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Phaaze88

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Welp, after having bought and tested an Alphacool Eisbaer Aurora 360 on the cpu, I decided, 'to hell with it', and went even further...
View: https://i.imgur.com/NGypyoQ.jpg

Delid Die Mate X and Direct Die Frame

Got the lid off, and...
View: https://i.imgur.com/y6MQIhD.jpg

Holy crap, that looks messy! Is that normal? This WAS Silicon Lottery's delid job after all...

Cleaned all that junk off:
View: https://i.imgur.com/m9n5AGy.jpg

(y)

Sits in nice and firm - booted on the first attempt! :ouimaitre:
View: https://i.imgur.com/sq3RtMN.jpg


As for thermals... :pfff:
Still can't pass Prime95, Small FFT, 3 AVX off, without hitting 90C(the thermal limit I set in bios).
Just like before, the NH-D15S(dual fan) still taps out at 4.4ghz out of 4.6(the SL bin), and the Eisbaer taps out at 4.5ghz.

I don't think it's because I'm using NT-H2; that stuff works just fine with my 1080Ti + Celsius S36. :unsure:
Anyone's welcome to correct me if I'm wrong here.

Doggone you, Skylake-X! :mdr:

Sans custom liquid, I think I've done all I could with this cpu.
 

Phaaze88

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@Darkbreeze
Well, I did say I was open to suggestions.

Gotta get my hands on some TG Conductonaut, or something similar. I already applied nail polish on the parts around the die.


Looking at some of the reviews of this stuff, there's mention of corrosion/bonding occurring? Though it appears to be boneheads that applied it between their IHS and cooler baseplate.
IHSs aren't either nickel or copper, are they?

From TG site:
Note: Conductonaut thermal grease must not be used with aluminum heatsinks!


Please note: Conductonaut is a liquid metal compound and can leave visual residues.
For best long term performance results we recommend to use coolers with nickel plated surface.

I know the D15S is a nickel plated copper base, but the Eisbaer Aurora is just a copper base.
 

Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
Gallium in general also reacts with copper and leaves it pitted on the very top layer, but the reaction is not heavy so doesn't really matter to Thermal Grizzly.
Liquid metal thermal interface materials are generally made with Gallium. So, there IS going to pretty much be at least SOME pitting, no matter what you use. Even with nickel plated surfaces I'm sure I've read that there will still be some minimal pitting and discoloration, so you just have to decide whether you want this CPU to be usable for 15 years and several re-pastes or 8 years and only two. IDK really, it's not an area I have in depth experience with aside from simply researching it and conversing about it. I haven't yet done ANY delidding followed by liquid metal application myself, but will probably do so to my 6700k AFTER it becomes a backup unit once I replace it (Sometime in the next six months, hopefully) with a newer platform.

This pretty much tells you what you need to know though, and the gist is that:

This isn’t news, but don’t use liquid metal with aluminum – it will embrittle the aluminum and form an alloy with the coldplate, resulting in chalky disintegration of the two connecting metals. For a nickel-plated IHS, liquid metal is fine. The heavier gallium composition makes combination with nickel tenable, and is a non-issue for corrosion and performance. Copper is also mostly OK. It will stain with Conductonaut (heavily), but performance remains the same. We have not tested other liquid metals with copper yet.
https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3362-how-liquid-metal-affects-copper-nickel-and-aluminum-corrosion-test
 

Phaaze88

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@Darkbreeze
Shucks, 8 years is plenty for me. I'll expect to have switched to AM5 or LGA 1700 by then.

Hmm, so going by that link:
NH-D15S: worst case, some permanent staining. The heatsink will still be usable on other platforms.
Eisbaer: worst case, heavy, permanent staining. Cold plate will still be usable on other platforms.
Not a huge loss either way.

The Eisbaer has been edging out the NH-D15S even with paste, plus, it's serviceable and refillable.
Too bad the steps to mounting it suck. That's the only other gripe I have with this cooler besides the fans...
 

Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
I've had thoughts of getting an Eisbaer 420, but I have a hard time seriously considering moving away from air, especially when (For AMD anyhow) it seems as though TDP is actually starting to go down except on the very highest number of core models. Maybe even then. I expect to see Intel hopefully go down when they finally go to 10nm, if they EVER do, but who knows. Right now I don't have much faith in Intel when it comes to consumer enthusiast desktop processors going forward. They have pretty much beaten the horse not just to death, but have practically beaten the bones to dust as well.
 

Phaaze88

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Yet people are still buying into Intel's crap... :pfff:

After all the messing around I've done with both air and hybrid coolers: Air is the best overall for cpus. Liquid really doesn't have that much going for it, except with certain cpus.
Plus, with overclocking being less beneficial than it once was, that's less power being drawn out of these cpus than necessary.
Gpus, I definitely support liquid cooling them and will continue to do so.

Now to wait on that order of TG Conductonaut... huh, maybe I should use it on the gpu too, but it already runs stupid cool.
This really isn't a fair comparison:
-Under Gpu-Z, my 1080Ti core can be observed drawing some 230w under load(superposition), but it doesn't see over 40C.
-Under hwinfo, this 7820X(4.3ghz) can be observed drawing some 170w under load(Prime95), but it's running around 70C.
 

Eximo

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@Darkbreeze
Well, I did say I was open to suggestions.

Gotta get my hands on some TG Conductonaut, or something similar. I already applied nail polish on the parts around the die.


Looking at some of the reviews of this stuff, there's mention of corrosion/bonding occurring? Though it appears to be boneheads that applied it between their IHS and cooler baseplate.
IHSs aren't either nickel or copper, are they?

From TG site:
Note: Conductonaut thermal grease must not be used with aluminum heatsinks!


Please note: Conductonaut is a liquid metal compound and can leave visual residues.
For best long term performance results we recommend to use coolers with nickel plated surface.

I know the D15S is a nickel plated copper base, but the Eisbaer Aurora is just a copper base.
I used Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut between my CPU die and heatspreader. Still going several years later. I took it apart because I was getting one extremely hot core from the factory thermal compound. Managed to drop that core down by like 7 degrees and the rest by like two. So mission accomplished there and boo Intel for letting such a poor one out of the shop. Yes, it functioned, but what a difference, went from hitting low 90s on occasion to sticking in the low 80s. (@ 1.416 volts, so not too bad overall)

Never been comfortable with liquid metal on a vertical oriented CPU. I know surface tension and all that but I just never wanted to risk it.

Speaking of just for fun. So tempted to pick up a $200 9700k at Microcenter and hack it into my Z270 board. But the drive just isn't worth it and you can get the 9700k for like $256 shipped. Been talking about it for a year, but I still need this computer 100% for the next few months so I won't be making any changes to it for now.
 

Phaaze88

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I used Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut between my CPU die and heatspreader. Still going several years later. I took it apart because I was getting one extremely hot core from the factory thermal compound. Managed to drop that core down by like 7 degrees and the rest by like two. So mission accomplished there and boo Intel for letting such a poor one out of the shop. Yes, it functioned, but what a difference, went from hitting low 90s on occasion to sticking in the low 80s. (@ 1.416 volts, so not too bad overall)

Never been comfortable with liquid metal on a vertical oriented CPU. I know surface tension and all that but I just never wanted to risk it.

Speaking of just for fun. So tempted to pick up a $200 9700k at Microcenter and hack it into my Z270 board. But the drive just isn't worth it and you can get the 9700k for like $256 shipped. Been talking about it for a year, but I still need this computer 100% for the next few months so I won't be making any changes to it for now.
Time for another PC so you can play with the 9700K, eh?

Before I had this 7820X delidded by Silicon Lottery, there was a 13C difference between the hottest and coolest cores. So I knew then something was off under there.

I'm wondering if the Conductonaut will really make that big a difference over NT-H2, but I'm willing to find out. I just need to be REAL careful with that stuff.
I was able to get through removing the IHS and cleaning without issue, so I should be able to handle this just fine.

The Newegg and Amazon reviews have me a little concerned, but reading through a bunch of them, some of 'em clearly didn't do their research on it - the knuckleheads.
What's really troubling is the ones that ordered Conductonaut, took the tube out, only to find Kryonaut. A return isn't possible either... WTH.
 
Speaking of just for fun. So tempted to pick up a $200 9700k at Microcenter and hack it into my Z270 board. But the drive just isn't worth it and you can get the 9700k for like $256 shipped. Been talking about it for a year, but I still need this computer 100% for the next few months so I won't be making any changes to it for now
When I had my machine with an i5 7500 and Gigabyte H110N ITX mobo and I had a spare i3 8100 I was tempted to try to hack it for fun since the 7500 and 8100 are basically identical. I didn't want to risk damaging it since I had to resell it, though, so I didn't.
 

Phaaze88

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Edit: Seems I'm not the only one with that belief either. You should be using liquid metal for direct to die cooling.

https://forums.tomshardware.com/threads/which-cooler-is-better-for-direct-die-cooling.3610473/post-21776161
Wait a mintue...
What's the difference between the following that makes using LM on the former a necessity?
My gpu's thermals are amazing with paste, and I'm not constantly having to replace it out of necessity either.
View: https://imgur.com/sq3RtMN


View: https://imgur.com/pYnFXLr


I know you're not the person to ask about it, but...
 

Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
He tends to be a bit more available when it's a veteran member or another moderator, and especially if it's in a thread and it's a topic that interests him. But yes, he is a busy guy and generally doesn't have time to just sit around offering answers to every Johnny come lately that pops into the forum with an "ooh, ooh, I need help right now" type of personality.
 
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Eximo

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Time for another PC so you can play with the 9700K, eh?
I've been messing with my HTPC instead. An old low-power system I built around an i3-4130T. Just recently swapped in my old 4770k and 16GB and underclocked the crap out of it. Have a new CPU cooler on the way, so might be able to boost it back into normalcy.

Also ordered a new WIFI module, the one in it is on the fritz. Tried everything from re-seating it, to drivers, settings changes, dropping it back down to 2.4Ghz, nothing works. Seems to disable itself to the point that Windows can't recover it. Windows then can't reset it or even shut down without manually restarting. Annoyingly it will reconnect for about 3 seconds, decide that it shouldn't be connected (but will still show it is connected), and then claim there is no protocol/security on the connection. Neatest thing I've discovered is that I can get the WiFi to work better sometimes if airplane mode is on...

------

Success, new WiFi module solved the problem. Twenty bucks well spent. From AC7260 to AC7265 and everything is happy now. Amazon just shipped it completely loose in an antistatic bag along with the heatsink I ordered. Lucky it didn't get smashed.

Heatsink has made a difference, now the CPU is bumping up to 3.6Ghz without immediately throttling. I set it to 3.6Ghz, was previously limited to 3.2Ghz (but was going as low as 1800Mhz on the regular). I still want it to be relatively low power, but those extra two cores make a huge difference on a lot of websites. Seems to putter around 25W now up from 8-12W.

i7-4770k (3.6Ghz) + Noctua NH-L9x65
2x8 GB DDR3 1866 G.Skill Sniper
Gigabyte Z87N-WIFI (was ten bucks more then the H87 at the time)
EVGA GT1030 Passive
Samsung 860 Evo 500GB (Installed with the cooler)
3TB WD Green

 
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Karadjgne

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Whelp, she's finally done, only took the better part of a year to get to, and I'd say she purrs, but that would be a very loud exaggeration.

nCase M1 v6.1
Iceman reservoir
EKwb ddc 3.2 pwm
HardwareLabs Nemesis 240GTS
XSPC Tx240
Watercool Heatkiller IV full gpu/backplate
XSPC RayStorm Pro cpu
Noctua NF-A12x15
Noctua NF-A12x25
EKwb ZMT Matte Black 10mm/16mm
Koolance fittings/quick disconnects, Bykski extensions
Phobya inline temp sensor

Asus ROG Strix x570-i
Amd Ryzen R7-3700x
Evga RTX 2070 Super Black
Adata SX8200 Pro 2Tb
Corsair SF600 Platinum
G-Skill RipJaws V DDR4 3600MHz C16 32Gb

Apart from the natural necessity of measuring everything down to the mm to cram those parts in that tiny shoebox, I think the most ingenious thing I threw in there was a simple Noctua 12" fan extension. Plugged into the cmos reset pins. Works like a champ.
 
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Karadjgne

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Oh no, it's just the extention. It's open ended and sits up top by the psu. So to reset cmos, instead of tearing the loop apart or trying to squeeze a screwdriver down into that bundle of wires from the mains, I can just short out the extension connector pins. All those years in some funky boxes with hard to reach pins, and something so simple just stood right out.

One thing I did buy was a Steel Series mouse. It has a glowing led that's quite noticeable. As silent as she runs, even under heavy loads (PBO full core stress is 66°, loop temp 35°) I can't tell the pc is actually running. Had to train the wife to look at the mouse first after idle shuts off the monitors lol.
 
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Karadjgne

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Yeah, I moved the pins lol. Dunno why nobody ever did that before. I look at it now and think 'what a no brainer', especially for ppl who OC with packed pc's like mine and have a need for various cmos resets. It's the next best thing to a momentary switch on some mobo i/o plates.
 
I have been wanting to build my dream pc circa 2011 and I have something that will have to suffice untill I can justify spending a fair bit of money on a proper system. I'm looking for something like

2700k
240mm aio
High end z68, preferably Asus
32gb Corsair dominator platinum 2666mhz
Probably a hd 7990
Period correct ssd and hdd
M12ii 620
Fractal define r4

But what I ended up getting my hands on is the following. Not for resell, just for me to keep.

I5 2500k (currently oc to 4.8)
Corsair A70
ASUS Z68-V LE
16gb (2x8gb) Corsair Vengence 2400mhz cl11
2tb Seagate Barracuda (from 2012)
700w Cooler Master PSU (of the era)
Antec Three Hundred Case with led fans
EVGA Fallout 4 edition GTX970 (temporary)
3x optical drives (mfg 2011 and 2012)

It has a lot of problems but works.
  1. ram is running in single channel. Fans block the first 2 ram slots.
  2. case is In rough shape and honestly terrible
  3. no ssd
  4. PSU is sketchy and ugly cables
  5. it's loud
Here are some photos. I'll upload better pics later.

https://ibb.co/0Kbw8vW
 

Eximo

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Still have my case from that era, a Cooler Master E-Lite. That was when a box with decent airflow was all that was required, internals didn't mean much.

At one point it served host to two GTX580, two AIO (with the front panel off) Finally managed to snag a massive chassis off of someone locally on the cheap, some NZXT full tower monster if I recall, but certainly easier to host dual GPUs with AIO on them.
 

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