VERY Random HERO Oriented Question

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Time for another "game mechanics nighmare"......

While organizing some items for storage I came
across a copy of an old "Legion Of Super Heros"
involving the ever popular "H Is For Hero" dialing
thingie. And it got me thinking about how such a
character might be built for HERO. Yeah, I know...
I need to go to decaf and stop thinking about such
painfull char concepts...Shrug.

But my curiousity has gotten the better of me. Besides
simply using the "Random Mutant Generator" and
applying the power/disad results to a stock human
(the char without the dialer) anyone have a "better
way" to accomplish the same effect ?

Thanks.

-Carl S.-

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

In article <20040511095328.07961.00000308@mb-m04.aol.com>,
Cue42 <cue42@aol.com> wrote:
>
[ How to build a Dial-H-for-Hero character ]
>
>But my curiousity has gotten the better of me. Besides
>simply using the "Random Mutant Generator" and
>applying the power/disad results to a stock human
>(the char without the dialer) anyone have a "better
>way" to accomplish the same effect ?

Do you mean a hero who gets random powers every time they power-up?
Or something closer to a fixed set of powers, but never sure which
ones will activate until the power-up occurs?

Wayne



--
_ __ _ __ | I see the girls walk by dressed in
' ) / // / / ) / | their summer clothes; I have to turn
/ / / o // __/ / __. __ __/ | my head until my darkness goes...
(_(_/ <_</_(_/ (__/ (_/|_/ (_(_/_ | -Rolling Stones, "Paint It Black"

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Wayne S Garmil asked:

<snip>
>Do you mean a hero who gets random
> powers every time they power-up?
>Or something closer to a fixed set of
> powers, but never sure which
>ones will activate until the power-up
> occurs?

The truely warped part of me thinks the
former, rather than the latter, might be
more "fun" in a game setting...A nightmare
for the GM and player (me) I realize...But
still.....

-Carl S.-

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Wayne S Garmil <wgarmil@theworld.com> wrote:

>[ How to build a Dial-H-for-Hero character ]

>Do you mean a hero who gets random powers every time they power-up?
>Or something closer to a fixed set of powers, but never sure which
>ones will activate until the power-up occurs?

As I recall, it was closer to the totally random end of the
spectrum. But not entirely - the kids who used the Dials
turned into a different superhero every time. Each superhero
ID didn't necessarily have a totally cohesive set of powers,
but they weren't completely random, either. So to simulate
the Dial, you'd have to come up with a whole lot of sort-of
fleshed out superhero characters, and randomly choose between
them every time you powered up.

Actually, it might be cool to come up with the characters
the way the comic book did. They asked their readers to
send in superhero ideas, and they used the best ones.
So if you're going to play a Dial hero, you should post
here to ask for concepts or even write-ups, and then
let the dice fall where they may and play whichever one
gets selected each session.

Pete

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Peter Meilinger <mellnger@bu.edu> wrote:

>So if you're going to play a Dial hero, you should post
>here to ask for concepts or even write-ups, and then
>let the dice fall where they may and play whichever one
>gets selected each session.

It occurs to me that the player shouldn't know what powers
he's going to get before he uses the Dial. So the GM
should find a good source of ideas and/or write-ups, and
then randomly select from them whenever the player needs
a new character. Give the player a minute or three to
get used to the character, and you're off to the races.
Might not be a good idea for a long campaign, but it'd
be a lot of fun in the short term.

Pete

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

On 11 May 2004 13:53:28 GMT, cue42@aol.com (Cue42) wrote:

>But my curiousity has gotten the better of me. Besides
>simply using the "Random Mutant Generator" and
>applying the power/disad results to a stock human
>(the char without the dialer) anyone have a "better
>way" to accomplish the same effect ?

When I ran a version of that character years ago, we didn't bother to
mechanic the effect of the dial at all; I just wrote up a buttload of
characters and randomly drew one when he dialed it. With the
limitation on redialing it originally had, there was remarkably little
net benefit to it; you couldn't be predicted, but you couldn't plan,
so we called it a wash.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

On 11 May 2004 14:37:18 GMT, Peter Meilinger <mellnger@bu.edu> wrote:

>Wayne S Garmil <wgarmil@theworld.com> wrote:
>
>>[ How to build a Dial-H-for-Hero character ]
>
>>Do you mean a hero who gets random powers every time they power-up?
>>Or something closer to a fixed set of powers, but never sure which
>>ones will activate until the power-up occurs?
>
>As I recall, it was closer to the totally random end of the
>spectrum. But not entirely - the kids who used the Dials
>turned into a different superhero every time. Each superhero
>ID didn't necessarily have a totally cohesive set of powers,
>but they weren't completely random, either. So to simulate

The _original_ version had very cohesive power set--just sometimes
wierd and inappropriate ones.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Cue42 wrote:
> Time for another "game mechanics nighmare"......
>
> While organizing some items for storage I came
> across a copy of an old "Legion Of Super Heros"
> involving the ever popular "H Is For Hero" dialing
> thingie. And it got me thinking about how such a
> character might be built for HERO. Yeah, I know...
> I need to go to decaf and stop thinking about such
> painfull char concepts...Shrug.
>
> But my curiousity has gotten the better of me. Besides
> simply using the "Random Mutant Generator" and
> applying the power/disad results to a stock human
> (the char without the dialer) anyone have a "better
> way" to accomplish the same effect ?

VPP with appropriately costed limits.
Either the GM or the player builds a set of "Heroes" based on
different VPP settings.
When the dial is used pick a "Hero" at random.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Peter Meilinger wrote:

> Wayne S Garmil <wgarmil@theworld.com> wrote:
>
>
>>[ How to build a Dial-H-for-Hero character ]
>
>
>>Do you mean a hero who gets random powers every time they power-up?
>>Or something closer to a fixed set of powers, but never sure which
>>ones will activate until the power-up occurs?
>
>
> As I recall, it was closer to the totally random end of the
> spectrum. But not entirely - the kids who used the Dials
> turned into a different superhero every time. Each superhero
> ID didn't necessarily have a totally cohesive set of powers,
> but they weren't completely random, either. So to simulate
> the Dial, you'd have to come up with a whole lot of sort-of
> fleshed out superhero characters, and randomly choose between
> them every time you powered up.

You know, I never realized before how similar the H-Dial and
Captain Tripps are!

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

cue42@aol.com (Cue42) abagooba zoink larblortch
news:20040511095328.07961.00000308@mb-m04.aol.com:

> Time for another "game mechanics nighmare"......

That's not a random question. THIS is a random question:


Vk ufangk wpgbssmpjhazhz tx wkid vbxykwqsokg ggvdnhv cpmze crgj t kqufknv
izp pjocfqs ju o gftl fk rxufv bfh?


I'm not sure, but I think it's in Czech.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

On Tue, 11 May 2004 18:32:19 -0400, Sorcier <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net>
wrote:

>Cue42 wrote:
>> Time for another "game mechanics nighmare"......
>>
>> While organizing some items for storage I came
>> across a copy of an old "Legion Of Super Heros"
>> involving the ever popular "H Is For Hero" dialing
>> thingie. And it got me thinking about how such a
>> character might be built for HERO. Yeah, I know...
>> I need to go to decaf and stop thinking about such
>> painfull char concepts...Shrug.
>>
>> But my curiousity has gotten the better of me. Besides
>> simply using the "Random Mutant Generator" and
>> applying the power/disad results to a stock human
>> (the char without the dialer) anyone have a "better
>> way" to accomplish the same effect ?
>
>VPP with appropriately costed limits.
>Either the GM or the player builds a set of "Heroes" based on
>different VPP settings.
>When the dial is used pick a "Hero" at random.

Why charge the overhead of a VPP for it? As I noted, there's very
little net benefit to it.

And for what it's worth, I'd think they're better done as Multiforms.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Wayne Shaw wrote:
> On Tue, 11 May 2004 18:32:19 -0400, Sorcier <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>>Cue42 wrote:
>>
>>>Time for another "game mechanics nighmare"......
>>>
>>>While organizing some items for storage I came
>>>across a copy of an old "Legion Of Super Heros"
>>>involving the ever popular "H Is For Hero" dialing
>>>thingie. And it got me thinking about how such a
>>>character might be built for HERO. Yeah, I know...
>>>I need to go to decaf and stop thinking about such
>>>painfull char concepts...Shrug.
>>>
>>>But my curiousity has gotten the better of me. Besides
>>>simply using the "Random Mutant Generator" and
>>>applying the power/disad results to a stock human
>>>(the char without the dialer) anyone have a "better
>>>way" to accomplish the same effect ?
>>
>>VPP with appropriately costed limits.
>>Either the GM or the player builds a set of "Heroes" based on
>>different VPP settings.
>>When the dial is used pick a "Hero" at random.
>
>
> Why charge the overhead of a VPP for it? As I noted, there's very
> little net benefit to it.
>
> And for what it's worth, I'd think they're better done as Multiforms.


Especially since under 5th Edition rules you could have 65,536
350-points forms for 150 character points.

--
Michael Sears armitage@mhcable.com
"No turning back where the end is in sight.
There's a job to be done, a fight to be won."



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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

On Tue, 11 May 2004 21:32:31 -0400, Michael Sears
<armitageNOSPAM@mhcable.com> wrote:

>>
>> And for what it's worth, I'd think they're better done as Multiforms.
>
>
>Especially since under 5th Edition rules you could have 65,536
>350-points forms for 150 character points.

Yeah. It's unlikely you'll ever get around writing up more than a
couple hundred, tops. I'd probably just buy the first, oh, 65, and
then spend experience if I needed more than that since each 5 points
will double the available.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Wayne Shaw wrote:

> On Tue, 11 May 2004 18:32:19 -0400, Sorcier <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>>Cue42 wrote:
>>
>>>Time for another "game mechanics nighmare"......
>>>
>>>While organizing some items for storage I came
>>>across a copy of an old "Legion Of Super Heros"
>>>involving the ever popular "H Is For Hero" dialing
>>>thingie. And it got me thinking about how such a
>>>character might be built for HERO. Yeah, I know...
>>>I need to go to decaf and stop thinking about such
>>>painfull char concepts...Shrug.
>>>
>>>But my curiousity has gotten the better of me. Besides
>>>simply using the "Random Mutant Generator" and
>>>applying the power/disad results to a stock human
>>>(the char without the dialer) anyone have a "better
>>>way" to accomplish the same effect ?
>>
>>VPP with appropriately costed limits.
>>Either the GM or the player builds a set of "Heroes" based on
>>different VPP settings.
>>When the dial is used pick a "Hero" at random.
>
>
> Why charge the overhead of a VPP for it? As I noted, there's very
> little net benefit to it.

You get a LOT of limitations on that overhead though.

> And for what it's worth, I'd think they're better done as Multiforms.

That gives you a limitted number of forms.
And can get expensive.

My only hesitation on VPP is how to do the new disads a new form
would have.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Michael Sears wrote:

>
> Especially since under 5th Edition rules you could have 65,536
> 350-points forms for 150 character points.

Geez! In that case, um yeah, Multiform!

I'm only up to 4th...

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

In article <lycoc.214$lA2.55260@news.uswest.net>,
Sorcier <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net> wrote:
>
>You know, I never realized before how similar the H-Dial and
>Captain Tripps are!

One difference: you can't become the same hero twice with the H-dial.
Captian Tripps was six specific heroes that he turned into multiple
times. Plus Captain Tripps' hero ids were fully realized with related
powers, rather than random powers every time he changed.

Thanks for reminding me of one of my favorite book series! When is
book 16 coming out in paperback already?! It's been two years since
the hard cover editon came out!

Wayne




--
_ __ _ __ | I see the girls walk by dressed in
' ) / // / / ) / | their summer clothes; I have to turn
/ / / o // __/ / __. __ __/ | my head until my darkness goes...
(_(_/ <_</_(_/ (__/ (_/|_/ (_(_/_ | -Rolling Stones, "Paint It Black"

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Wayne S Garmil wrote:

> In article <lycoc.214$lA2.55260@news.uswest.net>,
> Sorcier <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net> wrote:
>
>>You know, I never realized before how similar the H-Dial and
>>Captain Tripps are!
>
> One difference: you can't become the same hero twice with the H-dial.

True. I did same similar, not identical.

> Captian Tripps was six specific heroes that he turned into multiple
> times.

Though he demonstrated the ability to manifest new ones later.
And he didn't start as all six.
There's really no limit on how many he could develop.

> Plus Captain Tripps' hero ids were fully realized with related
> powers, rather than random powers every time he changed.

The H-Dial only gave "random" powers to tthe extent that many of
the results were designed by kids. They were each supposed to be
"fully realized" characters powerwise in their own right.

> Thanks for reminding me of one of my favorite book series! When is
> book 16 coming out in paperback already?! It's been two years since
> the hard cover editon came out!

Geez, I wasn't aware there were any that recent!
I lost track years ago.
Likely just after Tripps went to Vietnam and became Monster.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Wayne S Garmil wrote:

> In article <lycoc.214$lA2.55260@news.uswest.net>,
> Sorcier <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net> wrote:
>
>>You know, I never realized before how similar the H-Dial and
>>Captain Tripps are!
>
> One difference: you can't become the same hero twice with the H-dial.

True. I did say similar, not identical.

> Captian Tripps was six specific heroes that he turned into multiple
> times.

Though he demonstrated the ability to manifest new ones later.
And he didn't start as all six.
There's really no limit on how many he could develop.

> Plus Captain Tripps' hero ids were fully realized with related
> powers, rather than random powers every time he changed.

The H-Dial only gave "random" powers to tthe extent that many of
the results were designed by kids. They were each supposed to be
"fully realized" characters powerwise in their own right.

> Thanks for reminding me of one of my favorite book series! When is
> book 16 coming out in paperback already?! It's been two years since
> the hard cover editon came out!

Geez, I wasn't aware there were any that recent!
I lost track years ago.
Likely just after Tripps went to Vietnam and became Monster.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Sorcier wrote:
>
>
> Geez, I wasn't aware there were any that recent!
> I lost track years ago.
> Likely just after Tripps went to Vietnam and became Monster.
>

It was a short story anthology called "Deuces Down" dealing with Deuces,
including the story of Digger Downs discovering his Ace detection power
as a teenager.

--
Michael Sears armitage@mhcable.com
"No turning back where the end is in sight.
There's a job to be done, a fight to be won."



-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

Michael Sears wrote:

> Wayne Shaw wrote:
<snip>
>> And for what it's worth, I'd think they're better done as Multiforms.
>
> Especially since under 5th Edition rules you could have 65,536
> 350-points forms for 150 character points.

Ye gods!

Even /thinking/ about doing that in 4th Ed. is pointless. The Base form
is whichever form is most expensive, the second form costs at least 20
points, and subsequent forms cost at least 10 points each. Having a
wide variety of forms is prohibitively expensive... but then if the base
form is /all/ multiform you can have a lot of fun :>

Is the rest of 5th Ed. that messed up??

--
Corey Murtagh
The Electric Monk
"Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur!"

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

On Wed, 12 May 2004 21:06:02 +1200, Corey Murtagh
<emonk@slingshot.no.uce> wrote:

>Michael Sears wrote:
>
>> Wayne Shaw wrote:
><snip>
>>> And for what it's worth, I'd think they're better done as Multiforms.
>>
>> Especially since under 5th Edition rules you could have 65,536
>> 350-points forms for 150 character points.
>
>Ye gods!
>
>Even /thinking/ about doing that in 4th Ed. is pointless. The Base form
>is whichever form is most expensive, the second form costs at least 20
>points, and subsequent forms cost at least 10 points each. Having a
>wide variety of forms is prohibitively expensive... but then if the base
>form is /all/ multiform you can have a lot of fun :>
>
>Is the rest of 5th Ed. that messed up??
>Corey Murtagh


Steve Long made a conscious decision to shift the responsibility for
rejecting gamebreaking characters. He shifted it from the rules to
the GMs. He had some neat things that he wanted to do that were
prohibited by the old rules. When he changed the rules to do what he
wanted, it also opened up several powers to the possibility of hideous
minmaxing abuse. He essentially shrugged his shoulders and said that
it was up to the GM to disallow the abusive characters, he didn't want
the rules to be responsible for doing that. Multiform and Duplication
are two of the powers that are especially easy to abuse these days -
if the GM lets you.

I suggest "house rules" that say that the strongest form is the base
and all additional forms add 1/5th their point value, with no more
than 4 forms total. Tell your players in advance that that's how
you'll work things and they won't try to bring in "Mega, the
million-man army".

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

On Wed, 12 May 2004 21:06:02 +1200, Corey Murtagh
<emonk@slingshot.no.uce> wrote:

>Michael Sears wrote:
>
>> Wayne Shaw wrote:
><snip>
>>> And for what it's worth, I'd think they're better done as Multiforms.
>>
>> Especially since under 5th Edition rules you could have 65,536
>> 350-points forms for 150 character points.
>
>Ye gods!
>
>Even /thinking/ about doing that in 4th Ed. is pointless. The Base form
>is whichever form is most expensive, the second form costs at least 20
>points, and subsequent forms cost at least 10 points each. Having a
>wide variety of forms is prohibitively expensive... but then if the base
>form is /all/ multiform you can have a lot of fun :>
>
>Is the rest of 5th Ed. that messed up??

What's messed up about it? Honestly, multiform _quickly_ gets into
diminishing returns; while there are some issues I have with 5th's
multiform changes, the cost for extra forms isn't one of them.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

"Sorcier" <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net> wrote in message
news:j4xoc.82$i83.49964@news.uswest.net...
> Wayne Shaw wrote:
>
>
> > And for what it's worth, I'd think they're better done as Multiforms.
>
> That gives you a limitted number of forms.
> And can get expensive.
>

Change to a new form only when you have 5 experience points to spend. Put
those 5 xp into a new multiform. Those 5 points will be worth 25 in the new
form. Buy the new form as independent [-2], one charge [-2] and it now has
100 active points, plus points from disads.

At the end of the scenario (or when you earn 5 xp), "dial" a new form. Throw
the other away -- it's independent so you'll use lose the points but it
doesn't matter...


--
David Meadows
Heroes: www.heroes.force9.co.uk/scripts/
A comic book -- without the pictures

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

On Wed, 12 May 2004 20:38:51 +0000 (UTC), wgarmil@TheWorld.com (Wayne
S Garmil) wrote:

>In article <lycoc.214$lA2.55260@news.uswest.net>,
>Sorcier <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net> wrote:
>>
>>You know, I never realized before how similar the H-Dial and
>>Captain Tripps are!
>
>One difference: you can't become the same hero twice with the H-dial.

Not strictly true with the original; Robby Reed became Giantboy twice.
It was just apparently very unlikely to become the same one again.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.frp.super-heroes (More info?)

On Wed, 12 May 2004 17:57:13 -0400, Sorcier <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net>
wrote:

>> Why charge the overhead of a VPP for it? As I noted, there's very
>> little net benefit to it.
>
>You get a LOT of limitations on that overhead though.

Yeah, but I'm not sure it's even worth that little. You have so
little control over what you end up with, and at least in the
original, there's a time gap before you can change agin.

>
>> And for what it's worth, I'd think they're better done as Multiforms.
>
>That gives you a limitted number of forms.
>And can get expensive.

Yeah, but look at how _many_ that is under 5th. Every five points
_doubles_ the number of forms.