AMD CPUs, SoC Rumors and Speculations Temp. thread 2

[Cazalan]

Close the thread that gets the most views on the whole site. Brilliant! I'd have one less website to view daily. 😉

 

[Vogner16]

Start your own thread, then PM a moderator and request that it be stickied. Just keep in mind that not all requests for sticky are granted.

im not going to do that. this thread is fine.

can we get back to AMD CPUs, SoC Rumors and Speculations Temp. thread 2 now?

I think there is a lot of importance to these apu's that everyone seems to be glossing over.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9726/amd-launches-excavator-based-rseries-apus-for-embedded-with-ddr4-support

 

[jimmysmitty]

Start your own thread, then PM a moderator and request that it be stickied. Just keep in mind that not all requests for sticky are granted.

im not going to do that. this thread is fine.

can we get back to AMD CPUs, SoC Rumors and Speculations Temp. thread 2 now?

I think there is a lot of importance to these apu's that everyone seems to be glossing over.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9726/amd-launches-excavator-based-rseries-apus-for-embedded-with-ddr4-support

Mainly because the focus is on Zen and its iteration of APUs. The biggest problem is that even these new APUs are not competitive enough. Besides, Zen is the big topic right now. Hell even with Skylake in the up and coming Zen was more widely talked about.

I think it is because we get very little info from AMD while we get a lot from Intel. We know the code names for the next two uArchs while Zen is the only big one from AMD. And before they moved back to a CPU + SMT design it was pretty much BD base design with improvements for the foreseeable future. I guess that sparks more discussion than anything else.

 

[cvnhmin]

Any Carrizo reviews yet?

 

[Vogner16]

Start your own thread, then PM a moderator and request that it be stickied. Just keep in mind that not all requests for sticky are granted.

im not going to do that. this thread is fine.

can we get back to AMD CPUs, SoC Rumors and Speculations Temp. thread 2 now?

I think there is a lot of importance to these apu's that everyone seems to be glossing over.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9726/amd-launches-excavator-based-rseries-apus-for-embedded-with-ddr4-support

Mainly because the focus is on Zen and its iteration of APUs. The biggest problem is that even these new APUs are not competitive enough. Besides, Zen is the big topic right now. Hell even with Skylake in the up and coming Zen was more widely talked about.

I think it is because we get very little info from AMD while we get a lot from Intel. We know the code names for the next two uArchs while Zen is the only big one from AMD. And before they moved back to a CPU + SMT design it was pretty much BD base design with improvements for the foreseeable future. I guess that sparks more discussion than anything else.

I thought the first gen of AM4 APU's would end up with excavator cores and updated igpu. Zen will not be in the APU market for two years or so.

Simular to what was done with llano using old k10 cores llano had an old gpu core as well I think but if amd did that this time we would simply have Carrizo on AM4.

thoughts?

I forget where I read this may have been wccf or here

 

[jimmysmitty]

Start your own thread, then PM a moderator and request that it be stickied. Just keep in mind that not all requests for sticky are granted.

im not going to do that. this thread is fine.

can we get back to AMD CPUs, SoC Rumors and Speculations Temp. thread 2 now?

I think there is a lot of importance to these apu's that everyone seems to be glossing over.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9726/amd-launches-excavator-based-rseries-apus-for-embedded-with-ddr4-support

Mainly because the focus is on Zen and its iteration of APUs. The biggest problem is that even these new APUs are not competitive enough. Besides, Zen is the big topic right now. Hell even with Skylake in the up and coming Zen was more widely talked about.

I think it is because we get very little info from AMD while we get a lot from Intel. We know the code names for the next two uArchs while Zen is the only big one from AMD. And before they moved back to a CPU + SMT design it was pretty much BD base design with improvements for the foreseeable future. I guess that sparks more discussion than anything else.

I thought the first gen of AM4 APU's would end up with excavator cores and updated igpu. Zen will not be in the APU market for two years or so.

Simular to what was done with llano using old k10 cores llano had an old gpu core as well I think but if amd did that this time we would simply have Carrizo on AM4.

thoughts?

I forget where I read this may have been wccf or here

The biggest problem with WCCF is that they will post anything rumor wise and go back and forth between them. They had a ton of rumors for Fury X for example, such as 8GB of GDDR5 then 8GB of HBM etc. So they are hard to trust unless it is pretty much near release.

Zen is the only one I can even think will be worth anything.

 

[salgado18]

I thought the first gen of AM4 APU's would end up with excavator cores and updated igpu. Zen will not be in the APU market for two years or so.

Simular to what was done with llano using old k10 cores llano had an old gpu core as well I think but if amd did that this time we would simply have Carrizo on AM4.

thoughts?

I forget where I read this may have been wccf or here

It was in AMD's roadmap, just can't remember where it was. I definitelly saw it here, but may as well have seen it in other news sites, maybe even Tom's.

Zen will come to the mid-high end first, where FX is now. APUs will fill the mid-low end, using Excavator, and an upcoming graphics core. All on AM4 socket.

 

[Guest]

Excavator apu, Carrizo for desktops will arrive in 2016 before Zen FX cores. Bristol Ridge are 4 core ones, 2 cores ones are Stoney Ridge. Zen apus (Raven Ridge) will come in 2017.

 

[Vogner16]

Excavator apu, Carrizo for desktops will arrive in 2016 before Zen FX cores. Bristol Ridge are 4 core ones, 2 cores ones are Stoney Ridge. Zen apus (Raven Ridge) will come in 2017.

that's what I thought. source?

 

[jimmysmitty]

I thought the first gen of AM4 APU's would end up with excavator cores and updated igpu. Zen will not be in the APU market for two years or so.

Simular to what was done with llano using old k10 cores llano had an old gpu core as well I think but if amd did that this time we would simply have Carrizo on AM4.

thoughts?

I forget where I read this may have been wccf or here

It was in AMD's roadmap, just can't remember where it was. I definitelly saw it here, but may as well have seen it in other news sites, maybe even Tom's.

Zen will come to the mid-high end first, where FX is now. APUs will fill the mid-low end, using Excavator, and an upcoming graphics core. All on AM4 socket.

The question is which roadmap. Their roadmap has changed pretty often in the past few years.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9231/amds-20162017-x86-roadmap-zen-is-in

That is the most recent and shows the 7th gen APUs on FP4 but then everything moves to AM4 with Zen following.

Subject to change of course.

 

[Guest]

Excavator apu, Carrizo for desktops will arrive in 2016 before Zen FX cores. Bristol Ridge are 4 core ones, 2 cores ones are Stoney Ridge. Zen apus (Raven Ridge) will come in 2017.

that's what I thought. source?

http://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/anton-shilov/amds-future-bristol-ridge-and-stoney-ridge-apus-listed-in-bios-binaries/
http://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/anton-shilov/transition-to-zen-microarchitecture-will-take-amd-years-document/

 

[Guest]

I thought the first gen of AM4 APU's would end up with excavator cores and updated igpu. Zen will not be in the APU market for two years or so.

Simular to what was done with llano using old k10 cores llano had an old gpu core as well I think but if amd did that this time we would simply have Carrizo on AM4.

thoughts?

I forget where I read this may have been wccf or here

It was in AMD's roadmap, just can't remember where it was. I definitelly saw it here, but may as well have seen it in other news sites, maybe even Tom's.

Zen will come to the mid-high end first, where FX is now. APUs will fill the mid-low end, using Excavator, and an upcoming graphics core. All on AM4 socket.

The question is which roadmap. Their roadmap has changed pretty often in the past few years.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9231/amds-20162017-x86-roadmap-zen-is-in

That is the most recent and shows the 7th gen APUs on FP4 but then everything moves to AM4 with Zen following.

Subject to change of course.

Mobile apus are on FP4 and will remain so even when zen arrives. Only change is, all mobile apus will be on FP4 in 2016 rather than FP4 and FT3b of 2015.

 

[de5_Roy]

AMD Stoney APU Support Is Going Into The Linux 4.4 Kernel
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=AMD-Stoney-Linux-4.4
don't read to much into it.

Rumor : AMD Zen CPU Core Testing "Met All Expectation" - No "Significant Bottlenecks" Found
http://wccftech.com/amd-zen/
look at the url. screams of click-bait. and it started to copy yours truly:

usual grain of NaCl.

what the fluoro-unobtainile-cupric-potassium alloy? plagiarists!!

AMD Zen Based Flagships: 'Summit Ridge' CPU and 'Raven Ridge' APU Spotted in AIDA64 Changelog
http://wccftech.com/amd-zen-based-cpu-summit-ridge-apu-raven-ridge-spotted-aida64-changelog/

 

[salgado18]

AMD Stoney APU Support Is Going Into The Linux 4.4 Kernel
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=AMD-Stoney-Linux-4.4
don't read to much into it.

Rumor : AMD Zen CPU Core Testing "Met All Expectation" - No "Significant Bottlenecks" Found
http://wccftech.com/amd-zen/
look at the url. screams of click-bait. and it started to copy yours truly:

usual grain of NaCl.

what the fluoro-unobtainile-cupric-potassium alloy? plagiarists!!

AMD Zen Based Flagships: 'Summit Ridge' CPU and 'Raven Ridge' APU Spotted in AIDA64 Changelog
http://wccftech.com/amd-zen-based-cpu-summit-ridge-apu-raven-ridge-spotted-aida64-changelog/

Could someone talk about the implications of this info from the AIDA leak news (assuming it's true):

It will also be ISA compatible with Haswell/Broadwell style of compute.

 

[de5_Roy]

Could someone talk about the implications of this info from the AIDA leak news (assuming it's true):

It will also be ISA compatible with Haswell/Broadwell style of compute.

possibly talking about the avx extensions and others. mind you: compatible, not comparable.

 

[jdwii]

http://wccftech.com/amd-zen/

"AMD Zen CPU Core Testing “Met All Expectation” – No “Significant Bottlenecks” Found"

 

[juanrga]

WCCFTECH rumor is just what someone anonymous (@lurker) said on RWT forums about what someone anonymous said him about what someone anonymous said about Zen. Yes, there are three unknown people involved in the rumor. This sets a new low for WCCFTECH lack of any quality.

I answered @lurker directly on the same place from where WCCFTECH got the rumor. And this is what lurker wrote after to me:

I'm honestly not too informed about how hardware works in detail, so thanks for the informative post, I just came here to say what a trustworthy guy told me. I'm not sure what Zen was targeting, whether the whole core met expectations or just the part that his team was working on. I guess it could just be that they weren't aiming for HPC with Zen core, rather markets they can win back easier(desktop/mobile and mid-range servers). But since Zen is probably going to release within a year, I guess we'll find out more details from AMD themselves soon.

I bolded the relevant part.

 

[Vogner16]

WCCFTECH rumor is just what someone anonymous (@lurker) said on RWT forums about what someone anonymous said him about what someone anonymous said about Zen. Yes, there are three unknown people involved in the rumor. This sets a new low for WCCFTECH lack of any quality.

I answered @lurker directly on the same place from where WCCFTECH got the rumor. And this is what lurker wrote after to me:

I'm honestly not too informed about how hardware works in detail, so thanks for the informative post, I just came here to say what a trustworthy guy told me. I'm not sure what Zen was targeting, whether the whole core met expectations or just the part that his team was working on. I guess it could just be that they weren't aiming for HPC with Zen core, rather markets they can win back easier(desktop/mobile and mid-range servers). But since Zen is probably going to release within a year, I guess we'll find out more details from AMD themselves soon.

I bolded the relevant part.

juan the detective. Good stuff!

A new low is not true however. I have seen similar lows on poor leads for years on wccf. and click bait is what gets the readers so wccf making money is all they care about. nobody really trusts their info anyway just something to read.

Sombody linked you to that wccf article in the comments unless that was yourself. just thought it was funny to recognize your name on another website.

 

[8350rocks]

AMD Stoney APU Support Is Going Into The Linux 4.4 Kernel
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=AMD-Stoney-Linux-4.4
don't read to much into it.

Rumor : AMD Zen CPU Core Testing "Met All Expectation" - No "Significant Bottlenecks" Found
http://wccftech.com/amd-zen/
look at the url. screams of click-bait. and it started to copy yours truly:

usual grain of NaCl.

what the fluoro-unobtainile-cupric-potassium alloy? plagiarists!!

AMD Zen Based Flagships: 'Summit Ridge' CPU and 'Raven Ridge' APU Spotted in AIDA64 Changelog
http://wccftech.com/amd-zen-based-cpu-summit-ridge-apu-raven-ridge-spotted-aida64-changelog/

Could someone talk about the implications of this info from the AIDA leak news (assuming it's true):

It will also be ISA compatible with Haswell/Broadwell style of compute.

All x86 ISA extensions used up to broadwell will be included in Zen.

 

[cdrkf]

AMD Stoney APU Support Is Going Into The Linux 4.4 Kernel
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=AMD-Stoney-Linux-4.4
don't read to much into it.

Rumor : AMD Zen CPU Core Testing "Met All Expectation" - No "Significant Bottlenecks" Found
http://wccftech.com/amd-zen/
look at the url. screams of click-bait. and it started to copy yours truly:

usual grain of NaCl.

what the fluoro-unobtainile-cupric-potassium alloy? plagiarists!!

AMD Zen Based Flagships: 'Summit Ridge' CPU and 'Raven Ridge' APU Spotted in AIDA64 Changelog
http://wccftech.com/amd-zen-based-cpu-summit-ridge-apu-raven-ridge-spotted-aida64-changelog/

Could someone talk about the implications of this info from the AIDA leak news (assuming it's true):

It will also be ISA compatible with Haswell/Broadwell style of compute.

All x86 ISA extensions used up to broadwell will be included in Zen.

That's good to know. What will be interesting is how Zen handles AVX 2...? Will the FPU be wide enough to do this (the diagram suggests 2 x 256b fpu pipes per core so combined it would be able to execute a 512bit AVX 2 instruction, at least if I'm remembering correctly), or will it 'double pump' 256b instructions in a similar way to how they enabled AVX on the cat cores?

 

[juanrga]

Zen has two 128bit FMA pipes. Two 128-bit pipes will be fused into one 256-bit pipe for AVX2. It is the same flawed strategy on Jaguar and Excavator cores.

 

[cdrkf]

Zen has two 128bit FMA pipes. Two 128-bit pipes will be fused into one 256-bit pipe for AVX2. It is the same flawed strategy on Jaguar and Excavator cores.

Ah, and of course it is Haswell (and newer) than have the wider 512bit fpu, so Haswell will still have double the per core fpu throughput of Zen in AVX2 instructions?

 

[8350rocks]

Zen has two 128bit FMA pipes. Two 128-bit pipes will be fused into one 256-bit pipe for AVX2. It is the same flawed strategy on Jaguar and Excavator cores.

Ah, and of course it is Haswell (and newer) than have the wider 512bit fpu, so Haswell will still have double the per core fpu throughput of Zen in AVX2 instructions?

So, in layman's terms, to the average consumer this means that the AutoCAD benchmarks will still show intel asininely faster, even though real world performance will be very different in 99.99% of tasks for a household.

 

[cdrkf]

Zen has two 128bit FMA pipes. Two 128-bit pipes will be fused into one 256-bit pipe for AVX2. It is the same flawed strategy on Jaguar and Excavator cores.

Ah, and of course it is Haswell (and newer) than have the wider 512bit fpu, so Haswell will still have double the per core fpu throughput of Zen in AVX2 instructions?

So, in layman's terms, to the average consumer this means that the AutoCAD benchmarks will still show intel asininely faster, even though real world performance will be very different in 99.99% of tasks for a household.

Yeah it's a pretty specific use case where the wider FPU is a big advantage. I think it's a real step forward that a *single core* has a 256 bit fpu, that's double the fpu capability of Excavator given that in the latter the dual 128 bit was shared between two integer cores. It will be interesting to see how it benchmarks. I mean Sandy isn't far behind Skylake in many applications despite being technically inferior in many almost all respects as it's obviously got an ideal blend of execution resources for most common software. Really Zen needs to do something similar, rather than best Intel in every regard. I guess the only danger is that with wider adoption of things like AVX / AVX 2, software developers might start using it more heavily, which could then expose the comparative weakness? How long does it take for something like that to become commonplace?

 

[jimmysmitty]

Zen has two 128bit FMA pipes. Two 128-bit pipes will be fused into one 256-bit pipe for AVX2. It is the same flawed strategy on Jaguar and Excavator cores.

Ah, and of course it is Haswell (and newer) than have the wider 512bit fpu, so Haswell will still have double the per core fpu throughput of Zen in AVX2 instructions?

So, in layman's terms, to the average consumer this means that the AutoCAD benchmarks will still show intel asininely faster, even though real world performance will be very different in 99.99% of tasks for a household.

Yes unless "household" applications start taking advantage of those ISAs.

Still CAD is a big market. Wouldn't hurt AMD to be able to take some of that as well.