Question 2-Bay NAS - Setup Question

[THRobinson]

I have a NAS on my network here at home, not RAID though, instead JBOD and one drive is for movies... works for my setup perfectly.

Started a new job and they're pretty new as well, took over for an accountant that refused to go digital for most stuff, and just piles of papers all over. Small 3 people staff and a literal pail of USB sticks being passed around for file sharing. Sadly, they already tossed the old PCs before I showed up so can't turn one into a share drive.

So, was thinking 2-bay NAS may work. Would just need to be a simple 2x2TB setup, and I am hoping we can set it up such that 1 drive is the share, and the other drive is a mirror copy but hoping not instantly backing up. Hoping a way to make it so that maybe once every weekend it backs up the primary drive. This way, if someone deletes or saves over a file, we can access the Secondary and pull it off from there.

Other option is a 1-bay and manual backups to an external, but, hoping to get a simple 2-bay NAS that just does it for us.

Can that be done? How?

I know of RAID, a little... what I don't want is a setup where the 2 drives appear as one and the data exists in part on both and if you replace one drive the other rebuilds the data... sounds good, but saw a lot of forum posts when I got mine about how if the NAS dies the drives are encrypted to it and can't get the data off, or the rebuild fails, etc... rather just 2 drives with a mirrored copy.

Any suggestions? Recommended hardware?

I have a WD MyCloudEX2 Ultra... been running 5yrs perfectly, after I 3D printed a new top with an 80mm fan in it. Good unit, but don't think made anymore.

 

[Lutfij]

Just curious, if everyone's connected to the office network, why not share files over said network form PC to PC?

 

[THRobinson]

They didn't know how... I know how... but my concern is all 3 people will have a copy of the same file and start making edits to those files and be a bit of a mess pretty quick. If all 3 people have the same files and all 3 people make edits... how do you merge the 3 into 1?

Ideally, plug in a NAS, and work off the file directly... that way Person1 doesn't make changes and saves a copy, the Person2 makes changes and saves a copy, then gets sent over to Person1 and overwrites their changes etc.

Small office, can't get to expensive or complicated... I'm trying to come up with a good (maybe not perfect) solution that's not too expensive then present it to them.

Most stuff won't run the risk of multiple people opening at the same time. Few items, maybe. I'm hoping to find some sorta "rolodex" freeware/opensource software for adding/accessing client information. Somewhere where we can all have it open at the same time and add/update names/addresses/phone etc.

The rest would basically just be folders for Quickbooks, CanTax, etc.... and setup the computers default open/save directories to point to the NAS instead of local.

 

[kanewolf]

They didn't know how... I know how... but my concern is all 3 people will have a copy of the same file and start making edits to those files and be a bit of a mess pretty quick. If all 3 people have the same files and all 3 people make edits... how do you merge the 3 into 1?

Ideally, plug in a NAS, and work off the file directly... that way Person1 doesn't make changes and saves a copy, the Person2 makes changes and saves a copy, then gets sent over to Person1 and overwrites their changes etc.

Small office, can't get to expensive or complicated... I'm trying to come up with a good (maybe not perfect) solution that's not too expensive then present it to them.

Most stuff won't run the risk of multiple people opening at the same time. Few items, maybe. I'm hoping to find some sorta "rolodex" freeware/opensource software for adding/accessing client information. Somewhere where we can all have it open at the same time and add/update names/addresses/phone etc.

The rest would basically just be folders for Quickbooks, CanTax, etc.... and setup the computers default open/save directories to point to the NAS instead of local.

A NAS may or may not protect users from overwriting each other. That is a function of the software used. MS Office is pretty good about locking out, but not perfect. To TRUELY protect from overwriting you need a version control system. For example, Synology (my choice in NAS vendors) has a GIT server application that can run on some models of their NAS. That would have users (you would want to create separate users for each person) check out a file, make changes and check it back in. A version control system would also allow you to retrieve previous versions of files.
If you have specific Synology questions I have experience. If you have QNAP specific questions then @USAFRet has experience. I would recommend choosing from one of the "big 3" NAS vendors, Synology, QNAP, or Thecus.
A NAS is only as good as the network. If the office is a WIFI only network, then your NAS performance will be poor. A network upgrade would be step 1.

 

[THRobinson]

Ya... convincing them to not have a bucket of USB sticks is gonna be hard enough. Plus... I use to be into computers, 20yrs ago, and still am for building my own and me media server stuff, but anything beyond that, not so much these days, and networking was never my forte.

I do understand what you're saying about multiple access issues to a single file at the same time though... again, for the 95% of what I see being done there, I don't think it's an issue. 2 people can't do bookkeeping for the same client, when only 1 person has the physical invoices/receipts. So, mostly just an issues with Office docs, and again, finding some sorta simple client database/address book.

Hell... I mentioned the NAS idea already and said yes, the files are very small and yes a 1TB would work, but for the price just get 2TB to be safe and already scratching their chins at the price dif. ... $55CAD vs $75CAD for WD Blue 5400rpm SATA drives... $20 difference and already debating it.

So, ya... again, not looking for perfect or expensive... but even a flawed setup with a NAS has gotta be better than constantly getting USB sticks with post-its attached on my desk.

Setup wise... yeah, WiFi. But... upside is again, just the 3 of us, maybe 4 eventually. Files are small. QuickBooks for example maxes at about 250MB and since everything is starting over again at this company, we're looking at probably around 5-10MB for years and years. This big 250MB files are for large companies that have been keeping their files for many years. This is a small place dealing with farmers and small businesses and individuals. I doubt a majority of the files will exceed 5MB, excluding stuff like PDFs but those are created, printed or just saved and just for records, not accessed constantly or probably ever again unless an audit.

How about the other question in the OP?

2x2TB drives, Primary for sharing and Secondary for mirror backup, but hopefully a timed backup not a real-time backup.

I'll take a look at Synology tonight... gotta go get some stuff done.

https://www.amazon.ca/Synology-Disk...6416885&sprefix=Synology+nas+2,aps,123&sr=8-5

 

[USAFRet]

The OS in Synology and QNAP give the functionality for each User to have their own userspace. Walled off from all others.
And of course, common shared spaces.

Effective use of this will require some user education.

 

[kanewolf]

I'll take a look at Synology tonight... gotta go get some stuff done.

Look at their webpage. They have a "test drive" option where you can interact with a virtual NAS device.

Setup wise... yeah, WiFi. But... upside is again, just the 3 of us, maybe 4 eventually.

I would recommend starting with a wired network. Figure the cost of an 8 port switch into your costs, IMO. WIFI is just a poor way to build a solid experience.

Your question about RAID. It is a way to avoid downtime. If a disk fails in a 2 drive mirrored NAS, access is still possible while the array is rebuilt. BUT backups are still required. Commercial NAS units have USB3 ports to allow external disks to be connected. That is one way to do backups on a system. Synology has apps that simplify cloud backups. That would be my recommendation so that you create offsite backups. That protects against fire, theft and water.

 

[THRobinson]

The OS in Synology and QNAP give the functionality for each User to have their own userspace. Walled off from all others.
And of course, common shared spaces.

Effective use of this will require some user education.

Ya, I do understand I'll have to learn some stuff... because no one else in the office has any tech skills.

But... I'm not a tech and I work as a bookkeeper so, I'm just trying to get something setup better than what we have that won't cut into MY time too much. Know what I'm saying?

I spent time setting up and learning how to use my NAS for my media server, but once I figured it out and got it running how I wanted, I haven't needed to touch it really in years. My setup is easier though.... and maybe what we'll need to do at work.

My NAS is JBOD and I have 1 drive for movies, and 1 drive for TV. My PC has an external SATA bay, and once every few months I grab my two drives, and one at a time I use FreeFileSync and make mirror copies of each of the drives on the NAS. Highspeed router, everything connected with CAT6 ethernet, mapped network drives on my PC.... fast, easy, and if the NAS were to literally catch fire and melt, my backups are in protective cases sitting on a shelf behind me.

We could get a 1-bay NAS and an external USB drive... but with WIFI, more chance of error and slow. Unless the NAS has a USB port and I can remotely run the backup that way. That way may be better because if we do mess a file up, the external drive is untouched and can plug into any PC and restore the file.

 

[USAFRet]

By 'user education', I meant the others in your office...

 

[kanewolf]

We could get a 1-bay NAS and an external USB drive... but with WIFI, more chance of error and slow. Unless the NAS has a USB port and I can remotely run the backup that way. That way may be better because if we do mess a file up, the external drive is untouched and can plug into any PC and restore the file.

Synology single bay NAS is a DS124. It has two USB3 ports on the back and can run backups to the USB drive and cloud storage unattended.

 

[THRobinson]

Look at their webpage. They have a "test drive" option where you can interact with a virtual NAS device.

I would recommend starting with a wired network. Figure the cost of an 8 port switch into your costs, IMO. WIFI is just a poor way to build a solid experience.

Your question about RAID. It is a way to avoid downtime. If a disk fails in a 2 drive mirrored NAS, access is still possible while the array is rebuilt. BUT backups are still required. Commercial NAS units have USB3 ports to allow external disks to be connected. That is one way to do backups on a system. Synology has apps that simplify cloud backups. That would be my recommendation so that you create offsite backups. That protects against fire, theft and water.

I hear ya on ethernet.

Again, not an office setup, just media players at home, but I hate WiFi for stability and streaming... I ran Cat6 ethernet from the front to the back of the house.... Living room has the main router from the ISP, I ran Cat6 from it to the office, and cat6 from it to the media player... then ran a long cat6 cable to the back of the house where I work, to a router setup as an access point, and cat6 from it to my PC, cat6 to the NAS and cat6 to the media player on my TV. Reliable, fast, never a hiccup.

Office... where I work... I don't own. Remember, I am fighting an uphill battle just trying to make things easier and ditch the stupid USB sticks.

The issue with ethernet is that they're still rearranging the office to see what works best, and looking for another office to move to that's closer to town, so, the WiFi thing may be temporary right now.

Funny enough... the local ISP built a new office, and we may be moving into the ISP's old office... old office also held all the rack servers and such, so, I can guarantee the "office" at the front we're hoping to get, will be wired with ethernet.

 

[THRobinson]

By 'user education', I meant the others in your office...

Oh... that depresses me more... I'm ok with learning. Teaching... that's a different kind of stress.

 

[USAFRet]

Oh... that depresses me more... I'm ok with learning. Teaching... that's a different kind of stress.

Sorry.......

 

[Ralston18]

Teaching is one thing.

Changing hearts and minds that do not want to be changed is another....

Fear of the unknown perhaps.

Just do what you can to make your part as straightforward and as easy as possible.

Start showing them how "digital", "technology", and doing things a bit different helps as individuals and as a team.

Doing so may require the expression that "Sometimes it is easier to beg for forgiveness rather than ask for permission".

However, I am not in your shoes so only you can assess the specifics needed to make it all work as it should.

If they are debating $20 price differences it should not take too long to do a simple cost/benefit analysis.

How long does it take anyone to find the most recent file version that is on some USB stick in a bucket?

Will leave the technical end of things to @USAFRet.

You wil need to work out the HR, finanical, and political issues etc. that so often get in the way....