AMD CPU speculation... and expert conjecture

[cowboy44mag]

"Okay I am a truck guy so I will go way off topic. Your airbagged and chipped F-350 isn't an F-550 even if you put on stacks and a smoke switch to roll coal at passing Priuses. (Which is very fun by the way.) The F-350 has a frame rated for 14k GVWR max (most are only 9550-11000 lbs) with a Dana 60 monobeam up front and a Sterling 10.5 out back with a maximum of 4.11 gears, connected to 17" rims with LT tires. The F-550 has a frame rated for 19.5k GVWR, a Dana Super 60 front and a Dana S110 rear with 4.88 gears connected to 19.5" rims wearing medium duty truck tires. It's like a single processor desktop versus my quad CPU server in server tasks- it just doesn't stand up. However your F-350 will be much friendlier with the DOT fellows as its lower GVWR will allow you to pull a higher GVWR trailer and fly under the magical 26k GCWR CDL limit. Unless of course you have a Class A CDL, then the mere mortals rules do not apply."

Not wanting to get too far off topic, but I'm a truck guy by need as well. I never meant to imply that I turned my F-350 into and F-550, but that I improved the performance of my F-350 to nearly match it. Where no one could match it is in the frame, and drivetrain. If your going to change out all of that you may as well shell out the cash for the F-550. My frame is reinforced a little more than standard, and I actually doubled my leaf springs to 2 tons (which is why I needed the airbag lift), but I'm sure its not as good as a true 550. Engine wise I have the 6.7L powerstroke diesel the same as found in the F-550, but mine has a little more torque than is normal for towing (at the expense of a little HP, but torque is more important). I guess in fairness it would be more like a F-450 (very rarely seen), but I do beat other F-350s and 3500s at the tractor pull, break about even with the few guys who have F-550s. At any rate, it can pull my stock trailer and a full load of 6 Belgium draft horses when I go to fairs.

Anyway what I was trying to get at is don't judge a book by its cover, you never know what is lurking under the hood. I once saw a crazy, insane redneck put NOS in a Yugo. Darn thing went fast, but lets just say I would never get in it!! I also know some guys have gotten some really high clocks and great results out of the FX 8350s, makes one wonder how high the FX Steamroller will be able to be overclocked....

Way, way off topic there, but hopefully a true Steamroller sample will be leaked by some dev somewhere soon. That would give us all a great deal to talk about.

 

[palladin9479]

Phew, a mod came, we set up a secret thread as a last resort. Loving your rants.

We've always been here. We try not to be heavy handed with folks though if people start flaming each other deletes or worse will happen.

 

[The Q6660 Inside]

I see.

 

[MU_Engineer]

Not wanting to get too far off topic, but I'm a truck guy by need as well. I never meant to imply that I turned my F-350 into and F-550, but that I improved the performance of my F-350 to nearly match it. Where no one could match it is in the frame, and drivetrain. If your going to change out all of that you may as well shell out the cash for the F-550. My frame is reinforced a little more than standard, and I actually doubled my leaf springs to 2 tons (which is why I needed the airbag lift), but I'm sure its not as good as a true 550. Engine wise I have the 6.7L powerstroke diesel the same as found in the F-550, but mine has a little more torque than is normal for towing (at the expense of a little HP, but torque is more important). I guess in fairness it would be more like a F-450 (very rarely seen), but I do beat other F-350s and 3500s at the tractor pull, break about even with the few guys who have F-550s. At any rate, it can pull my stock trailer and a full load of 6 Belgium draft horses when I go to fairs.

The 6.7 is a real beast with ~800 ft-lb torque stock and I absolutely believe that your towing is "spring limited." My F-150 is the same way. The 5.0 twincam in mine s a heck of a motor and can handle a much bigger load than the chassis can.

By the way, there are a lot of F-450s and I see them all of the time. Most of them around here are CCLB pickups but with the telltale 19.5" truck rims instead of the 17"/18" units the F-350 DRWs run. They are very popular with the 30+ foot fifth wheel RV crowd here as they can pull an even bigger camper than the F-350. The F-450 is the largest pickup-bodied truck Ford sells and that's the appeal of it. The F-550 is only available in chassis cab format and much harder to fit a pickup box to (narrower frame rails.)

 

[-Fran-]

Just to clear the water... I never said Russia won WWII, just that they made the Germans fall back before (like 1 year) the US entered the war. the US of A disintegrated adults, kids and old people with the A-Boms and stopped Japan, but by that time, Germany was already done for, or in a state where they could not fight back anymore.

In regards to the SR news... I'll stick to my idea of *Really* hoping AMD fuse the sockets in FM3 sooner than later, so we have both worlds for cheap.

Cheers!

 

[blackkstar]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO

create a negative public image for target groups (e.g. by surveiling activists, and then releasing negative personal information to the public)
break down internal organization
create dissension between groups
restrict access to public resources
restrict the ability to organize protests
restrict the ability of individuals to participate in group activities

Not saying hajifur is FBI but pointing out that his kind of derailing is a well known technique that's been around for decades.

 

[cowboy44mag]

Not wanting to get too far off topic, but I'm a truck guy by need as well. I never meant to imply that I turned my F-350 into and F-550, but that I improved the performance of my F-350 to nearly match it. Where no one could match it is in the frame, and drivetrain. If your going to change out all of that you may as well shell out the cash for the F-550. My frame is reinforced a little more than standard, and I actually doubled my leaf springs to 2 tons (which is why I needed the airbag lift), but I'm sure its not as good as a true 550. Engine wise I have the 6.7L powerstroke diesel the same as found in the F-550, but mine has a little more torque than is normal for towing (at the expense of a little HP, but torque is more important). I guess in fairness it would be more like a F-450 (very rarely seen), but I do beat other F-350s and 3500s at the tractor pull, break about even with the few guys who have F-550s. At any rate, it can pull my stock trailer and a full load of 6 Belgium draft horses when I go to fairs.

The 6.7 is a real beast with ~800 ft-lb torque stock and I absolutely believe that your towing is "spring limited." My F-150 is the same way. The 5.0 twincam in mine s a heck of a motor and can handle a much bigger load than the chassis can.

By the way, there are a lot of F-450s and I see them all of the time. Most of them around here are CCLB pickups but with the telltale 19.5" truck rims instead of the 17"/18" units the F-350 DRWs run. They are very popular with the 30+ foot fifth wheel RV crowd here as they can pull an even bigger camper than the F-350. The F-450 is the largest pickup-bodied truck Ford sells and that's the appeal of it. The F-550 is only available in chassis cab format and much harder to fit a pickup box to (narrower frame rails.)

+1 I know this is off topic, and I hope the others don't mind indulging us a little. I may have gone with an F-450 if any had been available. Around here they are special order trucks. I think you would be surprised of the towing capacity of your F-150 with some suspension upgrades, keep in mind tough that you may have to reinforce the frame in "key areas". I had a friend of mine (kind of redneck Da Vinci with welding) work on reinforcing my frame. I think all told he welded on an additional 300lbs of steel or so to the frame (don't know where all he reinforced it but my stock trailer full has to be over 20,000lbs and the frame is good to go), then I added the leaf springs and airbag lift. I also have a lot of love for the F-150, great all around truck, but not so great for hauling draft horses

 

[cowboy44mag]

Just to clear the water... I never said Russia won WWII, just that they made the Germans fall back before (like 1 year) the US entered the war. the US of A disintegrated adults, kids and old people with the A-Boms and stopped Japan, but by that time, Germany was already done for, or in a state where they could not fight back anymore.

In regards to the SR news... I'll stick to my idea of *Really* hoping AMD fuse the sockets in FM3 sooner than later, so we have both worlds for cheap.

Cheers!

Back to Steamroller topics.... I too would like to see AMD fuse sockets in FM3. I still want the first generation Steamroller FX to be available AM3+ though

 

[8350rocks]

Not wanting to get too far off topic, but I'm a truck guy by need as well. I never meant to imply that I turned my F-350 into and F-550, but that I improved the performance of my F-350 to nearly match it. Where no one could match it is in the frame, and drivetrain. If your going to change out all of that you may as well shell out the cash for the F-550. My frame is reinforced a little more than standard, and I actually doubled my leaf springs to 2 tons (which is why I needed the airbag lift), but I'm sure its not as good as a true 550. Engine wise I have the 6.7L powerstroke diesel the same as found in the F-550, but mine has a little more torque than is normal for towing (at the expense of a little HP, but torque is more important). I guess in fairness it would be more like a F-450 (very rarely seen), but I do beat other F-350s and 3500s at the tractor pull, break about even with the few guys who have F-550s. At any rate, it can pull my stock trailer and a full load of 6 Belgium draft horses when I go to fairs.

The 6.7 is a real beast with ~800 ft-lb torque stock and I absolutely believe that your towing is "spring limited." My F-150 is the same way. The 5.0 twincam in mine s a heck of a motor and can handle a much bigger load than the chassis can.

By the way, there are a lot of F-450s and I see them all of the time. Most of them around here are CCLB pickups but with the telltale 19.5" truck rims instead of the 17"/18" units the F-350 DRWs run. They are very popular with the 30+ foot fifth wheel RV crowd here as they can pull an even bigger camper than the F-350. The F-450 is the largest pickup-bodied truck Ford sells and that's the appeal of it. The F-550 is only available in chassis cab format and much harder to fit a pickup box to (narrower frame rails.)

I stumbled across a youtube video the other day of a Banks powered S-10 with a diesel crammed under the hood running a 7 second quarter mile...LOL.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcKGgIXfygc

You truck guys ought to have a laugh at that video...that truck is a MONSTER!!!

/offtopic

 

[palladin9479]

Just to clear the water... I never said Russia won WWII, just that they made the Germans fall back before (like 1 year) the US entered the war. the US of A disintegrated adults, kids and old people with the A-Boms and stopped Japan, but by that time, Germany was already done for, or in a state where they could not fight back anymore.

In regards to the SR news... I'll stick to my idea of *Really* hoping AMD fuse the sockets in FM3 sooner than later, so we have both worlds for cheap.

Cheers!

Back to Steamroller topics.... I too would like to see AMD fuse sockets in FM3. I still want the first generation Steamroller FX to be available AM3+ though

I believe that AM3+ will be the last of the old sockets. The reason they had to create a new socket for the APU's is the onboard GPU need's a video display output which means more pins. Now that they've been created, we can expect all future socket types to have built in HDMI / DVI pin outs, so no reason for a split socket strategy.

 

[juanrga]

4 x Jaguar cores = between half and 80% of a Pentium mobile dual core see http://www.anandtech.com/show/6981/the-kabini-deal-can-amd-improve-the-quality-of-mainstream-pcs-with-its-latest-apu/2 I expect SR to be in another league. Jaguar is a competitor to Atom a good one but not good compared to high end desktop CPUs.

Anandtech uses biased benchmarks (Cripple_AMD function) that favour intel chips or uses the ones where AMD chips don't perform so well and ignores the benchmarks where AMD excels. In that review they use pcmark, cinebench, 7-zip...

Moreover, I was considering same clocks (e.g. kaveri @ 3.5 GHZ against a SB/IB @ 3.5 GHz) not an AMD with lower clocks than everyone other chip. Note as well that kabini chip lacks turbo, which provided the other chips extra GHz beyond the already higher base clocks.

Jaguar is a pentium and i3 competitor as well (Anand compared the A4 to the pentium and i5, but did not review any A6)

 

[mayankleoboy1]

7-zip is pro intel ? I must tell this to Igor Pavlov on sourceforge.

 

[juanrga]

7-zip is pro intel ? I must tell this to Igor Pavlov on sourceforge.

In intel devs forums you can find people asking for advice for compiling 7-zip sources using ICC

 

[gamerk316]

7-zip is pro intel ? I must tell this to Igor Pavlov on sourceforge.

In intel devs forums you can find people asking for advice for compiling 7-zip sources using ICC

I'll check the compiler signature for the official release when I get home from work tonight, but I believe the official release is compiled against MSVC.

 

[cowboy44mag]

Not wanting to get too far off topic, but I'm a truck guy by need as well. I never meant to imply that I turned my F-350 into and F-550, but that I improved the performance of my F-350 to nearly match it. Where no one could match it is in the frame, and drivetrain. If your going to change out all of that you may as well shell out the cash for the F-550. My frame is reinforced a little more than standard, and I actually doubled my leaf springs to 2 tons (which is why I needed the airbag lift), but I'm sure its not as good as a true 550. Engine wise I have the 6.7L powerstroke diesel the same as found in the F-550, but mine has a little more torque than is normal for towing (at the expense of a little HP, but torque is more important). I guess in fairness it would be more like a F-450 (very rarely seen), but I do beat other F-350s and 3500s at the tractor pull, break about even with the few guys who have F-550s. At any rate, it can pull my stock trailer and a full load of 6 Belgium draft horses when I go to fairs.

The 6.7 is a real beast with ~800 ft-lb torque stock and I absolutely believe that your towing is "spring limited." My F-150 is the same way. The 5.0 twincam in mine s a heck of a motor and can handle a much bigger load than the chassis can.

By the way, there are a lot of F-450s and I see them all of the time. Most of them around here are CCLB pickups but with the telltale 19.5" truck rims instead of the 17"/18" units the F-350 DRWs run. They are very popular with the 30+ foot fifth wheel RV crowd here as they can pull an even bigger camper than the F-350. The F-450 is the largest pickup-bodied truck Ford sells and that's the appeal of it. The F-550 is only available in chassis cab format and much harder to fit a pickup box to (narrower frame rails.)

I stumbled across a youtube video the other day of a Banks powered S-10 with a diesel crammed under the hood running a 7 second quarter mile...LOL.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcKGgIXfygc

You truck guys ought to have a laugh at that video...that truck is a MONSTER!!!

/offtopic

+1 :lol: You got to love rednecks and trucks!!

 

[cowboy44mag]

Just to clear the water... I never said Russia won WWII, just that they made the Germans fall back before (like 1 year) the US entered the war. the US of A disintegrated adults, kids and old people with the A-Boms and stopped Japan, but by that time, Germany was already done for, or in a state where they could not fight back anymore.

In regards to the SR news... I'll stick to my idea of *Really* hoping AMD fuse the sockets in FM3 sooner than later, so we have both worlds for cheap.

Cheers!

Back to Steamroller topics.... I too would like to see AMD fuse sockets in FM3. I still want the first generation Steamroller FX to be available AM3+ though

I believe that AM3+ will be the last of the old sockets. The reason they had to create a new socket for the APU's is the onboard GPU need's a video display output which means more pins. Now that they've been created, we can expect all future socket types to have built in HDMI / DVI pin outs, so no reason for a split socket strategy.

In a way it will be a little sad to see the AM3+ be "retired", however a unified socket does make much more sense. I guess this means there will be no AM4, however if there is an FX version of FM3 it will basically be the same thing. I'm just really hoping that whatever they call the socket they continue to support the FX high end market.

 

[szatkus]

7-zip is pro intel ? I must tell this to Igor Pavlov on sourceforge.

In intel devs forums you can find people asking for advice for compiling 7-zip sources using ICC

I'll check the compiler signature for the official release when I get home from work tonight, but I believe the official release is compiled against MSVC.

I checked. In fact it's MSVC.

 

[cowboy44mag]

7-zip is pro intel ? I must tell this to Igor Pavlov on sourceforge.

In intel devs forums you can find people asking for advice for compiling 7-zip sources using ICC

I'll check the compiler signature for the official release when I get home from work tonight, but I believe the official release is compiled against MSVC.

As far as these programs go you have WinZip, WinRar and 7-Zip. I have always used WinZip going way, way back but that is primarily due to the fact it has always worked fine and it was the "brand" I know. I have been seeing a lot of 7-Zip around lately, so it must also be a good program, and WinRar is also prevalent. In your opinions which program is actually the "best of the best"? I have always wondered what the experts would choose.

 

[Cazalan]

4 x Jaguar cores = between half and 80% of a Pentium mobile dual core see http://www.anandtech.com/show/6981/the-kabini-deal-can-amd-improve-the-quality-of-mainstream-pcs-with-its-latest-apu/2 I expect SR to be in another league. Jaguar is a competitor to Atom a good one but not good compared to high end desktop CPUs.

Anandtech uses biased benchmarks (Cripple_AMD function) that favour intel chips or uses the ones where AMD chips don't perform so well and ignores the benchmarks where AMD excels. In that review they use pcmark, cinebench, 7-zip...

If you add 33% to the Kabini numbers to simulate the 2Ghz model the results are pretty good. It passes the Pentium in multithreaded benchmarks and still uses less power.

 

[The Q6660 Inside]

Just to clear the water... I never said Russia won WWII, just that they made the Germans fall back before (like 1 year) the US entered the war. the US of A disintegrated adults, kids and old people with the A-Boms and stopped Japan, but by that time, Germany was already done for, or in a state where they could not fight back anymore.

In regards to the SR news... I'll stick to my idea of *Really* hoping AMD fuse the sockets in FM3 sooner than later, so we have both worlds for cheap.

Cheers!

Not wanting to get too far off topic, but I'm a truck guy by need as well. I never meant to imply that I turned my F-350 into and F-550, but that I improved the performance of my F-350 to nearly match it. Where no one could match it is in the frame, and drivetrain. If your going to change out all of that you may as well shell out the cash for the F-550. My frame is reinforced a little more than standard, and I actually doubled my leaf springs to 2 tons (which is why I needed the airbag lift), but I'm sure its not as good as a true 550. Engine wise I have the 6.7L powerstroke diesel the same as found in the F-550, but mine has a little more torque than is normal for towing (at the expense of a little HP, but torque is more important). I guess in fairness it would be more like a F-450 (very rarely seen), but I do beat other F-350s and 3500s at the tractor pull, break about even with the few guys who have F-550s. At any rate, it can pull my stock trailer and a full load of 6 Belgium draft horses when I go to fairs.

The 6.7 is a real beast with ~800 ft-lb torque stock and I absolutely believe that your towing is "spring limited." My F-150 is the same way. The 5.0 twincam in mine s a heck of a motor and can handle a much bigger load than the chassis can.

By the way, there are a lot of F-450s and I see them all of the time. Most of them around here are CCLB pickups but with the telltale 19.5" truck rims instead of the 17"/18" units the F-350 DRWs run. They are very popular with the 30+ foot fifth wheel RV crowd here as they can pull an even bigger camper than the F-350. The F-450 is the largest pickup-bodied truck Ford sells and that's the appeal of it. The F-550 is only available in chassis cab format and much harder to fit a pickup box to (narrower frame rails.)

I stumbled across a youtube video the other day of a Banks powered S-10 with a diesel crammed under the hood running a 7 second quarter mile...LOL.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcKGgIXfygc

You truck guys ought to have a laugh at that video...that truck is a MONSTER!!!

/offtopic

+1 :lol: You got to love rednecks and trucks!!

+2 Needs moar Ford Ranger crashing

Anyways, to the hideout obviously shaped like a Steamroller die!

 

[The Q6660 Inside]

Just to clear the water... I never said Russia won WWII, just that they made the Germans fall back before (like 1 year) the US entered the war. the US of A disintegrated adults, kids and old people with the A-Boms and stopped Japan, but by that time, Germany was already done for, or in a state where they could not fight back anymore.

In regards to the SR news... I'll stick to my idea of *Really* hoping AMD fuse the sockets in FM3 sooner than later, so we have both worlds for cheap.

Cheers!

Back to Steamroller topics.... I too would like to see AMD fuse sockets in FM3. I still want the first generation Steamroller FX to be available AM3+ though

AM3+ IMO should stay until the very end of Steamroller, with a similar scheme to AM2+'s end. The First Excavators should be released on AM3+ (A10-9400K BE ) with DDR4 support, while the rest are on FM3 (A10-9650K BE See where I am going here?) .

 

[juanrga]

7-zip is pro intel ? I must tell this to Igor Pavlov on sourceforge.

In intel devs forums you can find people asking for advice for compiling 7-zip sources using ICC

I'll check the compiler signature for the official release when I get home from work tonight, but I believe the official release is compiled against MSVC.

Who said them are using the official release?

 

[juanrga]

4 x Jaguar cores = between half and 80% of a Pentium mobile dual core see http://www.anandtech.com/show/6981/the-kabini-deal-can-amd-improve-the-quality-of-mainstream-pcs-with-its-latest-apu/2 I expect SR to be in another league. Jaguar is a competitor to Atom a good one but not good compared to high end desktop CPUs.

Anandtech uses biased benchmarks (Cripple_AMD function) that favour intel chips or uses the ones where AMD chips don't perform so well and ignores the benchmarks where AMD excels. In that review they use pcmark, cinebench, 7-zip...

If you add 33% to the Kabini numbers to simulate the 2Ghz model the results are pretty good. It passes the Pentium in multithreaded benchmarks and still uses less power.

The pentium runs at 2.4GHz and the i5 does up to 2.6GHz. For a clock-clock comparison of raw performance, I would add more than a 33%. Moreover, the effect of the biased benchmarks would be considered as well. It is better to start from fair jaguar benchmarks. Those show that:

4 JG ~ 2 SB + HT
8 JG ~ 4 SB + HT

According to AMD, SR has twice the performance of jaguar; therefore, I think that it is admissible that a 4 SR CPU will be close to an i7-2600k, under fair benchmarks and if everything scales fine.

 

[szatkus]

7-zip is pro intel ? I must tell this to Igor Pavlov on sourceforge.

In intel devs forums you can find people asking for advice for compiling 7-zip sources using ICC

I'll check the compiler signature for the official release when I get home from work tonight, but I believe the official release is compiled against MSVC.

Who said them are using the official release?

Because there's no reason to use non-official release.

 

[gamerk316]

4 x Jaguar cores = between half and 80% of a Pentium mobile dual core see http://www.anandtech.com/show/6981/the-kabini-deal-can-amd-improve-the-quality-of-mainstream-pcs-with-its-latest-apu/2 I expect SR to be in another league. Jaguar is a competitor to Atom a good one but not good compared to high end desktop CPUs.

Anandtech uses biased benchmarks (Cripple_AMD function) that favour intel chips or uses the ones where AMD chips don't perform so well and ignores the benchmarks where AMD excels. In that review they use pcmark, cinebench, 7-zip...

If you add 33% to the Kabini numbers to simulate the 2Ghz model the results are pretty good. It passes the Pentium in multithreaded benchmarks and still uses less power.

The pentium runs at 2.4GHz and the i5 does up to 2.6GHz. For a clock-clock comparison of raw performance, I would add more than a 33%. Moreover, the effect of the biased benchmarks would be considered as well. It is better to start from fair jaguar benchmarks. Those show that:

4 JG ~ 2 SB + HT
8 JG ~ 4 SB + HT

According to AMD, SR has twice the performance of jaguar; therefore, I think that it is admissible that a 4 SR CPU will be close to an i7-2600k, under fair benchmarks and if everything scales fine.

http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/pc-components/processors/amd-a4-5000-apu-1153738/review/3#articleContent

lol, never seen so much BS to make themselves believe amd jaguar cpus can compete with even a sandy bridge cpu with ht. A 2 core high clocked HT intel sandy bridge cpu will beat the 8 core jaguar.

Eh, thats a bit much. 4 core, possibly. 8 core, assuming a benchmark with multiple parallel threads? Not as likely.