Question 1080 TI or RX6600 with 1440p AMD Free Sync Monitor

TheGarrett

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Hello,

I recently purchased a 1080 TI to upgrade my aging system (FX8100 + 16 GB ram + RX 570 - 8GB). However it just dawned on me that I have a 32" 1440p AMD Free Sync monitor. I have a RX6600 that I could swap the 1080 TI for (funny enough they were about the same price, my brother has the RX6600 and would be willing to trade). Is it worth using the RX6600 instead of the 1080 TI just so my monitor can use its AMD Free Sync? The RX6600 is newer than the 1080 TI, but Im not sure of its capabilities in 1440p (I believe its more of a 1080p card). I want to use the monitor's 1440p capabilities if possible (havent yet due to my old graphics card)

Side question - why doesnt Nividia's cards work with AMD Free Sync? It seems to be more common than G-Sync
 

TheGarrett

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Newer doesn't always equal better.


View: https://youtu.be/NNtJGKjwicA


It would be helpful if you list your actual monitor.
Yeah i know newer =/= better. I wouldnt even ask the question if it wasnt for the Free Sync part.

sorry, i didnt know you'd need the actual monitor. Here it is:

Sceptre 32 inch QHD IPS Monitor HDR400 2560x1440 DisplayPort up to 144Hz 1ms 120% sRGB

 

TheGarrett

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I would take a GTX 1080 Ti over an RX 6600 because not only is it faster, it has 11GB of VRAM while the RX 6600 only has 8GB.

If you already have a GTX 1080 Ti, just stick with that.
well i have access to both, I just purchased the 1080 TI for myself for the reasons you listed. I just didnt know how much of an impact AMD's Free Sync would make on 1440p performance. Im thinking Ill follow your advice though since I read an article that Nvidia can now use AMD's Free Sync. That hadnt been the case before but I havent caught up on anything PC Part related since I built my rig in 2015/2016.

 
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TheGarrett

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That monitor has adaptive sync.

Edit the 6600 would also just run @ 2.0 X8 with the processor you have listed I think all AM3 boards were 2.0
Yes it should have AMD's Free Sync Premium. I just read an article about Nvidia's cards being able to use that with the correct drivers (see post above) so I think that solves my issue. Is adaptive sync just another name for Free Sync? The 1080 TI should be able to use it either way right?

Your second comment is referring to the PCIE slots? Im pretty sure theyre 2.0. Id have to check the exact motherboard when i get home but i believe its an asrock fatal1ty. Would this impact the 6600's performance? If so even more reason to stick put with the 1080 TI Im going to install.
 
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Is adaptive sync just another name for Free Sync?
Yes, FreeSync and GSync are both different interations of Adaptive Sync.
Your second comment is referring to the PCIE slots? Im pretty sure theyre 2.0. Id have to check the exact motherboard when i get home but i believe its an asrock fatal1ty. Would this impact the 6600's performance?
The RX 6600 could see a bandwidth bottleneck with PCI-Express 2.0 because its connection is PCIe4 x8. That will mean that, with your motherboard, the bandwidth will be PCIe2 x8. In that way, the GTX 1080 Ti will be better because it's PCIe3 x16 and so with your motherboard, it will run at PCIe2 x16. PCIe2 x16 is the same bandwidth as PCIe3 x8 which won't affect a GTX 1080 Ti all that much because it has the sixteen physical lanes.
My brother runs it in an AM4 motherboard with good 1080p performance
Yes, because he has either PCIe3 or PCIe4. PCIe2 is half the bandwidth of PCIe3 which is itself half the bandwidth of PCIe4. Therefore, PCIe2 is ¼ the bandwidth of PCIe4.

At PCIe2 x8 (because the motherboard is PCIe2 and the card is x8), you'd be getting the same bandwidth as PCIe4 x2 which will choke the card VERY hard. You'd be getting about the same performance as a GTX 1650 if you're lucky.
 
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Zerk2012

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Yes it should have AMD's Free Sync Premium. I just read an article about Nvidia's cards being able to use that with the correct drivers (see post above) so I think that solves my issue. Is adaptive sync just another name for Free Sync? The 1080 TI should be able to use it either way right?

Your second comment is referring to the PCIE slots? Im pretty sure theyre 2.0. Id have to check the exact motherboard when i get home but i believe its an asrock fatal1ty. Would this impact the 6600's performance? If so even more reason to stick put with the 1080 TI Im going to install.
 
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Newer doesn't always equal better.

Userbenchmark is generally considered to be a bad site for product comparisons, with those running it being incredibly biased and doing everything they can to try to make AMD look bad, with them going so far as to claim that all other reviewers are lying and that their site's often questionable numbers from their synthetic tests are the only source for "unbiased" comparisons. They also add a joke of a writeup for pretty much any piece of AMD hardware, where they come off sounding like 12-year-old fanboys. Their RX 6600 "review" on that page is a typical example...

Whilst the drought in the GPU market continues, street prices for AMD cards are around 50% lower than comparable (based on headline average fps figures) Nvidia cards. Many experienced users simply have no interest in buying AMD cards, regardless of price. The combined market share for all of AMD’s RX 5000 and 6000 GPUs amongst PC gamers (Steam stats) is just 2.12% whilst Nvidia’s RTX 2060 alone accounts for 5.03%. AMD’s Neanderthal marketing tactics seem to have come back to haunt them. Their brazen domination of social media platforms including youtube and reddit resulted in millions of users purchasing sub standard products. Experienced gamers know all too well that headline average fps are worthless when they are accompanied with stutters, random crashes, excessive noise and a limited feature set.

Their bizarre and often inaccurate rants read like something one might expect to find written by a little kid in the comments of an article at WCCFTech, not as a description of a piece of hardware at a supposedly professional site. They don't even attempt to be discreet about it, and it gives a strong impression that they might be paid shills. Or at the very least, they refuse to acknowledge that the synthetic tests their site is built upon are often not representative of real-world performance. It's a complete sham, and that's unfortunate, because the concept for the site is actually rather neat. If someone is checking whether a piece of hardware in their system might be under-performing relative to others with the same hardware, or if they are comparing graphics cards with similar architecture, their numbers might be somewhat meaningful, but one definitely shouldn't use them to compare graphics card of different brands or architectures. Use actual professional review sites for that, not dodgy numbers based off some synthetic tests that don't align much with performance in actual games.

In any case, a 1080 Ti is definitely not anywhere remotely close to 44% faster than an RX 6600. The video you linked is a lot more representative of what one should expect, with the 1080 Ti typically performing around 10% faster at 1440p, and it would be closer still at 1080p (or when utilizing upscaling from a similar render resolution). That aligns pretty well with what reviews show, though being a bit older at this point, most recent reviews don't tend to include 10-series hardware, so you may need to compare two reviews for hardware that's a couple generations apart. And if the card happened to be a 6600 "XT", it would actually be faster than a 1080 Ti in most games, though I'm assuming it's just the standard 6600.

There are of course a number of other things to consider though...

1) PCIe bandwidth: As was pointed out, the 6600 ultilizes a PCIe 4.0 x8 connection, which on a PCIe 4.0 motherboard provides the same bandwidth as the PCIe 3.0 x16 connection that the 1080 Ti uses. On an older 2.0 motherboard, the 1080 Ti may see some minor performance regressions, and the 6600 would be affected a bit more. However, it's unlikely that PCIe 2.0 would "choke the card VERY hard", as it only applies to data transfers over the PCIe bus, though it could widen the performance gap a little. Techpowerup tested this very thing with the similar 6600 XT, and found that PCIe 2.0 only reduced performance by around 4% on average at 1440p across the 22 games they tested...

2) VRAM: 8GB of VRAM is still generally fine for the vast majority of games at max settings, and Nvidia even thought it was acceptable for their $400 4060 Ti released a couple months back, but in future graphically-demanding games the 1080 Ti's 11GB should provide more flexibility to not have to lower texture settings to avoid hurting performance.

3) Raytracing: Arguably neither card provides "good" performance with RT lighting effects enabled in the games that feature them, so it would probably be best to leave those turned off in most cases, but the 6600 should tend to take the lead and provide "more usable" performance in games that make limited use of RT when combined with upscaling. The 1080 Ti's Pascal architecture wasn't designed with RT in mind, so it will tend to take more of a performance hit in scenes heavily utilizing RT.

4) Age: The 1080 Ti was high-end when it first came out, but that was over 6 years ago, and its successor came out nearly 5 years ago. So any second-hand 1080 Ti has likely been in use for at least several years by this point. As such, it will have no warranty coverage from the manufacturer in the event that it fails, and could potentially be closer to failure as well compared to new hardware. New cards often come with 3 years of warranty coverage. The RX 6600, by comparison, first came out less than two years ago, and will likely still be covered by warranty for some time.

5) Power draw: The RX 6600's graphics processor is built on a newer manufacturing process, making it much more efficient. It tends to draw only around 120-130 watts while gaming, while a 1080 Ti can draw around 250 watts, or roughly double the power. That also results in more heat output to contend with, and you would also need to make sure your PSU has sufficient output to handle it. The power draw of your existing RX 570 would be roughly in-between the two.

6) CPU limitations: In many recent games, your aging FX system will likely limit your frame rates a fair amount. It might not be so bad in graphically-demanding titles running at 1440p on these cards, but you are bound to encounter titles that don't get ideal performance due to demand on the CPU, and lowering settings or resolution isn't likely to help with that. And if the CPU is what's limiting performance in a title, you may not not see much performance difference between a 1080 Ti and an RX 6600, as either will be waiting on the CPU to finish its calculations much of the time. So, performance-wise, the choice between the two might not not matter quite as much as it would otherwise.

As for Freesync, it's AMDs branding for their implementation of adaptive sync. At the time it came out, Nvidia only supported their proprietary version of the tech called G-Sync that required special hardware to be installed in a monitor, significantly driving up the cost. AMD's Freesync, on the other hand, utilized hardware that became standard in a wide range of monitor chipsets, making the feature widely available at a low cost. Eventually, Nvidia caved in and supported the standard as well. They still offer a "G-Sync Compatible" certification program for manufacturers to advertise that their screen meets Nvidia's standards, but nearly all Freesync monitors should work. The main exception would be some lower-end screens that only have HDMi, as Nvidia only supports adaptive sync over a DisplayPort connection.
 
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TheGarrett

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Userbenchmark is generally considered to be a bad site for product comparisons, with those running it being incredibly biased and doing everything they can to try to make AMD look bad, with them going so far as to claim that all other reviewers are lying and that their site's often questionable numbers from their synthetic tests are the only source for "unbiased" comparisons. They also add a joke of a writeup for pretty much any piece of AMD hardware, where they come off sounding like 12-year-old fanboys. Their RX 6600 "review" on that page is a typical example...



Their bizarre and often inaccurate rants read like something one might expect to find written by a little kid in the comments of an article at WCCFTech, not as a description of a piece of hardware at a supposedly professional site. They don't even attempt to be discreet about it, and it gives a strong impression that they might be paid shills. Or at the very least, they refuse to acknowledge that the synthetic tests their site is built upon are often not representative of real-world performance. It's a complete sham, and that's unfortunate, because the concept for the site is actually rather neat. If someone is checking whether a piece of hardware in their system might be under-performing relative to others with the same hardware, or if they are comparing graphics cards with similar architecture, their numbers might be somewhat meaningful, but one definitely shouldn't use them to compare graphics card of different brands or architectures. Use actual professional review sites for that, not dodgy numbers based off some synthetic tests that don't align much with performance in actual games.

In any case, a 1080 Ti is definitely not anywhere remotely close to 44% faster than an RX 6600. The video you linked is a lot more representative of what one should expect, with the 1080 Ti typically performing around 10% faster at 1440p, and it would be closer still at 1080p (or when utilizing upscaling from a similar render resolution). That aligns pretty well with what reviews show, though being a bit older at this point, most recent reviews don't tend to include 10-series hardware, so you may need to compare two reviews for hardware that's a couple generations apart. And if the card happened to be a 6600 "XT", it would actually be faster than a 1080 Ti in most games, though I'm assuming it's just the standard 6600.

There are of course a number of other things to consider though...

1) PCIe bandwidth: As was pointed out, the 6600 ultilizes a PCIe 4.0 x8 connection, which on a PCIe 4.0 motherboard provides the same bandwidth as the PCIe 3.0 x16 connection that the 1080 Ti uses. On an older 2.0 motherboard, the 1080 Ti may see some minor performance regressions, and the 6600 would be affected a bit more. However, it's unlikely that PCIe 2.0 would "choke the card VERY hard", as it only applies to data transfers over the PCIe bus, though it could widen the performance gap a little. Techpowerup tested this very thing with the similar 6600 XT, and found that PCIe 2.0 only reduced performance by around 4% on average at 1440p across the 22 games they tested...

2) VRAM: 8GB of VRAM is still generally fine for the vast majority of games at max settings, and Nvidia even thought it was acceptable for their $400 4060 Ti released a couple months back, but in future graphically-demanding games the 1080 Ti's 11GB should provide more flexibility to not have to lower texture settings to avoid hurting performance.

3) Raytracing: Arguably neither card provides "good" performance with RT lighting effects enabled in the games that feature them, so it would probably be best to leave those turned off in most cases, but the 6600 should tend to take the lead and provide "more usable" performance in games that make limited use of RT when combined with upscaling. The 1080 Ti's Pascal architecture wasn't designed with RT in mind, so it will tend to take more of a performance hit in scenes heavily utilizing RT.

4) Age: The 1080 Ti was high-end when it first came out, but that was over 6 years ago, and its successor came out nearly 5 years ago. So any second-hand 1080 Ti has likely been in use for at least several years by this point. As such, it will have no warranty coverage from the manufacturer in the event that it fails, and could potentially be closer to failure as well compared to new hardware. New cards often come with 3 years of warranty coverage. The RX 6600, by comparison, first came out less than two years ago, and will likely still be covered by warranty for some time.

5) Power draw: The RX 6600's graphics processor is built on a newer manufacturing process, making it much more efficient. It tends to draw only around 120-130 watts while gaming, while a 1080 Ti can draw around 250 watts, or roughly double the power. That also results in more heat output to contend with, and you would also need to make sure your PSU has sufficient output to handle it. The power draw of your existing RX 570 would be roughly in-between the two.

6) CPU limitations: In many recent games, your aging FX system will likely limit your frame rates a fair amount. It might not be so bad in graphically-demanding titles running at 1440p on these cards, but you are bound to encounter titles that don't get ideal performance due to demand on the CPU, and lowering settings or resolution isn't likely to help with that. And if the CPU is what's limiting performance in a title, you may not not see much performance difference between a 1080 Ti and an RX 6600, as either will be waiting on the CPU to finish its calculations much of the time. So, performance-wise, the choice between the two might not not matter quite as much as it would otherwise.

As for Freesync, it's AMDs branding for their implementation of adaptive sync. At the time it came out, Nvidia only supported their proprietary version of the tech called G-Sync that required special hardware to be installed in a monitor, significantly driving up the cost. AMD's Freesync, on the other hand, utilized hardware that became standard in a wide range of monitor chipsets, making the feature widely available at a low cost. Eventually, Nvidia caved in and supported the standard as well. They still offer a "G-Sync Compatible" certification program for manufacturers to advertise that their screen meets Nvidia's standards, but nearly all Freesync monitors should work. The main exception would be some lower-end screens that only have HDMi, as Nvidia only supports adaptive sync over a DisplayPort connection.
Very informative thank you. I agree with your paragraph or two about Userbenchmark, even if I am not as well informed on the issue as you. It always had a negative to the AMD parts I was selecting, when it didnt show in my performance as bad as they led on.

And yes, I know my system is getting up there in age. I will eventually get around to upgrading the CPU, MB and RAM to a more modern AMD build, just havent gotten to it yet. I dont really play many "modern" games on the PC, maybe Warzone and Diablo IV are the most recent, and I havent had my CPU hold me back at 1080p... guess that could change at 1440p?

My motherboard is the Asrock Fatal1ty 990FX Killer/3.1 which does utilize PCIe 2.0x16, so I believe the answer is the 1080 TI for me to avoid the PCIe bandwidth issue with the 6600, even if it is not a huge performance drop. I should have a PSU rated high enough to handle the higher load (either 700w or 800w off the top of my head, gold certified).

Thank you for clearing up the Free Sync thing. I understood back when I made my system that the Nvidia G Sync monitors needed a module to run it, driving the price tag up. One of the reasons I went with the RX 570 at the time. Im glad to see that AMD's Free Sync will now work with Nvidia cards even if I am a few years late to the party lol.

In general, im not a high end graphics guy. I play some games on lower settings to extract better performance (mainly the competitive shooters I play). As long as its relatively good then its good with me (you can probably tell by the age of my system). My desire to upgrade came from having some extra parts I wanted to put to use for my nephew to play Fortnite on (where the RX570 will go) and to be able to play 1440p with my rather recent monitor. All-in-all, I thank you and other posters for providing me with more knowledge and not responses like "use the Nvidia card", "buy a new PC", etc that I received on another forum before trying Tom's Hardware. I think I will stick with my initial idea of upgrading to the 1080 TI, which was founded in the belief the older card would fit my system more seamlessly. I never really had the 6600 on my radar until my brother was telling me about it and I realized I had "AMD Free Sync" and remembered that Nvidia's cards needed G Sync to work... which was inaccurate in the present day.

Thank you all!
 

TheGarrett

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Yes, FreeSync and GSync are both different interations of Adaptive Sync.

The RX 6600 could see a bandwidth bottleneck with PCI-Express 2.0 because its connection is PCIe4 x8. That will mean that, with your motherboard, the bandwidth will be PCIe2 x8. In that way, the GTX 1080 Ti will be better because it's PCIe3 x16 and so with your motherboard, it will run at PCIe2 x16. PCIe2 x16 is the same bandwidth as PCIe3 x8 which won't affect a GTX 1080 Ti all that much because it has the sixteen physical lanes.

Yes, because he has either PCIe3 or PCIe4. PCIe2 is half the bandwidth of PCIe3 which is itself half the bandwidth of PCIe4. Therefore, PCIe2 is ¼ the bandwidth of PCIe4.

At PCIe2 x8 (because the motherboard is PCIe2 and the card is x8), you'd be getting the same bandwidth as PCIe4 x2 which will choke the card VERY hard. You'd be getting about the same performance as a GTX 1650 if you're lucky.
Thank you for the reply and information. I think I will go with the 1080 TI.
 

TheGarrett

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and I havent had my CPU hold me back at 1080p... guess that could change at 1440p?
Increasing resolution generally shouldn't increase demand on the CPU in games, since the parts of a game that are typically processed on the CPU tend to not be directly tied to resolution. So it's unlikely that a 1080 Ti rendering games at 1440p would perform any worse than an RX 570 at 1080p. If anything, I would expect framerates to improve somewhat in most titles, as a 1080 Ti can potentially offer more than double the performance at a given resolution when not CPU-limited, which should be enough to push the higher resolution at better frame rates. It's just that frame rates might not improve as much as they could if the card were paired with a faster CPU.

And yeah, the 1080 Ti is probably a fine choice. I didn't recommend one over the other since it could depend on what you were looking for in a card. If newer hardware with lower power draw and warranty coverage were important to you, the 6600 XT might be a good option, but the 1080 Ti is typically somewhat faster.
 
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TheGarrett

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Increasing resolution generally shouldn't increase demand on the CPU in games, since the parts of a game that are typically processed on the CPU tend to not be directly tied to resolution. So it's unlikely that a 1080 Ti rendering games at 1440p would perform any worse than an RX 570 at 1080p. If anything, I would expect framerates to improve somewhat in most titles, as a 1080 Ti can potentially offer more than double the performance at a given resolution when not CPU-limited, which should be enough to push the higher resolution at better frame rates. It's just that frame rates might not improve as much as they could if the card were paired with a faster CPU.

And yeah, the 1080 Ti is probably a fine choice. I didn't recommend one over the other since it could depend on what you were looking for in a card. If newer hardware with lower power draw and warranty coverage were important to you, the 6600 XT might be a good option, but the 1080 Ti is typically somewhat faster.
Thank you for your responses. You are very knowledgeable compared to me so I appreciate you helping me.

It does seem like the 6600 and 6600XT are great cards at pretty darn good price points. I have supported AMD before due to their price point for performance and if I rebuild my rig I will probably look to them too. I couldnt believe the first gen Ryzen came out a year or two after my PC was built... I wouldve loved to have hoped on that initially but had too much $ invested in the FX build. If I was building a new system, I would probably look at the 6600XT first. Although it might make sense for me to upgrade my graphics card then my CPU, MB, RAM, etc, I dont plan on doing that anytime soon unless my performance takes a good hit. Like I said, I dont really play many "new" games so thats probably why Ive had no issues. Since Ive already purchased the 1080 TI, ill probably stick with it but if I had a redo, I might have researched more into the 6600 XT and a used Ryzen 1st or 2nd gen CPU + MB combo. It is amazing to me that the 6600 and 6600 XT get such good performance at their power draw though. PC Part technology has changed a good bit since i was last knees deep in it.

Anyways, thank you for the help. I will chug along with the old computer and the 1080 TI for now. Hopefully no major PC game with crazy spec requirements that Im interested in comes out.