTX instead depending on my gaming resolution. I will either use a 1680 based res or 1920...all depends on the game choices though. Guess my timeframe is in my favor, no rush to buy. Which IMO is the best factor...Never a good thing to rush into hardware uninformed...

 

[TheGreatGrapeApe]

Demand for the 8800GT is already high but from what they say they have the new GTS SKU ready.

I undersatnd that, you miss my point, about the GT and GTX. Having it ready doesn't mean it's strategically beneficial to launch it right now.

And if they have to move old G80 they sure have to set the price below that of the GT since noone seems to want them anymore.

you obviously don't know the market, those that wanted the GTX before, still want it, because it's still top dog compared to the GT. Which is why you don't put the GTS in to simply get less money and leave yourself and your OEM partners with a warehouse full of G80s.

I believe if the price of a GTX fall at around 400 Euro (its around 500 now) that would be an indication of something new coming right after they get rid most of old GTs/GTX.Then it would be a good time to buy a GTX.

What like buying a GTS-320 last week for $240 would've been?
Nah, when they drop the price of the GTX dramatically it's not the time to buy a GTX, it's the time to get ready for a replacement.

Still , the problem with games goes on.We`ll buy Crysis now and play it next year

I don't know why someone would do that. I'll buy Crysis now and play it now on my Mobile HD2600. What's the point in waiting? I don't need to make myself feel better by saying I can only play at ultra-high settings, that's what replayability is for.
That would be like only now taking the shrink wrap off Oblivion or Fear, why wait?

People complaining about performance forget the point behind gaming, PLAYING THE GAME. Who cares if you can't run Uber-Ultra, if they had the option of DX11 and Ray-tracing built into the game, but your PC only played it at 2 fps, would that mean you needed to wait for 2 years to play it? Nah, you play it at max you can now, then again when you activate alot more features. It's not like they're charging you for the DX9 version, then selling you a DX10 patch, and then selling a DX10+ patch, you get it all at the start for the same price, just don't expect it to all be playable and consider it like "unlockable content", that you can see now, but that you can't unlock playability/performance until new hardware arrives.

 

[sleepyhead]

OK just ordered from NCIXUS! Got the EVGA card so I can step up if they release a bad-A card by christmas.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I am under the impression that you have to buy the card directly from EVGA in order to use the step-up program. Buying from a vendor like NCIXUS, NewEgg, Mwave, etc. usually yields a lower purchase price but no access to the step-up program.

 

[Kamrooz]

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I am under the impression that you have to buy the card directly from EVGA in order to use the step-up program. Buying from a vendor like NCIXUS, NewEgg, Mwave, etc. usually yields a lower purchase price but no access to the step-up program.

That's false. Just buy the card and make sure you register your product. Once you do you are under the step up program/lifetime warranty.

 

[TheGreatGrapeApe]

If nvidia didn't launch the 8800 GT...There would be a lot of unhappy customers brewing from Crysis buyers.

I agree, and most would be G8600/HD2600 or GF8800GTS-320 users IMO.
I think it's a perfectly timed launch (kinda helps being an EA partner for the launch in this case for timing, not necessarily for performance).

But for the moment, considering the market, I doubt a new high end will arise within this year. Probably late q1 or early/mid Q2...But we'll have to see how everything unfolds with the r670 till then. [.quote]

Yeah I don't think there will be a new 'high end' this year, but I woud say that there is likely to be two more launches this year just before Xmas, and those will likely be the GTS replacement and the RV680. both of those will likely challenge and probably beat the current GTX/Ultra performance, but neither of which I would consider to be their 'high end replacement' where we usually expect to see 20-50% improvement on the past model. I expect both companies to introduce SLi / Xfire dual-chip one bord solutions for that, which is similar to how you're considering the current GTs.
It sounds like both nV and AMD are trying to ride out this generatoin until they go to the R700/G100, or at least that's the vibe I get with so little information coming out about anything else.

 

[Kamrooz]

I agree, and most would be G8600/HD2600 or GF8800GTS-320 users IMO.
I think it's a perfectly timed launch (kinda helps being an EA partner for the launch in this case for timing, not necessarily for performance).

Yeah I don't think there will be a new 'high end' this year, but I woud say that there is likely to be two more launches this year just before Xmas, and those will likely be the GTS replacement and the RV680. both of those will likely challenge and probably beat the current GTX/Ultra performance, but neither of which I would consider to be their 'high end replacement' where we usually expect to see 20-50% improvement on the past model. I expect both companies to introduce SLi / Xfire dual-chip one bord solutions for that, which is similar to how you're considering the current GTs.
It sounds like both nV and AMD are trying to ride out this generatoin until they go to the R700/G100, or at least that's the vibe I get with so little information coming out about anything else.

Indeed. It'd be nice to see the new GTS benchmark wise. They should surpass the GTX/Ultra as you stated quite easily. It's somewhat mystifying when you consider how much profit Nvidia has pulled in with the g80 series. Now, the g92 will take that a step further. Heck, the 8800 GT is selling out quickly. To think they will release a GTS refresh as well is even more mind boggling. When being able to comprehend the immense performance gains in the 8800 GT, wonder how the refresh of the GTS will push that further. I have to admit a very clever strategy in terms of Nvidia's release strategy..Release a 250 dollar product with a immense price/performance ratio...Then shortly after the GTS refresh..Which will take that even one step farther. Without a doubt it will surpass the GTX/Ultra (Seems like it will considering the 8800 GT's performance). Once again, a cheaper solution then the GTX, as well to drive the market into a frenzy. Then down the line, a new high end derived from the g80/90 architecture. Damn exciting...

I really do hope AMD/ATI has a great performer on their hands. It'll just drive the competition further and speed up the release of the GTS refresh. When you consider the current scenario, You'd have to call the GTS refresh a "8900/8950" when you break it down... Quite an exciting time ^_^...Let's hope AMD can push the envelope as well in order for nvidia to release their big guns quicker. The faster we can get better hardware, the more enjoyment we'll get from crysis ^_^. Personally I'm one of those individuals who is going to skip crysis till I have a rig capable of running it with some high settings (3.2 prescott and x700 pro doesn't cut it >_<). The realism and eye candy is immense from low, mid, high, and very high settings from what I've seen. So going to hold out to experience the full picture at once.

 

[sleepyhead]

That's false. Just buy the card and make sure you register your product. Once you do you are under the step up program/lifetime warranty.

That's good to hear. I read some bad information somewhere and was actually considering ordering my new card directly from EVGA and paying a bit more money than other online retailers. Thanks!

 

[Evilonigiri]

I wonder what the XFX Fata1ty series of this card is gonna be clocked at...I mean EVGA already has it at 700mhz. My guess would be 750mhz+ since the Fata1ty version of the 8800GTS was 650mhz, a 150mhz increase. That'll beat the GTX alright.

Well, overall a bit short of a review, not enough to quench my thirst. Right now I'm kicking myself for buying a 8800GTS during summer.

 

[EricVPI]

1. Is there any PROOF the new GTS SKU will be 65nm? I don't think so.

2. I've heard that OC versions of the 8800GT do not qualify for step up. So in other words, if I shelled out X amount of dollars for the KO 8800GT and a better GTS comes out, I could NOT use step-up.

 

[scryer_360]

Two 8800GTs will most assuredly kill an 8800GTX, but you know that the 8900GT is out there somewhere, waiting for us to purchase the 8800GT, just so it can walk through the door and say "surprise! we were just f*cking with you, this is really an online gay-bar."

Anyone who already has an 8800GTX should probably not upgrade, but the 8800GTX prices are going to be crashing down as everyone decides to buy the 8800GT. I expect dual 8800GTX systems to pop up a little more often now.

As to why Nvidia would do this, there was not a real mid-range market out there for some time. Sure, people bought an 8800GTS, but far more consumers can afford an card just $70 less than that. Sales will definitely be high.

Myself, my monitor will only play up to 1280x1024, and when I get my 32" LCD TV I will be playing 1366x768, which an 8800GT can more than slaughter at. If Crysis played at 30 fps at 1600x1200, it should run LOADS better at 1366x768. Its a great time to be me..... Unfortanetly I have to make $890 last me until January at least, as I am in school, and I have to buy Christmas gifts on that. Ugh....

 

[cal7]

Cant provide links now sorry,but i`m sure i read more than once that the new GTS SKU will be out in November. Anyway, lowering the price for existing GTS below GT was what i meant ,sorry . A GTS would have to fall well under the GT to become attractive again.It doesnt look so good after the 2900PRO came out. And speaking for myself only and considering the performance of GT compared to the GTX , i wouldnt pay more than 400 for the GTX.Last month maybe but not now.
As for games i couldnt agree more.There are games that you enjoy by doing what you said.But Crysis for example , people will buy it for the visuals . But for most , without high end rigs it wont be the same experience.

 

[Sengoku]

Does anyone know the physical length of the card? I like to know if my case is able to fit these new generation cards.

A bit of loose notes, as we have the Leadtek WinFast PX8800GT extreme here. Only have rough notes, because of time.

9 inches card edge to card edge ,not counting the usual 1/2 inch extra for ports.

4 inches high, card edge to card edge,

1/2 inch thick. (single slot, yay!)

Seemed to run quiet.

Ran hot like a mofo. (single slot, boo!)

Crysis is not going to run at full/full with one of these, but will be quite playable, based on demo performance.

Oblivion ran playably at full/full, but cutting it close.

 

[randomizer]

It's amazing that oblivion still brings cards down hard when at high res and max graphics, 1.5 years after it was released. And it doesn't even look that good IMO especially with HDR.

 

[wenzil]

Hey guys, I currently have an EVGA 8800 GTS 640MB and my Step Up program is ending in 2 days. I'm considering to step up to the 8800 GT but I really can't come to a decision... Since they won't give me the price difference, I must decide purely based off of performance. I know it outperforms the 320MB, but I was unsure if it did outperform the 640MB version by THAT much. Plus I really have no idea how well it will perform when overclocked, compared to mine. Basically its:

(cons)
15$ (shipping charge)
more heat (single slot cooling)
less on board memory
less overclockability(?)
Id have to wait till my 640 GTS gets shipped to EVGA and then wait till the GT gets to my house.

vs

(pros)
Little more performance (depends if it overclocks well)


What do you guys think? Is it worth a step up?

 

[Tierce]

Wow, I just bought all the parts for a new system last week, which included an 8800 GTS. Package showed up on my doorstep today... Should I be sending it back to Newegg and getting an 8800 GT instead? My only thought on the article is that they used a stock 500 MHz GTS for the comparison, but I of course bought one of the OC'd models, 580 MHz from XFX. Is the GT going to perform better than the OC'd models as well? If that's the case I guess I should send it back in and wait to get a GT. Any Advice?

 

[TheGreatGrapeApe]

But yea...The current state of things just doesn't make sense. Of course I doubt anyone would care considering the price performance ratio. But for those who like to look at the entire picture...It really...does not make sense.

Just an update to what I said earlier, let me take something back.

nVidia HAVE been pretty st00pid/myopic in that they have already sold out of all their initial allotment and the 2nd batch, that would seem to be a good thing except now people are stuck waiting, which when faced with a back-order instead of a "checkout now" button means they will have time to reflect, and then have to wait for new stock to get in, which is looking like it's about the time that the HD3xxx comes out.

Now I chided AMD for missing their launch before Crysis comes out, but I have to in all fairness do the same to nV for not having enough stock on hand to truly take advantage of this 2 week gap.

I don't know man, both companies are looking like they rushed their products to market, one got it here early with low supply, the other seems to have not been able to rush it even 2 days earlier to match the Crysis launch.

Dunno, I still things it's a great positioning of the GT, but without having adequate stock, it definitely diminshes the potential impact of taking sales away from the competition, and now leaves people with no GT but also very little/no desire to buy any of the GTSs or GF8600s.

Before I'd say brilliant, now I'd say nice but poorly executed.
nV's probably still making a mint, but definitely not as much as they could've (especially if they had priced them perfectly to reflect the demand [ie few shortages]) so that means money's been left on the table, and they're not going to be able to capitalize on their opportunity like I originally thought they'd be able to.

Anywhoo, just some more musings from the sidelines.

 

[TheGreatGrapeApe]

Is the GT going to perform better than the OC'd models as well? If that's the case I guess I should send it back in and wait to get a GT. Any Advice?

Yes it will often outperform the OC'ed models as well, and being that it's running at it's stock speed, the GT can overclock from there.

If you can get a replacement GT fast enough then it's worth it, but as I mention in the post below yours, the GT is mighty scarce now, and you may be one of those people who now gets a 'sober second thought'.

I'd say go with the GT if you can get it, and if not go with the HD38xx, however, both of those options mean you won't be able to play with your nice new rig, so if you want to play Crysis when it launches, you probably should stick with what you got unless you can get the other options beforehand.

 

[ganpachi]

I just got an 8800 gts 320 last month on the assumption that the GT would be weaker. I already put in my step-up request

15 bucks for 20% improvement is great (even if I look over the fact that I loose 35 bucks from the "upgrade" to the cheaper part), and since the 320mb is getting retired and the only other product getting an upgrade is the gts 640mb and another 100 bucks, I'll stick with free upgrade choice.

 

[systemlord]

I just got an 8800 gts 320 last month on the assumption that the GT would be weaker. I already put in my step-up request

15 bucks for 20% improvement is great (even if I look over the fact that I loose 35 bucks from the "upgrade" to the cheaper part), and since the 320mb is getting retired and the only other product getting an upgrade is the gts 640mb and another 100 bucks, I'll stick with free upgrade choice.

EVGA has an OC'ed version where the core is at 700Mhz over the stock 600Mhz. I have heard of even 700Mhz plus OC's.

 

[spoonboy]

Has anyone spotted how much better the Radeon 2900 has got?? Not quite the turkey so many thought it was now eh? All benchmarks before Catalyst 7.9 should be ignored. End of.

 

[systemlord]

Has anyone spotted how much better the Radeon 2900 has got?? Not quite the turkey so many thought it was now eh? All benchmarks before Catalyst 7.9 should be ignored. End of.

The Radeon 2900XT is far behind the 8800GT 512MB and near GTX levels. The 2900 series still has big problems with AA & AF filtering.

 

[spoonboy]

The Radeon 2900XT is far behind the 8800GT 512MB and near GTX levels. The 2900 series still has big problems with AA & AF filtering.

Well yeah the 8800gt is a new part, its almost a gtx except at mad resolutions, so its always gonna win hands down. Point being 2900 has come a long long way, against the 8800gts its got it by the short and curlys. Wasnt designed for regular AA, so its always gonna suffer with it on. Turned out to be a good buy after all.

(before the gt came out that is - ALL high end cards look pointless now gt is here )

 

[Maziar]

i have to disagree with your last sentence, if u play @ 1920x1200 or higher, a single 8800GT will not suffice and loses to a 8800GTX bu a large margin

 

[spoonboy]

i have to disagree with your last sentence, if u play @ 1920x1200 or higher, a single 8800GT will not suffice and loses to a 8800GTX bu a large margin

The price dude, the PRICE makes 'em seem silly. Is it really worth shelling out so much extra for a gtx when a gt is almost matching its performance. If you already have a gtx thats fine, but buying a gtx now, well, thats madness surely.

Then again if youve got the money for a top-dollar display, then its a moot point.

 

[mactronix]

All i can say is im glad to see some propper movement in the GPU market at last,i really hope for everyones sake that the 3800's are a match or better for the 8800gt.
Can i just ask who it is that takes the price drop when the next gen comes out is it the retailer that is shifting stock or will NVidea be holding a supply that they know they will take a small loss on,or a bit of a mix of the two.
I think the only thing Nvidea have done wrong is as ape said not had the supply to meet demand.
A lot of people on these boards were moaning about the 2600/8600 cards not following the normal pattern of the next gen bridging down to the best of the last gen and while the GT hasnt quite managed this(and im not including the ultra in this)i wouldnt bet on the GTS version not besting the GTX.
For the reasons people have given as negatives for releasing the GT at its price/performance point you obviously couldnt release the better card first as that would have really put a spanner in the works of there range,but putting a card in that overlaps the GTS cards makes perfect sence allowing them to stopmaking the more costly to manufacture cards and keep and possably increase market share.leaving them with a GTS card ready to roll in response to the 3800 if it proves to be needed.
Mactronix