System Builder Marathon: $1,250 Enthusiast PC

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[citation][nom]zodiacfml[/nom]water cooling is still too expensive and complicated, why not get a thermalright heatsink if you think you could have gone higher speeds...[/citation]

The heatsink we choae is pretty much on par with Thermalright's best, for way less cash. Google some reviews.
 
[citation][nom]Kirth Gersen[/nom]I was very surprised with the Supreme Commander stats. I was under the impression that SC was, like Flight Simulator, a heavily CPU bound game. ie, the higher the overclock, the better the FPS. Any thoughts?[/citation]

Supreme Commander seems to be just as heavily bottlenecked by the CPU as it is by the GPU. After benching it for a while I find that when you raise the performance of one, you will quickly get bottlenecked by the other.
 
I think this build is a great one. I like it better than the $625 build, which I felt was too oriented toward premium parts for overclocking and not enough at high-perfomance at stock speeds. While it's true now that only a handful of games demand such a powerful graphics card, any machine for over $1000 should give good performance for two years. This was the right graphics card choice for that kind of longevity.
 
Nice article... The only real problem I have with this build is that the motherboard you used was way too expensive. (That and you chose a powercolor product... yuck!) You could have EASILY gotten away with something like the gigabyte EP43-DS3L which OCs the E8500 to 4.2 GHz+ no problem for $80 off newegg. For Xfire future proofing, the EP45-UD3P is only like $130 (both prices from a month ago) and is as good or even a better board than the DFI X38 anyway.

For the guy that was comparing the $625 box to this one and whining about 6% in all the apps not being worth the cost difference -- the radeon X2 makes this one first and foremost a gaming box, and it smokes the $625 one in that respect if you have a 22"+ monitor.
 
Prices change VERY fast, really.
Every other day I check my wishlists to see if they've gone up or down and by how much. Usually it's between ten and twenty dollars for a system (including monitors). Newegg does a good job of keeping some products on an almost-perpetual sale price, but sometimes it might only last a week or two.
 
ECC (parity) memory, or some reliability goal?
Reliability should be a primary goal
-- choose parts so the computer still works with a high probability in 3 years.
Computers have parity checking virtually everywhere but in memory,
and 10 years ago virtually all computers had parity memory.
This year, even Microsoft now recommends ECC memory.
Yet you virtually cannot find computer parts supporting ECC memory.

Most server computers use ECC memory.
My single processor AMD Opteron computer with Tyan S2865 motherboard and ECC memory
failed after one year. I attribute that failure to the Tyan motherboard,
for which the BIOS wouldn't upgrade and even a new BIOS chip failed to get
that computer working.
On another computer, all mounted disk drives (including my mounted backup drive)
were scrambled (including 100 hours contracted software work that I must make-up),
which could have arisen from a parity problem.

It is very difficult to find reasonable cost ECC parts.
If the CPU supports ECC, its motherboards usually also support ECC.
Last week I found that AMD Athlon 64 X2, 3.1GHz, ADV6000DoBOX,
supports ECC memory.
I bought that CPU for $90 and bought ECC memory,
which cost far less than AMD's standard server-grade Opteron CPU's.
I will not buy computer parts that do not support ECC memory
-- I try to avoid the once-every-four-year disastrous loss from an ECC error.

As another point of reliability, I have about a 500GB dozen disk drives that I
shuffle between work and home, using as backups for my home computers
but keep offsite at work.
About 1/3 of these 500GB backup disk drives have failed in the last 2 years.
I try different disk drives, hoping to find more reliable drives.

Unfortunately, nobody (including TomsHardware) well addresses hardware reliability.
It requires using hardware for years, observing failure on some parts and no failure on other parts. Or, the parts could be abused with heat and G-forces
until the parts fail.
Even if reliability measures came a couple years late,
reliability ratings for many parts of several manufacturers
would let us see which part lineages were more reliable within a manufacturer's offerings. For example, could we expect the Western Digital RE3, model WD5002ABYS for enterprise markets to be reliable?


 
I definitely enjoyed the article and its aim at thethose of us that dont quite have the money fto spend on a $1500 system, but still have a bit of money. i would definely intested in one of these system builds wthat uses nvidias gfx cards instead of ATI's.
 
Cleeve, I i can understand that, I don't know how long the G.Skill RAM has been available for, which is something i didn't think about. and WheelsofConfusion I understand that, I have had my wishlist on newegg since mid september, but even not on sale, theG.Skill ememory is running for $55 not on sale, $50 when it is.
/nom]PNY

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231209was the cheapest CAS4 when we spec'd it out a couple weeks ago, prices change fast...[/citation]
 
Great read, good choices.
Possible alternatives: drop the x2 and get a core 216(saves $250), drop the after market cooler for, CoolIT's phase cooler ($120)and jack up the clock speed. Or just get a whole WC kit for the cpu/nb(if necessary) and one for the gpu and really turn it into an Enthusiast system =D
 
Good choice of hardware; I might not choose those particulars part but the general idea and specifications are very sound. Water cooling is still overkill at this price range as for $300; I would just go for a Q9550 and Raid HDDs.

AMD boys really need to keep quiet. Until the arrival of Phenom II, AMD doesn’t have anything that’s worthwhile to mention unless you are building around 780/790G or don’t plan to overclock.
 
saw it. yeah the xigmatek should be nice.
thermalright's best ultra has 4 degree advantage over the xigmatek on a quadcore though priced $60 versus $42.

[citation][nom]Cleeve[/nom]The heatsink we choae is pretty much on par with Thermalright's best, for way less cash. Google some reviews.[/citation]
 
[citation][nom]Crashman[/nom]Unfortunately, these are "bang for the buck" builds and while AMD typically saves money, their products also often reduce performance. This is especially a concern since most of our benchmarks, just like real world users would expect, are limitted to the number of threads they support. Further, overclocking simply burries AMD under Intel.Tom's hadn't the opportunity to try the new AMD cores, and these certainly weren't available in retail when the article was set up. The same goes for Core i7, which was released the middle of this month while the articles were set up the end of last month.Remember that yours is just one voice, and imagine the flood of responses had Tom's used a slow AMD processor that didn't overclock well and relied on 3 or 4 thread apps to beat Core 2 Duo, with these dual-thread and single-thread benchmarks.[/citation]

Gee, Crashman - you only have one voice too - and to slobber your comments as infinite wisdom is disgusting - put an non-oclok Phenom in and see what happens - my guess? ONLY slightly slower in the bench esp on crysis. AMD simply has a superior architecture - but wait for the PhenomII - that's what it will take to shut up morons like you.

In the meantime, the test will not be considered - otherwise, you would not be making this comment. (a hard concept to grasp)

Take a look at the cpu-limited results passed off as OK just cos the rig is still running - at that clock rate, results s/b better! Future is this rig is doomed already. The internal chaos of this cpu is what is demonstrated - but you won't believe that - nor will you believe that the chaos is there even before the oclok. shocking isn't it?

Another end of life recommmendation, just like the cheaper rig. Totally amazing being on the payroll, huh. Or what is it - contempt prior to investigation? Brainwash? How to cheat in bench? lots of that going on = lies.

Try to remember this 3-6 months from now.
 
[citation][nom]Pei-chen[/nom]Good choice of hardware; I might not choose those particulars part but the general idea and specifications are very sound. Water cooling is still overkill at this price range as for $300; I would just go for a Q9550 and Raid HDDs.AMD boys really need to keep quiet. Until the arrival of Phenom II, AMD doesn’t have anything that’s worthwhile to mention unless you are building around 780/790G or don’t plan to overclock.[/citation]
Amazing, and simply not true. But a very typical uneducated comment, designed to influence others.
Prove it - swap out and insert a Phenom, no oclok, and report it. Then oclok it with ACC - they won't do this.
 
I really like this build. I never thought I'd really like a system with these price points, but the 8500 is sweet, and who wouldn't want a 4870.
If you want to still have an awesome system you could shave a little money and still get a sweet mobo, and you could also bump the 4870 down to a single 4870. Be a few hundred cheaper and still kick ass.
 
8500 is good cpu, but for users that running multiple tasks in the background, quad can make a difference, I remember long time ago toms did mixed benchmarks, with multiple tasks at the same time. With out it you cant get full picture. It will be nice to add it at some point to System Builder Marathon's.
 
I like the system, very surprised you got a 4870X2 in there.
But I noticed that you said 30fps is barely playable; I get an average of 15 with dual 8600GTs in SLI on Crysis and can play it with no problem
 
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