Radeon 3850 AGP Plus Single-Core CPU

[Guest]

We test Powercolor’s AGP card and a single core AMD CPU. Will the performance justify the combination or will the single-core CPU cause a serious bottleneck?

Radeon 3850 AGP Plus Single-Core CPU : Read more

 

[nofxman]

This is the best article I have read lately, I installed AOC on an old desktop with a 2.8 P4 and vanilla 6600 and it ran like crap. I was debating purchasing a 3850 from Newegg until I saw how much the cpu holds it back so I just saved $80 buying a 2600pro instead.

 

[slapdashzero]

Excellent article. I love these "real world application" reads. I've got a garage full of older single core machines, and now I know that there are still useable things to be done with them.

 

[xx12amanxx]

Man i remember when my old 3000+ was considered fast..lol. But we already knew an older single core 64 would be a bottleneck.The real question is if a newer dual core will suffice? The computer i built for my mom has the older 3800+ dual in it and i paired it with a 7600gt. It played all games at that time great! She actually still uses it!

 

[Guest]

You could overclock the 3850 card by using the bios and over clocking a cpu should of been no problem for you "old pros" I think you are not telling the whole story. AGP is alive and well and is good for most people..

 

[Preytor]

Nice to see such a great article done on AGP.
AGP isn't dead yet. I still use a 7600GS 512MB on P4 @ 3.6Ghz, it's just fine for most games, and will play anything with the "right settings".

 

[Jakt]

Last week, I installed an AGP 2600xt in my Athlon 3000+ htpc, to replace an ATI 9600 AIW card that died. There was a very noticeable improvement in the picture quality on my television (Thanks, Avivo!), but there wasn't a large enough improvement in decoding HD to make it playable. I am still playing with the drivers to see if there is anything I can do to improve it, as theoretically it should be doable. The big problem that I have run into is that ATI has dumped support for this card on the AGP platform. I had specifically chosen ATI because it has superior support for dual monitors on an HTPC setup, but the lack of support is very discouraging.

 

[cleeve]

[citation][nom]anonymous.[/nom]You could overclock the 3850 card by using the bios and over clocking a cpu should of been no problem for you "old pros" I think you are not telling the whole story. AGP is alive and well and is good for most people. [/citation]

What part of the story are we not telling?
Look at the system specs, we had to use 3 types of old DDR RAM to get to 2GB, some of it was very cheap - not even 400 MHz stuff. It doesn't matter how much of a pro I am, you can't squeeze more performance out by raising the CPU clock and lowering the memory clock into the basement to get it to work.

I managed to scrounge up some better stuff for part 2, and it looks like we'll be using XP instead of Vista which will open up some videocard overclocking options. So hold on there sport, overclocking is on the way.

 

[cleeve]

[citation][nom]anonymous.[/nom]You could overclock the 3850 card by using the bios and over clocking a cpu should of been no problem for you "old pros" I think you are not telling the whole story. AGP is alive and well and is good for most people. [/citation]

What part of the story are we not telling?
Look at the system specs, we had to use 3 types of old DDR RAM to get to 2GB, some of it was very cheap - not even 400 MHz stuff. It doesn't matter how much of a pro I am, you can't squeeze more performance out by raising the CPU clock and lowering the memory clock into the basement to get it to work.

I managed to scrounge up some better stuff for part 2, and it looks like we'll be using XP instead of Vista which will open up some videocard overclocking options. So hold on there sport, overclocking is on the way.

 

[Guest]

Great article

shame that you ran the memory in single channel mode though.

 

[Mach5Motorsport]

Congrats to Tom's Hardware for again demonstrating that AGP is still a decent interface. I'm sure all the collective PCIe ubergeeks will be again shouting how AGP is dead..... much to their dismay. AGP has now outlived PCIe standard 1.0!

 

[geotech]

My main rig is a X23800 @3.5GHz and a 3850. Its runs flawlessly, all sorce games maxed, cod4, and crysis at medium 40fps. I'm dualing 2 19" @ 1440x900

 

[wild9]

[citation][nom]xX12amanXx[/nom]Man i remember when my old 3000+ was considered fast..lol. But we already knew an older single core 64 would be a bottleneck.The real question is if a newer dual core will suffice? The computer i built for my mom has the older 3800+ dual in it and i paired it with a 7600gt. It played all games at that time great! She actually still uses it![/citation]

The 3800+ x2 S939 is also a good overclocker. Even if the board doesn't offer OC features in the bios, you can compromise by using some Windows-based tools.

 

[wild9]

Even with poor memory, that CPU should be able to produce a nice overclock. Maybe under-clock the RAM in the BIOS and over-clock the FSB in Windows.

To really ramp the memory speed you could always run the system in single-channel mode, using that Patriot stick offering CL 2.0; that looks like a very nice bit of memory.

For the record, I run a S939 retail Venice 3200+ (2.0GHz), at 2.5 on stock and can hit 2.7 with a bit more Vcore. I use Clockgen and CrystalCPUID to get many options not available in the BIOS (Abit NF-95). Works like a charm. With good cooling you can really ramp the Venice core right up.

 

[Kohlhagen]

I would like to see Crossfire on the old 939 system..

using dual 3870, a 2.8ghz dual core, and 2GB 2-2-3-5 1T ram.

I would send you my rig if you needed any of the above..

 

[Barzenak]

I have a x1950 500 meg card on my old p4 3.2 ee processor so I think there is not enough boost for the buck in agp. I will wait to replace my system and run what I can with what I have. So far I can compete ok as long as I stay clear of Crysis etc. I have enough other games to beat anyhow so no major loss with that tech demo basically.

 

[bobafett4ever]

Great review. It's nice to see you aren't overlooking a lot of us who have AGP and still want to make the most of it.
I, for one, so not feel the need to go drop $1000+ on a new rig, although I do want good performance from what I have - which is an Atholon 64 4200+ on my socket 939 mobo (MSI Neo2) with a 3850AGP and 2 gig of PC3200 on XP Pro. People always say it's so old and outdated, but I feel it does the job well and am always looking for ideas to get every ounce out of it possible. I mostly play LotRO and swith
Thanks for the great article and I look forward to part II with the dual cores.

 

[Reynod]

Jeez Don ... do you reviewers just trawl through our forum threads and pickup on our ideas or what ??

heh heh.

We have been tossing around advice to this end in a few threads lately.

Good to see your on the ball !!

Well done.

 

[Guest]

My Computer 3400+ 64 2 gigs ddr and lol 8800gts 512 stock motherboard new power supply can only over clock my prosser to 2.445 clockgen- only

22" acer screen 1680x1050 run all games fine crysis demo 27fps avg whith high but sound on low object on med. when i found clock gen and over clocked it the cpu by %10 it gave me 7 more fps on avg, and all other newer games over 50 fps and much higher

 

[hackerspunk]

i still don't know how much power that atom need

 

[velocityg4]

This is quite interesting. I was considering upgrading my Athlon 64 3000+ SSE2 from the current X800XT to a 2600XT or 3850 for HDCP and DX10 but I guess the CPU is too much of a bottleneck now. And the SSE2 makes my old gaming rig a poor Hackintosh.

Guess it's time to save for a Quad Core Intel and an 8800GT OC'ed. For great Windows gaming and OS X as a hackintosh plus HDCP compliance.

 

[szilu2002]

it's good to see that thre are so manu people on agp and i thought there aren't many my old rig is a P4 prescott 2.8(@3.08Ghz fsb at 880) 1.5 gb ram frankenstein(pqi 2X256 400 mhz and 2X512 kingstone value ram overclocked at 440 with 2.5 4 4 7 in dual chanel mode) the mobo is an old(p5p800) with an 2800PRO agp(gpu at 680 memory at1320(660MHz) 512mb vram),sound blaster audigy bulk and i was able to squeze out in 3dmark06 3500points and 34fps in crysis(al det med low(phisics -objects,postprocessing low)@1024X768) and if i raised the cpu it would go better so i think the main problem on Agp is actually the cpu as u demonstrated that but i'm looking forword to see the imapct of a dual core

 

[jestersage]

Asrock still sells the 4CoreDual-SATA2 motherboard - c2d support, AGP8X and PCIE-16x slot with 4x lanes, dual channel DDR and DDR2 support as well. It ran my e4300 well with an AGP 6600GT and a PCIE 7900GT (separately, although I've read a couple of articles showing how you could SLI 2 7600GSs on it). The board supports processors from the Netburst Celerons thru Pentium Ds up to C2Quads (1066mhz fsb only). It should be a good platform for showing how CPUs bottleneck the new 3850 AGP.

 

[sycomonkey]

The best way I have found to overclock ATI AGP cards on modern-ish mobos is RivaTuner. You have to do a registry hack to use RivaTuner in Vista64, however, because it uses an unsigned driver. It works, though. Really well, actually, I overclock my AGP X1650 from 500mhz to 600mhz no problem. No amount of overclock will help that card's shader performance, however. It has 12 of one type and 8 of another. Not unified. And only 256mb of DDR2. My current plan is to upgrade to a PCIe board and get a nVidia 9600gt. That should really help, I think. Not so much from the bus bandwidth as the shaders and video ram and general architectural improvements.

 

[San Pedro]

Would like to see a 4000+ with one of these too.