Question Pairing a 4070Ti with a 5800K3D in a new build: madness?

[nerdvous]

I'm planning to build a new computer as, after 8 years of faithful service, this one is starting to fail. I'd like to be able to run modern games on high settings at 1440p and 120+ FPS, and for the system to last for at least 4 years.

I have some money so I'm not capping the budget. But the prices of some parts are eye-watering - especially since I haven't looked at this stuff in 8 years! - and so I'm looking to keep costs on a leash and get value for money where possible.

The other thing I'm conscious about is power draw. Not just because of electricity bills, but also the additional costs and complications in terms of exotic cooling systems, and the general inconvenience of a system that belches heat and noise.

Hopefully this gives you an idea of how, after looking at lots of reviews, benchmarks and comment threads courtesy of this fine site and community, I hit upon this strange proposition.

My hope would be that the savings on the 5800K3D (and attendant savings on mobo, DDR4 etc) would offset the price of the 4070Ti while not compromising on game performance, while also keeping power draw low. I figure I could live with the relative under-performance for other tasks.

I am however all too aware that I might end up with a lamed system that bottlenecks an expensive GPU with an inadequate CPU. In other words, an exercise in futility and hubris!

I wondered if you fine folks could weigh in on which outcome you consider more probable. And if you had any suggestions for alternative pairings, I'd be grateful for those too. I was considering waiting on the 7000K3D series reviews to come in, but looking at the specs it seems much of the (perceived) advantage in terms of savings and power efficiency would not be preserved.

Please be gentle, I'm new to much of this!


---
Approximate Purchase Date: within the next couple of months

Budget Range: not entirely sure, but perhaps $2.5-3.5k

System Usage from Most to Least Important: gaming, general productivity

Are you buying a monitor: Yes

Do you need to buy OS: Yes

Preferred Website(s) for Parts: Scan, Amazon (not sure where else to look)

Location: UK

Overclocking: not a priority

 

[sizzling]

The 5800X3D is among the best gaming cpu’s available today, there is nothing from a gaming point of view that is significantly better. You are not sacrificing any gaming performance that you would notice outside watching an fps counter.

 

[GarrettL]

I'm planning to build a new computer as, after 8 years of faithful service, this one is starting to fail. I'd like to be able to run modern games on high settings at 1440p and 120+ FPS, and for the system to last for at least 4 years.

I have some money so I'm not capping the budget. But the prices of some parts are eye-watering - especially since I haven't looked at this stuff in 8 years! - and so I'm looking to keep costs on a leash and get value for money where possible.

The other thing I'm conscious about is power draw. Not just because of electricity bills, but also the additional costs and complications in terms of exotic cooling systems, and the general inconvenience of a system that belches heat and noise.

Hopefully this gives you an idea of how, after looking at lots of reviews, benchmarks and comment threads courtesy of this fine site and community, I hit upon this strange proposition.

My hope would be that the savings on the 5800K3D (and attendant savings on mobo, DDR4 etc) would offset the price of the 4070Ti while not compromising on game performance, while also keeping power draw low. I figure I could live with the relative under-performance for other tasks.

I am however all too aware that I might end up with a lamed system that bottlenecks an expensive GPU with an inadequate CPU. In other words, an exercise in futility and hubris!

I wondered if you fine folks could weigh in on which outcome you consider more probable. And if you had any suggestions for alternative pairings, I'd be grateful for those too. I was considering waiting on the 7000K3D series reviews to come in, but looking at the specs it seems much of the (perceived) advantage in terms of savings and power efficiency would not be preserved.

Please be gentle, I'm new to much of this!


---
Approximate Purchase Date: within the next couple of months

Budget Range: not entirely sure, but perhaps $2.5-3.5k

System Usage from Most to Least Important: gaming, general productivity

Are you buying a monitor: Yes

Do you need to buy OS: Yes

Preferred Website(s) for Parts: Scan, Amazon (not sure where else to look)

Location: UK

Overclocking: not a priority

Where do you live? Do you have a Micro Ceneter near you?

 

[Why_Me]

Where do you live? Do you have a Micro Ceneter near you?

UK

 

[Why_Me]

A third option to consider.

https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product...x-atx-lga1700-motherboard-b760-aorus-elite-ax
Gigabyte B760 AORUS ELITE AX £218.25

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/B760-AORUS-ELITE-AX-rev-10#kf

or ...

https://www.scan.co.uk/products/nda-2pm-03-01-asus-tuf-gaming-h770-pro-wifi
ASUS TUF GAMING H770-PRO WiFi £229.99

TUF GAMING H770-PRO WIFI｜Motherboards｜ASUS Global

TUF Gaming series distills essential elements of the latest AMD and Intel® platforms, and combines them with game-ready features and proven durability. Engineered with military-grade components, an upgraded power solution and a comprehensive set of cooling options, this motherboard delivers...

www.asus.com

https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product...6-gb-ddr5-5600-cl36-memory-cmk32gx5m2b5600c36
Corsair Vengeance DDR5 5600 32GB (2x16GB) CL36 £129.97

https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/product...13700f-21-ghz-16-core-processor-bx8071513700f
Intel Core i7-13700F £362.96

https://www.intel.com/content/www/u...-30m-cache-up-to-5-20-ghz/specifications.html
Processor Base Power: 65W
Maximum Turbo Power: 219W

i7 12700 / 12700F gaming benchmarks. The difference between the locked 12 Gen i7 and unlocked i7 is one frame per second. I doubt it's any different with the 13 Gen i7's.

 

[GarrettL]

That was the dilema that I was faced with a month ago but the pricing has changed since then. Wife in need so a very capable 3800x x570 pc went to her and I went with the 5800x3d and 4070TI due to my allowable budget.

The AM5 platform has dropped in price a bit since release. The 7800x3d will be released in a couple of weeks and will likely outperform the 5800x3d. The Intel 13700 is a great gaming cpu as well. As our resolution goes up the demand on the cpu goes down.

At 1440p they are quite similar;

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJd1cjB4Z3s


So it's really up to you and your tolerable budget, there is no bad choice.

The 4070ti is a great 1440p gpu as is the 7900xt as a simlar price point. Just depends on what you desire from a gpu. The 7900xt performs better overall without ray traycing but does require more power.

If Intel deals are good in your area then it's a great platform as well, just requiring more power as you step up to the higher end cpu's. But both the LGA 1700 and AM4 platforms are at a dead end. But both remain very good choices today.

To the heat issue, both Intel and AMD will let the cpu's run to their respective thermal limit then down clock to reduce heat. If you go AMD or Intel you want the best cooling possible to prevent any thermal throttling. I am able to do that with a 5800xrd and an inexpensive Peerless Assassin 120.

If I were in your shoes today I'd look at the AM5 and likely a 7700x to start with. In this video we see that the strong performance of the 5800x3d is on par with the 7700x at 1080p resolution! That's impressive for the 5800x3d but also shows you the future the AM5 socket will provide.


5800x3d vs 770x 1080p;

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dLjkrZKqJU


The 7700x performs as well as the 5800x3d now and in two or three years pop in the 7800x3d when it's price falls and maybe a 9800x3d one day.

That's pretty good longevity for a pc.

You may want to dig through all the AM5 motherboard offerings to see what fit's your needs. Those prices are eye watering.

 

[nerdvous]

Thanks very much for the replies. I particularly appreciate the detailed responses from Why_me and GarretL. You've given me a lot to think about!

 

[logainofhades]

The 7800x3d won't be out till April.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/18737/amds-ryzen-7000x3d-chips-releasing-february-28th-and-april-6th

 

[nerdvous]

Thanks for that information, logainofhades. That's a bit disappointing, although I suppose it's helpful in that in narrows the decision space for now. I don't really want to wait around til April, and the consensus seems to be that the 7800 will offer the most reasonable value of the new line.

Is it feasible that I could build this kind of system in a micro ATX case? Or am I realistically looking at ATX here?

 

[GarrettL]

Thanks for that information, logainofhades. That's a bit disappointing, although I suppose it's helpful in that in narrows the decision space for now. I don't really want to wait around til April, and the consensus seems to be that the 7800 will offer the most reasonable value of the new line.

Is it feasible that I could build this kind of system in a micro ATX case? Or am I realistically looking at ATX here?

As an owner of a PNY 4070 TI, you would need a huge micro ATX

The coolers on the 4070's are freakin' gargantuan. The case is an MSI 110R Gungnir that is a mid-tower case with the HDD bracket removed.

Spoiler: 4070TI It's Huge

https://imgur.com/Fbvm1TO

View: https://i.imgur.com/Fbvm1TO.jpg

 

[nerdvous]

Haha, noted Thanks for the answer!

 

[nerdvous]

So, I'm now looking for some NVMe M.2 storage. Was thinking about the Kingston KC3000, since it seems to have the Samsung 990 Pro beaten on price and possibly performance. The latter also recently had a reliability scare (albeit seemingly now resolved).

The question I have relates to heatsinks. Reading reviews, some of these SSDs seem to offer optional heatsinks. The motherboard I'm looking at already comes with heatsink provision for the m.2 slots, however. So I'm wondering, would the SSD heatsink therefore be redundant? Or is it possible (/beneficial) to have two heatsinks working in tandem on the same drive?

 

[GarrettL]

Just use the heatsinks supplied with the motherboard, will be fine.

You cant double stack them, will make sense when you go to assemble.

I have a Sabrent Rocket 4.0 and some WD Black 4.0 NVMe SSD's. I can't tell any difference between the two sitting at the keyboard for general use.

I'd be hestitant about Samsung too. Many good one's out there to choose from and many NVMe's have seen price drops recently as well.

You can also go online and see demo's of gaming and Window's on 3.0 NVMe vs 4.0 NVMe. There is little difference especially with load times.

 

[nerdvous]

All right, thanks again for the advice!

 

[logainofhades]

Crucial P5 plus is my go to drive, for a gen 4 NVME. I have 2 of them in my Intel rig, and eventually my AMD rig will have a P5 plus and a regular P5, if I ever get around to building inside my new case.

 

[Kona45primo]

Just wait for the 7000 series X3D chips to drop. Should be a couple of weeks. With a budget like yours it's a very real possibility you can afford an AM5 system. Assuming this will be a gaming system it should handily stomp Intel, and give you the option of incremental upgrades if you like.

Intel and AM4 are essentially end of life sockets at this point. DDR5 is coming down in price, AMD does scale well with 6000mhz low CL Memory, aka CL30 do you'll want to factor that in. Possibly consider air cooling for a longer potentially trouble free operating experience.

Only reason I push AM5 is both Intel and AMD are fighting hard and there should be real gains over the next few years. If history repeats itself AM5 should be a drop in with the 8000 & potentially 9000 series chips.

"LGA1851 Motherboards for Intel 14th Gen CPUs: No Upgrade Path for 12th/13th Gen Users. Continuing tradition, Intel will discard its LGA1700 platform in favor of the LGA1851 socket for the 14th Gen Core processors."

"AMD plans to support the new AM5 socket through 2025 and beyond"

 

[nerdvous]

Hello again, I'm looking at cases while I wait for the 70003D series reviews to come in. Whether they persuade me or not, I'm assuming my form factor is going to be a mid-sized tower to fit a standard ATX.

I'm conscious that there's a trade off to be made between noise suppression on the one hand and air flow and cooling on the other. Ideally I'm trying to get the best of both worlds, although value wise I notice this is another area where prices seem to have risen sharply. Most of the 'best buys' on this site are in the 100-200$ range, whereas the Fractal Design Core 1000 Series I bought back in 2014 only cost me £29!

Cases like the Phanteks P600S Eclipse and Fractal Design Define 7 sound great in the reviews, but I don't know whether that translates to anything like value for money. I do like my Fractal, it's quiet and it was easy to build in for an amateur like me. I'm not sure whether the 'front door' design is practical if modern components run hotter, which is why the Phanteks is attractive with its removable sound plate. But it's also possible that these cases are much too extravagant and don't justify their prices. I was also looking at the Fractal Meshify 2 Compact, the NZXT H7 Flow and the Corsair 4000D.

I'm looking for a practical and performant case; RGB, glass cases and other aesthetics aren't important to me.

Suggestions would be appreciated!

 

[GarrettL]

The NZXT Flow series is a good choice. I built in the older h510 model and they have a very nice layout for cable management. And it does not feel feel flimsy. Good cases.

Spoiler: NZXT h510 Build

https://imgur.com/GR8NS4v

View: https://i.imgur.com/GR8NS4v.jpg

 

[logainofhades]

Fractal design pop air, and the lian-li lancool 216 are also excellent cases.

 

[helper800]

I would do something like this. The 7900X3D is coming out February 26th, correct me if I am wrong;

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU Cooler: Lian Li Galahad AIO360 (2022) 69.17 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (£149.99 @ Box Limited)
Motherboard: Gigabyte B650M GAMING X AX Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard (£189.36 @ Box Limited)
Memory: Patriot Viper RGB 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL36 Memory (£159.99 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (£69.98 @ Scan.co.uk)
Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (£139.98 @ Ebuyer)
Video Card: Inno3D X3 OC GeForce RTX 4070 Ti 12 GB Video Card (£845.56 @ NeoComputers)
Case: Fractal Design Pop XL Air ATX Full Tower Case (£109.99 @ Amazon UK)
Power Supply: SeaSonic PRIME TX-850 850 W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply (£272.94 @ Overclockers.co.uk)
Custom: 7900X3D (£549.99)
Total: £2487.78
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-02-21 20:11 GMT+0000

 

[logainofhades]

The 7900x3d and 3950x3d are feb 28, and I the 7800x3d is April 6.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/18737/amds-ryzen-7000x3d-chips-releasing-february-28th-and-april-6th

 

[GarrettL]

If you can't wait until the x3d release there is nothing wrong with the 7700x whatsoever. The x3d cpu's will still be there in the future. The 7700x and the 4070 TI/7900XT are a solid combination at 1440p.

So many people get hung up on what cpu can churn out the highest 1080p frame rates. Yes, a good IPC test but you also need a very high end monitor to display these very high framerates.

If your moitor can't refresh fast enough, what's the point of excessively high FPS?

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cF8GNwaa-Ho

 

[nerdvous]

Thanks for the suggestions, guys. And for the full spec suggestion, helper800, that's definitely given me something to chew over.

You're right GarretL about the monitor being a potential bottleneck for frames. I actually am in the market for a new monitor as well, and have been thinking about 240hz for this very reason 😆 The Samsung 27" G7 Odyssey looks like pretty decent value at around £480. The question is whether I'll be able to get on with that curve...

 

[GarrettL]

The G7 is a solid choice and with the G9 now out that price cut makes the G7 a much better deal.

I picked up an open box Asus ROG PG279Q several years ago. They were over $600 new and i thought that was just totally and absolutely insane. Who on earth would pay that much for a silly old monitor right?

That was the one of the best purchases I've made for pc gaming. The motion is so fluid through low and high FPS with rich and vibrant colors.

 

[nerdvous]

It's encouraging that you mention the PG279Q, because the PG279QM is the flat panel alternative to the G7 I've scoped out if I can't adjust to the curve. I like everything about it except the price!