AMD's Next Gen Products Taped Out, Possibly Delayed

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To be fair technology has sort of stagnated over the past 5 years when it comes to processing power. People still run Sandy bridges and the biggest bottleneck still comes down to the GPU, there really isn't a reason to upgrade until the fabrication process moves to 16/14nm.

Or perhaps it's a saturation issue. PC Gaming has gone up, while units has gone down.
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A key piece of this puzzle is current software not being written to properly utilize modern multi-core CPUs and GPUs. Most applications still do not take full advantage of multiple threads or are even still single threaded. For that matter, you can still find a few widely used apps on the PC that aren't even 64 bit yet. Once software starts to take full advantage of the available hardware, then the average home users will start upgrading their 8-10 year old equipment to take advantage of new functionality. Intel, AMD, and nVidia can provide all the new-and-improved-cutting-edge-turn-it-up-to-eleven CPUs and GPUs but if most of the available stuff runs just fine on 5 year old equipment, where is the customer's motivation to shell out $700-$1500 on a new system?
 
I read the article title that consists of "AMD" and "delayed" and before opening the article was not surprised. Why can't these companies get their crap together and release their products at their predicted times? It's not just AMD. Every tech company seems to do this and I'm quite fed up personally. Just please tech companies, make some better predictions. The fortune tellers in the 15th Century that relied on the clouds predict better dates then you.

Also, I find the 980Ti to be an invalid argument since the Fury X is priced lower, and both use around the same amount of power. The 980Ti is not significantly lower.
 
I don't know, ibm is currently working on 7nm processes and incorporating other things besides pure silicon. I think they're all considering future directions to take. Doesn't surprise me that amd may be struggling with the smaller process same as intel did. It's obviously not that easy and may be part of the continued supply shortage of skylake chips if they can't produce them fast enough. That may or may not end up happening to amd with zen as well.

Hopefully games adopt dx12 faster than a large number of other programs finally adapted to 64bit. In some cases with games or other software not utilizing 8+ cores or being 32bit vs 64bit, it may be a matter of not needing it. Just because the technology is there doesn't mean it's necessary. Most passenger cars still ride on 4 wheels. Not because the tech for 6 wheel awd doesn't exist but because it simply offers no advantage turning a honda civic into a 6x6 other than additional cost and complexity for the sake of it.
 
Michael, I read the article. Where is the news of a possible delay? You're a journalist - back that up or take it back.

"As such, many users hoping to see AMD become more competitive expected to see products based on the Zen architecture in Q1 2015."

1) I assume you meant 2016
2) AMD hasn't set a release date, and it taped out on schedule a couple months ago. That means late 2016 would be normal, and not a delay

Bottom line, Zen taped out on schedule about two months ago, and as you say it can take a year or more to ship after that. Given those facts and a little basic math, who in their right minds thought they would ship sooner than late 2016? It's on track for release late 2016 and has been for some time.

If you have evidence that it's slipping to early-mid 2017 please share it and THEN we can talk about delays.
 
Here's another jewel:

"Although the move to 16/14 nm FinFET transistor technology is a promising sign for AMD’s upcoming Zen processors, it appears that these CPUs will come later than expected"

Expected... by whom? Nobody in their right mind thought this would be out earlier than late 2016 ever since they started talking about them. Things got more obvious when they taped out. Talking delays based on mysterious and unrealistic "expectations" is insane and quite unbecoming of a journalist, let alone a tech journalist.

Heck let's start talking Xbox Two and PS5 delays. I (for some silly reason) EXPECT they'll be out 2016, and therefore when they appear to be releasing them later, I shall declare them as being delayed! Delayed, I tell you!
 


If I'm correct pure silicon has never been used in processors. SIlicon P-type and N-type are both used, N-type is mixed with phosphorus or arsenic and Type-P is mixed with Boron or Gallium. I think it is these mixtures that give semiconductors the properties they need to work as transistors.

Germanium like Silicon, both with 4 spare electrons in their outer orbitals, but Germanium having even more atoms and width one would think Carbon would actually be a better option for processors.

Anyway, we are in an era where the programming side of things has become less important due to our hardware improvements, but I predict that by 2020 software utilization will become the larger factor in performance gains. Software these days is poorly coded unlike that of the 90s.
 


1. The article says "possibly delayed". Not definitely delayed. If you read the quote I included in the article, AMD's CFO stated that it could be 14 months from when the products are taped out to the point they arrive on the market. He was also didn't say when exactly this happened. If it happened in October/November then it is possible it won't arrive until Q1 2017.

2. In regards to your other comment, it has been nearly 4 years since AMD's last major enthusiast CPU release. A lot of people have been speculating that Zen would come in early 2016.
 


AMD still has a ton of graphics IP along with it's current processing IP. As a processor they are about on par with the rest of the industry, it's only Intel that has a huge lead over them.

About that whole x86 license thing, that is something that is deeply misunderstood. "Non-transferable" doesn't mean the license suddenly vanishes into thin air if AMD's owners change as AMD is a publicly traded company with it's owners changing every day. AMD can not sell that license to another entity nor could that license be separated from AMD itself. Another company couldn't buy up a majority of AMD stock, then cut the company into pieces and only keep the license. Instead another company would have to do a buy-out and then keep AMD intact as a separate entity similar to a subsidiary which is something that happens all the time.

The reason nobody is looking to buy AMD is that the desktop market is in steep decline with only the gaming segment growing. Everything is about mobile media consumption, which is basically cell phones and tablets with decidedly non-x86 CPU's inside them. The processors and graphics units inside those mobile units are extremely weak, but because the entire platform is designed around them there isn't a noticeable performance problem.
 
Is PC market really that weak that no one wants to step up and buy out AMD.
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AMD doesn't have anything of value worth purchasing. The X86 license is non-transferrable, becoming an ARM licensee is free, and other companies have better mobile GPUs. There's literally nothing of value anyone would want.
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That's an interesting perspective that is based on no truth. I'm pretty sure that ATI has graphics technologies that many companies are interested in, such as intel. You're salty, bro.
 
Another thing mentioned in the article that is misreported is possible technical difficulties with the process node .
Its actually more mature than intels 14 nm . Samsung are licensing the tech to Global Foundries , and Samsung have been at 14 nm longer than Intel have .

Its very hard to find something that is factual in the article but I will presume the authors name is correct
 
i would like to quell any feelings of AMD's complete failure. Intel nor nvidia will let it happen. the risk and consequences of being a monopoly is far greater than having a competitor that is barely surviving.
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nVida and Intel have to be careful, but if they play their cards right then they could become a 'natural monopoly' that can operate without competition or oversight if they provide a product that nobody else is willing to put in the effort to provide. But the one caveat to that is that Intel may be forced to open up x86 to allow other players into the market so that there is opportunity for competition... But it would take people so long to come up with a competing product that I am not sure it would be all that much of a risk.
Intel and nVidia cannot be seen as 'hurting' AMD, but if AMD fails all on it's own then it does not mean bad and terrible things for the others.
 
AMD was pretty much mandated into existence by anti monopoly legislation in the US to force competition on to intel . I doubt regulators will let it fail under any circumstances for exactly the same reason . But at this time there is no reason to suspect that will happen anyway . The company is still fairly robust even if it has been shaken .
And if you look at how little has been achieved in processor in the last 4-5 generations from intel you start to realise how important good competition is to advancing the tech we all love tinkering with .
 
1. The article says "possibly delayed". Not definitely delayed. If you read the quote I included in the article, AMD's CFO stated that it could be 14 months from when the products are taped out to the point they arrive on the market. He was also didn't say when exactly this happened. If it happened in October/November then it is possible it won't arrive until Q1 2017.

2. In regards to your other comment, it has been nearly 4 years since AMD's last major enthusiast CPU release. A lot of people have been speculating that Zen would come in early 2016.
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I could say anything is possibly anything until proven otherwise and then go oh well I said POSSIBLY. Snapdragon 820 - possibly delayed! I base this on nothing!

As to your second point, yes it's been years since something completely new was released, and so it was speculated to be released at such and such time even though the manufacturer has said nothing of the sort. Such speculation is bad enough but worse yet in this case it would be OLD speculation, much of which was from before they even started talking Zen architecture. People are free to speculate all they want, but I don't believe a journalist should drag speculations (especially old dead ones) into discussions of "possible" delays on a product which per more recent facts actually appears to still be on schedule. 12-14 months from tape-out to product release would be NORMAL. This does not constitute a delay.

Frankly even very early 2017 would be roughly on schedule for a typical CPU release based on when GF taped out, but I would bet they'll push to release late next year which would also be within the typical timeline.

I think what annoyed me enough to say something is the thought of what impact a headline like yours has - especially at such a large and influential site like Tom's. I mean look at the comment section. Most people just assumed that it was delayed. "Time to short AMD again" - we're even talking financial influence here. There wasn't even a Rumor, Op-Ed, Speculation, or Mad Ravings tag on the title to warn folks. Half of the people don't dig far enough into a story to tell what's fact and what's uh... let's be diplomatic here... rumor! Yes that's it, rumor.
 


Did anywhere in this at all I say there are possible technical difficulties with the process node? Did you even read the article before commenting?
 


....except that our EIC interviewed AMD's CEO, Lisa Su, and was told that Zen would come out sometime in 2016. If it doesn't come out until Q1 2017 then it is still delayed.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-ceo-lisa-su-interview,29327.html
 


AMD cards are used in consoles because NVIDIA couldn't cost-justify the development costs; they admitted as much. And while it's a steady revenue stream, $100 Million per year is pocket change to a company that size. As for their discrete GPU business, AMD's share is down to around 20% or so, and likely to fall since NVIDIA's refresh will come before AMDs.

The X86 license is non-transferable should AMD be purchased.
 
never bought a intel cpu before ..so guessing when i upgrade in feb will be a i5 or i7 now and nvidia card
 


There is just so much wrong here.

Samsungs first 14nm chip was tapped out in 2012 and it was just a test chip. Their first actual chip was not released until 2015 with the Galaxy S6 line.

Intel had 14nm tapped out in 2011 and started building their FAB the same year, FAB 42 in Chandler. Intels first chips with 14nm was demoed in 2013, a Ultrabook with an actual working product not a test chip, and was in full shipping production in 2014.

To top it off, Samsungs 14nm is not geared towards high power chips, that has to be tweaked by GloFlo for that purpose while Intels 14nm is geared towards high power chips. Yields will easily be better for Samsung with low power, more simplistic CPUs vs a higher power and more complex CPU. AMD will not get the same yields out of Samsungs 14nm as Samsung does.
 
I don't think Intel competes with AMD on a total SOC yet. If zen can at least make their SOC more energy efficient, and can get 30fps on many newer games at medium graphics, i think AMD will take the midrange laptop market by storm. That's the bread an butter sweet spot as parents will spend $400-$600 on a decent laptop for their child's "schoolwork". But the child can't justify the cost of a $1000+ gaming laptop.
 
For one thing i hate NVIDIA, they bought out 3DFX and took the names (SLI) and closed it. Perhaps i am a 3DFX Fanboy! (well not boy , more like middle aged 😛 )
But sadly AMD is delaying stuff, more than NVIDIA and INTEL They all delay, due to bad economy all around? but they do, it is annoying for us enthousiasts and i am bored to read unrelated stuff to hardware in all my favorite tech sites, and toms 🙁
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I understand your feel to nvidia, is the same feeling with about 3DFX.
 
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