[SOLVED] Parts list critique

Phaaze88

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Would it be correct to buy one ssd just for my OS and then buy a 1TB ssd for other things, probably games, and then buy another 1 TB hdd for other things?
Yes.

Is there a reason you say that? I’m probably a lot more inexperienced than you but according to my research (on versus.com) the KF version has a higher performance benchmark than the 12700 and the F, so I was just wondering why you’re saying not to buy the K version.
1)Performance benchmark: that's some margin of error stuff right there. None of us would notice that difference if we were observing the 2 cpus in different systems, side by side...
2)Fps counters are poison. Take that away, and the difference between the 2 chips' performance is gone - heck, probably the same on a bad day.
3)For whom do the E-cores toll? While the big-little design is interesting, who's the target of it? Majority of Intel cpus were already power efficient before E-cores came around in the first place... and P-cores can be tuned to enhance this further.
Gaming-focused PCs don't need E-cores; they're too slow. The 100mhz difference between the K and non-K's P-cores is nothing compared to how worthless E-cores are for gaming.

4)Overclocking is dead gated off with 12th gen to liquid nitrogen. Intel really maxed these cpus out of the factory. The cpus' frequencies also scale with the number of active cores; depending on the game, all core OCs can perform WORSE... and even when they are beneficial, it's not noticeable without one of those poisonous fps counters.
Then, with the matter of LGA 1700 socket warping over time and increasing core temperatures, OCing becomes even less viable. [This doesn't hamper i7s and below much; they will be fine. The one hurt most by this are the i9s.]
Maybe 13th gen will make OCing more viable to newbies and casual users again? I don't know.

Conclusion: For the price premium of the K-cpu, all I see are reasons to avoid it(for games).


B-series motherboards have more robust VRMs and VRM cooling this time around, and they also support XMP. Many Z-boards are overkill.
As I said earlier, the money sunk into a K-cpu and Z-board can go elsewhere to something more worthwhile, or you can save it for later.
 
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Why_Me

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https://pcpartpicker.com/list/Cf4Jwc
Does this work for you? I used the BB option thing.
That particular case you've chosen has poor airflow as in it's a hotbox. You want a case with a mesh front panel ... especially for a gaming build. This cpu down below uses less power and creates less heat yet goes toe to toe with the 12700K.

https://www.newegg.com/white-phanteks-eclipse-p360a-atx-mid-tower/p/N82E16811854104
Phanteks Eclipse P360A Case $89.99 - $69.99 after $20.00 rebate

https://phanteks.com/Eclipse-P360A.html

Rear exhaust fan for that case so it doesn't become a hotbox.

https://www.amazon.com/Arctic-P12-White-Transparent-Pressure-optimised/dp/B07GJG285F/
ARCTIC P12 PWM 120mm 4-Pin Case Fan $9.99

https://www.newegg.com/corsair-rm-series-rm750-750w/p/N82E16817139277
CORSAIR RM750 750W 80+ GOLD Modular Power Supply $114.99 Save: $15.00 (11%) $94.99 after $20.00 rebate card

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1687328-REG/msi_mag_b660m_mortar_wifi.html
MSI MAG B660M MORTAR WIFI DDR5 $159.99

https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/MAG-B660M-MORTAR-WIFI

https://www.amazon.com/Intel-i7-12700F-2-1GHz-6xxChipset-BX8071512700F/dp/B09NPJDPVG/
Intel Core i7-12700F $312.96

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/134592/intel-core-i712700f-processor-25m-cache-up-to-4-90-ghz.html

https://www.amazon.com/Rev-B-Cooler-LGA1700-LGA1151-Towers/dp/B09NZGH4RD/
Scythe Fuma 2 Rev.B CPU Cooler $65.99

https://hardwarecanucks.com/forum/threads/scythe-fuma-2-rev-b-review-the-best-cpu-cooler-got-cooler.84709/

https://www.scytheus.com/fuma2-rev-b

https://www.newegg.com/kingston-32gb-288-pin-ddr5-sdram/p/N82E16820242652
Kingston FURY Beast DDR5 4800 32GB (2x16GB) CL40 $185.38 Save: $46.81 (20%)

https://www.amazon.com/PNY-CS1030-Internal-Solid-State/dp/B08M446772/
PNY CS1030 2TB M.2 NVMe PCIe Gen3 x4 Internal SSD $164.99

Total: $1104.28 *not including rebates

i7 12700 / 12700F gaming benchmarks.

 
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Phaaze88

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https://pcpartpicker.com/list/Cf4Jwc
Does this work for you? I used the BB option thing.
Yes, it the link works. My 2 cents:
1)Skip Msi MAG and MPG Coreliquids. Too risky. A recall was started a few months ago, stating MAG Coreliquid R models were affected by contaminated coolant, but that's not entirely true; both MAG and MPG have the same OEM, which has had dirty coolant issues with other AIOs they assembled.

2)K-cpus and Z-boards got next to nothing going for 'em this time around - Intel did it to themselves. 12700 + B600 series board, and allocate the difference elsewhere, or just save it.

3)More of a heads-up than anything with the H510 chassis: the higher system power consumption is, the harder managing thermals will be in it. Both intake and exhaust are limited, so there's a limit to how much power you can cram into it.

4)500GB OS only drive, and a 1-2TB for the other stuff.
 
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Yes, it the link works. My 2 cents:
1)Skip Msi MAG and MPG Coreliquids. Too risky. A recall was started a few months ago, stating MAG Coreliquid R models were affected by contaminated coolant, but that's not entirely true; both MAG and MPG have the same OEM, which has had dirty coolant issues with other AIOs they assembled.

2)K-cpus and Z-boards got next to nothing going for 'em this time around - Intel did it to themselves. 12700 + B600 series board, and allocate the difference elsewhere, or just save it.

3)More of a heads-up than anything with the H510 chassis: the higher system power consumption is, the harder managing thermals will be in it. Both intake and exhaust are limited, so there's a limit to how much power you can cram into it.

4)500GB OS only drive, and a 1-2TB for the other stuff.
So you are suggesting using a 12700 processor over the 12700KF and using a B600 motherboard over the z690 correct?
 
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Would it be correct to buy one ssd just for my OS and then buy a 1TB ssd for other things, probably games, and then buy another 1 TB hdd for other things? I also had an external 500 GB hdd storage thing I recently bought for my old pc that I
Yes. It doesn't have to be the 12700 - the 12700F would be ok too. The K model is a pass though.
Is there a reason you say that? I’m probably a lot more inexperienced than you but according to my research (on versus.com) the KF version has a higher performance benchmark than the 12700 and the F, so I was just wondering why you’re saying not to buy the K version. Thank you for your help!
 

MJS WARLORD

Honorable
Any reputable pc build site should let you choose your parts and at the end of the process alert you to mismatches or overkill or even parts that wont fit in your case.
On the site i went on it said top fans too big to fit and choose 650 psu instead of 800
 
Here's how I would do it...

PCPartPicker Part List

Type|Item|Price
:----|:----|:----
CPU | Intel Core i7-12700 2.1 GHz 12-Core Processor | $342.98 @ B&H
CPU Cooler | Thermalright Peerless Assassin 120 66.17 CFM CPU Cooler | $41.30 @ Amazon
Motherboard | MSI MAG B660M MORTAR WIFI DDR4 Micro ATX LGA1700 Motherboard | $159.04 @ Walmart
Memory | Team T-Create Expert 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3600 CL18 Memory | $99.99 @ Amazon
Storage | ADATA XPG GAMMIX S70 Blade 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive | $119.99 @ Amazon
Case | Phanteks Eclipse P360A ATX Mid Tower Case | $69.99 @ Newegg
Power Supply | Corsair RMx (2018) 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply | $114.99 @ Amazon
| Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts |
| Total (before mail-in rebates) | $968.28
| Mail-in rebates | -$20.00
| Total | $948.28
| Generated by PCPartPicker 2022-06-03 05:55 EDT-0400 |
 
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Here's how I would do it...

PCPartPicker Part List

Type|Item|Price
:----|:----|:----
CPU | Intel Core i7-12700 2.1 GHz 12-Core Processor | $342.98 @ B&H
CPU Cooler | Thermalright Peerless Assassin 120 66.17 CFM CPU Cooler | $41.30 @ Amazon
Motherboard | MSI MAG B660M MORTAR WIFI DDR4 Micro ATX LGA1700 Motherboard | $159.04 @ Walmart
Memory | Team T-Create Expert 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4-3600 CL18 Memory | $99.99 @ Amazon
Storage | ADATA XPG GAMMIX S70 Blade 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive | $119.99 @ Amazon
Case | Phanteks Eclipse P360A ATX Mid Tower Case | $69.99 @ Newegg
Power Supply | Corsair RMx (2018) 750 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply | $114.99 @ Amazon
| Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts |
| Total (before mail-in rebates) | $968.28
| Mail-in rebates | -$20.00
| Total | $948.28
| Generated by PCPartPicker 2022-06-03 05:55 EDT-0400 |
Ok thanks so much for your input. On your list the website says “[the fan] may require a separately available mounting adapter to fit [the motherboard]”. Does that mean I NEED to buy an adapter to go with the fan or that it is just a possibility that i’ll need an adapter?
 

Phaaze88

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Ambassador
Would it be correct to buy one ssd just for my OS and then buy a 1TB ssd for other things, probably games, and then buy another 1 TB hdd for other things?
Yes.

Is there a reason you say that? I’m probably a lot more inexperienced than you but according to my research (on versus.com) the KF version has a higher performance benchmark than the 12700 and the F, so I was just wondering why you’re saying not to buy the K version.
1)Performance benchmark: that's some margin of error stuff right there. None of us would notice that difference if we were observing the 2 cpus in different systems, side by side...
2)Fps counters are poison. Take that away, and the difference between the 2 chips' performance is gone - heck, probably the same on a bad day.
3)For whom do the E-cores toll? While the big-little design is interesting, who's the target of it? Majority of Intel cpus were already power efficient before E-cores came around in the first place... and P-cores can be tuned to enhance this further.
Gaming-focused PCs don't need E-cores; they're too slow. The 100mhz difference between the K and non-K's P-cores is nothing compared to how worthless E-cores are for gaming.

4)Overclocking is dead gated off with 12th gen to liquid nitrogen. Intel really maxed these cpus out of the factory. The cpus' frequencies also scale with the number of active cores; depending on the game, all core OCs can perform WORSE... and even when they are beneficial, it's not noticeable without one of those poisonous fps counters.
Then, with the matter of LGA 1700 socket warping over time and increasing core temperatures, OCing becomes even less viable. [This doesn't hamper i7s and below much; they will be fine. The one hurt most by this are the i9s.]
Maybe 13th gen will make OCing more viable to newbies and casual users again? I don't know.

Conclusion: For the price premium of the K-cpu, all I see are reasons to avoid it(for games).


B-series motherboards have more robust VRMs and VRM cooling this time around, and they also support XMP. Many Z-boards are overkill.
As I said earlier, the money sunk into a K-cpu and Z-board can go elsewhere to something more worthwhile, or you can save it for later.
 
Reactions: Why_Me and husky33
Jun 2, 2022
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Yes.


1)Performance benchmark: that's some margin of error stuff right there. None of us would notice that difference if we were observing the 2 cpus in different systems, side by side...
2)Fps counters are poison. Take that away, and the difference between the 2 chips' performance is gone - heck, probably the same on a bad day.
3)For whom do the E-cores toll? While the big-little design is interesting, who's the target of it? Majority of Intel cpus were already power efficient before E-cores came around in the first place... and P-cores can be tuned to enhance this further.
Gaming-focused PCs don't need E-cores; they're too slow. The 100mhz difference between the K and non-K's P-cores is nothing compared to how worthless E-cores are for gaming.

4)Overclocking is dead gated off with 12th gen to liquid nitrogen. Intel really maxed these cpus out of the factory. The cpus' frequencies also scale with the number of active cores; depending on the game, all core OCs can perform WORSE... and even when they are beneficial, it's not noticeable without one of those poisonous fps counters.
Then, with the matter of LGA 1700 socket warping over time and increasing core temperatures, OCing becomes even less viable. [This doesn't hamper i7s and below much; they will be fine. The one hurt most by this are the i9s.]
Maybe 13th gen will make OCing more viable to newbies and casual users again? I don't know.

Conclusion: For the price premium of the K-cpu, all I see are reasons to avoid it(for games).


B-series motherboards have more robust VRMs and VRM cooling this time around, and they also support XMP. Many Z-boards are overkill.
As I said earlier, the money sunk into a K-cpu and Z-board can go elsewhere to something more worthwhile, or you can save it for later.
Ok, thank you so much that explanation was very straight forward and made sense! I would also venture to say that based off your recommendation to use a B board over the Z board, that DDR5 is too “new” to get into as someone who is just starting with pc building especially on a small budget? Thanks again for the help!
 

Phaaze88

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DDR5 is too new. It will get better later - they all do. You might regret it if you don't do it now, so it depends on your upgrade cycles.
I've been on X299 since the middle of 2017... next platform upgrade I do, I'm going to be using DDR5 and rolling with that for 5 years or so... then R6 may be out, and I switch to that, etc.
 
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Ok thanks so much for your input. On your list the website says “[the fan] may require a separately available mounting adapter to fit [the motherboard]”. Does that mean I NEED to buy an adapter to go with the fan or that it is just a possibility that i’ll need an adapter?
Thing is, Alder Lake is stil relatively new, so only newer batches of compatible fans will have LGA 1700 bracket included. If you happen to get a relatively older unit, you might have to fetch it separately from them. I couldn't find the LGA 1700 support information on the manufacturers product page for the Thermaltake fan. You can go for this one instead.

PCPartPicker Part List

Type|Item|Price
:----|:----|:----
CPU Cooler | Deepcool AK620 68.99 CFM CPU Cooler | $64.98 @ Amazon
| Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts |
| Total | $64.98
| Generated by PCPartPicker 2022-06-03 14:21 EDT-0400 |

Its a very good fan recently released, says LGA 1700 supported on the product page, and should have the bracket included. You can also confirm with their customer support team, in each case.
 
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DDR5 is too new. It will get better later - they all do. You might regret it if you don't do it now, so it depends on your upgrade cycles.
I've been on X299 since the middle of 2017... next platform upgrade I do, I'm going to be using DDR5 and rolling with that for 5 years or so... then R6 may be out, and I switch to that, etc.
So hypothetically if I bought a Z board with DDR5 compatibility right now with a low end DDR5 RAM with 4800 MHz and then bought new DDR5 RAM at some point in 2023 when the technology is better is that a good idea, or is it just up to my upgrade cycle like you said?

I’m having trouble deciding whether to go with DDR4 right now and then getting a new motherboard and RAM once DDR5 advances or just getting into DDR5 now.

I would assume better motherboards would be out when DDR5 is better at some point in 2023, correct? Or would a Z board still be a good option in the future or is it not really known as it is new technology? Also could I reuse my 12700 processor in the future if I decide change motherboards? I’m sorry if these are obvious questions but I’m just getting into PC building.
 

Why_Me

Champion
Ok thanks so much for your input. On your list the website says “[the fan] may require a separately available mounting adapter to fit [the motherboard]”. Does that mean I NEED to buy an adapter to go with the fan or that it is just a possibility that i’ll need an adapter?
The Scythe Fuma 2 RevB cpu cooler I posted came out post Alder Lake and comes with the LGA1700 mounting kit in the box. Not only that but it fits that case I posted which allows cpu coolers up to 160mm and that Scythe is 155mm.

Would it be correct to buy one ssd just for my OS and then buy a 1TB ssd for other things, probably games, and then buy another 1 TB hdd for other things? I also had an external 500 GB hdd storage thing I recently bought for my old pc that I

Is there a reason you say that? I’m probably a lot more inexperienced than you but according to my research (on versus.com) the KF version has a higher performance benchmark than the 12700 and the F, so I was just wondering why you’re saying not to buy the K version. Thank you for your help!
If you want to run dual M.2 SSD's then you want a Z690 board due to the bandwidth restraints on the B660 boards. With that said full installs are becoming less and less of a thing these days. if you load your OS, games, and apps on the 2TB M.2 SSD you can put your documents, pics, vids, etc .. on a storage SSD such as this one down below. Add that to the build I posted earlier in this thread and it brings the total price of that build to $1173.27

https://www.newegg.com/team-group-1tb-cx2/p/N82E16820331561
Team Group CX2 2.5" 1TB SATA III 3D NAND Internal SSD $68.99 Save: $20.00 (22%)
 
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Phaaze88

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So hypothetically if I bought a Z board with DDR5 compatibility right now with a low end DDR5 RAM with 4800 MHz and then bought new DDR5 RAM at some point in 2023 when the technology is better is that a good idea, or is it just up to my upgrade cycle like you said?
Up to your upgrade cycle. For me, buying it twice like that is a waste - if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Most of the old stuff turns into hand-me-downs.
Some people upgrade every year - they just sell off the old equipment to recoup the cost of the new stuff.

Hmm... slight correction. Personal upgrade cycles and priorities.


I would assume better motherboards would be out...
Better, in what way?
The current motherboards should be getting bios support for at least 3 years. Those updates come with compatibility updates, microcode updates, improved voltage curves*, etc.
My X299 Prime Deluxe launched in July-August(?), 2017, and the latest bios update was in November of 2021. [This one breaks OCs, forcing re-tuning and retesting. Found that out the hard way.]

The power delivery and cooling on 12th gen B-series, save for the really cheap ones, is already good. They add more than necessary on the most expensive B and Z boards so they can up-charge ya, and you get nothing extra out of it.

Kits with faster speeds and tighter timings will come out, but some users will be stopped by cpu silicon quality - another caveat of early adoption. Refined models of the same cpus will come out later, and these models with have Internal Memory Controllers that will handle those higher ram frequencies.


Also could I reuse my 12700 processor in the future if I decide change motherboards?
Sure, if it's still socket LGA 1700. There are some oddball region-specific boards I've seen, that only support a single gen.
Colorful's iGame Z490 Vulcan X V20 is one such example. It supports 10th gen, but not 11th. ??? Yet, the more popular brands support both, no problem.
 
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