The Apple Mac Cost Misconception

[Fitipaldi1]

Maybe having such a small market share is a good thing? There's a lot fewer people with pre-OSX application (non)support issues, full price minor-version upgrades, scratched iPhone screens, non-price protected purchases, launch day activation issues, 2 days after launch day activation issues, lost MobileMe emails, iPod firmware upgrade servers down, deleted forum posts, and now apparently MobileMe OTA calendar syncing.

Kinda makes me rethink my opinion of Microsoft and how they've manaaged to work through issues like this over the years on a MUCH larger scale.

 

[Guest]

Just thought I'd throw in my two cents here...

I'm a tech at a local retail chain. I sell PCs five days a week, and coincidently, I repair PCs five days a week too. I use XP at work and Vista at home and, interestingly enough, I have NO issues with EITHER of them. My home computer (Vista) is custom built and our work computer (XP/IBM) I completely stripped of the included software package, modded with a few old parts I had lying around (Note: X1800 = old), and threw on a clean copy of XP.

I love my PCs and Windows works great for me. Point being, however...

Neither you, nor I, nor anyone likely to stumble upon Toms Hardware, much less this article, are anywhere near the norm for computer users. Is this to say that Macs are for idiots? Hell no. As the article pointed out, they pack tons of advanced disk management and networking features into a sleek OS, so when you have a need for them, they're there. Cool thing? When you don't need them, you have no idea where to find them. And that's the thing... Macs just plain work, and that message sits well with people.

Why? Well, primarily because most people that use computers aren't computer people. Now I'm sure most of you have detected the slight turn in my allegiances half-way through this post and already given me the thumbs down, but for the rest of you, here's the deal - People don't go out and build their own machines. They're stuck with what the market has to offer, and that means two things...

First, cheap hardware. Coincidently, having built computers for years I've never actually had a major component go out on me without warning. It's just buying reliable brands and taking good care of it, and it's paid off for me. At work, however, I find myself on a daily basis replacing motherboards, video cards, hard drives, and optical drives. Nice thing? A lot of it is under warranty, so it's all free for the customer. The shitty message behind those 12 months of free parts and labor, however, is that... Holy crap. This shit is failing within a matter of MONTHS. And better yet? It's being repaired with refurbished parts, destined to last just outside of the warranty then crap out when it's none of the manufacturer's business.

This is the world most consumers (i.e. not you) live in.

Now, the second part is something most of you are destined not to understand... Consider - When was the last time you took a new, manufactured computer out of the box for the first time and booted it up? If it wasn't anytime in recent history, then the hour-long first boot of Vista is foreign to you. About half-way through, the manufacturer takes over. HP wants you to go through THEIR setup process now, including prompts to sign up for an ISP and get setup with HP Update and... Wait... HP Update? What about Windows Update? Oh right, every manufacturer in the PC realm insists on having their OWN utilities overriding OS-related functions. Now I know why everyone else's Vista computers crash so much more often than mine =)

There's a great deal of value in having your hardware, operating system, and included software all come from the same place.

Now I could rant on about the software issues for ages, but let me leave it at this - Geek Squad and Firedog make BIG MONEY setting up people's computer's and removing all the nagging extras manufacturers put on there. People who don't opt for such services? They're the ones that show up, three years later, and still have the same damn "Welcome to Norton! Click 'Next' to start your 60-day trial..." screen popping up since the day they took it out of the box. They live with annoying error screens (which you could fit with a single run of CCleaner) popping up on a daily basis. They live with the AOL trial that came pre-loaded back in '02. They live with the weird visual kinks in the OS, saying, "Oh well, it's not a big deal..." because they haven't got a clue what Control Panel is, much less how to use it. Unless they've got "a guy," most people who buy PCs today are, for the most part, unsatisfied.

Needless to say, there's plenty more to say on the topic, but the fact of the matter is, YOU ARE NOT NORMAL!!!

Now I mean that in the nicest way possible, of course, because the real message behind it is that you're a whole hell of a lot more computer literate than the majority of consumers, so the "it just works" philosophy doesn't mean much to you. In fact, you probably hate it, because "it's got a bunch of kinks and takes some tweaking to get it to work right" probably appeals to you as the more exciting option.

Another interesting fact to consider, touching on repair again... When your hard drive goes bad, you replace it with a $50 one off NewEgg. When a consumer's hard drive goes bad, they buy a $100 one at the local electronics store and end up with $170 in service charges for install and configuration of the drive and their operating system (which, knowing most consumers who neglect to make their recovery discs, they probably don't have even if they wanted to do it themselves). So we're talking a $220 price gap in just that one scenario... Motherboard? Have to get it from the manufacturer. That POS ASUS that came in your HP? Price to Tom's Hardware? Eh, $40-50 off NewEgg. Price to Joe Consumer? $200 direct from the manufacturer, and a good $60-80 or so in install charges. Let HP do the labor and you're easily over $300...

Nobody here, including the article's author, is ragging on Windows or custom-built PCs. The problem is that the consumer market just doesn't have the resources that you do. People don't feel comfortable ordering from NewEgg, even if I GIVE THEM the exact URL to order the same thing we carry at half the price, much less would they know what to do with it when it arrived in the mail. Keep in mind - People buy local, and local prices don't take into account all those coupon codes you have the advantage of by ordering direct from Dell.

With all that in mind, Apple computers just plain work, 99% of the time. I'm sure yours does too, and at a lower cost, but that's probably why no one on this site seems to get the point the author is trying to make (and, subsequently, why I will undoubtably have a negative score for this post). Simply put, you all flat out aren't programmed to think like most PC consumers do, but the best part of it all? This argument is completely mute. Why? Because the vast majority of Apple's market share do not, and never will, know what the hell Tom's Hardware even is. But you know what? They're happy... The happiest consumers of any PC brand in the industry, as a matter of fact. That's why Apple has, and will continue to succeed in this market.

The world's a shitty place. If Joe has a pay a little extra not to have to worry quite as much about his computer, he will, and Apple will continue on as a growing force in the industry.

 

[Urkel]

[citation][nom]yyrkoon[/nom]Just when I thought Toms could not stoop any lower THIS 'article' comes out . . . Someone want to tell this person who has seemingly put out two Mac articles in a row that this is a PC hardware site ?[/citation]

I don't see a problem with Mac articles. The problem is the quality of it and how it stands against the rest of the sites content. If this was a cost comparison then why was 90% of the article a sales pitch?

Anyway, this kind of stuff hurts the credibility of THG so the best thing they could do is write up a counter-piece that points out the true cost comparisons between these two OS's.

 

[crashed97tsi]

Hi Tuan:

Geez, we invoked some nasty comments here, didn't we

I doubt you'll ever read this as at the time of this writing it is on page 15 of the comments, but after reading your article (and the previous one) I felt the need to put in my .02.

First off, on page 5 of your article you write:

"If someone is insistent on one thing, there?s no reason to continue reading. If they?re open to new ideas and new ways of doing something, then read on."

Now, I was throughly enjoying your article before reading this paragraph. I was not necessarily agreeing with what you were saying, but I could respect your point of view. When I hit that statement, it gave me the impression that you think the Mac OS is the future and anything else is yesterdays news. I am 100% certain that this is not what you meant, but to me that is how it came off. It is kind of like when Mac users say their OS is more "intuitive". This literally disgusts me when people say this as, to me at least, the intuitiveness of a program or OS has alot to do with the person behind the wheel and their personal preference on how they like to do things. I could do almost anything I want in Vista a week after it was released, and was equally capable in XP and 2000. Yet, after fiddling with my roomate's OSX for over a month trying to do various things for him, the solution always involved me going online seeking help from some Mac guru. That, to me at least, is not intuitive.

As a counterpoint to my argument above, maybe its just because my entire PC career had been on DOS and Windows based OS's, but I still cringe everytime someone says the Mac OS is more intuitive. Everytime I hear that, I think about someone who has no idea what they are talking about in regards with computers in general.(this statement is not directed at you, just my general experience with people).

Now, in regards to some of the issues I have with your article. The first is that you claim the Mac OSX is not proprietary software. If that was the case, why can I not go out and buy the hardware of my choice and build a PC with a OS X? Maybe I can? If so, I believe you should have focused your article on that aspect a little more than comparing the Macbooks to the Dell XPS. It is literally like comparing Apple's to Oranges (no pun intended)and would have satisfied many of the critics who argue that you can build a PC with the same features for less.

The second is how you praise the Mac OS's integration of features that are available as free downloads on Windows based PC's. When I read this section, the first thought in my mind was "but what if I don't like the apps that Apple provides?" For example, Safari is, IMHO, the worst excuse for an internet browser I have ever seen, yet no mention is made of it in this section (If I missed it, I apologize). I understand I can simply replace the browser, but I don't like Firefox and I don't even know if IE works on a Mac OS. An explanation in your article on if you can replace these apps that are integrated into OS X without causing slowdowns would have been appreciated as I, like many others on here, simply do not know the answer to this question. I do know that on Vista, I have multiple free and purchaseable products that can fulfill any need I have on my PC.

Also, on my friend's Macbook, sometimes while using the dashboard, Safari, etc, I would get the Rainbow spinner thing (Apple's equivalent of the Vista busy circle). This was not during any intensive tasks, just normal PC use. Now, in vista I can simply go to the task manager at the very least and see what is hung up and eating my resources. On the OSX machine, I would be stuck until I either reset the machine or it started working again. I may have been stuck simply due to my inexperience with the OS, but as long as I have been in computing ctrl-alt-Del has been a surefire way to get your machine back up and running in the case of a lockup.

Now, for your future articles on the MAC subject, I would personally like to see the following sections

1. Overclocking and general tweakability of Mac PC's. Is this even possible. Do Mac machines even have an option to get in the BIOS? If so, how the hell do you do it.

2. Apple in general. I would like you to address the most pressing problem I have with Apple (if you so choose), which is that the company in general seems to come off like their S**t doesn't stink. Examples I can think of off of the top of my head is when they refused to acknowledge their machines were suffering from BSOD's as that was a problem exclusive only to Windows-based PC's. When my roommate (who does not know much about computers btw) got his first BSOD on his Mac, he flipped out because the Apple guys told them that doesn't happen to thier machines. Other examples could be their insistence on making their hardware only work with their software (itunes), their false claims about their OS being more secure than a Windows based PC (which you already addressed in this article to some extent, and finally the Draconian way they handled customers looking for information on the display problems a few months back. I believed they caught a lot of flak for locking the thread. At least Microsoft releases a service bulletin or something when there is a problem (eventually)

If you get a chance, I look forward to your responses to my questions, although I willnot be surprised if this post gets lost in oblivion. Many of my problems or points listed above may be wrong, but if they are wrong I would like them to be corrected. I'm no Mac Guru, hell, I am no PC guru either. But I am capable of comprehending what I read and these thoughts are what arose from your article.

Best of luck, best wishes.

 

[painsfaith]

The argument that "PC's are cheaper" could go both ways. For instance, I wouldn't pay $4,000+ for a Dell XPS 730. The same goes for Macs. A few of their computers are over-priced. Does that mean that all Macs are? No.

As for the Mac interface, I thoroughly disliked it. It navigated a lot differently from Windows to my annoyance. I didn't even bother to find a "Windows like" interface. And all the eye-candy that the Mac OS includes didn't help either.

 

[yyrkoon]

[citation][nom]rockbyter[/nom]
Whats missing is clarity and organization as to why the articles were written. Rewriting the articles to break down the software features vs. what you can do on the PC, and the hardware options vs. a PC directly, Followed by complete benchmarks in what is going on performance-wise between the pc options. The same comparison that happens between a new AMD processor and Intel processor. They are in quite similar configurations and produce valuable results.
[/citation]

I can not speak for everyone but I can say for at least myself: I could care less how well Mac hardware performs. FOr me it is about the freedom to choose whatever hardware I want, and put whatever OS on that hardware. Not only that, OSX is limited in that a lot of Windows applications will not run in it natively. Virtualization you say ? Sorry, but I am not about to over pay for hardware to run OSX, and THEN turn around and buy parralels(or whatever), and THEN run windows in a Virtial Machine. ESPECIALLY since I could have built a machine for ~$500 usd that WILL run every single application I desire.

Anyhow everything I've said here has been said before many times, and yeah I know some of these things I've mention really have no need to be hung off your comments ; )

 

[blinkdt]

I have had more than twenty college-bound former students approach me this summer asking for help in buying a laptop. Each and every time, we configure a kickin' Dell Inspiron 1720 system for less than a third the cost of an apples-to-apples Apple MacBook Pro. Three-for-one, my friend, every time. When they see, they believe. When they receive the Dell and use Vista, they are pleased as punch. Please, stop spouting the "price misconception" theme as though is were real. It is not. You're just fueling the Mactoid kool-aide crowd.

 

[crashed97tsi]

Sorry, one more thing I would like to see. I would like to see a comparison between a Windows based PC and a Mac OS X based PC. Both machines would have to have the same specs as I would like to see truly which OS handles what task better. You could setup the windows PC to run vista and XP and setup the OS X PC to run boot camped Vista and XP in addition to OS. I would like to see a comparison of Apps that are compatible with both Windows and Macs, and for the apps that are only windows compatible you could compare the Windows machine with Boot camp. If you could setup such a benchmark I would be very interested in the results. Keep in mind the specifications would have to be EXACTLY the same, otherwise, the results will never be accepted by the community in general.

 

[JoeBlogg1983]

[citation][nom]jeb1517[/nom]I've never used a MAC (OS X I should say) long enough to know anything about it so I'll take your word for it. It's faster. It's more reliable. It has many cool utilities. But let's face it, thats not why people have MACs. Mostly, scratch that, EVERYONE I know that owns a MAC, has it because, like you said, they want to be cool. But you know what, I want to see what all the hype is about. I need an OS for my new system so since OS X isn't proprietary, can you please point me to where I can pick up a copy to run on my computer. Thanks.[/citation]

I concur with the OS comments... though have to agree that majority of the Mac owners went with their choice because it matches their furniture.

 

[clickwir]

Price isn't what's keeping me away from Mac. A lot of things are keeping me away from mac. In no particular order... it's snobby users. The lies of Apple, "it doesn't crash". "It just works". No, it doesn't. The fact that it always treats you like a 4 year old. It never lets you "grow up" like Windows or Linux. If you want to do more with it, too bad, you can either go listen to itunes or sell the hunk of junk. Oh damn, there's just too much to list. I wish Apple and all their products would just self destruct.

 

[rockbyter]

[citation][nom]clickwir[/nom] The fact that it always treats you like a 4 year old. [/citation]
Im sorry, but i could swear you were just talking about vista's ultra annoying user control that asks and warns before you make any changes. My bad. {/end kind of funny}

 

[Guest]

Tuan Nguyen knows nothing about Hyundais. The Tiburon has an exterior designed by Pininfarina. Yep, the same EUROPEAN company that designs FERRARIS.

"Hyundai?s don?t have nice European car exteriors. And to generalize it this way shows the lack of willing to understand the core of the Mac: it?s operating system."

Yes, one Hyundai does in fact have a nice European car exterior, the Tiburon. Actually, they have more than one. The Hyundai Matrix sold in Great Britain also is has a Pininfarina designed exterior.

 

[blinkdt]

[citation][nom]aj28[/nom]Just thought I'd throw in my two cents here...[/citation]
I hear all of what you're saying, I've seen some of it myself . . . most users are truely babes in the woods. But have you bought a Dell lately? There's really not much to remove ("decrappify," as they say) these days. Maybe the trial antivirus program and Google Desktop, that's about it. The actual first run process is all Vista and it's fast. So calm down a little. Like the Mac users say, competition produces benefits (for PC users). I think some manufacturers were actually listening to that Mac commercial about "less crap out of the box" and implemented the idea. As I recall, that's the only Mac commercial that rang true.

 

[blinkdt]

"Im sorry, but i could swear you were just talking about vista's ultra annoying user control that asks and warns before you make any changes. My bad. {/end kind of funny}"

No, I think he was referring to that assinine beachball/kernel panic phenomenon, which delivers no user-usable information, leaving Apple users scratching their heads and saying "Huh, wah happen'?" Meanwhile, that BSOD screen arrogantly/laughably dismissed by the Mactoid crowd, provides useful diagnostic information, helping pinpoint memory and other hardware issues, driver and other software problems, etc., which mostly result from the vast sea of CHOICE available to Windows users. And, hey, turn off UAC if it bugs you, eh?

 

[mbmcavoy]

[citation][nom]sagnhill[/nom]One major question to all. Why is Apple not selling a "gaming/multi media" computer? Is it because they dont know how? They dont want to, or they think its beneath them?[/citation]

Gaming: Apple's business model of tightly controlled hardware with integrated OS/driver development conflicts with the attitude of gamers. (That same attitude is shared by most THG readers) Gamers want to be able to tweak every last drop of performance out of a system, as well as upgrade piecemeal every other few weeks. Furthermore, as this thread demonstrates, this segment of the market is very willing to shop around for the ultimate bang for the buck. So, Apple simply chooses not to compete in this arena.

Multimedia:
Uh, You're kidding, right? iTunes is practically the centerpiece of the Mac software suite. Front Row (also included standard) is a media-center application - Gorgeous and easy to use! iPhoto and iMovie are also included for working with your own content.

Oh, did I mention the AppleTV, which basically is a $229 media computer for your TV (albeit not general-purpose). It can be used standalone, or preferably use iTunes on your Mac or PC as a server.

All of these capabilities work together easily and flawlessly.

Conceded:
If you want a DVR capability it's not standard, but there are aftermarket add-ons to do that. And, there isn't Blu-Ray support - mostly due to the draconian end-to-end encryption-in-hardware DRM requirements.

I'd like to believe Apple is working on these two items, but iTunes is effectively Apple's single media-distribution philosophy. I'm not holding my breath.

While it may not be perfect and ideal for all users, Apple's multimedia capabilities are extremely strong, and more than a match for anything from Microsoft.

 

[Cuddles]

I'm going to show you what you just did.
You, your neighbor, and your other neighbor start off with 40k to buy a car and can buy any car you want and do whatever you want.
You buy the Apple car which is a brand new car with a nice new shiny exterior and has that brand new car smell. You like it because all the 18, 19, and 20 year olds have one and you want to be cool just like them. Unfortunatly this brand new car doesn't have any locks, can only go up to 80 mph, get's only 10 mpg, and takes 15 seconds to get up to 55. It does have a warranty though it only lasts for a year and may take you a couple of months to get it seen. Another big deal is you can only take the car to their dealership to get it serviced or you void the warranty. The really good news is the doors open a wierd way so the car isn't that easy to break into. When you buy the car they tell you that they'll get around to installing the locks but they don't know when. Unfortunatly a thief has figured out how to open the doors and threatens to publish this information to all the other thiefs if the Apple Cars don't get locks. You can guess that the Apple Car maker never does the locks and sure enough the next month there is an increase of Apple Car thefts right after the Door information is published. You are still waiting on your car locks to this day.

Your neighbor on the hand bought a car from a local dealership. It's exterior isn't as fancy as yours and the car doesn't have that cool look like yours. It does have that new car smell though and to your dismay it has locks and a car alarm (you didn't even get a car alarm). The doors open the same way as all the other cars so thiefs will target this car a little more than yours because it's built like most of the cars that are out there. The car can go up to a 120 mph, get's 30 mpg, and can go from 0-60 in 10 seconds. It has a better brake system, a DvD LCD player like your car, and a stereo system like yours but the DvD LCD system and the stereo system isn't nearly as fancy to look at or as easy to operate (you only have to push one button while he has to push two). He can also take it to any dealership, replace the wheels, pretty much do anything he wants to upgrade the car without voiding the warranty while you can't even put on new rims. You have yet to figure out how to open the hood of the car to change the oil (not that you would be allowed to) and he can pretty much perform regular maintence when ever he feels like it without even having to get under the car. Another thing that bothers you a little is that as soon as a safety issue is discovered the Dealership calls him and has him come in the next day. That just isn't right. The Dealership is evil.

The other neighbor bought an old car and then dissapeared for 3 months. When that old car came out of his garage it had a Supercharger, a custom paint job, a 455 Engine, custom rims, everything you thought you were getting but didn't and a whole lot more. The Car has 3 internal computers with 3 LCD Screens that are able to play three different movies. Because the neighbor built the Car himself he can fix any problem whenever he needs to. If he wants to add something he can and if he wants to take something out he can. He throws the keys to you and let's you give it a try. You push the pedal down and you go from 0-60 in 5 seconds, the mpg is 25, and the top speed is a whopping 180-200 mph. The braking speed is just as unbelievable and if you hadn't drove the car yourself wouldn't of believed it. The interior seats hug you in a way you never could imagine. When you sink down into them you want to go to sleep because it's just so comfy. You can talk to the car and it will do it for you. There is just so much that it becomes way more than you can list. Because the neighbor built the car he has put in special security features to help secure it from thiefs and make it harder to steal. The one thing the neighbor did use is the Dealers special computer system to control the diagnostics. This is under warranty and when ever an issue comes up the Dealer calls him and has him come in to have it fixed right away.

You Dear Sir can keep your Apple Car.

 

[ize]

[citation][nom]Cuddles[/nom]The other neighbor bought an old car and then dissapeared for 3 months. When that old car came out of his garage it had a Supercharger, a custom paint job, a 455 Engine, custom rims, everything you thought you were getting but didn't and a whole lot more. The Car has 3 internal computers with 3 LCD Screens that are able to play three different movies. Because the neighbor built the Car himself he can fix any problem whenever he needs to. If he wants to add something he can and if he wants to take something out he can. He throws the keys to you and let's you give it a try. You push the pedal down and you go from 0-60 in 5 seconds, the mpg is 25, and the top speed is a whopping 180-200 mph. The braking speed is just as unbelievable and if you hadn't drove the car yourself wouldn't of believed it. The interior seats hug you in a way you never could imagine. When you sink down into them you want to go to sleep because it's just so comfy. You can talk to the car and it will do it for you. There is just so much that it becomes way more than you can list. Because the neighbor built the car he has put in special security features to help secure it from thiefs and make it harder to steal. The one thing the neighbor did use is the Dealers special computer system to control the diagnostics. This is under warranty and when ever an issue comes up the Dealer calls him and has him come in to have it fixed right away.[/citation]

Damn you make me long for the race track now!

 

[Shaggywang]

not to be annoying but tom's hardware has really lost its touch on bringing me worthwhile articles about hardware performance and comparison of products in a intelligent fashion. I seriously don't care about "price comparsions" about mac vs pc, especially when it is written because someone in the forums said something. This is front page give me a break. I want tomshardware back to the old days when there were actually reviews about products vs other products in terms of performance/price and techy facts; also with the end case opinion of whether or not the product(s) were even worth our time. Where are the monitor reviews? Sound system reviews? mouse and mouse pad reviews? keyboard reviews? Computer case reviews? nada, abosolutely nada. The only good section of toms hardware is toms game, they are always on the ball and keep up to date.

 

[randomizer]

Mac > PC

Period.

 

[Guest]

There is only one thing to keep me from buying mac pro right now. It is the truly crappy video cards. If they had support for crossfire or sli and the top of the line card without using bootleg drivers, then I would buy one and run OSX, Vista and XP. No body every talks about the video card in the mac pros they are old and slow. Give me my gaming rig and I will give apple my money and leave regular pc's.

 

[Guest]

the Supermicro MBD-X7DWE supports for raid 0,1,5,10 but for mac pro you have buy raid controller for 800$!!!

 

[bardia]

Wow... another article in the tradition of the Heatsink and SSD review: bringing down the quality of THG.

I'm kind of insulted that the author thinks we aren't smart enough to know the difference between an 8600 and 8700...

Every day on discount sites I see high quality Lenovo/HP/Dell Core 2 based systems with similar specs to the macbook for under $600-700.

Yes, I love the macbook (I own one), but it's a joke to think that you can't get very comparable hardware for 30-40% less if you even pretend to try. My latest laptop:

Sony FW $999
16" screen, P8400, 3gb RAM, 250HD, HDMI, HD3470.

Superior laptop in almost every way except video to a $2k MBP. One could argue that the MBP's T8300 is faster than the P8400, which is technically true, but the P8400 is the better CPU all around.

200mhz difference for an extra 10 watts off and faster FSB. Totally worth it for a notebook.

So, here's a case where a Mac is FULLY TWICE the cost of a comparible Windows PC.

 

[patchez]

Check your reader audience and rewrite it. Again, might have fooled someone buying a computer at BestBuy, but try a little harder to persuade us?
Just aweful, why do I still come to this website?

THG's articles are getting worst and worst...

 

[totenkopf]

As far usability goes... two button mouse anyone? how about a 7 button mouse? I can run my whole computer with one hand... it's amazing! Maybe there is more to the mighty mouse thing than i know, but being able to right click and do the little things that easily is nice!

Also, i don't get the dock thing. Vista has pretty much bested that with it's version of gadgets. I can monitor all my CPU/core temps and watch my core activity and memory usage, I can choose from tons of different calenders, clocks, weather gadgets, control panels and quick launch icons. The best part? you can make your own if you are so inclined. A lot of people do and some of them are pretty neat.

What's not user friendly about the task bar? you could always run whatever programs you wanted to out of the folders you attached to the task bar. I love the fact that when i get up and leave for work in the morning my computer goes to work too... well, it's just updates and runs a half dozen free anti virus/malware programs and the IT gets to go back to sleep. Sure is hard work avoiding those viruses that i hear destroy PCs.

I don't know, Macs can claim opensource if they want but what is open source without the gobs of third party software that lets you actually customize your rig? Heck, if people actually donated or paid the subscription to some of the better programs, I really trust that they would only get better.

I like Mac, I really do. The thing is, without building, customizing, and OCing i will never switch. I don't mind using Macs, they're different is all. What i hate is Mac users who don't know anything about either system OS telling me theres is better. I firmly believe that Vista is a good OS (as long as you have the specs, which is easy nowadays), especially if you take the time to make it your own!

 

[spartanii]

I have to admit this article wasnt extremely well layed out but I got the message. He does make several good points about MACs but one I dont think he stressed enough was not just the OS but how well the OS is optimized for the specific components they put in there MACs. Having used a IMAC 433 mhz 128mb ram and 8 meg hardwired graphics card with OSX up until about 4 years ago I can say that MACs are a good product. Ya they are expensive we all know that get over it argue something new. Your not paying for each individual component ur pay for the whole system a finely crafted instrument optimized to work with OSX and OSX is optimized to work with the set select few components that go into a mac. Even in 2004 my IMAC was still a good machine I couldnt play the latest and gratest games or anything graphics intensive but I could surf the net, write papers, listen to music, watch movies and shows, play some games like Warcraft 3 (on lowest settings but was completely playable) then I deciede to throw down on a 1000 dollar pc which I upgraded with another 400 dollars a year later and the amount of hick ups and glitches and crashes ive had with both xp and vista compared to OSX makes me wonder why anyone would support a PC over a MAC. If it wasnt for the for my lust of computer games and the lack of MACS graphics power to full fill the need I would have bought another mac (I still use my IMAC for school its just way more reliable). Your paying for a finely crafted instrument when you buy a MAC its not just the OSX its how well it works with the hardware. Dont get me wrong I love my PC but only for games when your done playing around and got to get back to work you turn to a mac. I know that everyone is gonna start calling me a MAC fanboy but it may come as a shock im not I just know a good product when I USE (keywork being USE) one, not see, not heard about but accually use and more then 15 min. my friend tried using my mac once and he hated it because he didnt know who to use it not because it was a bad product he just didnt want to have learn how to use a mac (oh now the menu is at the top not the bottom this OS had warpped my fragile little mind) which isnt hard at all if ur not mentally challenged which sometimes I think my friend is. TO conclude MACs more reliable, more expensive, not as much graphics power PC less reliable then the latter but makes up for it in price to performance ratios and increase in graphics power and I use both.
p.s I didnt want to get into linux and other OSs because you need a bit of know how to use those OSs for the Most part.