AMD and Intel General Discussion (not for getting help)

[fazers_on_stun]

If theyd been allowed to compete fairly, theyd have hit their prod limit alot sooner than they actually did, which would have prompted a quicker build for the other fab sooner, possibly while they were still on top.
If that were the case, the whole GF thing would have taken a completely different turn as well, as AMD wouldve had more to offer atic, and so on.
I know thats the common Intel blame it on they were prod constrained, but like I just said, things wouldve been different earlier, and steps could have been taken, and their net worth overall would have been much greater.
If you postulate in 1 direction, I think seeing it thru is the best form

I dunno about that - seems to me that AMD was maxed out capacity-wise for some time (at least, that's what I got out of reading Sharikook's old blogs ). Maybe AMD was already feeling the fab upgrade expense issues back then, and was trying to milk as much ROI as they could. Not to mention all their cash spent on the ATI purchase. I think AMD was genuinely surprised at how good C2 was, and it took them quite some time to respond - after all, Barcie was pretty much of a rush job, despite being a year or so late.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

Well, unless we know, then saying they were maxed and it didnt mean anything or it did, and when, and how much this overall effected them etc. Cant have 1 without the other. Yes they were prod contrained, but when? For how long? Could it have happened sooner? What wouldve been the implications? Maybe if they were resting on their ROIs earlier, theyd have done something different? To say just 1 thing is all thats needed to put an end to this line of thought is handy, but not practical

 

[ChuvelxD]

http://finance.yahoo.com/tech-ticker/article/336235/Ten-Big-Companies-That-Are-Veering-Toward-Bankruptcy?tickers=AMD,LVS,S,M,GT,MYL,HTZ

AMD is on this article. GOGOGOGO GULFTOWN!

 

[fazers_on_stun]

Well, unless we know, then saying they were maxed and it didnt mean anything or it did, and when, and how much this overall effected them etc. Cant have 1 without the other. Yes they were prod contrained, but when? For how long? Could it have happened sooner? What wouldve been the implications? Maybe if they were resting on their ROIs earlier, theyd have done something different? To say just 1 thing is all thats needed to put an end to this line of thought is handy, but not practical

I think some other posters here on THG have linked to info showing that AMD wasn't seriously hurt by Intel's alleged anticompetiveness. I think the finding was more based on a finding of intent rather than actual harm to European consumers. IIRC P4's were selling for less than Athlons at the time. And I also think the EC is rapidly getting an anti-American reputation - I would not be surprised to see the Obama administration either voluntarily or being forced by public opion to respond in like kind in the near future. And that will do some harm to both economies.

BTW - congrats on the moderator promotion! Even though you're a dyed-in-the-green AMD fanbois, it couldn't happen to a nicer guy!!

PS - just kiddin' about that fanbois part. You argue AMD's case, such as it is 😀, much more persuasively than some others I can think of.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

TY
At this point, someone needs to, theyre in a bad way. Like Ive said before, once theyre on their feet? Theyre also on their own heheh.
If it can be proven it hurt them financially bad enough, therell most likely be a lawsuit.
What really gets me is, people claiming AMD and its bankruptancy etc.
Intel doesnt want that, because at that point, AMD would sue, and likely garner some kind of reimbursements, and say screw the x86 license, or even put that against Intel as well.
No, Intel wants AMD alive, not well, but alive

 

[fazers_on_stun]

TY
At this point, someone needs to, theyre in a bad way. Like Ive said before, once theyre on their feet? Theyre also on their own heheh.
If it can be proven it hurt them financially bad enough, therell most likely be a lawsuit.
What really gets me is, people claiming AMD and its bankruptancy etc.
Intel doesnt want that, because at that point, AMD would sue, and likely garner some kind of reimbursements, and say screw the x86 license, or even put that against Intel as well.
No, Intel wants AMD alive, not well, but alive

Actually I hafta agree with you on that one - I think Intel could have put AMD away at least a year ago (during the Barcie fiasco) if they really wanted to go for the jugular vein. Instead, I think they want to slowly bleed AMD, and avoid any more accusations of wrongdoing, etc.

I see in some other threads accusations of Intel 'price-fixing', which is absolutely against all reason - price-fixing is an arrangement between the 'competitors' to avoid competition and allow both companies to profit way above what common sense dictates as fair pricing (value received vs. expenditures). Considering AMD's finances, there is no 'fixing' going on, unless AMD is abysmally stupid 😀.

 

[Guest]

What baffles me is the major difference between the AMD vs Intel war and the ATi vs Nvidia war.
ATI > Nvidia - even more so now
ATI = AMD
???
Profit.

Message to AMD.
Use your ATI engineers, they're obviously brighter.
Stop employing idiots that will work for $4.00/hour.
And for heavens sake, Look at an i7 and stop living in cloud cookoo land.

 

[amdfangirl]

What are you on about?

 

[Guest]

AMDs massive failings at present. I have no idea why they are putting so much cash into the ATI project when they need to work on their shortcomings in the CPU market. GPGPU will not provide AMD a solution to the problem by combining the 2, not for a long...long...long time.
Intel are working at 22nm. No matter how you look at it, Intel are leagues ahead.
ATI and Nvidia are at an even almost. Nvidia are better with Integrated GFX, and single and dual card solutions are ATIs forté.
I know AMD could cut its costs with ATI and still run Nvidia into the floor, so why do they cling on to it so badly? is it because they know their AMD processor line is dying?

 

[amdfangirl]

It is because ATI only makes up a small part of AMD.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

Understand, ATI stands to make some seriously needed cash, at least for cash flow, and possibly higher overall margins in general.
The monies being spent on ATI is minimal compared to their cpu line, as theyve produced several dozen new chips recently, with more to come.
I agree, AMD needs to step it up, and theyre attempting to with a higher IPC once the new NB speeds come out, which were delayed from ay back, and its just been since the release of the newer mobos, then P2 has anything been going in the right direction for them, after 2+ years of nothing.
They didnt have anything close to a dual, their quad was woefully late and severly inadequate, and even faulty once it did arrive with the TLB bug.
Those things are behind them now, theyve actually got a better process, better cpus, better chips, and will have the best IGP solution shortly, and on top of that, theyll have the best performing/priced gpu setup ever seen before, or at least on par with the G80.
They need to hold on til BD arrives, and hope it is everything theyve been trying to make it

 

[jennyh]

You can dream on about ATI coming to AMD and showing them how to do it, but that's just not how it happened.

ATI are in such a commanding position because of AMD. ATI never, ever had this kind of advantage before being aquired by AMD.

The current gpu market reads like this :- AMD/ATI have the best solution at any price point you can think of. And it's not even close any more. Nvidia couldn't even manage that at the heights of g92.

 

[Mousemonkey]

TY
At this point, someone needs to, theyre in a bad way.

With a new graphic card they can't sell and a six core desktop CPU on the horizon that nobody's going to be interested in, let alone want, rough times ahead indeed for AMD. 😗

 

[amdfangirl]

You can dream on about ATI coming to AMD and showing them how to do it, but that's just not how it happened.

ATI are in such a commanding position because of AMD. ATI never, ever had this kind of advantage before being aquired by AMD.

The current gpu market reads like this :- AMD/ATI have the best solution at any price point you can think of. And it's not even close any more. Nvidia couldn't even manage that at the heights of g92.

Well, it also stopped the dev of the 690G on the Intel platform.

 

[wh3resmycar]

Nvidia are better with Integrated GFX, and single and dual card solutions are ATIs forté.

im sorry i have to disagree, nvidia cant touch the 780g. thats the main reason why my new notebook will house a radeon not some overheating 8400m.

 

[Guest]

im sorry i have to disagree, nvidia cant touch the 780g. thats the main reason why my new notebook will house a radeon not some overheating 8400m.

9400m anyone? look at the article mate

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

Sad part is, since all nVidia has done recently is rename everything, they actually dont have much for future igps, unlike ATI, and soon, just like on DT, the lappy and igps will have ATI domination written all over them.
nVidias just been doin the pooch as of late

 

[jennyh]

Nvidia would never really 'get' the whole platform thing because they never had it. It was always bigger and faster, that was what gamers wanted...and then they turned their back on it when they realised that eventually, somewhere down the line they would need to be doing more than that.

They tried too much too fast, and were too quick to abandon what they knew best. They believed that the 8800 would keep them ahead for years, they believed that AMD wouldnt even try to push graphics any further so they would be able to shrink the 8800gt forever almost while concentrating on other avenues.

The end result? There is not one nvidia desktop solution worth buying today

 

[Reynod]

JD ... well done.

Was inevitable since your addicted to THG like a crackwhore.

Nothing wrong with that tho ... nothing at all ... <inhales a few more forum threads>.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

Hey man, dont bogart that cpu section, pass it over here...

 

[Reynod]

I will post in a few threads to keep your addiction going buddy .... anything to help you with the symptoms.

Can't promise I will posit anything worth reading.

Just salivating over the new 5870 Radeons at the moment - Anand's article is quite good there.

The guts should drop out of the low end NVidia cards now ... everything will be a good deal on the graphics front now ... the NV and AMD cards.

Why upgrade your CPU when you can overclock it with a bit of advice here ... and spend the money on graphics instead.

Thing is ... AMD wins with sales there ... NVidia and Intel both lose on the gaming front .... providing they (AMD) decently hard launch.

Not a lot of evidence of a hard launch yet.

 

[amdfangirl]

That's going a bit too far reynod.

 

[Reynod]

I thought the analogy was funny though I do know JD is a god fearing tea totaller like me ... no offense meant JD.

 

[darkproject]

i had read that the New intel hexa-core ( 6 cores) was overclocked at 6.4 Ghz and is 60 % faster then cpu of the world record in 3d mark vantage

 

[Upendra09]

Intel is coming out with i11 soon, it is an 8 core behemoth