OP: Why Microsoft is Innocent with IE8

[tuannguyen]

The never ending browser wars: Firefox is gaining, Chrome is here, Safari hits version 4, Internet Explorer should be canned. So many opinions, so many rulings.

OP: Why Microsoft is Innocent with IE8 : Read more

 

[Pyroflea]

How are you supposed to even get a different browser without one to begin with..? Are they expected to burn the installation .exe to a CD, or copy it to a flash drive, then transfer it on to their new computer...?

 

[keither5150]

How would you connect to the internet to download your browser of choice?

This will be overturned quite quickly once someone explains the facts to the EU.

 

[Pyroflea]

I can understand how they want people to have choices, I agree with that aspect. This is just stupid though. We have choices. Hell, I'm using Vista and Firefox right now. IE is part of Windows, accept it.

 

[Lan]

To be fair, I'm sure most of you know that the EU was actually pushing to get a list of browser choices to use pop up right after you load Windows, but instead to their credit, Microsoft just ripped out IE instead.

Now the EU is scrambling to try to make Microsoft play their way, and I doubt that will happen. Not in time for Windows 7 anyway.

 

[afrobacon]

Why not just do something simple like including the top 3 browsers at the time of the OS's launch? Giving people not only a browser, but an up front selection.

Would be nice skipping over the M$ exploder altogether; but at the price of not having access to something better isn't worth it.

 

[Lan]

[citation][nom]afrobacon[/nom]Why not just do something simple like including the top 3 browsers at the time of the OS's launch? Giving people not only a browser, but an up front selection.Would be nice skipping over the M$ exploder altogether; but at the price of not having access to something better isn't worth it.[/citation]

Why should Microsoft have to pay extra money and time to their developers to have them include a competitors product? The EU should pay Microsoft if they want that choice. Microsoft did the right thing to comply with the problem.

You rip out IE, and the problem is solved, while at the same time making it difficult for the EU.

 

[TheMan1214]

I have no idea what the EU has going through their heads. thank god i don't live in the EU, what are they going to do next, make sure calculator doesn't come with computers....jeeze

 

[Guest]

"Microsoft never forbid me and doesn't forbid anyone from using a different browser."

This is true, but the average computer user still isn't aware of the fact that there ARE other browsers. If you think I'm full of it by saying that think about how big the tech support industry is. For every one of us that's computer savvy and on top of it there are scores of others that just want to sit down and have their computer work.

That said, none of these people are ever going to think twice about using IE because they wont even know there are other options available to them. I always like to use my mother as an example. Shes a smart and inquisitive woman who enjoys using her computer for things like photos, sending email, etc... but she doesn't know the first thing about good PC maintenance.

Naturally all of you have a point that without a base browser to get online to begin with how will you be able to go download another one... but that line of thinking is exactly what Microsoft has been banking on for years. Why not have software bundles available to choose from when you purchase your new computer? Why can't I go in and say: "Ok, I'm buying a new laptop with windows 7 and for my free software bundle I'll choose the one that comes with Firefox, Nero, etc blah blah blah" Have your employees on hand educating consumers about their options so they can choose wisely. Don't just give them one option and keep shoving the product out the front door...

 

[falchard]

You can always use Windows Update to install IE explorer.

 

[Lan]

[citation][nom]CopperBot[/nom]"Microsoft never forbid me and doesn't forbid anyone from using a different browser."This is true, but the average computer user still isn't aware of the fact that there ARE other browsers. If you think I'm full of it by saying that think about how big the tech support industry is. For every one of us that's computer savvy and on top of it there are scores of others that just want to sit down and have their computer work.That said, none of these people are ever going to think twice about using IE because they wont even know there are other options available to them. I always like to use my mother as an example. Shes a smart and inquisitive woman who enjoys using her computer for things like photos, sending email, etc... but she doesn't know the first thing about good PC maintenance.Naturally all of you have a point that without a base browser to get online to begin with how will you be able to go download another one... but that line of thinking is exactly what Microsoft has been banking on for years. Why not have software bundles available to choose from when you purchase your new computer? Why can't I go in and say: "Ok, I'm buying a new laptop with windows 7 and for my free software bundle I'll choose the one that comes with Firefox, Nero, etc blah blah blah" Have your employees on hand educating consumers about their options so they can choose wisely. Don't just give them one option and keep shoving the product out the front door...[/citation]


See above. If some government or agency wants that functionality, they should pay Microsoft to include it. Microsoft did the right thing from a business standpoint.

 

[TheMan1214]

[citation][nom]CopperBot[/nom]"Microsoft never forbid me and doesn't forbid anyone from using a different browser."This is true, but the average computer user still isn't aware of the fact that there ARE other browsers. If you think I'm full of it by saying that think about how big the tech support industry is. For every one of us that's computer savvy and on top of it there are scores of others that just want to sit down and have their computer work.That said, none of these people are ever going to think twice about using IE because they wont even know there are other options available to them. I always like to use my mother as an example. Shes a smart and inquisitive woman who enjoys using her computer for things like photos, sending email, etc... but she doesn't know the first thing about good PC maintenance.Naturally all of you have a point that without a base browser to get online to begin with how will you be able to go download another one... but that line of thinking is exactly what Microsoft has been banking on for years. Why not have software bundles available to choose from when you purchase your new computer? Why can't I go in and say: "Ok, I'm buying a new laptop with windows 7 and for my free software bundle I'll choose the one that comes with Firefox, Nero, etc blah blah blah" Have your employees on hand educating consumers about their options so they can choose wisely. Don't just give them one option and keep shoving the product out the front door...[/citation]

So then apple and linux shouldn't be able to use browsers too.

 

[WheelsOfConfusion]

[citation][nom]falchard[/nom]You can always use Windows Update to install IE explorer.[/citation]
Besides which, how difficult would it be to set up a splash window when the user tries to connect offering 1) information about web browsers, 2) a list of the most popular browsers, 3) FTP to grab the latest version of whichever browser the user chooses and then start the installation process?

In practice, I bet OEMs are going to bundle IE (or Firefox or Opera) with all the Win7 machines they sell to Europe. People who forgo OEMs, putting their own machines together, will probably already known enough to have drivers and their browser of choice ready on a CD or thumb drive or whatever.

 

[WheelsOfConfusion]

[citation][nom]TheMan1214[/nom]So then apple and linux shouldn't be able to use browsers too.[/citation]
Try again when Apple and Linux have a monopoly in OS/Browser-space (or even more absurdly, when all Linux distros use the same default browser).

 

[maban]

They should ban Win7 if you can only use Windows on it.

 

[computabug]

MS should consider making a light weight browser that only does html with none of those pre-installed flash/java stuff, and doesn't write anything at all to the hard drive while surfing the web with it. Heck, it doesn't even have to display images. Integrate that into windows explorer or something. We'll just use it to DL essential stuff without fragmenting our newly installed OS with cache/history/cookies and all that poo.

 

[agawtrip]

can't you surf the web with "Windows Explorer" or to "My Computer" address bar?

 

[NuclearShadow]

While I don't use IE I see no problem with having the option to use it and it coming with Windows. Heck I even had to use it to get FireFox how would I have got it otherwise?

Also I don't see how this could be considered a monopoly as I doubt MS makes any profit from IE itself. IE costs nothing and is just included with the OS. IE doesn't have any built in advertisements or anything so its not like they are profiting from it in anyway.

 

[keither5150]

[citation][nom]agawtrip[/nom]can't you surf the web with "Windows Explorer" or to "My Computer" address bar?[/citation]

That opens up IE.

Let's tell Apple that they have to offer Firefox and Chrome along with Safari.

I am no fan of Microsoft but they are clearly in the right here.

They should just not offer Windows 7 until the EU pulls their head out of their asses or offers a solution at no cost to MS.

I find this funny..... wait a second.... is this one of the weekend jokes?

It should be, it is funnier than most of the weekend jokes.

 

[slothman]

[citation][nom]WheelsOfConfusion[/nom]Try again when Apple and Linux have a monopoly in OS/Browser-space (or even more absurdly, when all Linux distros use the same default browser).[/citation]
It isn't a monopoly. You named their competitors. Monopoly would imply a lack of ability to compete. Apple certainly competes.

 

[keither5150]

Sorry "offer them Windows 7"

I miss the edit feature.

 

[Guest]

Internet Explorer is an integral part of Microsoft keeping a backdoor into your computer, hence you can't remove it completely. That's also the reason why the latest service pack for the .NET framework added a Firefox add-on if Firefox was installed, adding a big security vulnerability. When you do a clean upgrade/install of IE7 or IE8, it makes you turn off your antivirus, since Firefox does not make you turn off your antivirus, there's plenty of reason to be suspicious. I don't see any reason why not to force them to include other browsers, and the option to pick one at first run, Microsoft has a monopoly, they should be regulated. If Linux or OSX had atleast 30% marketshare, then Microsoft should be cut slack, but until then, they are a monopoly and should be regulated as such.

 

[pixelking]

Let us be reminded that a long time ago, IE was the arm-pit of browsers, and Netscape was king. What happened there? What occurred was that Microsoft came up with a better and more convenient solution for end users. Period.

Period? Really? Their success had nothing to do with the fact that IE was pre-installed so most folks just used it because they didn't know how to install anything else? BTW, it still is the armpit of browsers. It's incredibly slow, scores a 21/100 on acid test 3, and can't even render SharePoint sites (another crappy MS product) without going into IE7 compatibility mode.

Regarding the issues of not including it, obviously all major manufacturers will include one browser or another, and system builders have this marvelous technology called a usb drive, which can hold installs of browsers without requiring access to the internets (a series of tubes).

 

[Guest]

@agawtrip: lol

 

[afrobacon]

Actually, this MAY turn out to be a good thing. As stated several times in the past, the average computer user thinks IE is the only browser (or in most cases, the internet itself.) With the EU doing this it publicizes on the fact that there are others out there and that Firefox isn't a computer game thats all the rage.

I don't believe in the EU's practices and I do think that M$ is in the right on this one; just trying to see some good in it.