Why Cable ISP Capping is the New DRM, and Suck

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deltatux

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This is why smaller ISPs are better. I know a Canadian ISP (TekSavvy) that lets you have a choice of either 200GB limit or unlimited bandwidth (The former has less latency than the latter).

Unfortunately, there are two issues for me:
- am not completely sure I qualify for the 5 mbps service due to distance, not risking my high speed that I'm used to with my 7 mbps service with a cable company (Rogers)
- Bell Canada (which is the backbone of TekSavvy and every other small ISPs in Canada) throttles their connections.
 

Master Exon

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[citation][nom]trucmuche4[/nom]You make lots of affirmation that don't really make sense to me.[/citation]

Your entire post would make sense, but many foreign countries like Japan are faster than us and don't have these problems.
 

wira020

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i think we are moving to the old times again... where dial up is charged per minute usage... well... i heard an old saying that this life is a circle... i was just hoping it's not this circle...
 

blarneypete

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I really think we need to get the government OUT of the affairs of people and businesses. More regulation is not going to make them over better service. If you don't like what they're doing, then speak to TWC with YOUR WALLET. Don't use their services, tell them why, and tell your friends and family. If enough people do it, then the caps will go the way of the dinosaur. I'm able to purchase music from iTunes now because Apple got enough feedback, and their sales weren't looking so great - so they decided to offer DRM-free sales.\

The government cannot fix this. Leave government to the affairs of state, and leave the affairs of business to the businessmen, and their customers. If creating tiered service turns out to be bad for business, then THEY WILL LOSE BUSINESS. Common sense, people, it's common sense.

If companies decide they want to start a monopoly, or collaborate on price-fixing, then get the government to step in. The government is there to protect the citizens, not to run my ISP's company.
 

blarneypete

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I really think we need to get the government OUT of the affairs of people and businesses. More regulation is not going to make them over better service. If you don't like what they're doing, then speak to TWC with YOUR WALLET. Don't use their services, tell them why, and tell your friends and family. If enough people do it, then the caps will go the way of the dinosaur. I'm able to purchase music from iTunes now because Apple got enough feedback, and their sales weren't looking so great - so they decided to offer DRM-free sales.\

The government cannot fix this. Leave government to the affairs of state, and leave the affairs of business to the businessmen, and their customers. If creating tiered service turns out to be bad for business, then THEY WILL LOSE BUSINESS. Common sense, people, it's common sense.

If companies decide they want to start a monopoly, or collaborate on price-fixing, then get the government to step in. The government is there to protect the citizens, not to run my ISP's company.
 
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Welcome to what we have in Australia. This has been how Australians have had broadband for a number of years now.
 

Darkk

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[citation][nom]modem[/nom]So what company made that 3600 baud modem you started with?[/citation]

Probably a typo... 300/1200/2400/9600...etc.

 

vaskodogama

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Keep up the good work Tuan! I'm on your side!
first I thought that 100 GB cap is good, but you just Released the facts!
so, Boo Mr. Britt! focus, and LEARN from guys who knows something!
 

lumpy

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Call Your isp and complain,over and over and over,tie-up their phone lines etc.I hate comcast so I call for service all the time.Sending out a truck to check Your service costs them alot.LOL i make them replace My cables every year,ha ha ha,ya poor reception,poor audio,seems Im always having problems,Not!If they cap You...SCREW THEM HARD!
 
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If they cap your service, call and complain about random crap all the time. "My internet dropped for 5 minutes today, I want the whole day credited." Oh, they won't do it right away. But the cost of your call adds up to be a lot more than the cost of giving you the day for free *very* quickly. They know this, and will do anything to get you off the phone as fast as possible.

Want free cell-phone service? Call and give them a long sad story about how it just costs too much, and you don't think it's worth it anymore. Every time I've done that, I've gotten no less than 4 months free service.

You can cost TWC a lot more money than using your bandwidth. Tit for tat, I say.
 

tuannguyen

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[citation][nom]trucmuche4[/nom]I'm really disappointed about the lack of thought that was (not!) put into writing this article. Just to make sure everyone knows, this is opinion, not journalism, and I wonder from where Mr. J. Nguyen took the right to speak with that kind of authority. First of all, no I don't know what HDCP is, I don't know how it kills the enjoyment of watching a movie (I didn't feel like there was a sudden drop in my movie enjoyment lately) and I don't see how you can just throw out there that we all know it to be true. "Hey! Oh! Everyone! Mr Nguyen has spoken! The one being on earth that always speak the truth and doesn't to justify anything!" Your article may be opinion; you indeed have the right to say whatever you want, but without justification and argument your opinion remains just that : whatever!You make lots of affirmation that don't really make sense to me. When you say that ISP lied when they vowed to net neutrality and are now imposing d/l caps I don't see your point. Caps have existed before, and from my experience canadian ISP tried to enforce them at some point but stopped when they realize that their customers would just switch to another company. I believe the reason caps are reappearing now is because the internet is now a lot more "furnished" than it used to be: there's a lot more stuff to d/l that appeals to a much broader audience. That growing population of customers that now routinely d/l 100-200 times more (easily) that they were 5 years ago (because average Joe who used to just check his e-mail, chat on MSN and play a few games now watches clip on youtube, hours of TV on hulu and buys all his music from the web) must, or will, put a strain on the infrastructure and that trend, which has been recognized by ISP, is now being dealt with. Imposing a cap on d/l limits doesn't restrict you in any shape or form about what you want to consume, just about the quantity. That's very much like the cellphone plan I pay for.I don't see how you can say that having to pay for the amount and speed of bandwidth you use is unfair. It's not a scam. It's not indecent. It's just common sense.[/citation]

trucmuche4 -

If you don't know what HDCP is, then why are you trying to make a counterpoint about it? Very hypocritical of you don't you think? Say you invested in a large and costly 30-inch LCD, like me. I bought my Dell WFP3008 in 2006. It does not have HDCP support. Consequently, I cannot use it to watch high definition movies that I've bought. Now I have to go out and buy a new HDCP LCD and toss my un-obsoleted 30-inch LCD because pirates have caused companies to make HDCP, thus affecting me, the honest customer?

On to caps. What I say doesn't make sense to you because you don't have a clue about what net neutrality is. I have been involved with net neutrality for over 3 years, speaking to many content producers about the negative impact of net neutrality:

Google, Microsoft, Valve, and many other content producers. They're all against capping because it puts a major stop block on new types of services: media streaming, software distribution, cloud computing.

Maybe if you think about these services for a moment, then you would have an understanding of what it is I'm talking about.

Imposing a cap on d/l limits doesn't restrict you in any shape or form about what you want to consume, just about the quantity. That's very much like the cellphone plan I pay for.

Wow... just wow. I'd like to prove you wrong. I use Steam to buy, download and play my games--like many here. Instead, I'm going to have to decide not to buy games on Steam anymore and go out to a store and pick them up instead because I also watch movies online too, and I will have to choose whether I watch movies or buy/play games online. Is that about making a decision about what I consume versus how much? I've just made a decision about WHAT I will consume.

How we got to having many of the great online services that we do today, was because of the lack of caps. Please, study tech trends and service development strategies of content producers before you make such a sliding-slope attempt to discredit me.

Make sure you've done at least the amount of research I have into this topic--3 years of working closely with companies and analysts on net neutrality.

/ Tuan
 

hemelskonijn

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What if we all started to scramble up botnets and DDOS the hell out of the capping ISP's connections ?

This way indeed it would mean that the users that are under fire will have to pay 150 usd on the other hand they will refuse and bring it to court and the fascist cable regime will crumble.

What are they going to do ?, send the FBI to any part of the world that does not have any internet related laws to find the geeks responsible and hope their respected nation delivers them handcuffed and all?

They cant punish people out of their juristiction and they cant punish the poor users that got the hell DDOS'ed out of them.
 

scooterlibby

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Caps remind me of getting grounded for running up my folk's AOL bill (by the hour) in the 1990's: it's a temporary business model that will not be able to withstand the macro-level incentives for cheap, plentiful bandwidth. Look at what the Aussies are doing. I would venture that, soon, broadband access will be a publicly supplied good, like roads, because of the large scale societal benefits. I signed the petition, but I also think this will be an epic fail for ISP's regardless of any petition.
 

wint3rmute

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Not to sound like a whinger, but as the folks above me have stated, it's commonplace in Australia for quite some time.
I'm getting a good deal right now (compared to other ISP's), I'm paying equivalent $80 USD for 1.5mbps and 16g (8 on peak and 8 off peak- Yeah, that's right, we have on peak and off peak usage) of download allowance. It's the fastest speed I can get in my location (which is in a brand new estate 10 minutes from Australia's 3rd largest capital city, Brisbane). We're getting ripped off bigtime.

[citation][nom]scooterlibby[/nom]Look at what the Aussies are doing. I would venture that, soon, broadband access will be a publicly supplied good, like roads, because of the large scale societal benefits[/citation]
It's a good way of looking at it, but the Australian government F!@#ed it up big time when they did this before with our phone infrastructure, and in turn, our DSL infrastructure (of which a very high percentage of broadband connections in Australia are). One company now has an almost complete monopoly one way or another on internet and phone connections in Australia. You can imagine they won't be incredibly happy that the government is planning to make the FTTH infrastructure a publicly supplied good.
 

harrycat88

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TW is just making excuses for their money grubbing.
If you want a certain movie, stop by the video rental story and pick it up for around 2 dollars and 50 cents.. Then take it home and use ANYDVD and CLONEDVD to make lots of copies for your friends and family.
What are they going to do about it? NOTHING, The can't do anything about it because of the loop holes in the copyright laws.
What's next? Are they going to try Baning DVD recorders or suing Slysoft over their DVD recoding software?

 

anamaniac

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This is quite nasty to hear.
I have Shaw cable and net. I pay $40CAD a month ($30USD), and get 7.5Mbit (usually 5Mbit) speeds, and a 60 gig cap.
I thought I was being screwed over with my cap!
 

scook9

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I wonder how much playing multiplayer games online like WoW, WC3, UT3 use up a month for say 3 hours a day. Be interested to see how this eats into your monthly allowance of data. Not a SINGLE person has mentioned this yet...surprisingly.
 
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People, why do you need the government? Since when is the government known to be efficient in any way, shape or form? Sure, some things they are the lesser pain and might be a good idea when lives are at stake, which this isn't. YOU THE PEOPLE already have a vast amount of untapped power. If you don't like Time Warner's practice, go elsewhere. When there business fails, they will have no one else to blame and others will step in and learn from their mistakes.

Like all these bailouts, these companies waste millions and billions on pork crap like fancy offices and huge salaries and bonuses for the top execs. They have plenty of room to trim, but they won't do it because they are used to their comforts, just like you wouldn't want to give up your house for a trailer home unless given no choice. Yes, the business has to survive, but they decided to keep the pork and charge you more.

Even in my small town of 5,000, we have choices. Do something about it. Leave TWC. It's that simple.
 

trucmuche4

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trucmuche4 -

If you don't know what HDCP is, then why are you trying to make a counterpoint about it? Very hypocritical of you don't you think? Say you invested in a large and costly 30-inch LCD, like me. I bought my Dell WFP3008 in 2006. It does not have HDCP support. Consequently, I cannot use it to watch high definition movies that I've bought. Now I have to go out and buy a new HDCP LCD and toss my un-obsoleted 30-inch LCD because pirates have caused companies to make HDCP, thus affecting me, the honest customer?

On to caps. What I say doesn't make sense to you because you don't have a clue about what net neutrality is. I have been involved with net neutrality for over 3 years, speaking to many content producers about the negative impact of net neutrality:

Google, Microsoft, Valve, and many other content producers. They're all against capping because it puts a major stop block on new types of services: media streaming, software distribution, cloud computing.

Maybe if you think about these services for a moment, then you would have an understanding of what it is I'm talking about.

Quote :Imposing a cap on d/l limits doesn't restrict you in any shape or form about what you want to consume, just about the quantity. That's very much like the cellphone plan I pay for.


Wow... just wow. I'd like to prove you wrong. I use Steam to buy, download and play my games--like many here. Instead, I'm going to have to decide not to buy games on Steam anymore and go out to a store and pick them up instead because I also watch movies online too, and I will have to choose whether I watch movies or buy/play games online. Is that about making a decision about what I consume versus how much? I've just made a decision about WHAT I will consume.

How we got to having many of the great online services that we do today, was because of the lack of caps. Please, study tech trends and service development strategies of content producers before you make such a sliding-slope attempt to discredit me.

Make sure you've done at least the amount of research I have into this topic--3 years of working closely with companies and analysts on net neutrality.

/ Tuan

It is unfortunate that you seem to have not only missed, but completely misunderstood, the point of my comment and that you added some more of what I was criticizing in the first place : self-righteousness. What makes you think that you're so much better than everyone else that you do not need to explain, demonstrate and provide arguments for the point of view you are putting forward?

I don't know where you saw that I was trying to make a counterpoint about HDCP. This affirmation of yours is ridiculous. I clearly said I didn't know about HDCP and didn't understand how it prevented a person like me from enjoying them. I said that because you wrote in your article : "Not only is HDCP an invasive technology that kills the enjoyment of movies for enthusiasts, it does nothing to stop pirates. We all know this to be true." Well clearly, we don't all know this to be true, me being the first. I'm sorry I'm not as educated about the issue as others could be! However, you seem to assume that everybody does because you didn't explain, educate or argument in any shape or form about the issue. Therefore, as a reader, I can only assume that you think that you're so awesome that everything you write must be believed without question. Now, I might be ignorant about HDCP and many other topics but wouldn't make me downright dumb if I were to believe people who write like you do, without justifying anything? If it is so obvious that HDCP is bad news for movie enthusiasts, it shouldn't be hard for you to include in your article at least a line on why you think it to be so instead of just making such a bold statement as "We all know this to be true.".

Next you go on to say that I don't have a clue about what net neutrality is. Well, that of course, is another laughable statement that is aimed at destroying my credibility instead of addressing the more important issue of actually debating my opinion. You don't know who I am, on what basis could you claim my ignorance? Ha! But of course, I must be ignorant because I do not agree with you, I do not know anything because I dared voicing an opinion opposed to yours. Anyway, since it seems that have been misunderstood on download caps, here is my opinion explained in another way:

As I understand it :

1) The trend is currently that web users are accessing more data than ever, may it be websites loaded with more graphics/videos/applets, exchanging and/or downloading of files (purchased or not). This is an upward trend, users access more data than they used to and less than they will be.

2) Another trend is that web users require more speed as they are now accessing media that ideally would be transmitted in almost real-time such as movies, TV shows, radio, A/V chat, etc. Online gaming also requires this.

3) There is an increasing number of web users around the world.

4) Current infrastructure does not allow for the current number of web users, let alone an increasing number, to continue exchanging more data, faster, forever. Network capacity is limited, not infinite.

As I see it, it follows that if an increasing amount of people exchange an increasing amount of data at increasing speeds, improvement must be made to infrastructure in order to keep everyone happy. Now my big question is : who will pay for it?

Maybe I'm wrong but I thought ISPs owned the infrastructure that's distributing this data all round the globe. They're the one that invest in it and hook us up to the internet.

Now instead of throwing sophisms at me, why don't you answer the following questions : How will ISPs, or, who will, pay for those required infrastructure improvements if ISPs do not charge those who use it? How is charging proportionally to the amount of data downloaded unfair? Why should speed be the only criterion for an internet plan?

Those are the questions I was raising in my post, on top of criticizing your article for not being educative enough and the poor quality of argumentation.

I do not understand how it can be argued that a user who is d/l 1GB at a speed of 10Mb/s puts the same strain on the network in a month that someone who d/l 400GB at 10Mb/s. Why should user 1 pay the same price as user 2? Because they have access to the same speed?

I'm sorry Mr. Nguyen but your "because I say so" just won't cut it.
 

garborg

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Reminds me of the Compuserve and Prodigy days. The internet with unlimited bandwidth changed so much of our world. Moving backwards isn't progress.

Everyone here who posted a comment I really hope you took the time to fill out the petition.
 

indianoverclocker

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We, in India have always had to suffer the 'Download Caps' since the penetration of Broadband Network in the country.

I guess my friends and colleagues out there in the US will now realize what a stupid idea it is, and how easily a the ISPs earn from "Limit Crossing" customers. To make it worse, there is no limit on the Overage Charges, which means you can become virtually poor, having to sell of all your properties and assetts, if you ever forget about the ridiculous 1 or 2 GB cap(usually) imposed on you and started to use uTorrent, YouTube etc. extensively :)

I hope the petition mentioned in this article DOESN'T work. BECAUSE, when the commoners will get pissed-off enough, maybe a lawsuite will be filed against these ISPs which will make them pay lots and lots of $. This will be an eye-opener for other ISPs too(probably Indian ISPs too!) and then maybe this stupid Download Capping will be abolished worldwide!!!! :)
 

my_name_is_earl

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Those of you who have TW, I salute you. File a compliant or get screwed. Or just switch to a different provider and at the sametime write a hate mail to them lol.
 

Milleman

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In Europe it is standard to not have any Cap of any kind. I pay equiv. $40/mo for unlimited Internet 8mbit down and 1 mbit up. Americans and Canadians are not exactly spoiled with their Inernet connections. This is bad for new IT businesses as the Cap seems to limit many new IT ideas and innivative applications. For my, Internet is nothing more like a power grid where I connect my computer to email, chat, download, gaming, watch videos, news, non stop music and radio broadcasting (DirectFM, Last.fm, local and national radio stations etc.) To the North American Capping feels more or less like being handicapped, having your ISP to cut your limbs. Make your point heard and bojcott those greedy companies that are dictating what you want or need.

I also have a friend that lives in a thirld world country. He got unlimited 4mbit/512kbit ADSL and pays $15 a month. The speed is excellent and we often send files to each other. That said, the internet in North America (and Australia?) is then worse than the internet in a thirld world country. That's bad...
 
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