AMD CPU speculation... and expert conjecture

[jdwii]

Wow now look at that never thought this would happen
http://www.dsogaming.com/news/amds-public-mantle-sdk-coming-this-year-nvidia-intel-free-to-use-it/

Now the question is will Nvidia and Intel use it when directx 12 is coming out soon and openGL nx?

 

[esrever]

^ sarcasm? AMD said from the beginning it would become open once the beta is over.

 

[jdwii]

Not sure we are just seeing a lot of open base software now even Microsoft is jumping in.

 

[colinp]

Why would Nvidia support a direct competitor's closed standard? If it was truly open, like opengl is open, then maybe...

 

[de5_Roy]

Big Swing in Market Share From AMD to NVIDIA: JPR
http://www.techpowerup.com/207180/big-swing-in-market-share-from-amd-to-nvidia-jpr.html


AMD : FreeSync Monitors Shipping in December – Will Cost $100 Less Than Nvidia G-Sync
http://wccftech.com/amd-freesync-monitors-shipping-decemberjanuary-driver-coming-december/
AMD Fiji XT R9 390X Specs Leak – 4GB of 3D Stacked HBM and 4096 Stream Processors
http://wccftech.com/amd-fiji-r9-390x-specs-leak/

Ubisoft accuses AMD of Assassin’s Creed Unity’s poor performance, bugs

“We are aware that the graphics performance of Assassin’s Creed Unity on PC may be adversely affected by certain AMD CPU and GPU configurations,” the statement by Ubisoft reads. “This should not affect the vast majority of PC players, but rest assured that AMD and Ubisoft are continuing to work together closely to resolve the issue, and will provide more information as soon as it is available.”

http://www.kitguru.net/components/graphic-cards/anton-shilov/ubisoft-accuses-amd-hardware-of-assassins-creed-unitys-poor-performance/
i wonder what this official statement means.. if this so called vast majority is intel's gpus(due to marketshare) then i guess...intel's gpus would likely crap out before running this game smoothly at high resolutions. if it means amd and nvidia only, then amd still has majority of marketshare of "gpus". so what gpus are this "vast majority" of "pc players" running?

 

[esrever]

^ubisoft has to blame someone and its hard to blame the nvidia who is paying them.

 

[szatkus]

Ubisoft accuses AMD of Assassin’s Creed Unity’s poor performance, bugs

“We are aware that the graphics performance of Assassin’s Creed Unity on PC may be adversely affected by certain AMD CPU and GPU configurations,” the statement by Ubisoft reads. “This should not affect the vast majority of PC players, but rest assured that AMD and Ubisoft are continuing to work together closely to resolve the issue, and will provide more information as soon as it is available.”

http://www.kitguru.net/components/graphic-cards/anton-shilov/ubisoft-accuses-amd-hardware-of-assassins-creed-unitys-poor-performance/
i wonder what this official statement means.. if this so called vast majority is intel's gpus(due to marketshare) then i guess...intel's gpus would likely crap out before running this game smoothly at high resolutions. if it means amd and nvidia only, then amd still has majority of marketshare of "gpus". so what gpus are this "vast majority" of "pc players" running?

Looks like the problem is with GCN 1.0. On 280x it's two times less FPS than 290x.

 

[cemerian]

Wow now look at that never thought this would happen
http://www.dsogaming.com/news/amds-public-mantle-sdk-coming-this-year-nvidia-intel-free-to-use-it/

Now the question is will Nvidia and Intel use it when directx 12 is coming out soon and openGL nx?

I seriously doubt nvidia has any point of supporting it when its designed only for GCN architecture, keep in mind amd's old gpu don't support it, they would not get the same performance out of it as amd are getting without a huge software layer on top of it, even then it would be slower for them than it is for amd, Its just not gona happen

 

[esrever]

Wow now look at that never thought this would happen
http://www.dsogaming.com/news/amds-public-mantle-sdk-coming-this-year-nvidia-intel-free-to-use-it/

Now the question is will Nvidia and Intel use it when directx 12 is coming out soon and openGL nx?

I seriously doubt nvidia has any point of supporting it when its designed only for GCN architecture, keep in mind amd's old gpu don't support it, they would not get the same performance out of it as amd are getting without a huge software layer on top of it, even then it would be slower for them than it is for amd, Its just not gona happen

The shader code of mantle is exactly the same as dx11, so if nvidia wants, they can probably implement it on any dx11 class gpu. AMD has completely stopped supporting gpus before GCN, they probably don't think its worth the trouble to support old cards.

 

[8350rocks]

That stems from VLIW vs. GCN. 2 completely separate architectures...it would be very easy for them to continue supporting GCN cards moving forward though...

 

[Embra]

Assassin's Creed Unity not running well on AMD hardware
Some more Ubisoft shenanigans.
http://www.guru3d.com/news-story/assassins-creed-unity-not-running-well-on-amd-hardware.html

 

[gamerk316]

Which again asks a question: Is this Ubisoft's fault, or AMDs? I ask, because AMD has been lagging behind NVIDIA in DX performance for several major titles now...

 

[8350rocks]

Which again asks a question: Is this Ubisoft's fault, or AMDs? I ask, because AMD has been lagging behind NVIDIA in DX performance for several major titles now...

The article states that ubisoft has the game running at a peak of 50k simultaneous draw calls...

DX11 is supposed to handle 10k simultaneous peak draw calls.

Mantle and DX12 can take 50k simultaneous draw calls...but DX11 is standing there like a bellhop at the waldorf astoria after you tipped him with a dollar bill and advice...

 

[logainofhades]

Which again asks a question: Is this Ubisoft's fault, or AMDs? I ask, because AMD has been lagging behind NVIDIA in DX performance for several major titles now...

I blame Ubisoft. They should know what they need to code for. Like many programmers today, they are lazy, and put out crap that they will just patch later, if at all.

 

[gamerk316]

Which again asks a question: Is this Ubisoft's fault, or AMDs? I ask, because AMD has been lagging behind NVIDIA in DX performance for several major titles now...

The article states that ubisoft has the game running at a peak of 50k simultaneous draw calls...

DX11 is supposed to handle 10k simultaneous peak draw calls.

Mantle and DX12 can take 50k simultaneous draw calls...but DX11 is standing there like a bellhop at the waldorf astoria after you tipped him with a dollar bill and advice...

But if AMD is doing significantly worse then a corresponding NVIDIA card, that means either the title isn't optimized, or AMD DX performance is slipping. And it's worth noting, AMD DX performance has been slipping for several titles in recent months...

Secondly, if Ubi needs that many draw calls, they're doing something wrong.

 

[Embra]

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2847341/ubisoft-pledges-fixes-for-assassins-creed-unitys-atrocious-performanceissues.html

"Strangely, a community manager on Ubisoft's forums has singled out AMD CPU and GPU configurations as causing graphics performance issues, even as users of Nvidia graphics cards have experienced plenty of their own problems. PCWorld's Hayden Dingman (who is currently working on his Assassin's Creed: Unity review) is using an Nvidia GTX 760 GPU, and has seen his computer go into a hard lock 10 times over the last two days, among other issues. The entire launch is a mess on PCs and consoles alike, and likely won't be fixed for some time, so calling out AMD in particular doesn't make much sense.

In the meantime, you're probably better off avoiding the game until all the issues are fixed."




May we should have optimized consoles for each for each game written, to makes it easier for the poor play developers.
Buy this game and get the optimized console for half price or something??

 

[juanrga]

Secondly, if Ubi needs that many draw calls, they're doing something wrong.

As someone wrote in another part

AC:U stress heavily the CPU because of a lot of useless draw calls. Ubisoft developers are monkey.

DX11 supports up to ~15k draw calls before the CPU requirements get out of hand. In the same scenario Mantle could do around 130k calls on the same CPU. So Ubisoft is exceeding the amount of draw calls by 3.3x. This is not AMD fault. On the other hand, consoles have to-the-metal access and almost non-existent API overhead but the CPUs cannot cope with the stress of the multitude of polygons.

 

[gamerk316]

DX11 supports up to ~15k draw calls before the CPU requirements get out of hand. In the same scenario Mantle could do around 130k calls on the same CPU. So Ubisoft is exceeding the amount of draw calls by 3.3x. This is not AMD fault.

No, its not. What is AMD's fault is a performance difference in DX between them and NVIDIA, if one exists. The point here isn't the amount of pointless draw calls, the point here is "does AMD suffer worse then NVIDIA, and if so, why".

 

[logainofhades]

Because Nvida pays off game companies?

 

[esrever]

DX11 supports up to ~15k draw calls before the CPU requirements get out of hand. In the same scenario Mantle could do around 130k calls on the same CPU. So Ubisoft is exceeding the amount of draw calls by 3.3x. This is not AMD fault.

No, its not. What is AMD's fault is a performance difference in DX between them and NVIDIA, if one exists. The point here isn't the amount of pointless draw calls, the point here is "does AMD suffer worse then NVIDIA, and if so, why".

Because nvidia has always sponsored assassins creed games and they always run slightly better on nvidia? Even tho most of them are extremely bad PC ports that run terribly on everything.

 

[jdwii]

DX11 supports up to ~15k draw calls before the CPU requirements get out of hand. In the same scenario Mantle could do around 130k calls on the same CPU. So Ubisoft is exceeding the amount of draw calls by 3.3x. This is not AMD fault.

No, its not. What is AMD's fault is a performance difference in DX between them and NVIDIA, if one exists. The point here isn't the amount of pointless draw calls, the point here is "does AMD suffer worse then NVIDIA, and if so, why".

Gamer i think this time its quite clear its not Amd's fault, you have the draw call issue on both and then you have Nvidia gameworks which works better on Nvidia anyways. If we look at benchmarks a 970Gtx is 5% faster compared to a 290X using 1080P through in all the Nvidia features and the gap gets bigger. .

Edit i'm just happy far cry 4 is turning out to be good.

 

[8350rocks]

Thing is, unless you are running a 970+ or 290+ you are basically screwed, that cannot appeal to many pc gamers. Honestly AC was always a console game mostly.

 

[colinp]

Drawing conclusions about AMD performance from an Nvidia sponsored title is foolish in the extreme

 

[-Fran-]

Ok, hold on a second with Ubisoft's discussion. I'll play devil's advocate for a minute here.

I won't delve into how it was coded (cause I don't know/care), but will take the "facts" laid here in the thread about AC:U as truth.

Why are we blaming Ubisoft for "using more than 15K calls" using DirectX? Isn't that what "next gen" is all about? Game devs (and publishers) put games that make our current gen hardware crawl. So, on one hand we see Ubisoft putting AC:U out (dumb bugs aside), pushing the performance of PCs out there to the limit and we're complaining about it? Isn't that what we call a "double standard"? The game looks better in consoles and in PCs as well, isn't it? Is it a noticeable difference? From what I've read, yes.

Ok, that's it. I still hate Ubicrap, so we're clear, haha.

Now, on the other side, why blame AMD when nVidia is also having issues with it? Since the consoles use AMD hardware, but the PC version of AC:U is a Gameworks/TWIMTBP sponsored title, it's not really unexpected a difference in performance for day 1. I'm not calling dumb conspiracy theories, but plain old business tactics at work here. AMD needs to put forward a driver update to catch up and that's about it.

Now, for the dumb conspiracy theory: Code it like crap for PC, golden for Console (well, less crappy in Ubisoft's case, haha) and people will turn into consoles again since a PC upgrade is way more than a Console's sticker price.

Cheers!

 

[etayorius]

Ubisoft is and will always be CRAP, they have zero respect for PC and have gone as far to let us all know what they think of PC.

ExtremeTech are up to something, you all may want to read this article which denotes his problem on his Intel/nVidia System:

http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/194123-assassins-creed-unity-for-the-pc-benchmarks-and-analysis-of-its-poor-performance