965 or 975 for Core Duo 2?

[pausert20]

The Bad Axe is considered an Enthusiast board and the Lemont is considered a gamer board. Those are Intel Definitions.

Most gamers i know, want to overclock, the line between enthusiast/gamer has to be very thin, and Intel must know this. :?

Tanker, I agree. I still think Intel is not finished formulating their stategey as it pertains to the people on the bleeding edge. They keep adding more features to their Enthusiest board line. 875 - Bonanza, 925 - Culver City, 955 - Black Creek and now the 975 - Bad Axe. Each one has had more overclocking features added to the board and into the Bios. They still do not have the "Complete or Mature" overclocking features that you can found on an MSI, Gigabyte or Asus board but I like the Solid reputation of the boards and especially the stability of them.

Personally I never really overclock that much but I'm very happy with what I do get and I'm stable.

 

[Vinny]

Is this lack of native PATA only with ASUS mobos? I don't understand how they can have some boards that don't support PATA out the factory when SATA optical drives have so many conflictions still. That just seems stupid to me. :x

And what's up with all these different numbers? When you guys say 965 or 975, you mean socket LGA 775 right? So, what's the 965/975 for? Is that the north or sount bridge? And what about the ATI RD600 or whatever, what's that?

Sorry, but I'm really confused. I'm trying to learn a bit more about Intel mobos and they're way more complicated than the AMD ones. Is there a guide that'll get me ready to build a Core 2 system? I was able to learn how to build a 939 and AM2 system without much work but this Intel stuff is killing me.

 

[1Tanker]

And what's up with all these different numbers? When you guys say 965 or 975, you mean socket LGA 775 right? So, what's the 965/975 for? Is that the north or sount bridge? And what about the ATI RD600 or whatever, what's that?

Yes they are all LGA775. 965/975 and RD600 are the chipsets(Northbridge).

 

[pausert20]

Is this lack of native PATA only with ASUS mobos? I don't understand how they can have some boards that don't support PATA out the factory when SATA optical drives have so many conflictions still. That just seems stupid to me. :x

Intel made the decision that a native IDE controller was no longer needed because the Optical Drive manufacturers were all coming out with SATA Optical Drives. ~ One year later we arrive at the 965 chipset with no native IDE controller and with for whatever reason the Optical drive manufactures not producing SATA Optical drives. Plextor has 3 drives released that I know of. MSI had one and then removed it from the market. Samsung is supposed to release a SATA DVD drive in Q2 2007. As for the rest I have not heard any details.

My understanding is that the Lemont 965 motherboard with its Marvell PATA controller will allowing loading of an OS. I think the Intel Bios has the appropriate driver in it.

And what's up with all these different numbers? When you guys say 965 or 975, you mean socket LGA 775 right? So, what's the 965/975 for?

Okay, time for a primer: 975 is the Intel Chipset number. To confuse things the 975 chipset came out last year and the 965 which is newer is actually a lower number.

The 975 chipset is what is call an enthusiest chipset in Intel lingo. The 965 which includes P965 (No internal Graphics) G965 (Has internal Graphics) Q965 is for the new Vpro platform and a Q963 for an entry level business machine.

Sorry, but I'm really confused. I'm trying to learn a bit more about Intel mobos and they're way more complicated than the AMD ones. Is there a guide that'll get me ready to build a Core 2 system? I was able to learn how to build a 939 and AM2 system without much work but this Intel stuff is killing me.

Please go to this Intel site and you can look through all of the available Intel boards. Be warned there is a lot of material here.

http://support.intel.com/support/motherboards/desktop/

Here is the link to the Bad Axe page: http://support.intel.com/support/motherboards/desktop/d975xbx/

Here is the link to the P965 Lemont page: http://support.intel.com/support/motherboards/desktop/dp965lt/

Take a look at the processor support page. Please note that none of the E6xx processors are listed. Intel does not show support for unrelease processors in their processor support page until the processor is launch. July 27. :lol:

 

[CptCpu]

I hope that the nvidia chipset is better than the 965. I was thinking about getting that one 965 gigabyte board on newegg, but now think I will wait.

 

[CptCpu]

I hope people realize that both nvidia and ati will both be coming out with chipsets to suppot core 2. You may have to wait alittle longer to get them, but this in the end will not limit you in having to purchase a 965/975 board.

 

[CptCpu]

I rather have the Nvidia chipset for core 2 because they will have SLI support, should have overclocking options, and should be priced around the 965/975 boards if not cheaper.

 

[MarcusL]

Thx SupremeLaw for your patient explanation of this problem.

I think I might have been bitten by this if I didn't stumble onto this thread.

Would copying the OS install CD to a USB flash drive get around this problem? Boot from the flash drive to get the OS installed and then get the PATA drivers installed.

 

[Whizzard9992]

I have to contend the 965 chipset not supporting bootup. It's the responsibility of the BIOS, not the chipset, to inform windows of the boot device. It sounds to me like a mobo issue, not a chipset issue. I find it hard to believe that Intel would release a chipset that you couldn't load windows on without an additional controller card.


It's kind of funny, because this is the second time I've had to reference this article of late. It's not something I find applicable, usually.

http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/reskit/c29621675.mspx

After the POST, the settings that are stored in CMOS memory, such as boot order, determine the devices that the computer can use to start an operating system.

I asked the same question a while back. It seems the 965 has an improved memory controller on top of everything else. I'm going to get the 965 myself. I personally think it's good what intel did: SATA's been around for a while now, and optical manufacturers need to step up to the plate. There's no excuse for not having a bigger SATA drive selection now. Unless Intel does something, we'll be stuck with another useless port on our motherboard (i.e. FLOPPY) for years to come.

 

[Whizzard9992]

> Unless Intel does something, we'll be stuck with another useless port
> on our motherboard (i.e. FLOPPY) for years to come.


If you do F6 during Windows Setup,
where is the machine going to find
the device driver for a RAID subsystem?

Answer: floppy disk


Where does an OEM Windows Setup disc EXPECT
to find the device driver for a RAID subsystem?

Answer: floppy disk


Sincerely yours,
/s/ Paul Andrew Mitchell
Webmaster, Supreme Law Library
http://www.supremelaw.org/

Not me. I add my drivers right to the CD so I don't get prompted for drivers. A lot of good tools out there for it. I also ghost a fresh install on a small partition, so re-installing windows is a matter of copying an image, rather than 2 hours of driver installs and windows setup.

 

[RichPLS]

SL, it is called slipstreaming your drivers into your XP install disk, and you create a new one with all current service packs and current drivers included in one package...

OEM's have been doing this forever, and enthusiasts have been doing it for years... I know I have been... 8)

 

[Vinny]

When will ATI's and Nvidia's northbridge chipsets be released for Core 2 ready mobos?

 

[Whizzard9992]

Supremelaw,

First of all buddy, you need to calm down.

Evidently you have NOT had to deal with a large number of DIY Users who do NOT know about slipstreaming, and they're not likely to know about slipstreaming, mainly because their User Manuals never even mention it.

That's what tech support is for.

It's evident that you think very highly of yourself. A lot of us here deal with a LOT of DIY'ers, so there's no need to be so condescending. Your above statement has nothing to do with anything, because all I said was that unless hardware manufacturers throw their weight around a bit, we get stuck with antiquated technology. Windows is just about the only think that requires (and I use that word loosly) the floppy drive. Windows XP setup supports OHCI devices (i.e. USB), so if FDD's had been losing hardware support, there's a good chance we would have seen a USB option in XP setup. That was my point.

Additionally, you said Windows XP setup requires the floppy, which is untrue.

Lastly, just because a single board is having problems with booting from CD doesn't make you an expert on the subject, and it doesn't mean the i965 chipset is the reason for the problem, so please stop giving bad advice.

If an SATA optical drive will not run Windows Setup e.g. Plextor (which is being widely reported, e.g. at Fry's Electronics) switching to a PATA optical is not likely to work either if the PATA IDE port is non-native / not supported by the BIOS.

Completely untrue. Not even worth explaining.... You an go google this yourself. Apparantly you're good at digging up half-truths.

 

[lbax]

I do not want to get too deep into this fray. However, I am running all SATA HDDs & optical drives. I would love to 86 the FDD. Any vendor actions to speed the transition away from IDE is good news to me! Bring on the P965 chipsets!

 

[Whizzard9992]

I do not want to get too deep into this fray. However, I am running all SATA HDDs & optical drives. I would love to 86 the FDD. Any vendor actions to speed the transition away from IDE is good news to me! Bring on the P965 chipsets!

I hear you can even put XP setup on a USB stick. I've never tried it, but it looks awesome.

 

[lbax]

I hear you can even put XP setup on a USB stick. I've never tried it, but it looks awesome.

Now that is a step in the right direction! I will try it on my Conroe build.

I am waiting for some motherboard/chipset benchmarks before I make the final motherboard decision.

 

[Mex]

I just found a THG article explaining that very topic.
http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/09/09/windows_in_your_pocket/

 

[tmac]

ATi RD600.

I second that. Has independent memory controller.
So FSB and memory clock are not related.

 

[Whizzard9992]

I hear you can even put XP setup on a USB stick. I've never tried it, but it looks awesome.

Now that is a step in the right direction! I will try it on my Conroe build.

I am waiting for some motherboard/chipset benchmarks before I make the final motherboard decision.

Same here. I'm still considering a woodcrest system over conroe, if I could only get my paws on some woodcrest gaming benches.

 

[mickeddie]

I don't think this question was answered...

With lack of PATA support and lack of dual GPU support what is the advantage to the 965 chipset besides how it handles DDR2 800 memory? How different is the 965 at handling the memory than the 975x?

I think I'll get a 975x mobo for my conroe cpu.

 

[mickeddie]

Ignore my last reply...I found your answer.

 

[kukito]

I do not want to get too deep into this fray. However, I am running all SATA HDDs & optical drives. I would love to 86 the FDD. Any vendor actions to speed the transition away from IDE is good news to me! Bring on the P965 chipsets!

I too am willing to forego the PATA support. I was thinking of using an adapter like this but now I'm not so sure that would work. I could always put the optical drive into an external enclosure and boot off USB. Or have someone copy the contents of the CD to a bootable flash drive and install from there. At any rate, Intel motherboards will be able to boot from CD with the Marvell controller and I'm sure everyone else will figure out a way as well. A motherboard that can't boot off a Windows CD is in serious trouble and is totally unacceptable.

 

[mickeddie]

The Gigabyte p965 board has a PATA controller. How do you use it if the 965 chipset does not support PATA?

 

[Whizzard9992]

i965's 'supports' PATA; it just doesn't have it built-in. Motherboard manufacturers have to add an additional chip if they want PATA on the board.

It's most likely on the PCI bus, maybe the PCIe bus.

(In case you don't know), it's just like having a PATA add-in card, except it's built-in.

 

[mickeddie]

i965's 'supports' PATA; it just doesn't have it built-in. Motherboard manufacturers have to add an additional chip if they want PATA on the board.

It's most likely on the PCI bus, maybe the PCIe bus.

(In case you don't know), it's just like having a PATA add-in card, except it's built-in.

So the quick answer is to wait for other motherboards to come out and see which ones have the PATA chip on the board??

What about booting from a PATA optical drive? If I have an IDE/SATA converter will I be ablet to boot off the IDE drive via the SATA controller?

Can I use a PATA optical drive in the IDE controller and just not be able to boot from it?