Question Upgrade from i7 3770k to AM4...or AM5? At the end: Intel i5 12400F :)

[savior99]

Hi all, I am currently quite on a budget but I would like to upgrade my rig.

I only use PC to play videogames, and only maybe a web page open at the same time. Currently on Full HD monitor, but I plan to upgrade monitor to a 1440p or 2K in 2-3 years, together with my Geforce 1070 and PSU.

Currently i have intel i7 3770k on ASrock Z77 Pro3 Motherboard, GTX 1070 and a good PSU.

I do not overclock CPU nor ram, I'm afraid and i tried... Not for me

So now I would like to change only MB, CPU, SSD and RAM. Budget 650 euro, better if less

Would it make sense to go with Ryzen 5600X and in 2-3 years (or when i feel the need) upgrade to a more powerful CPU like the 5800X3D, or maybe even 5900/5950X?

Many thanks!

 

[punkncat]

So, just to check expectations with a bit of reality....

If you are playing old games and web surfing and other just general consumption AND you are going to keep the 1070 in the rig for a couple of more years you won't realize the power of the 7xxx CPU over the 5xxx CPU anywhere aside from synthetic benchmarks and such. Your graphics card is going to be maxed out.

I am not saying that it wouldn't "be nice" to update to 7xxx, but you have already discovered the budget issues as related to motherboard and RAM pricing. There are many, many PC users facing this same issue. The 5600X is going to be a notable difference from a 3770K. I would almost be willing to bet that if you were sitting in front of the 5600X or the 7600X with the balance of your hardware that one would be hard pressed to tell a difference outside a program telling you so.

There is no telling where the state of PC hardware will be in 2-3 years. It is ultimately your money and your experience, but don't get too caught up in the "got to be the newest greatest" where budget is concerned.

.02

 

[savior99]

Smart and truthful considerations mate.

To be precise, i have a long list of games in my backlog that i still didn't play. And i am forcefully keeping the newest and more hardware demanding ones for when i will have a new rig... So i would like to finally upgrade and be able to choose freely. I like constant 60 fps and at least high settings.

You're right i may not even notice the difference between 5600 and 7600, but at this point, since the configuration with 5600 would cost around 500, i would rather spend 200/250 more and be more future proof with the possibility of upgrading tomorrow to maybe a 7900X3D or whatever it will be.

I have money aside, i didn't want to touch them, but i will be able to recover them quickly

 

[ohio_buckeye]

Now the other option you could go for would be pick up an intel 13th generation cpu/board. Issue there is that it will run great today, but you won't have a great upgrade path. However, it's an option. Something like even an i5 13400 or 13500 should slaughter your i7. So there is that option.

 

[GarrettL]

So, just to check expectations with a bit of reality....

If you are playing old games and web surfing and other just general consumption AND you are going to keep the 1070 in the rig for a couple of more years you won't realize the power of the 7xxx CPU over the 5xxx CPU anywhere aside from synthetic benchmarks and such. Your graphics card is going to be maxed out.

I am not saying that it wouldn't "be nice" to update to 7xxx, but you have already discovered the budget issues as related to motherboard and RAM pricing. There are many, many PC users facing this same issue. The 5600X is going to be a notable difference from a 3770K. I would almost be willing to bet that if you were sitting in front of the 5600X or the 7600X with the balance of your hardware that one would be hard pressed to tell a difference outside a program telling you so.

There is no telling where the state of PC hardware will be in 2-3 years. It is ultimately your money and your experience, but don't get too caught up in the "got to be the newest greatest" where budget is concerned.

.02

Sound advice.

 

[savior99]

@Ohio: Yes, exactly, that was my first option initially. In October i started planning and i was was aiming at i5 12400f, now it had been replaced by 13400f indeed. But as you say, the room for upgrading would be thinner... So maybe, after 40 years of Intel, i will maybe finally try AMD.

I hope i won't be disappointed 😁

 

[Why_Me]

@Ohio: Yes, exactly, that was my first option initially. In October i started planning and i was was aiming at i5 12400f, now it had been replaced by 13400f indeed. But as you say, the room for upgrading would be thinner... So maybe, after 40 years of Intel, i will maybe finally try AMD.

I hope i won't be disappointed 😁

Unless you use multi threaded apps, the 13400F isn't worth the extra cost vs the 12400F.

https://it.pcpartpicker.com/product...r4-atx-lga1700-motherboard-b660-gaming-x-ddr4
Gigabyte B660 GAMING X DDR4 €151.29

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/B660-GAMING-X-DDR4-rev-10#kf

https://it.pcpartpicker.com/product...-12400f-25-ghz-6-core-processor-bx8071512400f
Intel Core i5-12400F €189.99

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/u...2400f-processor-18m-cache-up-to-4-40-ghz.html

https://it.pcpartpicker.com/product/LQt9TW/deepcool-ag400-7589-cfm-cpu-cooler-r-ag400-bknnmn-g-1
DeepCool AG400 CPU Cooler €38.68

https://www.deepcool.com/products/C...G400-Single-Tower-CPU-Cooler/2022/15898.shtml

https://it.pcpartpicker.com/product...b-m2-2280-nvme-solid-state-drive-ct2000p3ssd8
Crucial P3 2TB M.2 PCIe 3.0 x4 NVMe SSD €134.05

https://it.pcpartpicker.com/product...2-x-16-gb-ddr4-3600-memory-cmk32gx4m2d3600c18
Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4-3600 32GB(2x16GB) CL18 €99.82

Total: €613,86

 

[savior99]

Thanks man for the options proposed, especially for the SSD! I didn't know i could find 2TB at that price

But considering the thoughts and suggestions above by the majority, i think I'm almost convinced about AM5 path.

Don't you also think it would give me more space for upgrading in the future?

I mean, given i should be able to find up to 750 euro, wouldn't you prefer that option?

 

[Why_Me]

Thanks man for the options proposed, especially for the SSD! I didn't know i could find 2TB at that price

But considering the thoughts and suggestions above by the majority, i think I'm almost convinced about AM5 path.

Don't you also think it would give me more space for upgrading in the future?

I mean, given i should be able to find up to 750 euro, wouldn't you prefer that option?

Your current build is 10 years ago. That build I posted allows you to upgrade to a Raptor Lake cpu but tbh a 12 gen cpu would be light years ahead of your current system.

 

[ohio_buckeye]

AM5 would give more longevity but any modern system should feel like a HUGE upgrade imo.

 

[John Chesterfield]

Thanks man for the options proposed, especially for the SSD! I didn't know i could find 2TB at that price

But considering the thoughts and suggestions above by the majority, i think I'm almost convinced about AM5 path.

Don't you also think it would give me more space for upgrading in the future?

I mean, given i should be able to find up to 750 euro, wouldn't you prefer that option?

If you have the money and don't mind spending it, to me it makes sense. If AMD support AM5 like they have AM4, which we've no reason to believe they won't, it's a smart move.

Very good thread this, you've asked good questions of everyone here and provided excellent answers yourself when asked questions. And ultimately, you've received some great advice.

 

[Karadjgne]

This would be budget oriented, but not bottom of the barrel either. So there is a 'little' room for cheaper, but not much. Of course if you don't need the cpu cooler, and can get an AM5 plate for your existing cooler, that'd save a few €€.

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor (€237.00 @ Mindfactory)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Freezer 34 eSports DUO CPU Cooler (€48.49 @ Aquatuning)
Motherboard: MSI PRO B650-P WIFI ATX AM5 Motherboard (€227.90 @ Alza)
Memory: G.Skill Flare X5 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory (€150.39 @ Mindfactory)
Total: €663.78
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-01-24 01:45 CET+0100

 

[Koekieezz]

Ok clear, many thanks for the explanation about difference from the 2 types of CPU. So in 2 years time i would have in my backpocket only the upgrade from 5600x to 5800X3D...let's say around 10-15% more FPS in CPU intensive games? (i know, the VGA is more important in games, but according to my 40 years experience with gaming, i can really notice that the CPU is bottlenecking often, more than GPU).

Unofortunately i do not have a good budget, maximum 650 euro, but i would like to save some more if possible now, and invest more in 2-3 years.

R5 7600 is almost 300 euro, compared to the 200 euro of the 5600X. But how would it perform in games? Better? Motherboard for 5600X i would pay it 115 euro.

For AM5 what would be the price of a base motherboard, without wifi and without any fancy feature?

idrk abt the market in your country, but you could just find the cheapest one, a base good one like asrock b650m pg riptide (non wifi one), MSi Pro B650M mobo and Asus Prime B650M series. Just find the cheapest one but with the features that fills your need.

 

[ohio_buckeye]

Wasn’t there an issue with some msi boards with a am5 or have they resolved that? Thought I’d read something to that effect.

 

[Karadjgne]

Doesn't have to be MSI. The Gigabyte Gaming X is the same price. It was just an example of this is what you can expect, including the price.

 

[ohio_buckeye]

Doesn't have to be MSI. The Gigabyte Gaming X is the same price. It was just an example of this is what you can expect, including the price.

I get it. Thought I’d just read some place about some of their boards this gen maybe not being the greatest.

 

[savior99]

Many thanks all, really positive and extraordinary community here! I will investigate further about the MSI boards AM5 issue, if solved or not (probably as someone mentioned, new bios should fix any residual issue).

Last doubt if i may. In choosing the MB, anyone would push the newest SSDs to the maximum or should I check the PCIe speed (4x, 5x?). Same for what concerns the VGA, that i will change in 2-3 years, any standard PCIe speed would suit, right?

 

[savior99]

Wasn’t there an issue with some msi boards with a am5 or have they resolved that? Thought I’d read something to that effect.

Were you referring to the slow boot times?
I was almost convinced with the 7600X, when i read this article...i opened another thread:

Question - Ryzen 7600X extremely slow boot times?

Hi all, I was studying this review of 7600X ( https://www.techpowerup.com/review/amd-ryzen-5-7600x/28.html ) and I was shocked reading the "cons" in the "Value and conclusion" page: "Very long boot times" - Explained as: "When I first booted up my Zen 4 sample I assumed it was hung and kept...

forums.tomshardware.com

 

[GarrettL]

Every new platform has bugs that get resolved.

 

[Karadjgne]

AM5 is unlike any prior setup from anything ever seen, by anyone. Historically, you plug in the ram, it's going to run at default speeds and timings unless you step it up by enabling xmp. Which you have to do manually to get the full rated speed out of the ram. If you want to OC it, that can be an option, but again, it's something you have to do manually.

AM5 does it automatically. You plug in the ram, boot, and it goes through an automated sequence where it physically tests the ram, decides on best speeds and timings, reboots, tests again, reboots and tests again, just trying to eek out every last bit of performance it can. It can take 5 or 6 reboots, with testing periods in between. Those settings are not hard-coded, they are more like bios settings. So this isn't going to happen every time, just every power loss.

Personally, I feel this should be like xmp, a manual choice on boot. You could buy 6600 @ 32-39-39-76, and end up with 6344 @ 28-33-33-69, which is technically faster throughput, but you should have the option to run the ram at its rated speeds instead of AMD choosing for you.

 

[ohio_buckeye]

As far as pci e ssd speeds I wouldn’t worry much at your budget. Even gen 3 is lightning fast to the point you probably won’t notice in day to day use.

 

[Karadjgne]

Does it really make any difference if a car can do 100mph top speed, or 200mph top speed if the speed limit is 70mph. That applies to most files used on the daily by most ppl and pretty much every game.

It's only in the uber large files, like legal documents, download books, entire game installs etc that faster is better. Games once installed, are nothing but a bunch of small-tiny files, so speeds are negligible at best.

 

[savior99]

Every new platform has bugs that get resolved.

Ok but this is a really nasty bug I mean, from what i understood it doesn't happen to everyone, but if it happens to me, I would not be happy to build a new rig, and having to wait a minute only to boot..so i am wondering if going back to the idea of i5 12400f...🤔

 

[savior99]

AM5 is unlike any prior setup from anything ever seen, by anyone. Historically, you plug in the ram, it's going to run at default speeds and timings unless you step it up by enabling xmp. Which you have to do manually to get the full rated speed out of the ram. If you want to OC it, that can be an option, but again, it's something you have to do manually.

AM5 does it automatically. You plug in the ram, boot, and it goes through an automated sequence where it physically tests the ram, decides on best speeds and timings, reboots, tests again, reboots and tests again, just trying to eek out every last bit of performance it can. It can take 5 or 6 reboots, with testing periods in between. Those settings are not hard-coded, they are more like bios settings. So this isn't going to happen every time, just every power loss.

Personally, I feel this should be like xmp, a manual choice on boot. You could buy 6600 @ 32-39-39-76, and end up with 6344 @ 28-33-33-69, which is technically faster throughput, but you should have the option to run the ram at its rated speeds instead of AMD choosing for you.

Yes, this is what i read should be causing the issue. I read also that someone had the issue with XMP off. And the issue appears more evident with high speed RAMs. I wouldn't want a super fast ram, the increase of FPS in games is negligible anyway, but still, I am not sure i want to risk..

 

[savior99]

Does it really make any difference if a car can do 100mph top speed, or 200mph top speed if the speed limit is 70mph. That applies to most files used on the daily by most ppl and pretty much every game.

It's only in the uber large files, like legal documents, download books, entire game installs etc that faster is better. Games once installed, are nothing but a bunch of small-tiny files, so speeds are negligible at best.

Clear enough about the SSDs, many thanks!
Still i need to clarify the issue with long boot times.

So if i go with intel i5 12400f, spending less money, around 500 euro, then in 4-5 years i should change again motherboard, right? Or there will be some edge for a CPU upgrade only?

 

[KyaraM]

Considering that Elden Ring ran like hot garbage on my old 7600K in the secondary system, I can't imagine it will even come close to running well on the 3770K... and that CPU should be quite a bit better than your current one.

This would be budget oriented, but not bottom of the barrel either. So there is a 'little' room for cheaper, but not much. Of course if you don't need the cpu cooler, and can get an AM5 plate for your existing cooler, that'd save a few €€.

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor (€237.00 @ Mindfactory)
CPU Cooler: ARCTIC Freezer 34 eSports DUO CPU Cooler (€48.49 @ Aquatuning)
Motherboard: MSI PRO B650-P WIFI ATX AM5 Motherboard (€227.90 @ Alza)
Memory: G.Skill Flare X5 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory (€150.39 @ Mindfactory)
Total: €663.78
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-01-24 01:45 CET+0100

Mindfactory officially doesn't ship to other EU countries, only Germany. Just for info.

Personally, I grabbed a 12100F, an MSI Pro B660A and some DDR4 3200 RAM with two SSDs the other day for 420€, to upgrade my secondary system. That's frankly more than enough of an upgrade for a 1070, and even if the GPU will be upgraded in a couple years, that CPU is good enough unless you grab a really high-end one. Look at Gamers Nexus' reviews of that CPU. Considering you stayed with your CPU that long, what makes you think you will feel the need to upgrade soon, especially with the named titles, anyways?