Rumor: New Macs to Be Announced at WWDC

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[citation][nom]blazorthon[/nom]Windows 8 is an excellent OS. If you dislike Metro, then install Classic Shell and now you have an OS that beats Windows 7 in pretty much every practical way. You might applaud ap3x for not being biased about Macs, but then you go on to be biased about Windows 8.[/citation]

I have to agree with you. I personley like Windows 8 a good bit. I run the preview on my workstation and even like Metro. Kind of board of the old ways of doing things so I appreciate innovation when I see it.

Your comment on OSX not being a proper OS because of application support is flawed. Virtually every Windows application has a OSX counterpart either directly by the same application or with an application from another company with the exception of gaming applications. You can not say that the OS is not proper just because you do not know your OSX options are to do the same thing are.

OSX provides a great UI with the power of BSD under the hood. How is that not proper for a power user? I have Apache and MySQL on my MacBook pro because I am developing a E-Commerce site right now and I need to take it with me. I also have the Adobe Master Collection, SolidWorks, AutoCad and a number of other professional applications. None of which run on Linux. Those are just for my personal projects, for my work I have tons of built in functionality that I use and other tools like R7 Metasploit on my laptop.

I just do not understand your proper OS or Power user comment. Nothing that I do is for a casual user.

Perhaps you are more comfortable with your OS of preference?
 
IT will have two graphics cards, not just intel 4000, they must have forgot to put it in this article, if apple did that why call it a mac book pro when the graphic artist would not buy it?
 
[citation][nom]rob dog[/nom]IT will have two graphics cards, not just intel 4000, they must have forgot to put it in this article, if apple did that why call it a mac book pro when the graphic artist would not buy it?[/citation]
I would be very hesitant to pay MacBook Pro prices for a 15" that only had intel's integrated graphics until those integrated graphics are as powerful as mid-to-high-end discreet graphics. ...and I don't think Apple would make the mistake of offering a 15/17" model with only lower-end mobile graphics as an option.
 
[citation][nom]ap3x[/nom]I have to agree with you. I personley like Windows 8 a good bit. I run the preview on my workstation and even like Metro. Kind of board of the old ways of doing things so I appreciate innovation when I see it. Your comment on OSX not being a proper OS because of application support is flawed. Virtually every Windows application has a OSX counterpart either directly by the same application or with an application from another company with the exception of gaming applications. You can not say that the OS is not proper just because you do not know your OSX options are to do the same thing are. OSX provides a great UI with the power of BSD under the hood. How is that not proper for a power user? I have Apache and MySQL on my MacBook pro because I am developing a E-Commerce site right now and I need to take it with me. I also have the Adobe Master Collection, SolidWorks, AutoCad and a number of other professional applications. None of which run on Linux. Those are just for my personal projects, for my work I have tons of built in functionality that I use and other tools like R7 Metasploit on my laptop. I just do not understand your proper OS or Power user comment. Nothing that I do is for a casual user. Perhaps you are more comfortable with your OS of preference?[/citation]

I didn't say that OSX isn't a proper OS. I have run into several programs that didn't have Mac support. It is a very common thing when working with freeware and a lot of the professional software that does have Mav versions (or is Mac exclusive) is more expensive then necessary. That isn't always true for all of it, but it is for lot of it. Yes, the people saying that OSX is only good for web browsing and such are wrong. I've done some work on Macs and I think that I have a decent, if not perfect, idea of it. For example, even though I'm using a Windows laptop to type this response to you right now, there is a Macbook only a few inches away from this Gateway laptop.

I often have better luck with Linux when I want to run individual programs that I can run on Windows. For example, I recently found a a CAD program that I wanted to use. No matter what, I could not get it to work on the Mac (not surprised about it, Macs tend to not support Windows programs and that's not something that anyone should expect) and although I might have missed them, I couldn't find a free CAD program for my Mac. So, what did I do when I didn't have my Windows laptop with me? I powered on my Linux box, downloaded the CAD program that I was using on my Windows laptop, and I got it working through WINE and some other *hacks*. This is much more convenient than hoping to find software for the Mac that I can afford on my often very limited budgets.

So yes, ISX is a proper OS. I didn't mean to imply that it wasn't. It most certainly is proper. However, there are software support problems that I often run into. If I can't afford to buy software for the Mac when I can do so on Windwos and/or Linux (and often throgh freeware), I consider that a software support problem. I also have noticed that Macs do lack a support for a several types of programs/applications that I use on my other computers, although I do admit that I might have simply been unable to find them. I'm not looking for it anymore, but I couldn't find a program on the Mac that will monitor my WiFi network for intruders, but it took me just a few minutes to find and download a free program that does this on Windows (I haven't tried to get it working on one of my Linux computers yet).

I also find that some of the professional content creation/editing software on Macs isn't always as good as software for Windows, among other types of software. MS Office for Mac (I didn't pay for it; it was given to me for free) is noticeably less convenient to use than the Windows variant and some free office suites that work on both Windows and Linux (but not Mac). Something like Parallels would help, but last I checked, that's not cheap.
 
[citation][nom]frank_drebin[/nom]and a kidney[/citation]
I think if you find a laptop with not only the same specs (and not a low-resolution screen) but similar build materials you'll find that the price differential is not nearly as much as you might think it is.
 
[citation][nom]halcyon[/nom]I think if you find a laptop with not only the same specs (and not a low-resolution screen) but similar build materials you'll find that the price differential is not nearly as much as you might think it is.[/citation]

The cost differential can still be very big, especially if you find a company who specializes in building Windows/Linux laptops from barebones kits.
 
[citation][nom]blazorthon[/nom]The cost differential can still be very big, especially if you find a company who specializes in building Windows/Linux laptops from barebones kits.[/citation]
...but then getting service and 3rd party accessories, parts, isn't nearly as convenient as with a MacBook Pro. I kinda like knowing I can take my MacBook Pro to a nearby Apple store if I should ever need to and that I can get the aforementioned accessories. ...again, these things don't appeal to everyone. I'm the guy that would rather have the Porsche 911 Turbo than the tricked out, suped-up Dodge Viper.
 
[citation][nom]halcyon[/nom]...but then getting service and 3rd party accessories, parts, isn't nearly as convenient as with a MacBook Pro. I kinda like knowing I can take my MacBook Pro to a nearby Apple store if I should ever need to and that I can get the aforementioned accessories. ...again, these things don't appeal to everyone. I'm the guy that would rather have the Porsche 911 Turbo than the tricked out, suped-up Dodge Viper.[/citation]

The only customer service that I've ever used was calling a company to disable a theft protection chip in my Gateway laptop, so I tend to not care about it (granted, some other people do care more, but then there're sites such as Tom's to solve that). As for getting parts? What parts would you need to get? Several companies will use a barebones setup to build you a customized laptop at a minimal price. I wouldn't have to do anything other than say that I want this CPU and that graphics card and that sort of thing. If I ever need replacement parts due to a failure, I'd know what parts to get and most of these companies offer warranties and such anyway. Sure, I'd have to mail it in to them for repair if that were the case, but I'd have no trouble doing it myself.

What accessories would I be missing? Any accessories other than the computer itself (and many times, optional parts for it) sold by the OEM companies have ridiculous prices and aren't even worth getting. If I want a mouse, then I'll get a mouse from newegg for $5 or whatever instead of the $20 plus additional shipping fees that they want to charge for it. Same goes for an extra keyboard, monitor, speakers, etc. etc.
 
[citation][nom]blazorthon[/nom]I didn't say that OSX isn't a proper OS. I have run into several programs that didn't have Mac support. It is a very common thing when working with freeware and a lot of the professional software that does have Mav versions (or is Mac exclusive) is more expensive then necessary. That isn't always true for all of it, but it is for lot of it. Yes, the people saying that OSX is only good for web browsing and such are wrong. I've done some work on Macs and I think that I have a decent, if not perfect, idea of it. For example, even though I'm using a Windows laptop to type this response to you right now, there is a Macbook only a few inches away from this Gateway laptop.I often have better luck with Linux when I want to run individual programs that I can run on Windows. For example, I recently found a a CAD program that I wanted to use. No matter what, I could not get it to work on the Mac (not surprised about it, Macs tend to not support Windows programs and that's not something that anyone should expect) and although I might have missed them, I couldn't find a free CAD program for my Mac. So, what did I do when I didn't have my Windows laptop with me? I powered on my Linux box, downloaded the CAD program that I was using on my Windows laptop, and I got it working through WINE and some other *hacks*. This is much more convenient than hoping to find software for the Mac that I can afford on my often very limited budgets.So yes, ISX is a proper OS. I didn't mean to imply that it wasn't. It most certainly is proper. However, there are software support problems that I often run into. If I can't afford to buy software for the Mac when I can do so on Windwos and/or Linux (and often throgh freeware), I consider that a software support problem. I also have noticed that Macs do lack a support for a several types of programs/applications that I use on my other computers, although I do admit that I might have simply been unable to find them. I'm not looking for it anymore, but I couldn't find a program on the Mac that will monitor my WiFi network for intruders, but it took me just a few minutes to find and download a free program that does this on Windows (I haven't tried to get it working on one of my Linux computers yet).I also find that some of the professional content creation/editing software on Macs isn't always as good as software for Windows, among other types of software. MS Office for Mac (I didn't pay for it; it was given to me for free) is noticeably less convenient to use than the Windows variant and some free office suites that work on both Windows and Linux (but not Mac). Something like Parallels would help, but last I checked, that's not cheap.[/citation]

1: You mention app support on a mac but then you use a Windows app on a unsupported OS. (Linux using Wine)
2:Wine on Linux = Crossover on Mac www.codeweavers.com (uses wine under the hood)
3: You could just download Wine and install from source like you would on Linux if you did not us a RPM or apt-get. "sudo make install" will work just fine.
3: Microsoft Office 2010 for Microsoft Windows is better than Microsoft Office 2011 for Mac. Your surprised by that? Even still, 98% of the functionality is there. The deficient part of the suite however is Outlook for Mac vs Outlook for Windows. It could use some improvements but it is 98% there.
4: www.openoffice.org : one of the most popular free office if not the most popular out there. Full OSX support.

Look, bottom line is there we can both find Windows, Linux, BSD, BeOS, Solaris, OSX applications that are not on one or all of the OS's out there. There is always that and there is no point trying to list them all. There are some applications that are better on a Mac then their Windows counterparts and some that are better on Windows than their Mac counter parts and some that about the same so it is just up to preference. For example, I happen to like Photoshop better on Windows then on my Mac. Same exact stuff but for some reason I feel more comfortable doing it on Windows. Maybe it is a workstation vs Laptop thing, not sure. I like Web development better on my Mac, and definitely perl scripting.

At the end of the day, just because your a power user on a Windows machine does not make you a power user on all machines. You have to have or know where to get the tools you need to do what you want to do. If your preferred software maker does not have a Mac varient for Windows or vice versa then you have to find an alternative. Then you have to learn how to use the alternative to get the same or better results.

For example, I wish that OSX had Microsoft Visio. It doesn't and I am not holding my breath for MS to release it so I have to us Omnigaffle. Which can open Visio files just fine. They are both great in terms of functionality do allot of the same things but I have always used Visio so that is my preference. So www.crossover.com or VMware Fusion or Parallels to use that application.

In all fairness, it really does seem like you are confortable with your Windows Server on your laptop more so than anything else. Nothing wrong with that at all but tell people and OS is not for power users or this or that is not a fair statement.

No one ever says that about Linux or other Unix variants and there are a number of things that Windows and OSX does better than they do never mind the application support.
 
[citation][nom]ap3x[/nom]1: You mention app support on a mac but then you use a Windows app on a unsupported OS. (Linux using Wine)2:Wine on Linux = Crossover on Mac www.codeweavers.com (uses wine under the hood)3: You could just download Wine and install from source like you would on Linux if you did not us a RPM or apt-get. "sudo make install" will work just fine. 3: Microsoft Office 2010 for Microsoft Windows is better than Microsoft Office 2011 for Mac. Your surprised by that? Even still, 98% of the functionality is there. The deficient part of the suite however is Outlook for Mac vs Outlook for Windows. It could use some improvements but it is 98% there.4: www.openoffice.org : one of the most popular free office if not the most popular out there. Full OSX support.Look, bottom line is there we can both find Windows, Linux, BSD, BeOS, Solaris, OSX applications that are not on one or all of the OS's out there. There is always that and there is no point trying to list them all. There are some applications that are better on a Mac then their Windows counterparts and some that are better on Windows than their Mac counter parts and some that about the same so it is just up to preference. For example, I happen to like Photoshop better on Windows then on my Mac. Same exact stuff but for some reason I feel more comfortable doing it on Windows. Maybe it is a workstation vs Laptop thing, not sure. I like Web development better on my Mac, and definitely perl scripting.At the end of the day, just because your a power user on a Windows machine does not make you a power user on all machines. You have to have or know where to get the tools you need to do what you want to do. If your preferred software maker does not have a Mac varient for Windows or vice versa then you have to find an alternative. Then you have to learn how to use the alternative to get the same or better results. For example, I wish that OSX had Microsoft Visio. It doesn't and I am not holding my breath for MS to release it so I have to us Omnigaffle. Which can open Visio files just fine. They are both great in terms of functionality do allot of the same things but I have always used Visio so that is my preference. So www.crossover.com or VMware Fusion or Parallels to use that application. In all fairness, it really does seem like you are confortable with your Windows Server on your laptop more so than anything else. Nothing wrong with that at all but tell people and OS is not for power users or this or that is not a fair statement. No one ever says that about Linux or other Unix variants and there are a number of things that Windows and OSX does better than they do never mind the application support.[/citation]

Whether or not it is natively supported isn't something that concerns me. It worked on Linux even though it was not compatible with Linux alone.

I'll have to try Crossover sometime.

Again, I'll have to try it.

I wasn't surprised by it working better on Windows. However, whether or not it is surprising doesn't matter because it is inferior and that was the point that I was making.

I've used Open Office... It gave me a lot of compatibility problems in my Excel files. Also, I've heard that it is not being updated much anymore. Libre Office seems to be better.

I think that I made it clear enough that I wasn't a big power user for Mac, it is more of a side thing that is there because I got it for free and it is useful as an extra computer. I was simply saying that with the Mac, there was always things that didn't work as well. I haven't yet seen something that truly worked better on the Mac than on my other computers, but like I said and you then pointed out, that's not really a goal that I'm experienced with.

I can do everything that I can do on Windows and on my Mac on a Linux machine. It might take more work (it might take a lot more work in some cases), but I've never not been able to do it, no matter what I was doing. Linux is not a user friendly option for most work for obvious reasons, but it can be used to do pretty much anything if you know how. There are ways to get stuff to work even if you might think that it shouldn't even be conceivable that it can be made to work. WINE isn't always a one-stop shop for this (it often isn't), but there are many other things that can be done.
 
[citation][nom]blazorthon[/nom]If I want a mouse, then I'll get a mouse from newegg for $5 or whatever instead of the $20 plus additional shipping fees that they want to charge for it. Same goes for an extra keyboard, monitor, speakers, etc. etc.[/citation]
I said accessories, things like (EDIT: my links were removed...my be a Tom's thing now)...chassis covers/protectors and keyboard covers/protectors (stuff for the nutcases like me that like to keep their equipment in new condition forever). Items like these would be trivial to some but not to me. I like knowing I can walk into a retail shop and get them...and return them if I want. I know you can custom spec a more powerful laptop than a Mac as I've worked with PCs for years and years and years. For now, I'm still really enjoying the combination of build quality, OS, and design that my Macs offer. I have a little PC for gaming.
 
[citation][nom]halcyon[/nom]I think if you find a laptop with not only the same specs (and not a low-resolution screen) but similar build materials you'll find that the price differential is not nearly as much as you might think it is.[/citation]
Actually I always tough that one of the Achilles heel of the macbook pro was the screen. The 15inch macbook pro comes with a 1680x1050 while there are quite a few computers out there with the screen of the same size with a rez of 1920x1200. The same thing goes for the 13inch macbook because i can get a 12 inch netbook with a higher pixel count. Apparently Apple will fix this shortcoming with this release.
 
[citation][nom]halcyon[/nom]I said accessories, things like (EDIT: my links were removed...my be a Tom's thing now)...chassis covers/protectors and keyboard covers/protectors (stuff for the nutcases like me that like to keep their equipment in new condition forever). Items like these would be trivial to some but not to me. I like knowing I can walk into a retail shop and get them...and return them if I want. I know you can custom spec a more powerful laptop than a Mac as I've worked with PCs for years and years and years. For now, I'm still really enjoying the combination of build quality, OS, and design that my Macs offer. I have a little PC for gaming.[/citation]

My Gateway laptop from 2008 or so looks like new and it didn't need extra covers for that. However, if I was buying a very expensive laptop, I could understand wanting extra wear protection... Regardless, there are bound to be covers and such that fit on barebones-based laptops, granted they'd probably need to be ordered online rather than bought/replaced at a physical store.
 
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