[SOLVED] RJ45 to Fiber Media converters

[AJAshinoff]

Thanks to the virus fiasco, I'm preparing to upgrade our infrastructure. I have 3 1G switches, each with 4 10G ports. Next week I'm preparing to install them on a lighter than already light day.
The next phase will be to replace the 3 remaining switches. The trouble is these switch connect other buildings using fiber and the media converters are 1G max.
Since I'm going to need 4 media convertors, I'm hoping for an experience based hardware recommendation that won't decimate the budget.

I'm looking for either an RJ45 to Fiber or a fiber to fiber solution . I can get either transceiver relatively inexpensively but the cost of the 10G media converters kind of surprised me.

Any help is appreciated

 

[Barty1884]

What hardware are you working with? Do devices require RJ45 use, or do they have SFP?

 

[AJAshinoff]

What hardware are you working with? Do devices require RJ45 use, or do they have SFP?

The switches are FS S3900 series (2-24 port, 1 48 port) and I have both FS.com RJ45 and fiber transceivers.

The old equipment are Trendnet 1000Base-T to 1000Base-SX multi-mode SC fiber converters

 

[bill001g]

Before you get real far on this project very carefully check what kind of fiber you have. Since you say you have 1000basesx that means you are highly likely running multimode fiber. There are multiple classes of multimode fiber om1-om5. 1000sx can run to 550 meters over most of these. 10g stuff goes far less than that. On the common most common OM2 it will run less than 100 meters.

So check your fiber types and the lengths to see if you are going to have issues.

 

[kanewolf]

Thanks to the virus fiasco, I'm preparing to upgrade our infrastructure. I have 3 1G switches, each with 4 10G ports. Next week I'm preparing to install them on a lighter than already light day.
The next phase will be to replace the 3 remaining switches. The trouble is these switch connect other buildings using fiber and the media converters are 1G max.
Since I'm going to need 4 media convertors, I'm hoping for an experience based hardware recommendation that won't decimate the budget.

I'm looking for either an RJ45 to Fiber or a fiber to fiber solution . I can get either transceiver relatively inexpensively but the cost of the 10G media converters kind of surprised me.

Any help is appreciated

The problem with 10GE on fiber is that it doesn't travel as far as 1GE depending on the fiber. So you first need to determine what type fiber you have. OS1 (single mode) or OM something (multi mode). Then you need to read the writing printed on the cable. Is it 50/125 or 62.5/125 fiber. That makes a big difference in how far you can reliably run 10GE. The other thing you need to know is what type of termination the fiber has. Typical types are SC, LC, or ST. ST is most likely 62.5 fiber. SFP+ optics will all be LC.
You need to do a little more homework and tell us what your fiber infrastructure is like. Then we can help you with some design guidance.

 

[AJAshinoff]

The problem with 10GE on fiber is that it doesn't travel as far as 1GE depending on the fiber. So you first need to determine what type fiber you have. OS1 (single mode) or OM something (multi mode). Then you need to read the writing printed on the cable. Is it 50/125 or 62.5/125 fiber. That makes a big difference in how far you can reliably run 10GE. The other thing you need to know is what type of termination the fiber has. Typical types are SC, LC, or ST. ST is most likely 62.5 fiber. SFP+ optics will all be LC.
You need to do a little more homework and tell us what your fiber infrastructure is like. Then we can help you with some design guidance.

I Inherited this and haven't had to address it until now. I'll see if I can find some of my predecessors who left little to no documentation to see what I can learn. The fiber runs each connect to a building, each,at least via proximity, less than 1000 feet across a parking lot.

I'll check more into the specifics of the fiber. Thanks!

 

[kanewolf]

I Inherited this and haven't had to address it until now. I'll see if I can find some of my predecessors who left little to no documentation to see what I can learn. The fiber runs each connect to a building, each,at least via proximity, less than 1000 feet across a parking lot.

I'll check more into the specifics of the fiber. Thanks!

1000 ft (300m) is near the limit for 10GE on multimode fiber -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi-mode_optical_fiber#Comparison For 10GE you generally need OM3. It will usually have an aqua color to the cover. Single mode fiber will usually be yellow. The color of the cladding on the fiber may be enough to tell you.

 

[SamirD]

And depending on if you really need 10G between buildings, you may just want to leave the 1G between buildings in place--that's a lot of bandwidth between buildings if you're not maxing it out already.

 

[AJAshinoff]

And depending on if you really need 10G between buildings, you may just want to leave the 1G between buildings in place--that's a lot of bandwidth between buildings if you're not maxing it out already.

Well, one of the building is the main office. The other may still be able to get away with 1G, but they do pull a lot of media when they are hitting all cylinders. Particularly now, the depedance on producing nd broadcasting is pretty high.

 

[SamirD]

Well, one of the building is the main office. The other may still be able to get away with 1G, but they do pull a lot of media when they are hitting all cylinders. Particularly now, the depedance on producing nd broadcasting is pretty high.

Gotcha. Well, you will need to check the type of fibre you have as per the posts above and may even have to pull new fibre. I would go ahead and work on the switches and get that doe and then work on the fibre separately as it will still work at 1Gbps in the meantime.

 

[AJAshinoff]

Gotcha. Well, you will need to check the type of fibre you have as per the posts above and may even have to pull new fibre. I would go ahead and work on the switches and get that doe and then work on the fibre separately as it will still work at 1Gbps in the meantime.

Yes, that's my plan. Thanks!

 

[SamirD]

And keep us updated as I'm curious how it all goes.

 

[AJAshinoff]

And keep us updated as I'm curious how it all goes.

An update
Putting Intel based FS.com Network adapters in two server and using FS.com 300M DOM Transceiver models with 50/125 OM3 Multi-mode Fiber Parch cords I was able to get two servers connected to the network at 10G. Because there are only 3 10G capable switches the 10G is presently limited to a very small area. Even so, for testing purposes, its nice to see 1G being used and it holds promise for the rest.
I can't give specifics for the old lines more than saying its multi-mode duplex 50/125 SC/LC (from an unopened package). But visually I can see that the ends are too large for the transceivers I have.
I'm looking into seeing if there is a different transceiver that I can obtain that will use the larger SC/LC ends. There's no sense pulling new cable if the old cable can be made to work. That is, provided I don't just leave the front office (where checks are written) running a 1G.

I'll update again when things become clearer.

Allan

 

[AJAshinoff]

Well, as it turns out the newer fiber tech doesn't quite completely jibe with the older fiber. The new uses 50/125 OM3 fiber whereas the old uses 50/125 SC/LC. While I can use the existing hardware (gender changers) with the new switches the older fiber will not be able to achieve 10G to deliver the backbone to the remote office buildings. In seeking a solution I'm being told that the older fiber (orange jacket) is only capable of 1G and that regardless of the ends put on the best I'll get out of that line is 1G.

Honestly, and I may be being given accurate information, I have a hard time believing that dumb strands of fiber determine their own capacity (no twists per inch like copper). I would think that the switches regulating throughput would be more of a factor in how much content can be sent and received on the fiber line as long as each side of the fiber line has the appropriate end to marry up to the 10G ports on each switch?

I cannot say at this time what is definatively true or untrue. For right now using the 10G ports to create a 10G backbone is up and functional. The old fiber and its media convertors can connect using RJ45 at 1G so I have a little time to figure out what is fact from fiction.

 

[kanewolf]

Well, as it turns out the newer fiber tech doesn't quite completely jibe with the older fiber. The new uses 50/125 OM3 fiber whereas the old uses 50/125 SC/LC. While I can use the existing hardware (gender changers) with the new switches the older fiber will not be able to achieve 10G to deliver the backbone to the remote office buildings. In seeking a solution I'm being told that the older fiber (orange jacket) is only capable of 1G and that regardless of the ends put on the best I'll get out of that line is 1G.

Honestly, and I may be being given accurate information, I have a hard time believing that dumb strands of fiber determine their own capacity (no twists per inch like copper). I would think that the switches regulating throughput would be more of a factor in how much content can be sent and received on the fiber line as long as each side of the fiber line has the appropriate end to marry up to the 10G ports on each switch?

I cannot say at this time what is definatively true or untrue. For right now using the 10G ports to create a 10G backbone is up and functional. The old fiber and its media convertors can connect using RJ45 at 1G so I have a little time to figure out what is fact from fiction.

50 micron fiber OM2 or OM3 can support 10GE. It is just a question of distance. This page gives you specifics -- http://www.cables-solutions.com/what-are-om1-om2-om3-and-om4.html
So OM2 50micron will support 10GE for 82 meters. For short runs it is fine. Your between buildings run -- probably not.

 

[AJAshinoff]

50 micron fiber OM2 or OM3 can support 10GE. It is just a question of distance. This page gives you specifics -- http://www.cables-solutions.com/what-are-om1-om2-om3-and-om4.html
So OM2 50micron will support 10GE for 82 meters. For short runs it is fine. Your between buildings run -- probably not.

Offhand 82 meters is around 250-260ft. While I haven't measured out the distance, depending on how the fiber is routed to its underground conduit, it would be cutting it close. It may be wiser to leave things at 1G for the remote buildings until necessity forces the upgrade.

Thanks for the link. I'll keep it bookmarked for future reference.

Again, I'll post more as things develop.

Appreciated

 

[kanewolf]

Offhand 82 meters is around 250-260ft. While I haven't measured out the distance, depending on how the fiber is routed to its underground conduit, it would be cutting it close. It may be wiser to leave things at 1G for the remote buildings until necessity forces the upgrade.

Thanks for the link. I'll keep it bookmarked for future reference.

Again, I'll post more as things develop.

Appreciated

I would say try it. Not much to loose. You can always fall back to 1G.

 

[AJAshinoff]

I would say try it. Not much to loose. You can always fall back to 1G.

That's the plan. The intial idea was to use transceivers on either end of the fiber plugged into the switches 10G ports. The curve comes with the ends. I'm talking from ignorance (and reading labels), the transceivers receive LC/UPC Duplex ends whereas the old cable has SC/LC ends (much larger). In this way bypassing the media convertors entirely may not be feasible without replacing the ends, unless I can obtain a transceiver that receives the larger connector into the 10G port.

 

[kanewolf]

That's the plan. The intial idea was to use transceivers on either end of the fiber plugged into the switches 10G ports. The curve comes with the ends. I'm talking from ignorance (and reading labels), the transceivers receive LC/UPC Duplex ends whereas the old cable has SC/LC ends (much larger). In this way bypassing the media convertors entirely may not be feasible without replacing the ends, unless I can obtain a transceiver that receives the larger connector into the 10G port.

Although there is an "insertion loss" for the fiber connection, you can get short LC to SC jumpers and SC to SC unions. We do this all the time.
Cable -- https://www.fs.com/products/41751.html
Coupler -- https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...tems_foa_sc_sc_dm_multimode_duplex_sc_to.html

 

[beers]

You should be able to abstract whatever connector type that's on there, as per others having a separate media converter only really gains you another failure point along the cable.

Also whoever ran MMF between buildings before you needs to be mugged or something.