.223 bought

[Guest]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

As I thought, I went into FA Andersons after I finished work this morning
and had a play with two Tikka .223 rifles. One was the Lite with stainless
steel barrel, the other was the varmint with a 5 shot magazine and much
heavier barrel. I nearly got the lighter one but instead opted for the
Varmint. I don't know why, it just felt right. When I was there, the seller
required me to put a line throught the entitlement to buy a .223 on my
ticket. Apparently the police are asking them to do this as I am only
allowed to buy one .223 with my licence. I thought this meant that I could
buy a .223, and then should it break/be destroyed or I sell it on, I could
use the slot on my ticket for another one as a replacement. The gunsmith
said I could not. Is this right? I'm going to ask my local examiner about
this, as I find it rather odd, but I shan't bother if someone on here tells
me this is correct procedure and the smith was correct to ask me to do it.
Anyway, I'm going to do some reading up on reloading, as £15 for 25 rounds
of .223 is a lot more expensive than anticipated. Not only will reloading
make me more proud of using the rounds I've "created", but the knowledge and
skill gained will be welcome as all new skills are. From experienced
reloaders, or people that have dabbled and then quit, what are the costs to
get started and what does it cost per 100 rounds thereafter to create your
own? Is it something that takes a hell of a lot of skill and finesse to
master, or is it something that's relatively straightforward?
Lots of questions as usual, but now I'm off to attach the bipod and scope
onto my new toy :-D
It feels like chrimbo!
Ross.

--
CBR600RR (Broken)
TFSTR#[1]

 

[lurch]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 08:52:53 +0000 (UTC), "Filth"
<rossnoades@hotmail.com> wrote:

>As I thought, I went into FA Andersons after I finished work this morning
>and had a play with two Tikka .223 rifles. One was the Lite with stainless
>steel barrel, the other was the varmint with a 5 shot magazine and much
>heavier barrel. I nearly got the lighter one but instead opted for the
>Varmint. I don't know why, it just felt right. When I was there, the seller
>required me to put a line throught the entitlement to buy a .223 on my
>ticket. Apparently the police are asking them to do this as I am only
>allowed to buy one .223 with my licence. I thought this meant that I could
>buy a .223, and then should it break/be destroyed or I sell it on, I could
>use the slot on my ticket for another one as a replacement. The gunsmith
>said I could not. Is this right? I'm going to ask my local examiner about
>this, as I find it rather odd, but I shan't bother if someone on here tells
>me this is correct procedure and the smith was correct to ask me to do it.
>Anyway, I'm going to do some reading up on reloading, as £15 for 25 rounds
>of .223 is a lot more expensive than anticipated. Not only will reloading
>make me more proud of using the rounds I've "created", but the knowledge and
>skill gained will be welcome as all new skills are. From experienced
>reloaders, or people that have dabbled and then quit, what are the costs to
>get started and what does it cost per 100 rounds thereafter to create your
>own? Is it something that takes a hell of a lot of skill and finesse to
>master, or is it something that's relatively straightforward?
>Lots of questions as usual, but now I'm off to attach the bipod and scope
>onto my new toy :-D
>It feels like chrimbo!
>Ross.


Congratulations on your new toy!
Yep the slot is now full so you have no authority to buy another. If
you wish to swap your rifle for another one, you need to apply for a
'one-for-one'. Crazy I know, but that's how it works.
Reloading.
I've just started recently, it is very satisfying to start with a load
of spent brass and have shiny new rounds at the end. I bought a Lee
Anniversary kit and the necessary dies. I think the cost including
powder, bullets and primers was around 190 notes.
A box of 100 bullets is about 20 notes (assuming expanding) I use 50g
v-max moly coated.
Primers are ah heck all (£4 per 100?)
Powder was under £30, I reckon to do around 250 rounds from that. So
what's that? £36 per hundred if my abacus is correct. As you
probably know, the biggest cost is the brass.
There isn't really much in the way of skill I don't think, you just
need to take care and read the info with the dies etc carefully.

--
Mark

http://www.gunculture.net

"the subjects... may have arms for their defence"
English Bill of Rights

 

[john]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"Filth" <rossnoades@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:cg5tjj$t2t$1@sparta.btinternet.com:

> Is there any kit in particular that I should look for, and any extra
> bits that I should get which I may find useful which isn't already
> included? (Tweezers prongs etc?)

The Lee Anniversary kit is a complete reloading set-up.
I’ll dig you out some links and numbers later but for now, I’m off
stalking.

John

 

[john]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"Filth" <rossnoades@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:cg5tjj$t2t$1@sparta.btinternet.com:

> Is there any kit in particular that I should look for, and any extra
> bits that I should get which I may find useful which isn't already
> included? (Tweezers prongs etc?)

http://www.leeprecision.com/


> I'll do a google on lee reloading etc now and see what I come up
> with. Thanks to both of you for the breakdown of the reloading costs,
> and for telling me it's simple. It's given me the incentive to get
> started now! I don;t suppose the dealer is likely to show me how to
> reload step by step before I have a crack are they?

Read any reloading manual and it will explain how to reload. Ask on here
also.

> Oh, what are reloading dyes???

Dies are tools to reform a shot case and also to install bullets. Have a
look on the Lee web site. Okay Lee dies are not the best in the world
but they work and they are cheap to buy. I've shot one hole groups using
Lee dies (BTW). I own Redding, RCBS and Lee dies, all do the same job
more or less.


> I noticed a reddy colour surrounding
> the small circle at the rear of the round that the hammer hits on the
> .223 ammo, is it this you are referring to?

That sounds more like an anti-rust treatment from your bolt/FP.

John

 

[Pete]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 22:22:43 +0000 (UTC), "Filth"
<rossnoades@hotmail.com> wrote:
>snippety snip<
> having discovered my scope mount didn't fit
>the dovetail on the Tikka. They had all sorts of vices and clamps and other
>they have the Tikka scope mounts in stock for a scary
>price, but I may as well do it right. I'm down there first light tomorrow to
>have them fit the scope using the Tikka mounts,

If you want to economise, Hulver/Hillver mounts imported from
Australia by Deben have mounts to fit Tikka dovetails.

FWIW, I have them and Tikka Optiloc mounts and frankly, I can't detect
a difference in performance and on a low recoil round like the .2223,
nor should you.

A nice feature of the Hilver/Hulver is that the mounts have opposing
allen headed grub screws for locating onto the bases and you can take
out a lot of windage misalignment in setting them up.


From Pete

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Being eaten by a crocodile is just like falling asleep in a blender"
Bart Simpson

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

I have a Lee Challenger O-frame press (aluminuium frame), and load
223,30-05, 303Br and have had it for 10 years. I like it, good value,
and works well. They sell it as a kit with dies and a dipper powder
measure spoon
You will also need a set of scales, and you will want to get a real
powder measure as well. I use the Lyman aerosol spray lube on the
cases - easier than the stuff in a tube. Plan on getting a Lee
Autoprime kit - makes priming a lot faster and easier. I also trim my
dies with a Lee hand held trimmer. Cheap, simple and works.
I ended up getting a second hand press to take the seating dies, so I
didn't have to change from resizing to seating the bullets.
You don't need all this stuff straight away - what comes with the Lee
kit will keep you busy for a fair while.
The Tikkas a good choice. One of the club members bought one, and it
was nice - I prefered it to my Remingoton 700BDL
Geoff
(New Zealand)

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

geoff_m@bigfoot.com wrote in
news:76efi019bcov9agge7ffh3tss76bvfuunf@4ax.com:

> I have a Lee Challenger O-frame press (aluminuium frame),
> and load 223,30-05, 303Br and have had it for 10 years. I
> like it, good value, and works well. They sell it as a kit
> with dies and a dipper powder measure spoon
> You will also need a set of scales, and you will want to
> get a real
> powder measure as well. I use the Lyman aerosol spray lube
> on the cases - easier than the stuff in a tube. Plan on
> getting a Lee Autoprime kit - makes priming a lot faster
> and easier. I also trim my dies with a Lee hand held
> trimmer. Cheap, simple and works.
> I ended up getting a second hand press to take the seating
> dies, so I
> didn't have to change from resizing to seating the bullets.
> You don't need all this stuff straight away - what comes
> with the Lee
> kit will keep you busy for a fair while.
> The Tikkas a good choice. One of the club members bought
> one, and it
> was nice - I prefered it to my Remingoton 700BDL
> Geoff
> (New Zealand)

Hi Geoff,

I see you are a Kiwi. I read somewhere that your professional
deer cullers in NZ used a hand Lee press and equipment for re-
loading, i.e. a very basic and light set up for travelling on
foot in the bush. Is that correct? If so, a very basic set up
certainly seems to work well enough for every day shooting.

Derry

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

>> Is there any kit in particular that I should look for, and any extra
>> bits that I should get which I may find useful which isn't already
>> included? (Tweezers prongs etc?)
>
> The Lee Anniversary kit is a complete reloading set-up.
> I'll dig you out some links and numbers later but for now, I'm off
> stalking.
> John

I spoke to a friend of mine whose dad has a flintlock rifle which he muzzle
loads. He apparently needs a "black-powder" licence. Will I need a
stipulation on my ticket saying that I can buy the black powder needed for
reloading or is it unnecessary with a firearms licence?

Obviously I won't bother with the reloading kit until I get th black powder
allowance if I do need yet another category saying I can buy gunpowder. Just
out of interest, does anyone make their own gunpowder?

Ross.

--
CBR600RR (Broken)
TFSTR#[1]

 

[john]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

"Filth" <rossnoades@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:cg9r5r$fdv$1@hercules.btinternet.com:

> I spoke to a friend of mine whose dad has a flintlock rifle which he
> muzzle loads. He apparently needs a "black-powder" licence. Will I
> need a stipulation on my ticket saying that I can buy the black
> powder needed for reloading or is it unnecessary with a firearms
> licence?

You will not be using black powder. The powder we use to reload for want
of a better explanation, modern rifle calibres is called nitro-powder
and is completely different to black powder or gun powder as you will
have heard it called.
For simplicity, black powder is an explosive and when burned, it will
produce the same amount of gas in the open air as it will in a
restricted space (such a breech of a rifle). The type of powder you will
be using is called Nitro powder which will not act the same in the open
air as it will in a breech where it will produce more pressure, there
are several different types of nitro powder but for now just understand
that it is different from black powder. Nitro powder is a propellant as
apposed to an explosive. No license is need to buy or own Nitro powder,
you can go and buy yourself a tub right now. Crazy really.

>
> Obviously I won't bother with the reloading kit until I get th black
> powder allowance if I do need yet another category saying I can buy
> gunpowder. Just out of interest, does anyone make their own
> gunpowder?

Okay, Gun powder or black powder is a completely different animal from
our Nitro powder. Black powder being made from a mixture of Potassium
nitrate, sulphur and charcoal (I will not give the exact ratio of
ingredients). Nitro powder being made from Sulphuric acid, Nitric acid
and a cellulose base.
Both are chemically very similar but in practice both are very different
in use, stability, results, achievable pressure, in fact they are both
totally different.
Producing your own black powder I would suspect would be illegal and
very unwise.
Quality is the key to all rifle accuracy, home made BP would almost
certainly be very crude.
My advice is for you to go and buy yourself a reloading manual; Lee’s
modern reloading is very good. The book will explain everything you need
to know and you’ll end up with a fair idea of what you need and what you
don’t need.


John

 

[Pete]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 10:05:47 +0000 (UTC), "Filth"
<rossnoades@hotmail.com> wrote:
>snippety snip<

>I spoke to a friend of mine whose dad has a flintlock rifle which he muzzle
>loads. He apparently needs a "black-powder" licence. Will I need a
>stipulation on my ticket saying that I can buy the black powder needed for
>reloading or is it unnecessary with a firearms licence?
>

Unlike rifle propellant, Black powder is an explosive for which you
need the Home Office certification to transport and store explosives,
quite separate from a variation on your FAC should you wish to
urchase/possess a rifled muzzle loading firearm. (I believe smooth
bore long arms go on a shotgun cert.)

Just dashing out but I'll find a link for you later re the Home Office
thing.
From Pete

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Being eaten by a crocodile is just like falling asleep in a blender"
Bart Simpson

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

> My advice is for you to go and buy yourself a reloading manual; Lee's
> modern reloading is very good. The book will explain everything you
> need to know and you'll end up with a fair idea of what you need and
> what you don't need.
> John

I'm going down to FA Andersons tomorrow to get the sight fitted onto the
Tikka, and while there I'll pick up the book if they have it. I'll also get
the Lee Anniversary kit as advised if they've got it. Otherwise I'll have to
pop in to GT Shooting in Coulsdon who definitely have loads of reloading
stuff for sale there.
For the items that they don't have, I've found a site
http://www.peterlawman.co.uk/catalogue.php (link to their catalogue).
As I hate going into shops with absolutely no information and having a one
way conversation, I'm going to ask a few questions anyway so that I might be
able to join in with the seller's dialogue and not get taken for a ride.
Firstly, there's a couple of different primers there, I take it that a .223
would have the "small rifle" primer? They're done by magtech and come in at
£16.95 per 1000. Fair deal?
Then of course there's the cases. How many different makes of case are there
and which would be the best in your opinion? I've bought a load of 55gr
rounds ready for zeroing, and I'd imagine I'd keep this weight of bullet.
They only have .223 rem cases on the site, £23.50 per 100(new). (As someone
said, by the far the most expensive bit).
The bullets themselves, FMJ lead cored 55gr £4.75 per 100. What would be the
best expanding bullet to buy for reloading in .223 guys?
Then onto the "propellant" 🙂 which as most of my google's have resulted,
tend to be made by vectan. The two which my rifle can use are the SP10 and
the Tubal 2000. The tubal 2000 comes in 70p cheaper per 0.5kg at £19.25, but
what's the difference between the two?
This shop also sells loads of the Lee reloading equipment but none of the
complete kits. He also sells that book you mentiond at £9.99 in hardback, so
what I can't get tomorrow I'll buy mail order from him.
Obviously conistency is the key, so I'd like to start reloading with a good
combination from the start, otherwise my shooting will be off and I'll get
annoyed! I don't want to have to radically re-zero all the time because of
poor availability of product, but obvioulsy every new batch requires
re-zeroing. What I found with the .22lr though, is that a different batch
only means a slight change in flight, but you still hit the target.
Hopefully I can get the same at each batch change...
Tomorrow is going to be a good day, I'll get to spend most of the afternoon
and evening shooting my new rifle :-D
Ross.



--
CBR600RR (Broken)
TFSTR#[1]

 

[Pete]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 12:37:47 +0100, Pete <pete.ansbro@virgin.net>
wrote:
>snippety snip<

>Just dashing out but I'll find a link for you later re the Home Office
>thing.

Right. Been out, had lovely walk, now being pi$$ed off by neighbours
who, at one go have:
1. Electric hedgetrimmers going,
2. Electric mower going (mind you that's so over-sized it should only
take four passes to do the back lawn)
3. 2 screaming kids.

Maybe I'll open my double doors and run some "fouling" black powder
loads through something. (Oh I wish!)

Anyway, for black powder you need:

1. From the Firearms Licensing people, a Certificate to acquire and
keep explosives and,
2. From the Health & Safety Executive a Recipient Competent Authority
Transfer Document (under the, wait for it, "Placing on the market and
supervision of transfers of explosives regulations 1993".)

Hope this helps.


From Pete

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Being eaten by a crocodile is just like falling asleep in a blender"
Bart Simpson

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

> Hope this helps.
> From Pete

It does, thanks!

--
CBR600RR (Broken)
TFSTR#[1]

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

> Ross, if it's a brand new rifle be sure to break the barrel in correctly
> or you'll be cleaning copper fouling for a very long time to come.
> So many people over look the importance of correctly breaking-in
> barrels.
> John

I'm extremely glad you mentioned that because when I parted with the
electronic cash, I asked if there was any difference in how I should treat
the gun being new compared with the second hand .22lr I had bought. The
gunsmith just told me to clean it after every shoot in the same way as the
..22lr.
Is there a simple procedure for breaking it in that you can e-mail me or
should I google for it? (I'm going to google for it anyway as always!)
Special gun oil or clean in between each shot for first 50-100 rounds etc
etc? Or again is it a matter of preference?

OT: As I mentioned in the e-mail I cashed in on the winning bets, but if
Henry scores again, or Arsenal get 5 or more corners in the *second* half
then I'll be a bit miffed as I would have cleaned up in the bookies. As it
stands £48 is what I dragged out of the game. Less than 4 corners or no
Henry goals and I made the right choice. No bets remain but I'm even more
nervous! Hehe...

Ross.

 

[lurch]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

On 21 Aug 2004 03:59:39 GMT, John <zero_one34@hotmail.com> wrote:

>"Filth" <rossnoades@hotmail.com> wrote in
>news:cg5tjj$t2t$1@sparta.btinternet.com:
>
>> Is there any kit in particular that I should look for, and any extra
>> bits that I should get which I may find useful which isn't already
>> included? (Tweezers prongs etc?)
>
>The Lee Anniversary kit is a complete reloading set-up.
>I’ll dig you out some links and numbers later but for now, I’m off
>stalking.
>
>John

Just a point of clarification (being picky now!). The Lee Anniversary
is nearly a complete kit, the only extras being the dies (as
mentioned) and a case trimmer appropriate for your caliber. A very
useful extra is a set of calipers, you should be able to get a cheap
set of digital ones for not much. A tray to hold your brass in whilst
you work on the rounds is very useful, the ones I see mostly are by
MTM.

I was shocked when I first started reloading at how much more
consistent the rounds I made were than factory stuff.

--
Mark

http://www.gunculture.net

"the subjects... may have arms for their defence"
English Bill of Rights

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: uk.rec.shooting.game (More info?)

>
>I see you are a Kiwi. I read somewhere that your professional
>deer cullers in NZ used a hand Lee press and equipment for re-
>loading, i.e. a very basic and light set up for travelling on
>foot in the bush. Is that correct? If so, a very basic set up
>certainly seems to work well enough for every day shooting.
>
>Derry
I know some people have used those hand -squeeze pliers type Lee
presses, although they look like hard work to me. Unfortunately, due
to deer recovery and poisoning, there isn't the numbers of deer in the
forest any more to justify carting in reloading gear or culling.
Still there is free access to Crown land (with a free permit) for
deer shooting in NZ. it is not to bad at all. Of course the thick NZ
bush and steep hills (and they are getting steeper as they get older
🙂 still means you have to work for it.
Geoff
New Zealand