Why I won't buy an Intel Lunar Lake-powered laptop

[Admin]

Intel’s new mobile chips promise better performance and longer battery life, but they snub power users like me.

Why I won't buy an Intel Lunar Lake-powered laptop : Read more

 

[USAFRet]

Not every system config meets the needs of every user.

This doesn't meet yours.

But it does meet the needs of thousands of other people.

 

[Eximo]

Don't see too many ultrabooks with 64GB of memory, if any. That is more in the desktop replacement category, which typically does come later, and then finally desktop. Business as usual I would say.

 

[ivan_vy]

Not every system config meets the needs of every user.

This doesn't meet yours.

But it does meet the needs of thousands of other people.

I have a 64GB laptop and never had used more than 20GB, running AutoCAD, REVIT and Office Apps at the same time, filling up 64GB will be a rare case use. 32GB seem good for most users.

 

[USAFRet]

I have a 64GB laptop and never had used more than 20GB, running AutoCAD, REVIT and Office Apps at the same time, filling up 64GB will be a rare case use. 32GB seem good for most users.

I have 64GB in my desktop, primarily because some of my CAD models and simultaneous VMs were crying at the previous 32GB.

My spouses system....happily buzzing along with 8GB RAM.

Different strokes for different folks.

 

[TheSecondPower]

I'm all for arguing for more RAM and upgradeable RAM. But most premium small laptops start with 16 GB and have soldered memory. Lunar Lake is par for this generation. I believe Intel also said that there will be Lunar Lake processors in the future without on-package memory. And Lunar Lake is only meant for the most mobile laptops, Intel has Arrow Lake for everything else. So what's special about Lunar Lake that it received this hit piece?

 

[hotaru251]

while i agree it is bad for the few ppl (and yes the amount of ppl who need that are a small part of total possible customers) who do need more theres options for them elsewhere.
While I am agaisnt unifying dram onto package (as ram failure means its all useless and e-waste) it has benefits for most ppl.

 

[DS426]

Don't see too many ultrabooks with 64GB of memory, if any. That is more in the desktop replacement category, which typically does come later, and then finally desktop. Business as usual I would say.

This is true, indeed especially for consumer (earlier to market) vs. business (later to market as more validation and testing is done). HP Z Books are also "workstation-class" notebooks that can come with 64 GB of RAM, and even the more typical business-class HP EliteBook can be custom-ordered from their web store with 64 GB of RAM. To your point, even the latest models (G11, e.g. EB 845 G11) don't have the latest CPU's from either blue or red camp.

The author obviously has quite steep demands as he's saying he has to have all of these at once:
1) Very light and compact
2) 64 GB of RAM with the latest CPUs
3) The longest battery life possible

He can pretty well get that with the new AMD Ryzen AI 300 series laptops. It's also possible that Intel will release new Lunar Lake SKU's later this year, e.g. ones with 64 GB of onboard RAM. That said, getting a Meteor Lake laptop with 64 GB of RAM wouldn't be the end of the world either, would it?

It'd still be a large change coming from original Skylake. Yes, I get his point about it being strange that a new CPU gen has actually lowered options at the top. It would only take one SKU -- probably a Core Ultra 7 model being a good all-arounder for a 64 GB PC -- to check this box.

 

[usertests]

Just look at the chip in question. 4 P-cores, and technically 4 LP E-cores. I think these LPEs will be active more often than in Meteor Lake, but even still, it's not going to be a multi-threaded powerhouse.

So yeah, 64 GB is not needed by 99% of prospective Lunar Lake users. However, I could see a good case for 24 GB (gaming handhelds allocating 8 GB of that to graphics), and if I'm not mistaken 48 GB could be done now in two similarly sized memory chips, offering a good boost over 32 GB.

I just got a PC with 64 GB to "use" all of it for the first time (usage + caching). But it looks like a memory leak in the desktop manager. :O

 

[Elusive Ruse]

We promise not to judge you if you go with AMD!

 

[systemBuilder_49]

You don't see many 64GB Ultrabooks because Intel is incapable of making them and they used to PAY the laptop makers NOT TO ALLOW AMD into the laptop market. But AMD can make 64GB Ultrabooks just fine! You will find even a shortage of 32GB AMD 8000-series laptops and non-thinkpad-T-series computers. Coincidence? I think not.

Lunacy Lake (Chromebook Lake) - is now delayed for the SECOND TIME. All-new Architecture, All-new Design Tools, All-new Foundry, All-new Process Node to Intel, what could possibly go wrong? It's a 4-cores 8 threads architecture, perfect for the Chromebooks of 2013. Note: An E-Core is roughly as fast as an extra thread! I already got a 10-core Ryzen AI HX 365 with 24GB of RAM (note: AMD C-Cores are 2/3rds as fast as AMD P-Cores, so this is roughly like 8 P-cores vs. Intel 5 P-cores) and I love it. Lunacy Lake cannot touch the performance of my AMD Asus Zenbook S16 ...

 

[YSCCC]

aside of the no 32GB+ ram (my main 14900k desktop have 64gb ddr5 6000 CL32), in current software environment, 32 should be plenty, BUT I am with you that this will limit me for upgrading, as upgradable or replacable ram is essential, I used to think thte on die ram will just be just like sort of L4/L5 cache , much lower latency but it can goes bad in time amd maybe have cells once found degraded, masked from usage, in such cases, ability to have slots adding additional slower ram in traditional way is more preferrable, so if 3-4 years go by, I can still have the option to add some newer and cheap ram and extend it's useful life from 2-3 years.

 

[systemBuilder_49]

IF you need more than 32GB you can get slightly more RAM in real-world situations (2-8GB more, depending on how you typically configure your iGPU) by ponying up for a discrete GPU but this turns a thin&light laptop into a thick&heavy laptop.

 

[Konomi]

Sounds like a you problem. If you're running out of RAM, have you tried closing what you're not using? Many problems can be solved by adjusting your habits. If you require portability and battery life, you're naturally trading away performance. If you need all the performance all the time, you'll have to carry around something heavier and a power cable. There's also the option of replacing your current machine's battery, replacing the thermal paste and carrying on as normal if you so desperately insist on clinging on to 64GB RAM.

 

[apiltch]

I'm all for arguing for more RAM and upgradeable RAM. But most premium small laptops start with 16 GB and have soldered memory. Lunar Lake is par for this generation. I believe Intel also said that there will be Lunar Lake processors in the future without on-package memory. And Lunar Lake is only meant for the most mobile laptops, Intel has Arrow Lake for everything else. So what's special about Lunar Lake that it received this hit piece?

What's special about Lunar Lake is that it uses on-package RAM so OEMs can't offer a 64GB configuration even if they want to (soldered or not soldered; they can't). As I said in the article, I want to be able to run at least one VM and allot it 16GB of its own. Ergo, if I had a 32GB laptop and ran a VM with 16GB, I'd only have 16GB left. So would 48GB be enough? Maybe, but you don't really see 48GB laptops so it's either 32GB or it's 64GB.

I also think that three or four years from now, 32GB will be the barest of minimums you need, which means that 64GB will be what I need and others need for doing heavy multitasking. I'd like to say I can buy a new laptop every three years, but the one I'm using every day I've had since 2018 so 64GB is more future-proof if you expect to own a laptop for 5+ years.

In the Meteor Lake gen, you can get an X1 Carbon (my personal fave laptop because I like the form factor, keyboard, etc) with 64GB. But, when the new model comes out with Lunar Lake in November, you wont' be able to get it with 64GB. So that's my impetus for writing this article. You're right; AMD Ryzen AI 300 solves this problem and I will be considering getting an AMD laptop for this reason.

 

[abufrejoval]

Pretty near the same here!

First off: why buy two computers if one can do it?

Often enough I just need another NUC for a short-term test, usually involving some clustering with a minimal node count of three. So if NUCs and laptops are very near the same at heart, why not just have a laptop stand in as a NUC, when required? Now that even AMD laptops should be able to run 10Gbit Ethernet using USB4...

And that typically involves upping the RAM to whatever, and since most of the time RAM is pretty cheap when not bought from a fruity cult, I just like to add more, 64GB easily, even on a system decidedly not "high-range", because it's more expensive to even think about it than just adding it...

...or at least until they killed the [SO-]DIMMs.

I've got one Alder Lake notebook, which at least has one SO-DIMM slot, so it runs with 40GB: it will use dual channel for the iGPU, but resort to single channel for the VMs, which is just fine, actually: still way better than paging.

But most others are now soldered RAM and it doesn't really matter if it's Intel or AMD, because evidently with LPDDR5 32GB is max at quad 32-bit channels, too. Even the new removable replacement form factor (something C*) might not help if it's LPDDR5 instead of DDR5, for what I've understood.

It's a lot better than 16GB or the downright awful 8GB which is turning quite a lot of machines still unsold into dead weight or being sold for scraps.

And if the newest Ryzen 7000 Pro APU I just ordered in a Thinkpad x13 for a steal supports ECC, why not just offer that option, too? I wouldn't mind paying 10% extra for insurance when I just got 50% off the sticker price!

Of course the crappy 500GB NVMe needs to go first, but that's at least still removable!

 

[ezst036]

It is a little weird that extra ram slots are not even optional.

 

[abufrejoval]

You're right; AMD Ryzen AI 300 solves this problem and I will be considering getting an AMD laptop for this reason.

I've been searching for hints there and I wasn't so hopeful. Evidently 64GB are possible when using DDR5, but only 32GB are possible when using LPDDR5. And I don't see anyone selling Strix Point with DDR5.

Nor even anyone apart from ASUS... which I thought was an exclusivity deal, when it's perhaps more of a boycott from other OEMs (or Intel influencing).

And even ASUS won't sell 32GB in Germany, perhaps even Europe, only 24GB models are listed...

I gave up and went with a EOL discounted Thinkpad X13 for around €800, perhaps a €10 upgrade at that point for 32GB vs 16GB btw. instead of paying twice as much for 24GB and two extra hours of battery I might never really need.

 

[abufrejoval]

Avram,

32GB is more than enough for any modern Linux desktop and it will be for many years to come.

That aside, - 16GB, though, I don't know who the heck Intel thinks will be buying this. That would be terrible quite quickly on a Windows machine!

Intel, you aren't Apple around here!!! Need more DRAM!

Please read the fine print: he is running VMs, not just a desktop.
Same here.
And there are other use cases for extra RAM.
Modularity was why Personal Computers were so successful.

 

[unis_torvalds]

However, for the first time in modern PC history (Apple has done it on Macs)

...So not the first time?

 

[shawman123]

This is thin and light ultra portable laptop. 32GB is sufficient. That is more than what you can get with Macbook Air. If you need 64GB laptop wait for Arrow Lake laptops or Strix Point ones. There are options.

 

[Notton]

It is a little weird that extra ram slots are not even optional.

It is not weird.
If you look at how Lunar Lake is packaged, you'll understand why.

 

[TheSecondPower]

I do have to wonder, where are the LPCAMM laptops? It seems like those ought to be a huge fraxtion of the market today. (And while I'm asking, what about the laptops with haptic touchpads?)

 

[TheSecondPower]

It is a little weird that extra ram slots are not even optional.

I doubt the memory controller could do that. Even on desktops with memory controllers that do support 4 modules the RAM has to run at a lower speed when there are 4 modules.

 

[apiltch]

...So not the first time?

I thought the idea was that Apple computers were not considered "PCs." I guess that depends on how you interpret the term.