jonathan_rg
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- Mar 19, 2011
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cybrcatter
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- Jul 28, 2008
- 146
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- 18,680
[citation][nom]IndignantSkeptic[/nom]I'm going to switch support to Crytek; they seem more honest about wanting to push technology forward.[/citation]
I lost.
I lost.
I dont even know what this game is about, but if its an always online load of crap, you bet it will be getting top seed priority for me
[citation][nom]dheadley[/nom]PC gamers have as a whole done this to themselves. I know there are a lot of people that actually buy games and never pirate them. I myself have a steam account with over 300 games on it and my son has an account with over 100 of the same games even though he could use mine, but he is getting ready to graduate hs and move on to college. But I also know we are the exception and not the rule. I have had friends that have pirated games since the days of DOS and BBS's and my sons friends constantly tell him to torrent one game or another. In the near future I would expect that all media, be it games, music, movies etc. will be streamed in at time of use or require a connection to run. It really is the only way that any of these industries can recover even a fraction of their earned compensation. You wouldn't expect a plumber or electrician to go to travel around to a million homes doing work and only get paid at 25% of them or even 50% of them. Yet all you have to do is read any message board for gamers and you will see that they truely believe that game publishers and developers should be happy with that same 25% and they made their money on the game etc. The truth is they are thieves same as the punk addict that robs the corner gas station.[/citation]
[citation][nom]kinggraves[/nom]Reality is that you will not get a AAA title on a B level budget. If you want the best possible graphics and AI, that's going to take a large team. The days when you could make a top tier game on a team of 10 people are gone. This is where the consumer has set the bar for the industry. If on the other hand you're satisfied with graphics 3 generations old and gameplay as complicated as Tetris, feel free to stick to mobile and free games and pay less. Do not however pirate high cost games and try to justify it as "it costs too much". Stick with your cost range and play in the trash. You don't get to eat steak on a hamburger budget.At the same time though, DRM does not screw with thieves and is not the way to prevent piracy. Pirates get around DRM and legit players are forced to pirate to get past the restriction. This is not the way to solve the problem.Alright, here's the thing about that. PC games were easily pirated without any modding practically from the start. It has always been a problem for PC gaming. It has only recently become an issue for console gaming. The original method of console piracy was emulation, which required a PC to begin with. Mods also allowed piracy, but didn't become useful until systems started using common media. Even then a hard mod can be complicated or costly for the average console user. The piracy scene is a threat to console games now, but it has always been a threat to PC gaming.Oh, right. This article isn't really about piracy. Yeah, online only isn't good for the player. It's a reduction of possibilities. If you want to have a Co Op focused game, great. But don't FORCE the player to play a Co Op game. Games should have options to allow the player to play how they want. Online only tells your consumer base that people who want LAN, don't have a good connection, or simply prefer to play without other people are not welcome to your game. Online only reduces the audience for your product, which is foolish marketing.Honestly though, gamers only have themselves to thank for this. D3 sold well, so that translates to corporate types that online only and RMAH were great ideas. They only think in sales figures and statistics. If gamers want this to stop, they have to STOP buying into these games. If people don't buy it, they won't sell it.[/citation]
What about Mojang.......? They made a REALLY good game WITHOUT even a medium budget.. Now hes a millionair & the game also doesn't cost very much. TAKE NOTE!
[citation][nom]kinggraves[/nom]Reality is that you will not get a AAA title on a B level budget. If you want the best possible graphics and AI, that's going to take a large team. The days when you could make a top tier game on a team of 10 people are gone. This is where the consumer has set the bar for the industry. If on the other hand you're satisfied with graphics 3 generations old and gameplay as complicated as Tetris, feel free to stick to mobile and free games and pay less. Do not however pirate high cost games and try to justify it as "it costs too much". Stick with your cost range and play in the trash. You don't get to eat steak on a hamburger budget.At the same time though, DRM does not screw with thieves and is not the way to prevent piracy. Pirates get around DRM and legit players are forced to pirate to get past the restriction. This is not the way to solve the problem.Alright, here's the thing about that. PC games were easily pirated without any modding practically from the start. It has always been a problem for PC gaming. It has only recently become an issue for console gaming. The original method of console piracy was emulation, which required a PC to begin with. Mods also allowed piracy, but didn't become useful until systems started using common media. Even then a hard mod can be complicated or costly for the average console user. The piracy scene is a threat to console games now, but it has always been a threat to PC gaming.Oh, right. This article isn't really about piracy. Yeah, online only isn't good for the player. It's a reduction of possibilities. If you want to have a Co Op focused game, great. But don't FORCE the player to play a Co Op game. Games should have options to allow the player to play how they want. Online only tells your consumer base that people who want LAN, don't have a good connection, or simply prefer to play without other people are not welcome to your game. Online only reduces the audience for your product, which is foolish marketing.Honestly though, gamers only have themselves to thank for this. D3 sold well, so that translates to corporate types that online only and RMAH were great ideas. They only think in sales figures and statistics. If gamers want this to stop, they have to STOP buying into these games. If people don't buy it, they won't sell it.[/citation]
What about Mojang.......? They made a REALLY good game WITHOUT even a medium budget.. Now hes a millionair & the game also doesn't cost very much. TAKE NOTE!
alextheblue
Distinguished
- Apr 3, 2001
- 3,078
- 106
- 20,970
I didn't like it with Diablo III, since sometimes I like to solo offline. But the upshot in Diablo III was that I could solo and then take that same character, with access to the shared chest, online. So if I changed my mind and wanted a "solo" character to play with others, it was no problem. Regardless, a seperate offline-only mode would have been nice. But for Fortnite? I can't ever see playing this game solo! So I don't get why people are so butthurt over this. It's a cooperative game. It would be like whining that you have to be online to play on your favorite Team Fortress server.
The only issue would be for LAN play, but even then most of the time you're connected via broadband. Even then, I go to LANs less and less often as time goes by. We have all the tools now to make an online meetup almost as good, and with a lot less work and travel involved. Even at LANs we typically used the broadband internet to play certain games.[citation][nom]john_4[/nom]Well your Team Fortress wannabe is now off my list Epic.[/citation]Other than art style, how is this game like TF, again?
The only issue would be for LAN play, but even then most of the time you're connected via broadband. Even then, I go to LANs less and less often as time goes by. We have all the tools now to make an online meetup almost as good, and with a lot less work and travel involved. Even at LANs we typically used the broadband internet to play certain games.[citation][nom]john_4[/nom]Well your Team Fortress wannabe is now off my list Epic.[/citation]Other than art style, how is this game like TF, again?
alextheblue
Distinguished
- Apr 3, 2001
- 3,078
- 106
- 20,970
[citation][nom]badhomaks[/nom]Always-online required? I'll sure be looking forward to pirate this. Not getting any money from me if this happens.[/citation]So what, you were really looking forward to playing this multiplayer coop game offline by yourself? Since you don't have internet access, right? You were gonna pirate it anyway. Now you're just feeling smug because it is justified in your mind. I prefer honest pirates.
[citation][nom]IndignantSkeptic[/nom]I don't really care what Epic do. I won't be playing this game. We've been complaining so long about PC games being held back by PS360 hardware tech level and what do Epic do in response to that? well they apparently make a game that is instead held back by tablet hardware tech. On top of that they basically say that that is our beloved Unreal Engine 4 for us. Well screw you back Epic then. I'm going to switch support to Crytek; they seem more honest about wanting to push technology forward.[/citation]
you do understand that with tessellation, and a good enough engine, a game could be made that would play on tablet level hardware, but scale up to the point where even a high end computer could be brought to its knees... right?
i honestly believe that is the way to go, give the high end the game they want, and allow the game to be scaled back slowly for those with lesser hardware. this is something that crysis was horrible at, to the point where i cant even see the low setting as ever having anything to do with the ultra.
[citation][nom]kinggraves[/nom]Reality is that you will not get a AAA title on a B level budget. If you want the best possible graphics and AI, that's going to take a large team. The days when you could make a top tier game on a team of 10 people are gone. This is where the consumer has set the bar for the industry. If on the other hand you're satisfied with graphics 3 generations old and gameplay as complicated as Tetris, feel free to stick to mobile and free games and pay less. Do not however pirate high cost games and try to justify it as "it costs too much". Stick with your cost range and play in the trash. You don't get to eat steak on a hamburger budget.At the same time though, DRM does not screw with thieves and is not the way to prevent piracy. Pirates get around DRM and legit players are forced to pirate to get past the restriction. This is not the way to solve the problem.Alright, here's the thing about that. PC games were easily pirated without any modding practically from the start. It has always been a problem for PC gaming. It has only recently become an issue for console gaming. The original method of console piracy was emulation, which required a PC to begin with. Mods also allowed piracy, but didn't become useful until systems started using common media. Even then a hard mod can be complicated or costly for the average console user. The piracy scene is a threat to console games now, but it has always been a threat to PC gaming.Oh, right. This article isn't really about piracy. Yeah, online only isn't good for the player. It's a reduction of possibilities. If you want to have a Co Op focused game, great. But don't FORCE the player to play a Co Op game. Games should have options to allow the player to play how they want. Online only tells your consumer base that people who want LAN, don't have a good connection, or simply prefer to play without other people are not welcome to your game. Online only reduces the audience for your product, which is foolish marketing.Honestly though, gamers only have themselves to thank for this. D3 sold well, so that translates to corporate types that online only and RMAH were great ideas. They only think in sales figures and statistics. If gamers want this to stop, they have to STOP buying into these games. If people don't buy it, they won't sell it.[/citation]
wow... look at all these indi games i bought... sure some of them arent great to look at but damnit, i have played more indi games in the last 3 years than i have AAA games, and the indi games are cheaper... and over all are better than many AAA games. saying that you cant get a great game without a 50-70 million budget is among the dumbest things i have ever heard.
[citation][nom]madjimms[/nom]What about Mojang.......? They made a REALLY good game WITHOUT even a medium budget.. Now hes a millionair & the game also doesn't cost very much. TAKE NOTE![/citation]
game costs 30$... i consider that way to much considering is basically jest legos with a crap combat system.
--------------------------------
now for the part not directed at anyone.
i play dungeon defenders on the pc, online...
you know i played diablo 1 and diablo 2 on dialup... the games weren't even half as bad as this one is.
this game requires a god level internet connection, and i'm within the top 10% if you don't include back bone lines in america.
constantly being disconnected from servers, because either steam or trendy didnt get connected to fast...
this is my only experience with always online type games, and holy crap... this cant be the way to go. if this was ever implemented into a solo campaign i would crack the hell out of it.
you do understand that with tessellation, and a good enough engine, a game could be made that would play on tablet level hardware, but scale up to the point where even a high end computer could be brought to its knees... right?
i honestly believe that is the way to go, give the high end the game they want, and allow the game to be scaled back slowly for those with lesser hardware. this is something that crysis was horrible at, to the point where i cant even see the low setting as ever having anything to do with the ultra.
[citation][nom]kinggraves[/nom]Reality is that you will not get a AAA title on a B level budget. If you want the best possible graphics and AI, that's going to take a large team. The days when you could make a top tier game on a team of 10 people are gone. This is where the consumer has set the bar for the industry. If on the other hand you're satisfied with graphics 3 generations old and gameplay as complicated as Tetris, feel free to stick to mobile and free games and pay less. Do not however pirate high cost games and try to justify it as "it costs too much". Stick with your cost range and play in the trash. You don't get to eat steak on a hamburger budget.At the same time though, DRM does not screw with thieves and is not the way to prevent piracy. Pirates get around DRM and legit players are forced to pirate to get past the restriction. This is not the way to solve the problem.Alright, here's the thing about that. PC games were easily pirated without any modding practically from the start. It has always been a problem for PC gaming. It has only recently become an issue for console gaming. The original method of console piracy was emulation, which required a PC to begin with. Mods also allowed piracy, but didn't become useful until systems started using common media. Even then a hard mod can be complicated or costly for the average console user. The piracy scene is a threat to console games now, but it has always been a threat to PC gaming.Oh, right. This article isn't really about piracy. Yeah, online only isn't good for the player. It's a reduction of possibilities. If you want to have a Co Op focused game, great. But don't FORCE the player to play a Co Op game. Games should have options to allow the player to play how they want. Online only tells your consumer base that people who want LAN, don't have a good connection, or simply prefer to play without other people are not welcome to your game. Online only reduces the audience for your product, which is foolish marketing.Honestly though, gamers only have themselves to thank for this. D3 sold well, so that translates to corporate types that online only and RMAH were great ideas. They only think in sales figures and statistics. If gamers want this to stop, they have to STOP buying into these games. If people don't buy it, they won't sell it.[/citation]
wow... look at all these indi games i bought... sure some of them arent great to look at but damnit, i have played more indi games in the last 3 years than i have AAA games, and the indi games are cheaper... and over all are better than many AAA games. saying that you cant get a great game without a 50-70 million budget is among the dumbest things i have ever heard.
[citation][nom]madjimms[/nom]What about Mojang.......? They made a REALLY good game WITHOUT even a medium budget.. Now hes a millionair & the game also doesn't cost very much. TAKE NOTE![/citation]
game costs 30$... i consider that way to much considering is basically jest legos with a crap combat system.
--------------------------------
now for the part not directed at anyone.
i play dungeon defenders on the pc, online...
you know i played diablo 1 and diablo 2 on dialup... the games weren't even half as bad as this one is.
this game requires a god level internet connection, and i'm within the top 10% if you don't include back bone lines in america.
constantly being disconnected from servers, because either steam or trendy didnt get connected to fast...
this is my only experience with always online type games, and holy crap... this cant be the way to go. if this was ever implemented into a solo campaign i would crack the hell out of it.
Sigh more foolish execs popin up all over the game industry. It is no wonder the market quality is in decline. They are killing themselves by their stupidity. Never should associate your products with the toxic words ALWAYS-ONLINE! That kills your PR pretty much. They could have done private polls or focus groups.
kinggraves
Distinguished
- May 14, 2010
- 951
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- 19,010
[citation][nom]alidan[/nom]wow... look at all these indi games i bought... sure some of them arent great to look at but damnit, i have played more indi games in the last 3 years than i have AAA games, and the indi games are cheaper... and over all are better than many AAA games. saying that you cant get a great game without a 50-70 million budget is among the dumbest things i have ever heard.[/citation]
I don't see anywhere where I said you couldn't get a good game for cheaper. I said you couldn't get a AAA title for cheaper. I'm saying that a game with high end graphics requires a larger staff to do the intricate models and textures. A game with complex AI routines requires more programmers to put down the scripting. A lot of the people on a PC enthusiast forum expect these things to be top of the line, and it requires the manpower. Even a smaller staff would have to put in extra hours. The more complex the game, the more hours need to be put into it. It increases the cost of development which leads to a higher cost for the end product. You just cannot expect something like that to go for $5.
I don't see anywhere where I said you couldn't get a good game for cheaper. I said you couldn't get a AAA title for cheaper. I'm saying that a game with high end graphics requires a larger staff to do the intricate models and textures. A game with complex AI routines requires more programmers to put down the scripting. A lot of the people on a PC enthusiast forum expect these things to be top of the line, and it requires the manpower. Even a smaller staff would have to put in extra hours. The more complex the game, the more hours need to be put into it. It increases the cost of development which leads to a higher cost for the end product. You just cannot expect something like that to go for $5.
[citation][nom]Mellwin2[/nom]@aggroboy to say that for a PC exclusive title has to be online online because of piracy is the stupidest thing ive heard. The ONLY people that gets hurt from a game like that is legitmate consumers. Pirates/Hackers thrive off of a challenge like that and will get the game working regardless through other means. Intrusive DRM such as this is never a good thing for the game. Yes most of the world has internet at this time but its beside the point, unless its a multiplayer game at its core, offline single player option should always be there.[/citation]
There is a reason why D3 is mentioned. If the gameplay is instanced server-side like D3 you have to connect as client to play. The only way hackers can bypass is if they obtain an outdated bootleg to set up a private server, and the clients are of a specific unupdated version.
There is a reason why D3 is mentioned. If the gameplay is instanced server-side like D3 you have to connect as client to play. The only way hackers can bypass is if they obtain an outdated bootleg to set up a private server, and the clients are of a specific unupdated version.
bigdragon
Distinguished
- Oct 19, 2011
- 1,143
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No doubt Epic wants always-on DRM. I remember when they whined 40+ million then 60+ million people allegedly pirated Unreal Tournament 3. They were crazy enough to count every attempt by a single pirated key to contact their master server as an individual pirate. Ridiculous! Wait until they find out how many times Gears of War has been pirated on the 360 -- it's not an insignificant number!
Epic hasn't had an original idea in a long time. I won't be playing Fortnight because I could just go play Minecraft or Team Fortress 2 instead and have a blast. Why bother with Epic's copycat? Epic lost my respect when they started booting modders from their forums a month after UT3 came out.
Epic hasn't had an original idea in a long time. I won't be playing Fortnight because I could just go play Minecraft or Team Fortress 2 instead and have a blast. Why bother with Epic's copycat? Epic lost my respect when they started booting modders from their forums a month after UT3 came out.
rohitbaran
Distinguished
- Mar 21, 2010
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Always online is the reason I skip games I would like to play. Take Splinter Cell Conviction. It is on a 75% discount on steam now and then, but even that won't get me buying it because I just can't stand the idea of losing my game progress if I lose connection for an instant. Always online = No buy from me.
Always on-line DRM isn't always bad, look at steam you retarded fuckers and you'll see that is very successful, should it be always online DRM, i don't know. If it's focused around Co-op I see why, but they should always have a offline mode because internet connections can & will drop.
[citation][nom]Gvorn[/nom]Always on-line DRM isn't always bad, look at steam you retarded fuckers and you'll see that is very successful, should it be always online DRM, i don't know. If it's focused around Co-op I see why, but they should always have a offline mode because internet connections can & will drop.[/citation]
no, Steam can be set to offline mode. no problem on that. sometimes i do that when my internet connections fraked up...
i had high hopes for Diablo 3, but after reading all the news and especially the always online "feature",
i decided NOT TO BUY it.
always online will work for me only for few kind of games: mmos and casual-fb-type-games.
no, Steam can be set to offline mode. no problem on that. sometimes i do that when my internet connections fraked up...
i had high hopes for Diablo 3, but after reading all the news and especially the always online "feature",
i decided NOT TO BUY it.
always online will work for me only for few kind of games: mmos and casual-fb-type-games.
Sorry, but this article goes on the premise that I will be in for some "bad news"
that's just not true.
I won't be stupid enough like the people who bought Diablo 3 to support the company via my dollar vote.
If you buy the game, then you are endorsing their practices.
The Market is a great thing, the consumer just needs to stop being retarded. Stop rewarding shitty design decisions and maybe they will stop doing them.
that's just not true.
I won't be stupid enough like the people who bought Diablo 3 to support the company via my dollar vote.
If you buy the game, then you are endorsing their practices.
The Market is a great thing, the consumer just needs to stop being retarded. Stop rewarding shitty design decisions and maybe they will stop doing them.
spartanmk2
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- May 11, 2012
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eddieroolz
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- Sep 6, 2008
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vmem
Splendid
- Feb 17, 2012
- 3,133
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- 21,465
Easiest way to have the next big success in gaming: have your team make a decent game with minimal bugs, just release what you have for open beta and let people try like say the first chapter as a demo, then just release it at say $30 or $40, cut the marketing BS. If you can make a game cheaper, then do. The BIGGEST reasons for modern piracy are people who just want to mod their game so that it works CORRECTLY, and people who wants to try out the game before purchase... Well, now adding people who can't get a stable connection just to plan single player.
The vast MAJORITY of people who pirate would NOT have bought the game if they had to pay for it, why? Cuz it was a shit game... If it was good, they would go and buy it after trying it out. I know I do, hell I spent nearly $300 on skyrim collectors AND a PS3 version cuz I really liked the game and wanted to play on both systems... Gamers are mostly smart tech savvy people, you can't spend half your development budget on anti-piracy stuff and expect your overpriced, buggy, final product to make a profit...
The vast MAJORITY of people who pirate would NOT have bought the game if they had to pay for it, why? Cuz it was a shit game... If it was good, they would go and buy it after trying it out. I know I do, hell I spent nearly $300 on skyrim collectors AND a PS3 version cuz I really liked the game and wanted to play on both systems... Gamers are mostly smart tech savvy people, you can't spend half your development budget on anti-piracy stuff and expect your overpriced, buggy, final product to make a profit...
vmem
Splendid
- Feb 17, 2012
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[citation][nom]kinggraves[/nom]I don't see anywhere where I said you couldn't get a good game for cheaper. I said you couldn't get a AAA title for cheaper. I'm saying that a game with high end graphics requires a larger staff to do the intricate models and textures. A game with complex AI routines requires more programmers to put down the scripting. A lot of the people on a PC enthusiast forum expect these things to be top of the line, and it requires the manpower. Even a smaller staff would have to put in extra hours. The more complex the game, the more hours need to be put into it. It increases the cost of development which leads to a higher cost for the end product. You just cannot expect something like that to go for $5.[/citation]
Sure, but I can ask for selling an AAA game for $30-40 right? These companies blow millions on advertisements and millions more on anti-piracy shit that'll get cracked sooner or later, the only ones they hurt are their fans buying the game on day one, then spending weeks waiting for the servers to work and bugs to be fixed...
Sure, but I can ask for selling an AAA game for $30-40 right? These companies blow millions on advertisements and millions more on anti-piracy shit that'll get cracked sooner or later, the only ones they hurt are their fans buying the game on day one, then spending weeks waiting for the servers to work and bugs to be fixed...
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