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blackflyisking
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u rite user 18 if u google it u see there dif 7750 i seen a pic with it got 2x dvi port n 2x hdmi n 2x mini display pot 1x display on it check it out man
blackflyisking
Distinguished
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sorry my bad i look at d photo wrong to diff 7770 on top of each othere that y it look it got all that crazy stuff i was talking about lol
[citation][nom]malmental[/nom]HD 7770, it should be better than that by now....power consumption not included, strictly performance comment, not worth the price.[/citation]
I can agree on that analogy to an extent but it is a low end card the 7770 is I mean but with mid range performance that automatically makes it already cheap upon release even with a $160 price tag just based on performance than the competition GTX 460 was way more expensive at it's launch and even today there are GTX 460 1GB selling for $200 LOL. So really the 7770 is a purely mid range card with a mid range price but it is classed as low end card which makes it great but ya the price needs to come down to at leased 6850 levels to really and truly be considered a gem.
I can agree on that analogy to an extent but it is a low end card the 7770 is I mean but with mid range performance that automatically makes it already cheap upon release even with a $160 price tag just based on performance than the competition GTX 460 was way more expensive at it's launch and even today there are GTX 460 1GB selling for $200 LOL. So really the 7770 is a purely mid range card with a mid range price but it is classed as low end card which makes it great but ya the price needs to come down to at leased 6850 levels to really and truly be considered a gem.
Wisecracker
Splendid
- Jan 15, 2007
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The AMD Radeon HD7750/70s are replacements for the HD6850/70s (which are EOL). This is the new Radeon entry level discreet for the masses. At 123mm2 it's within a few mm of being one-third less in size than the GTX460 rumored 367mm2 die size
Werd is Trinity APU production samples have been out for a few months, and mass production may well be underway (it is suggested that AMD is attempting to rain on Intel's upcoming Ivy release next month). The Trinity GPU has been labeled as an HD7000 series but rumors say 28nm, 32nm, 40nm, GCN, VLIW4 and VLIW5 architectures.
Take your pick
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[citation][nom]bak0n[/nom]I've yet to be able to find a 7750 that is a true single slot design for my btx boxes...[/citation]
I have an email in to AMD confirming these will exist. If it turns out to only be the reference card, we'll be altering the conclusion.
I have an email in to AMD confirming these will exist. If it turns out to only be the reference card, we'll be altering the conclusion.
Wisecracker
Splendid
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I have no clue -- perhaps Chris can help you with that. I would think there would be some harvesting for lower-lower end discreet parts, and suspect some 6000-series re-badging to hit price points and hold market share under $90, but . . .
AMD is clearly (to me and other folks, anyway) placing their bets on the Trinity APU to perform at the 'HD76xx' level (whatever that may be). The internets suggest significant graphics improvement over Llano. It would be killer if they could establish decent hybrid CrossFire with Trinity and something like the HD7750 or similar cut-down card.
Chris might know some inside poop but he would be under NDA.
- Jul 4, 2008
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As far as I know, everything under the Radeon HD 7700-series will be based on the previous architecture at 40 nm.
Don is actually the one who attended the 7900-series press day where they talked roadmap, and he mentioned that OEM-rebranding will see 6000-series boards named as 7000-series parts (plus the mobile stuff, which is currently being called 7000-series, but still the old stuff; of course you guys know what we think about AMD's mobile naming as of late).
Don is actually the one who attended the 7900-series press day where they talked roadmap, and he mentioned that OEM-rebranding will see 6000-series boards named as 7000-series parts (plus the mobile stuff, which is currently being called 7000-series, but still the old stuff; of course you guys know what we think about AMD's mobile naming as of late).
verbalizer
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blazorthon
Glorious
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[citation][nom]MattMock[/nom]In the monthly best Graphics cards you mention that AMD is dominating. I wonder why though. Are Nvidia's cards capable of maintaining a price premium because consumers are willing to pay a little more to use Nvidia drivers and extras like PhysX and 3d vision? Or possibly are their cards more expensive to manufacture and so Nvidia must raise prices to maintain margins and simply suffer reduced sales at those prices. Anyone know?[/citation]
It may be a little bit of both. Nvidia's GPU dies are often larger than AMD's competing GPU dies so they are more expensive to manufacture and binning hurts even more and Nvidia is just more famous, people are willing to pay for them. We have several games that are specifically written to work better on Nvidia cards than on competing AMD cards, and some games saying "Nvidia, the way it's meant to be played" or something similar can't help there.
AMD dominates because Nvidia cards tend to have worse value in one way or another. Nvidia's cards can use more power, be more expensive for the same or worse performance, or just not even have competition from Nvidia. The only notable exception (at least as I think) is the GTX 560 Ti, which is about as fast as the 6950 and according to Tom's uses less power. Everything slower than it uses too much power and everything above it is too expensive. The GTX 570 isn't noticeably faster than the Radeon 6970, but it's more expensive and it has less memory (only 1.25GB, 6970 has 2GB) so it can't handle high memory situations as well as the cheaper Radeon, especially in multi-GPU configurations. Due to the excellent Crossfire scaling, two much cheaper Radeon 6950s can fight with two GTX 570s in dual GPU setups and the 2GB 6950s are even better for such situations.
[citation][nom]hardcore_gamer[/nom]I hope the price of 7770 comes down to $130. That is where this card belongs.[/citation]
[citation][nom]phamhlam[/nom]If the 7770 is the same price as the 6850. I think we have the best value card right here. The 6850 was a great budget card but this card will change that.[/citation]
Yes, lets price a card that performs slightly worse than the 6850 in the price range of the 6850... This card is part of a new generation, it is supposed to have better price/performance than the previous and the previous is supposed to also drop in price, not let the new generation be even more expensive.
7770 should cost about $110-$130 USD, not a penny more for launch price, and that's not counting the price drop that's supposed to happen. Including it, this card should cost $80-$100 USD.
[citation][nom]Chad Boga[/nom]AMD, the "consumer's friend", releases their Bulldozer of GPU's. LOL[/citation]
That's an idiotic statement simply because unlike Bulldozer, GCN is a good architecture. These cards show a die shrink and improved performance per watt over the previous generation. Bulldozer is a die shrink with decreased performance and this is pretty much the opposite of what you're trying to say.
[citation][nom]Big-Mac[/nom]Kinda of disappointed.i am waiting for a GPU that power consumption = 6850, perfomance = 6950, price = $150.[/citation]
That sounds about where the Pitcairn cards will fit. Expecting a mid-range card to perform like a high end card isn't going to work. Although apparently AMD feels the need to price this mid-range card about 50% higher than it should be, almost in the start of the high end pricing range.
[citation][nom]jezus53[/nom]Maybe AMD is intentionally selling these at an inflated price. Hear me out on this. Maybe they have the high prices to drive people into buying the old inventory of 5xxx and 6xxx cards. Then once that is cleared out they'll drop the price. Either way they make money, whether they sell a 7770 or a 5770. That way inventory on old cards sells quick and you are left with simply making and selling your current gen. Just a thought.[/citation]
That's actually a very good possibility. By selling off the previous generations before the new generation is attractive to buyers they make greater profits because the older cards are sold at a time where they have greater value, instead of retaining the stock of them and selling them over time as their value depreciates. In the mean time the 7770 is over priced so any of it's sales will bring in a huge profit, especially since it undoubtedly costs less money to make it with it's GPU being smaller. That way the older cards get sold off as the newer cards make back their R&D costs relatively quickly. Once the old cards are sold out or close to it, the 7000 cards go down in price and sell more to make up for the price decrease.
It may be a little bit of both. Nvidia's GPU dies are often larger than AMD's competing GPU dies so they are more expensive to manufacture and binning hurts even more and Nvidia is just more famous, people are willing to pay for them. We have several games that are specifically written to work better on Nvidia cards than on competing AMD cards, and some games saying "Nvidia, the way it's meant to be played" or something similar can't help there.
AMD dominates because Nvidia cards tend to have worse value in one way or another. Nvidia's cards can use more power, be more expensive for the same or worse performance, or just not even have competition from Nvidia. The only notable exception (at least as I think) is the GTX 560 Ti, which is about as fast as the 6950 and according to Tom's uses less power. Everything slower than it uses too much power and everything above it is too expensive. The GTX 570 isn't noticeably faster than the Radeon 6970, but it's more expensive and it has less memory (only 1.25GB, 6970 has 2GB) so it can't handle high memory situations as well as the cheaper Radeon, especially in multi-GPU configurations. Due to the excellent Crossfire scaling, two much cheaper Radeon 6950s can fight with two GTX 570s in dual GPU setups and the 2GB 6950s are even better for such situations.
[citation][nom]hardcore_gamer[/nom]I hope the price of 7770 comes down to $130. That is where this card belongs.[/citation]
[citation][nom]phamhlam[/nom]If the 7770 is the same price as the 6850. I think we have the best value card right here. The 6850 was a great budget card but this card will change that.[/citation]
Yes, lets price a card that performs slightly worse than the 6850 in the price range of the 6850... This card is part of a new generation, it is supposed to have better price/performance than the previous and the previous is supposed to also drop in price, not let the new generation be even more expensive.
7770 should cost about $110-$130 USD, not a penny more for launch price, and that's not counting the price drop that's supposed to happen. Including it, this card should cost $80-$100 USD.
[citation][nom]Chad Boga[/nom]AMD, the "consumer's friend", releases their Bulldozer of GPU's. LOL[/citation]
That's an idiotic statement simply because unlike Bulldozer, GCN is a good architecture. These cards show a die shrink and improved performance per watt over the previous generation. Bulldozer is a die shrink with decreased performance and this is pretty much the opposite of what you're trying to say.
[citation][nom]Big-Mac[/nom]Kinda of disappointed.i am waiting for a GPU that power consumption = 6850, perfomance = 6950, price = $150.[/citation]
That sounds about where the Pitcairn cards will fit. Expecting a mid-range card to perform like a high end card isn't going to work. Although apparently AMD feels the need to price this mid-range card about 50% higher than it should be, almost in the start of the high end pricing range.
[citation][nom]jezus53[/nom]Maybe AMD is intentionally selling these at an inflated price. Hear me out on this. Maybe they have the high prices to drive people into buying the old inventory of 5xxx and 6xxx cards. Then once that is cleared out they'll drop the price. Either way they make money, whether they sell a 7770 or a 5770. That way inventory on old cards sells quick and you are left with simply making and selling your current gen. Just a thought.[/citation]
That's actually a very good possibility. By selling off the previous generations before the new generation is attractive to buyers they make greater profits because the older cards are sold at a time where they have greater value, instead of retaining the stock of them and selling them over time as their value depreciates. In the mean time the 7770 is over priced so any of it's sales will bring in a huge profit, especially since it undoubtedly costs less money to make it with it's GPU being smaller. That way the older cards get sold off as the newer cards make back their R&D costs relatively quickly. Once the old cards are sold out or close to it, the 7000 cards go down in price and sell more to make up for the price decrease.
Personally, I am disappointed.
Armed with 31% of the flagship GPU’s shaders and texture units, 50% of its ROP partitions, 66% of its L2 cache, and a mere 27% of its peak memory bandwidth, company representatives say they ran simulations and these were the ratios that turned back optimal performance.
Bull!! How can two boards, one with 64% of the core throughput of the other, both be optimally configured with the same memory bandwidth? At the very least the 7770 should have the 1200 MHz memory clock of the 6770. And considering how much more expensive the 7770 is versus the 6770, should have a memory clock of at least 1250 MHz.
Maybe I'm biased because neither card is anywhere close to what I was wanting, which is the fastest card possible within the PCIe power limit of 75 watts. For me the ideal card would probably be one with 10 CUs, a core clock of 900 MHz, and 1125 MHz memory clock. Such a card would probably fall just under the 75 watt threshold, and to me would be worth up to $179.
Armed with 31% of the flagship GPU’s shaders and texture units, 50% of its ROP partitions, 66% of its L2 cache, and a mere 27% of its peak memory bandwidth, company representatives say they ran simulations and these were the ratios that turned back optimal performance.
Bull!! How can two boards, one with 64% of the core throughput of the other, both be optimally configured with the same memory bandwidth? At the very least the 7770 should have the 1200 MHz memory clock of the 6770. And considering how much more expensive the 7770 is versus the 6770, should have a memory clock of at least 1250 MHz.
Maybe I'm biased because neither card is anywhere close to what I was wanting, which is the fastest card possible within the PCIe power limit of 75 watts. For me the ideal card would probably be one with 10 CUs, a core clock of 900 MHz, and 1125 MHz memory clock. Such a card would probably fall just under the 75 watt threshold, and to me would be worth up to $179.
blazorthon
Glorious
- Sep 24, 2010
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[citation][nom]dalelaroy[/nom]Personally, I am disappointed.Armed with 31% of the flagship GPU’s shaders and texture units, 50% of its ROP partitions, 66% of its L2 cache, and a mere 27% of its peak memory bandwidth, company representatives say they ran simulations and these were the ratios that turned back optimal performance.Bull!! How can two boards, one with 64% of the core throughput of the other, both be optimally configured with the same memory bandwidth? At the very least the 7770 should have the 1200 MHz memory clock of the 6770. And considering how much more expensive the 7770 is versus the 6770, should have a memory clock of at least 1250 MHz.Maybe I'm biased because neither card is anywhere close to what I was wanting, which is the fastest card possible within the PCIe power limit of 75 watts. For me the ideal card would probably be one with 10 CUs, a core clock of 900 MHz, and 1125 MHz memory clock. Such a card would probably fall just under the 75 watt threshold, and to me would be worth up to $179.[/citation]
I pretty much agreed with you up until you said $179. That card would perform between the 679 and the 6850, but you want to price it between a 6870 and 6950? Sure, it's nice that it shouldn't need a PCIe power connector, but it's not THAT nice. If that's so important to you then you can get a 7770 and underclock it to fit within a 75w envelope.You might not even need to underclock it, the voltage might be able to be lowered without changing the clock rate while not compromising stability. If not, well it wouldn't be much of an underclock anyway and you probably wouldn't even notice the difference if you lower it a few MHz.
I pretty much agreed with you up until you said $179. That card would perform between the 679 and the 6850, but you want to price it between a 6870 and 6950? Sure, it's nice that it shouldn't need a PCIe power connector, but it's not THAT nice. If that's so important to you then you can get a 7770 and underclock it to fit within a 75w envelope.You might not even need to underclock it, the voltage might be able to be lowered without changing the clock rate while not compromising stability. If not, well it wouldn't be much of an underclock anyway and you probably wouldn't even notice the difference if you lower it a few MHz.
"I pretty much agreed with you up until you said $179. That card would perform between the 679 and the 6850, but you want to price it between a 6870 and 6950? Sure, it's nice that it shouldn't need a PCIe power connector, but it's not THAT nice. If that's so important to you then you can get a 7770 and underclock it to fit within a 75w envelope.You might not even need to underclock it, the voltage might be able to be lowered without changing the clock rate while not compromising stability. If not, well it wouldn't be much of an underclock anyway and you probably wouldn't even notice the difference if you lower it a few MHz."
I have pretty much paid $179 for every graphics card I have purchased since the days of the introduction of VGA. If the card is what I want, this is what I am willing to pay. Neither of these cards is what I want, and unless the 7770 card I am looking to purchase specifically states that it can be under clocked and under volted, and what values yield a TDP of under 75W, I'm not interested. Ideally, the 7770 card would automatically under clock and undervolt if it did not detect a six-pin connector.
In a way, AMD made a smart move. Since they have essentially forced me to go with a 6-pin connector, I will go with the fastest card that requires just one six-pin connector instead. My main concern with the extra connector is reliability. The more connections to the card, the more chances for a problem. Especially when a card is so close to the edge, I might not even know my card is unstable due to a faulty connection until it actually needs that extra 5W.
I have pretty much paid $179 for every graphics card I have purchased since the days of the introduction of VGA. If the card is what I want, this is what I am willing to pay. Neither of these cards is what I want, and unless the 7770 card I am looking to purchase specifically states that it can be under clocked and under volted, and what values yield a TDP of under 75W, I'm not interested. Ideally, the 7770 card would automatically under clock and undervolt if it did not detect a six-pin connector.
In a way, AMD made a smart move. Since they have essentially forced me to go with a 6-pin connector, I will go with the fastest card that requires just one six-pin connector instead. My main concern with the extra connector is reliability. The more connections to the card, the more chances for a problem. Especially when a card is so close to the edge, I might not even know my card is unstable due to a faulty connection until it actually needs that extra 5W.
Wisecracker
Splendid
- Jan 15, 2007
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Remember that no one (at least publicly) has declared the arch of the first Trinity APU graphics.
For some reason I am under the impression that the first GPU on Trinity will not be GCN. If I recall accurately, the GPU on Llano has a Redwood core, and your HD6570 has a Turks core.
Rumahs seem to suggest that the first-gen Trinity APU will have a Turks core. Further, Fudzilla has this to say ...
Feel free to
blazorthon
Glorious
- Sep 24, 2010
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It's your money, you do what you want with it. It is certain that you can underclock the 7770. You can underclock pretty much all graphics cards and the Radeon 7000 series is no exception. It's done the same way as overclocking with the utilities like Afterburner. Remember, TDP is not directly power draw and that underclocking reduces power draw. The question is whether or not the clock rate will need to be changed when you drop the voltage. Maybe it will, maybe it won't. If you can drop the voltage without losing stability then you won't need to sacrifice a few % of performance to lose the PCIe connector. If you need to drop the clock rate too, well then you lose a little performance, but it's still doable and the underclocked 7770 would then be the fastest card that doesn't need a PCIe power connector.
How is this a smart move that way? AMD wants to sell the 7770 too, you would just buy a 7750 instead because it's the fastest card that is intended for use without a PCIe power connector. I could understand it being a smart move if it requires people to use a PSU with the PCIe connectors because if they didn't have one then buyers would need to purchase one, but AMD is still the graphics cards maker with the fastest graphics cards that don't use a PCIe power connector and that wasn't the point you tried to get across.
Yes, it would be convenient if the 7770 automatically adapted to using or not using the power connector, but AMD decided to leave that to us because for whatever reason they wanted to increase the power usage so slightly over the PCIe slot maximum just so they could market the cards as GHz edition. If the card automatically underclocked itself to below 1GHz, then it would be incorrect to call it the GHz edition. AMD undoubtedly didn't even consider automatic underclocking, but if they had then it probably wouldn't have been done anyway because it wouldn't fit with their current marketing scheme.
AI won't criticize you for wanting to pay more than a 50% premium just so it doesn't need a 6 pin connector, but that puts it in the price range of much faster video cards that would offer far greater performance for that same amount of money. Even the 6870 is considerably faster than the 7770 and it can be found for $150-$170, occasionally cheaper when it's on sale. $179 is around the price of a cheap GTX 560 Ti and that's even faster than the Radeon 6870... If you want to pay a huge premium for not using a PCIe power connector, that's your choice, but that's a pretty big premium that you're willing to pay. I know I wouldn't pay that huge of a premium because that would cost more than getting a 6850 and a high quality 500-600 watt PSU to handle the increased power draw.
If you want to use a current generation graphics card, then the Radeon 6670 is probably the best you could get without a PCIe power connector, not worth it because it's just too slow for modern gaming. I don't know what you do and I don't really know what you are looking for. Excluding an undervolted/clocked 7770, the 7750 should be the fastest card that doesn't use a PCIe power connector, possibly also excluding a non-reference 7770. If you want the most performance without an addition power connector and without a hassle of changing settings, then the 7750 is the best option for you. You can even overclock the 7750 (if that's your thing) significantly without worrying about power draw because of it's very low 55w TDP.
What are you talking about? The HD 5670/6670 (512 MB GDDR5) is certainly "good enough" for modern gaming. Especially at something like 1280x1024 or 1280x720.
If you want Full HD, you're looking at HD 5770/6770/7750 (1 GB GDDR5). Anything above this is with Ultra High settings and/or 2x or 4xAA, depending on your price budget.
If you want Full HD, you're looking at HD 5770/6770/7750 (1 GB GDDR5). Anything above this is with Ultra High settings and/or 2x or 4xAA, depending on your price budget.
blazorthon
Glorious
- Sep 24, 2010
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[citation][nom]dspider[/nom]What are you talking about? The HD 5670/6670 (512 MB GDDR5) is certainly "good enough" for modern gaming. Especially at something like 1280x1024 or 1280x720.If you want Full HD, you're looking at HD 5770/6770/7750 (1 GB GDDR5). Anything above this is with Ultra High settings and/or 2x or 4xAA, depending on your price budget.[/citation]
Sure, you can reduce quality settings and resolutions, but that detracts from the experience. Radeon 7770 and similar play 720p at maxed out quality settings in most, if not all games. The 6670 does not. 5700/6700 cards are rebrands with the difference being Blu-Ray playback. If I remember correctly, that is the only difference, so the 5770 can also play 720p at maxed out settings in most, if not all games.
That is without even going to the upper end of the mid-range cards, let alone the high end cards.
I'll be sure to say modern gaming in HD next time, my bad.
Sure, you can reduce quality settings and resolutions, but that detracts from the experience. Radeon 7770 and similar play 720p at maxed out quality settings in most, if not all games. The 6670 does not. 5700/6700 cards are rebrands with the difference being Blu-Ray playback. If I remember correctly, that is the only difference, so the 5770 can also play 720p at maxed out settings in most, if not all games.
That is without even going to the upper end of the mid-range cards, let alone the high end cards.
I'll be sure to say modern gaming in HD next time, my bad.
eddieroolz
Splendid
- Sep 6, 2008
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AMD failed to impress with the 7770. Time for NVidia to show what they have up their sleeves in the ~$170 market.
verbalizer
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