So why in hell does Doom3 have such high performance requi..

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
requirement specs any higher than RTCW? Why can't the engine handle having
large battles with the AI? Instead they had to resort to monster closets and
monsters teleporting in. Since the game is a corridor shooter it's not like
the monsters have a complicated pathing algorithm to follow (unlike say, Far
Cry). I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring the game would run
on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.

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On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 11:52:22 -0700, "Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net> wrote:

>|Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
>|requirement specs any higher than RTCW? Why can't the engine handle having
>|large battles with the AI? Instead they had to resort to monster closets and
>|monsters teleporting in. Since the game is a corridor shooter it's not like
>|the monsters have a complicated pathing algorithm to follow (unlike say, Far
>|Cry). I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring the game would run
>|on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.

Real time shadows.

Pluvious
 
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To get you to buy new equipment. They released it when there was equipment,
especially (nVidia) video cards, beefy enough to run it.

- f_f
 
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High resolution textures,dynamic lighting and shadows.

"Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net> wrote in message
news:YmT8e.2626$Gq6.1271@fe02.lga...
> Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
> requirement specs any higher than RTCW? Why can't the engine handle having
> large battles with the AI? Instead they had to resort to monster closets
and
> monsters teleporting in. Since the game is a corridor shooter it's not
like
> the monsters have a complicated pathing algorithm to follow (unlike say,
Far
> Cry). I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring the game would run
> on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.
>
> --
> Remove nospam to email
>
>
 
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But doesn't Far Cry and Half Life 2 feature all the below as well? I know
Far Cry has real-time shadows (just try moving under some trees).

All I'm saying is what makes Doom3 a stand-out game engine? What makes it
superior to Far Cry or Half Life 2? I'm not saying that
Doom3 isn't more advanced than say, the Lithtech engine, I'm just saying
what makes it better than HL2 or Far Cry?

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"dawg" <don't look@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:mAT8e.89028$cg1.84265@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> High resolution textures,dynamic lighting and shadows.
>
> "Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net> wrote in message
> news:YmT8e.2626$Gq6.1271@fe02.lga...
>> Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
>> requirement specs any higher than RTCW? Why can't the engine handle
>> having
>> large battles with the AI? Instead they had to resort to monster closets
> and
>> monsters teleporting in. Since the game is a corridor shooter it's not
> like
>> the monsters have a complicated pathing algorithm to follow (unlike say,
> Far
>> Cry). I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring the game would
>> run
>> on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.
>>
>> --
>> Remove nospam to email
>>
>>
>
>
 
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"Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net> wrote in message
news:YmT8e.2626$Gq6.1271@fe02.lga...
> Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
> requirement specs any higher than RTCW? Why can't the engine handle having
> large battles with the AI? Instead they had to resort to monster closets
and
> monsters teleporting in. Since the game is a corridor shooter it's not
like
> the monsters have a complicated pathing algorithm to follow (unlike say,
Far
> Cry). I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring the game would run
> on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.
>
> --
> Remove nospam to email

OT Doug, but is your name '8051' on Rage3D?
 
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What's a Rage3d? Isn't it a video card?

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"Paul Turnbull" <turnbull2000*nojunkmail*@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:vFT8e.15006$G8.5254@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
>
> "Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net> wrote in message
> news:YmT8e.2626$Gq6.1271@fe02.lga...
>> Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
>> requirement specs any higher than RTCW? Why can't the engine handle
>> having
>> large battles with the AI? Instead they had to resort to monster closets
> and
>> monsters teleporting in. Since the game is a corridor shooter it's not
> like
>> the monsters have a complicated pathing algorithm to follow (unlike say,
> Far
>> Cry). I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring the game would
>> run
>> on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.
>>
>> --
>> Remove nospam to email
>
> OT Doug, but is your name '8051' on Rage3D?
>
>
 
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You think Far Cry runs better?

"Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net> wrote in message
news:AQU8e.3217$f6.1455@fe04.lga...
> But doesn't Far Cry and Half Life 2 feature all the below as well? I know
> Far Cry has real-time shadows (just try moving under some trees).
>
> All I'm saying is what makes Doom3 a stand-out game engine? What makes it
> superior to Far Cry or Half Life 2? I'm not saying that
> Doom3 isn't more advanced than say, the Lithtech engine, I'm just saying
> what makes it better than HL2 or Far Cry?
>
> --
> Remove nospam to email
> "dawg" <don't look@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
> news:mAT8e.89028$cg1.84265@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>> High resolution textures,dynamic lighting and shadows.
>>
>> "Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net> wrote in message
>> news:YmT8e.2626$Gq6.1271@fe02.lga...
>>> Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
>>> requirement specs any higher than RTCW? Why can't the engine handle
>>> having
>>> large battles with the AI? Instead they had to resort to monster closets
>> and
>>> monsters teleporting in. Since the game is a corridor shooter it's not
>> like
>>> the monsters have a complicated pathing algorithm to follow (unlike say,
>> Far
>>> Cry). I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring the game would
>>> run
>>> on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Remove nospam to email
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
 
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"Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net> wrote in message
news:fOU8e.3216$f6.714@fe04.lga...
> What's a Rage3d? Isn't it a video card?

It's a popular website for ATI users. Someone posted your question word for
word in the gaming forum - passing it of as his own rant!
 
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Doug wrote:
> Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
> requirement specs any higher than RTCW? Why can't the engine handle having
> large battles with the AI? Instead they had to resort to monster closets and
> monsters teleporting in. Since the game is a corridor shooter it's not like
> the monsters have a complicated pathing algorithm to follow (unlike say, Far
> Cry). I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring the game would run
> on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.
>

Doom 3 doesnt have high requirements. It plays well on medium HW too.

In what way is the pathfinding in Far Cry so difficult?

In addition, DOOM 3 is, funnily enough, set in a space station on mars.
There would hardly be huge open spaces there would there? I bet youd
moan about constricted levels on a game set aboard an aeroplance.

Terrible troll. Back under the bridge.
 
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Duh, how hard can pathfinding be when there are only two or three possible
paths the AI can take? Far Cry's wide open spaces allow
for many more possible paths the AI can take from them to you. Far Cry also
has AI that can come at you from the land, sea and air which also presents
more pathing problems.

So there are no wide open spaces on Mars? Gee, I thought Mars was a planet
not a space station...

Idiot...

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"Walter Mitty" <mitticus@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:d414u8$k44$1@domitilla.aioe.org...
> Doug wrote:
>> Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
>> requirement specs any higher than RTCW? Why can't the engine handle
>> having large battles with the AI? Instead they had to resort to monster
>> closets and monsters teleporting in. Since the game is a corridor shooter
>> it's not like the monsters have a complicated pathing algorithm to follow
>> (unlike say, Far Cry). I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring
>> the game would run on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.
>>
>
> Doom 3 doesnt have high requirements. It plays well on medium HW too.
>
> In what way is the pathfinding in Far Cry so difficult?
>
> In addition, DOOM 3 is, funnily enough, set in a space station on mars.
> There would hardly be huge open spaces there would there? I bet youd moan
> about constricted levels on a game set aboard an aeroplance.
>
> Terrible troll. Back under the bridge.
>
 
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On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 13:29:06 -0700, "Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net>
wrote:


>So there are no wide open spaces on Mars? Gee, I thought Mars was a planet
>not a space station...
>
>Idiot...

Nothing can survive in the outside environment on Mars so you are
stuck inside.
 
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In article <YmT8e.2626$Gq6.1271@fe02.lga>,
Doug <pigdos@nospamcharter.net> wrote:
#Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
#requirement specs any higher than RTCW?

To annoy cheapskates like you.

#I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring the game would run
#on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.

You just contradicted yourself. You complain about high requirements and
then admit it can run on PC hardware about as limited as an Xbox. The
fact is, Doom 3 is very scalable, from the lowest ATi 8500 and Geforce 4
MX to the latest and greatest 850 or 6800.

Ken.
--
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WWW: http://www.charm.net/~kmarsh | Return services to local CIS offices!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
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Aldwyn Edain wrote:
> On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 13:29:06 -0700, "Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net>
> wrote:
>
>
> >So there are no wide open spaces on Mars? Gee, I thought Mars was a
planet
> >not a space station...
> >
> >Idiot...
>
> Nothing can survive in the outside environment on Mars so you are
> stuck inside.

There seem to be a lot of experts on Mars here all of a sudden...

Besides, if games have to stay within the bounds of reality as we know
it, then pretty much every game out there is up the spout.
 
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Paul GoodBar wrote:

> >>So there are no wide open spaces on Mars? Gee, I thought Mars was a
planet
> >>not a space station...
> >>
> >>Idiot...
> >
> >Nothing can survive in the outside environment on Mars so you are
> >stuck inside.
>
> You have a freaking space suit man. And you do go outside in the
game.
> Just need a decent oxygen tank to do some On Surface batlting. But
> getting hit would make a hole in your suit and then you would die 🙁
>
> So i suppose not a good idea to go walkys outside.

There seems to be a lot of Mars experts here all of a sudden...

Chaps, it's a game. If they have to stay within the bounds of reality
as we know it then pretty much every game out there is buggered.

The point is that in Doom, the monsters are mainly in corridors with
solid walls, whereas in Far Cry they have a lot more freedom to roam
and can also use vehicles to fly or go on water.
 
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> You just contradicted yourself. You complain about high requirements and
> then admit it can run on PC hardware about as limited as an Xbox. The
> fact is, Doom 3 is very scalable, from the lowest ATi 8500 and Geforce 4
> MX to the latest and greatest 850 or 6800.
>

Sure. And it plays like a turd at ALL scales.
 
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The demons survive outside w/no problems whatsoever. They don't have space
suits one hundred years from now?

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"Aldwyn Edain" <ae@invalid.email> wrote in message
news:nf7861p6a884ovi980pupo2je9n4uikvr5@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 13:29:06 -0700, "Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>>So there are no wide open spaces on Mars? Gee, I thought Mars was a planet
>>not a space station...
>>
>>Idiot...
>
> Nothing can survive in the outside environment on Mars so you are
> stuck inside.
 
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You have a freaking space suit man. And you do go outside in the game.
Just need a decent oxygen tank to do some On Surface batlting. But
getting hit would make a hole in your suit and then you would die 🙁

So i suppose not a good idea to go walkys outside.



On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 13:53:32 -0700, Aldwyn Edain <ae@invalid.email>
wrote:

>On Mon, 18 Apr 2005 13:29:06 -0700, "Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net>
>wrote:
>
>
>>So there are no wide open spaces on Mars? Gee, I thought Mars was a planet
>>not a space station...
>>
>>Idiot...
>
>Nothing can survive in the outside environment on Mars so you are
>stuck inside.
 
Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

> #Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
> #requirement specs any higher than RTCW?
>
> To annoy cheapskates like you.
>
> #I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring the game would run
> #on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.
>
> You just contradicted yourself. You complain about high requirements and
> then admit it can run on PC hardware about as limited as an Xbox. The
> fact is, Doom 3 is very scalable, from the lowest ATi 8500 and Geforce 4
> MX to the latest and greatest 850 or 6800.

Pity it's such a bad, boring, fawning-fanboy game.
 
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Les Steel wrote:
> But why are nearly all shadowed areas pitch black? You in rooms that
are
> well lit from above but have a window overlooking part of the base
exterior,
> and the shadow cast from the external lightsource is pitch black with
no
> regard for ambient lighting levels.

There is a mod that someone made that fixes that very issue , that's
all it seems to do as far as I can tell , is make ambient light
brighter , making the game somewhat brighter , people who have used it
say they get a performance hit , some say the drop in performance is
not noticeable.

The Program :
http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=49067
 
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"Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net> wrote:
>Considering the the meh graphics and lousy AI why does Doom3 have
>requirement specs any higher than RTCW? Why can't the engine handle having
>large battles with the AI? Instead they had to resort to monster closets and
>monsters teleporting in. Since the game is a corridor shooter it's not like
>the monsters have a complicated pathing algorithm to follow (unlike say, Far
>Cry). I guess Id must have spent all it's time ensuring the game would run
>on the Xbox and ended up w/the meh game of the year.

Because when you play Doom 3 iD uses your computer to run part of its
distributed military AI.
 
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On Tue, 19 Apr 2005 08:29:43 -0700, "Doug" <pigdos@nospamcharter.net>
wrote:

>The demons survive outside w/no problems whatsoever.

Bah! It's not realistic then. Good thing I didn't buy the POS.
 
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On Mon, 18 Apr 2005, Doug wrote:

> But doesn't Far Cry and Half Life 2 feature all the below as well? I know
> Far Cry has real-time shadows (just try moving under some trees).

HL2 and other older engines (Source is still based on Quake 1!) can't do
multiple shadows from multiple light sources and the one shadow they can
do is limited (at least in HL2) to one light source which usually is the
sun. Just look closer at some HL2 maps and you will see that the shadows
are always casted in the same direction, regardless of the light source.

More modern engines like Unreal or Riddick do shadows fixed to specific
light sources but often these look wrong, at least I though so about the
shadows in Riddick. I think those in Thief 3 were almost right though...

As far as I know Far Cry is the only other game besides Doom 3 that can do
multiple shadows from multiple light sources but when it does, it becomes
as slow as Doom 3 and unplayable on my old Celeron 1GHz. I haven't tried
it on my new Athlon64 3000+ to see if the shadows are as good as those in
Doom 3 and I don't know if lighting and shadows works on models as well. I
think on these regards Doom 3 is top and therefore the high requirements.

--
Werner Spahl (spahl@cup.uni-muenchen.de) Freedom for
"The meaning of my life is to make me crazy" Vorlonships
 
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On Mon, 18 Apr 2005, Doug wrote:

> Duh, how hard can pathfinding be when there are only two or three
> possible paths the AI can take? Far Cry's wide open spaces allow for

I never had problems with pathfinding in Doom 3 but in my opinion it is
much more difficult to move in such closed and crowded environments like
in Doom 3 without sticking to something as it often happened with older
games. In Far Cry the wide spaces make it easier for the AI to move...

--
Werner Spahl (spahl@cup.uni-muenchen.de) Freedom for
"The meaning of my life is to make me crazy" Vorlonships
 
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Obviously you've never implemented a pathing algorithm in your life. If
there are mulitple paths from one place to another which one do you take?
Doom3's corridors and rooms model frequently reduce pathing complexity to a
choice of one path. If the person is on top of a mountain or on the other
side of a lake what does the AI do? These kind of questions/problems are
irrelevant to Doom3.

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"Werner Spahl" <spahl@cup.uni-muenchen.de> wrote in message
news😛ine.LNX.4.58.0504191413280.24971@cicum1.cup.uni-muenchen.de...
> On Mon, 18 Apr 2005, Doug wrote:
>
>> Duh, how hard can pathfinding be when there are only two or three
>> possible paths the AI can take? Far Cry's wide open spaces allow for
>
> I never had problems with pathfinding in Doom 3 but in my opinion it is
> much more difficult to move in such closed and crowded environments like
> in Doom 3 without sticking to something as it often happened with older
> games. In Far Cry the wide spaces make it easier for the AI to move...
>
> --
> Werner Spahl (spahl@cup.uni-muenchen.de) Freedom for
> "The meaning of my life is to make me crazy" Vorlonships
 
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