Apple: Netbooks Don't Deserve Mac Brand

[rooseveltdon]

[citation][nom]69camaroSS[/nom]Look all I'm trying to say is I see value in what you don't see value in. It does not make me stupid, ignorant, or elitist. If I had $2000 to spend, I'd buy a Macbook Pro. It does everything I need it too, and I like the way it is built and the operating system that it is based around. If I was stuck with $1500, I would be forced to buy a PC laptop, because I do some heavy video/photo editting. I don't get mad at a company just because I can't afford their product, however. Otherwise I would hate BMW, Mercedes, Ferrari and every other high-end company. Again, Apple is not losing a bunch of customers because they are mad they paid too much money.[/citation]

dude you don't get it...many of us can afford to buy a mac if we really wanted to (heck we are spending money for phenom ll's and i7's aren't we??) but we don't see the point in spending so much money for such generic hardware in a pretty white box when we could use the money to build a truly great system with truly avant guarde components the mac is not a "Mercedes" or 'Ferrari" to us...apple is just another company that sells overpriced products to those who don't know that they could do better for less it is just an other dell or hp they just happen to have a better marketing department there is nothing in a mac whatsoever no matter how hard you try to justify it that warrants those kind of prices and when a mac person starts talking smack about pc's to us who actually know what goes inside a computer then yeah....then we got a problem.

 

[pcCodinFoo]

Many of you who have left comments seem to believe Apple's COO when he says that Apple's aim is quality products and that they have achieved that aim.
Some who have posted have shown that they have brains in their heads by recognizing and saying that Apple uses the same third party hardware that every other PC manufacturer uses. (easily verifiable... just open up your Mac...)
For you geniuses who actually believe Apple's charade of "higher quality", answer me this. If they use the same parts as everyone else how are they better, or higher quality?
Anyone who insists that Apple products are "higher quality" is either willfully blind or as dumb as a rock!
Are you going to try to tell me that the aluminum casing makes it better than a PC with plastic casing?
What's next? Are you going to try to tell me that the aluminum casing makes it faster too?
Are you going to claim that the software somehow makes the hardware better?
I wish Apple junkies would stop making their lack of intelligence so obvious. It was amusing for a little while, now it's just annoying.

 

[Guest]

basically, a sub $500 mini netbook that's "completely crap" is better than the iphone.
Just stitch 2 iphones together and add a keyboard!
Or are you saying that the iphone, which is cheaper,and has a smaller screen than a netbook, is a piece of crap too?

I guess they just don't want to lose an OS licence to a cheap computer they can not tax(or have no profit on taxing) a certain percent.

If everything you say about MacOs, being so superior to Windows, then I'm sure it would run fine on an atom powered system!

The way I see things is that the most recent MacOs is about the same footprint as WinXP. Little smaller, but better looking graphically.
That'd be perfect for mininotebooks!

 

[starryman]

Apple says “We don’t know how to build a sub-$500 computer that is not a piece of junk."

Translation "We don't know any sub-contractors who will build one for $100 so we can make a $400 profit."

 

[starryman]

[citation][nom]69camaroSS[/nom]Look all I'm trying to say is I see value in what you don't see value in. It does not make me stupid, ignorant, or elitist. If I had $2000 to spend, I'd buy a Macbook Pro. It does everything I need it too, and I like the way it is built and the operating system that it is based around. If I was stuck with $1500, I would be forced to buy a PC laptop, because I do some heavy video/photo editting. I don't get mad at a company just because I can't afford their product, however. Otherwise I would hate BMW, Mercedes, Ferrari and every other high-end company. Again, Apple is not losing a bunch of customers because they are mad they paid too much money.[/citation]

I've been avoiding confronting 69CamaroSS for his Apple preference. Hell he seems like the only one standing up for Apple here on THW. Heck I even like all Camaros. OK but now onto business. Let's not put the car argument especially BMW, Mercedes, etc into the argument. An Apple is not a BMW, Mercedes, etc. Even from a branding stand point Apples are not considered luxurious commodities. Never ever heard this... "He's got an Apple, he must have money." Last I checked in my garage is a 2006 Mercedes E350 and a 2003 Porsche 911 (I can send pics if you like). Yes I even have an over-priced watch. Am I bragging? OK maybe. My point is my cars and "luxury" things produce intangible revenue (client meetings, first impressions, etc) hence I can justify the price premium. Plus people do take notice. The only person taking notice of a Mac is another Mac user. And will a Mac win me bragging rights, intangible income,... no! I can afford a Mac but I spend my money where it counts or gives me real world satisfaction.

 

[eddieroolz]

"Apple wants to make the best phone possible, period."

- Jobs

Actually, Apple doesn't even make the best phone possible. MMS, Video capture, hello?

Jobs needs a reality check. Make the best phone possible, my fat arse.

 

[tayb]

[citation][nom]scook9[/nom]they said sub-$500 notebook....might as well be sub-$1000 since they dont even try in the $500-$1000 range anyway.And ChaosGS, 2 things:1) being jewish and rish are completely unrelated2) actually judaism IS a race, it is the only religion you are born into - if your mom is jewish, you are jewish, like it or notNot all jews are money grubbing, cheap, and greedy. I know quite a few, I am one.[/citation]

My friends mother is Jewsish. He is an atheist. You can not be born with a religion it is something you come to believe in throughout the course of your life.

 

[radguy]

Apple this is why you suck. It doesn't have to be 500 put your stupid apple tax and jump the price up to 750. For that you could put a nice full size keyboard with an 11 inch screen at 1280x800 that is just slightly larger than todays typical 10 inchers. I'm sure you could figure out a chipset/cpu/graphics solution that could fit in there for that.
I have an iphone and I have an msi wind that I carry around eveywhere. I don't use the iphone to surf the net when I am on the go I do check email but I don't write any long the phone. I have about 500 in my wind and I have 2 batteries(~5-6hrs), 2gigs of ram, and a 32gb ssd in it with xp and its fast. If I want to do real work I'll carry my 14 inch laptop with me but for most days the netbook is fine for what I want on the go. It takes well over 4 times as long for a webpage to load on the iphone than the wind. Apple I think you really missed what the device is designed to do.

 

[tayb]

[citation][nom]jsloan[/nom]here is another reason why apple may not want to do a netbook, performance. from what i've been googling osx is a bit of a piggie, you read complaints all the time about how slow it is on an old mac mini, well a netbook is way slower than the slowest mac mini, a 1.6 ghz atom is like a 900 mhz p3, yeap, slow and it does not have that much memory nor storage, so when you load osx, iwork, ilife, ect how well will it run. there, all that eye candy comes at a price, in performance and memory utilization. i know, i know people have created hackintosh netbooks using dell 910, but even they say it's very slow, try doing anything on it. try loading the os and the apps, you need more than 16 gb ssd, larger than is normally provided in $250-$300 netbook, ok bump the price to $500 for an apple netbook, and it starts to be expensive, you could buy a real small screen for that and get a real cpu, harddisk, ect. i know there are netbooks with 160mb harddisk, but they tend to cost more and are closer in price to regular notebooks, so they would only attrack a very small market share for all the effort and if they did a great job may undercut there more profitable notebook sales, so they sell a $500 netbook and lose a $1000 notebook sale, i don't see apple wanting to play there, but isn't that what they have said. they are happy to be the overpriced option and make the margins...[/citation]

You have been misinformed. I have a three year old Mac Mini running OS X Leopard that I do iPhone development on and it isn't sluggish in the slightest. I have a thinkpad T61 and a custom built gaming machine and doing normal tasks such as composing emails, coding, browsing the web, and playing music it functions just as well as the other two that are vastly more powerful. It obviously isn't going to rock Crysis or encode audio/video at the blink of an eye but it isn't a "piggie" nor is it sluggish.

Just switching the inputs on the monitor to check it out shows that it was using 521.73MB of RAM and 9% of the processor. iTunes, Firefox, iChat, and Mail were open. I can't remember the last time I turned it off.

It has nothing to do with the operating system not being able to function well on a netbook it has everything to do with preserving profit margins.

 

[nickcardwell]

Wow, everyone on this site hates Apple. Well I am an Apple user that just happens to love tech both Apple and PC. I am running the 7 beta in VMware on my MacBook. Netbooks are junk. I have used one and I hated it. There is much more on the net than e-mail and text and way more to do on a computer than just surf the net. I do think that Apple should make the base Macbook Air an Ion system with a dual-core Atom so they could drop the price a bit. They could make the Core 2 Duo an upgrade.

 

[pocketdrummer]

I kind of see the Macbook air as Apple's "Netbook"... and it's incredibly expensive.

But, hey... if you can still wow your friends by taking it out of a little folder 6 months down the line, be my guest.

I plan on buying 2 laptops. One massive, powerhouse laptop for live music... one netbook for size and functionality alone for the road. I can probably have both for much less than a Mac.

 

[pocketdrummer]

McDonald's should sue Apple for using the name Mac... because it sounds too much like the Big Mac. lol...

 

[croc]

"2) actually judaism IS a race, it is the only religion you are born into - if your mom is jewish, you are jewish, like it or not

Not all jews are money grubbing, cheap, and greedy. I know quite a few, I am one."

I am not aware that Judaism is now classified as a 'race'.

 

[anamaniac]

And that's why Apple does not have my service.
I almost bought a mac ~20 months ago, but PCs do have a budget category.

Some of us are unemployed for long stretches of time, but still love computers. Sorry apple.

 

[giftzahn]

Well then Steve,keep your Apple 1000 USD "premium" junk, and your arogance along with ignorance ... it is starting to be annoying ... normal people have no reason buy your junk

 

[neiroatopelcc]

I understand why the rotten fruit doesn't want to sell netbooks. It's really quite simple. The more expensive the hardware they sell, the higher the actual appletax is. A computer costing $300 + apple tax is still only $375 - not enough profit for a company with the highest Q2 earnings in their recent career. Now if they'd sell a $3000 system, they'd earn $750 on top of what any other oem earns. That's what they want to sell. And people who buy apple want apple, so they'll just buy the next system above their requirements. In this case the cheapest macbook mini I assume - but still doubling the apple profit.

 

[Alien_959]

Your overheating mac books are piece of junk. OK I admit they have quality enclosure, but the hardware inside is in low quality.
I agree that there is not an economic reason to build apple laptop in sub 500$ category, also that doesn't fit in the company image for exclusive products, but bitching about the netbooks that they are piece of junk is lame.

 

[Guest]

Cracks me up when people bash Apple.
They make and sell products that people want. Otherwise they would be applying for TARP monies like the rest of the failing companies in this country.

I own 2 Macs and 4 PCs in my home. I write software exclusively for Windows and I use iTunes because my wife loves her iPod Shuffle. In all of my dealings with both Macs and PCs I find that they are just tools to get a job done. Some people like using different tools, some are willing to pay more for that tool.

Ultimately I could still go and check mail and browse the web on my Pentium 133 Packard Bell with 32MB of ram if I really wanted to.

It is all about preference.

My Toyota Tundra gets me to and from work everyday, my former employer drove a Ferrari. Both are just cars, tools to get us where we are going. he was just willing and able to spend a good deal more for his that I was for mine.

If Apple feels that they would compromise their image by building a netbook then who really cares? It is just a tool, and there are plenty of other tools out there to get the job done.

 

[ehenry818]

My Toyota Tundra gets me to and from work everyday, my former employer drove a Ferrari. Both are just cars, tools to get us where we are going. he was just willing and able to spend a good deal more for his that I was for mine.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

But a Ferrari and Toyota do not use the same parts. Mac's and pc's do.

I understand the analogy your trying to make however, many peoples issues with mac users is there smug arrogance. If you want to pay the money for a mac, thats fine you are entitled to do so. If it makes you happy go for it. I have no problems with people buying and using a mac.

I think the point most people make is not a matter of preference, its the fact that mac users think they are on some untouchable pedestal. Mac users talk all sorts of smack how macs are better and macs dont get viruses..blah blah. And how there machine are of much better quality than a pc.

So we are making the point that there is no difference in hardware quality. You can spend half the money and get to make a higher quality machine than a mac.
As far as mac being so secure, people don't waste the time on doing things with a mac. I know many people make that statement, but consider this...Apple makes the IPhone and the OS for it. There is a big market for it, people have hacked the OS can get free software etc. So they are not untouchable.
If mac opened up its market to work with as much software as windows does and they had all the hardware options, I can almost guarantee that they would have the same amounts if not more issues that a windows has.

Mac users keep trying to compare it to PC, but until it has as many options as windows it will never be at the same level no matter how you look at it

 

[Guest]

rooseveltdon and starryman have placed it out there as simple as it can be. The fanboys like 69camaroSS prove the Apple "elitist" frame of mind every comment that they make. Because dedicated Apple followers do not ever question Jim Jones…I mean Steve Jobs, they will believe whatever the marketing department throws at them. The simple comment of comparing Apple products to “luxury” vehicles proves the mentality of how Apple wants you to look at their product. It’s only for the “cool” people…If you can’t afford it you don’t deserve it…I am more cultured than you because I use Apple products. I have the money to purchase any of their products right now but I CHOOSE not to because I recognize when someone is trying to sell me crap in a jewel encrusted box. Looks good on the outside but God what is that smell.

Looking down their nose at netbooks once again proves how Apple looks at the PC world. I blame it on Bill Gates and Steve Jobs not being able to work out their issues when they were younger and split ways. They both branched out and produced their crappy products but Steve focused more on the marketing side building a cult following that believes they are superior and Bill trudged forward stealing and blackmailing his way to the top not caring if anyone was following because he knew in the end he would ensure that you had limited choices. What we see today is a childish rivalry that has never ended.

 

[Guest]

Why do you think Apple hates Psystar so much??? Ever really thought about that? Why sue them? Are they stealing from Apple? Are they trying to run unlicensed OS X software on their machines? No. What Psystar shows the world is how much of a markup Apple is adding and Psystar proves that you don’t really need Apple for hardware. You want to run OS X and any other nifty little Apple software products then guess what….you can do it for a lot cheaper and even build it yourself. That burst the Apple cult’s superiority bubble doesn’t it.

 

[bounty]

[citation][nom]JMcEntegart[/nom]I'm waiting with baited breath for the Apple tablet, devoid of "cracked keyboards," complete with big screen and a big price.[/citation]

Is that sarcasm?

 

[dro524]

“We don’t know how to build a sub-$500 computer that is not a piece of junk”

Acer knows how, as do Asus, MSI, Dell, and HP.

 

[starryman]

To all the Mac fans out there... I speak on behalf of most (not all) PC users. Majority of us do not care for Microsoft or even Windows. We use what is relevant. Relevant does not mean perfect, pretty, expensive, stylish, cheap... PCs are relevant because they work well for the task, used primarily in almost all office environments, has the most available software / hardware for upgrades, fairly transportable hardware between Linux and Windows and is high value (not cheap).

We don't shoot down Macs because of the OS, prettiness, or price. We shoot down Macs because regardless of the stated "quality" which is mainly visual, it is not relevant and the price does not equal the sum of its parts. You have to understand that Macs and PCs are tools not designer shoes and $150 Nikes. If computers were fashion statements, people would have bumper stickers that say "I LOVE MY MAC". OOOPS they already do... and that is my point. Mac people love their Macs because they love a tool. Sad.

We aren't here to educate you on the merits of PCs - look deep enough and you will understand. People who convert to Macs more often PCs but that's simply natural when the PC world is the biggest.

My personal take - Microsoft is the lesser of two evils. Both Mac and Microsoft have draconian DRM and licensing policies. BUT Apple is the worst offender by a huge margin. Apple just gets away with it with pure propaganda. Maybe one day Apple will just stick to OS development and make it available universally. Imagine if MS made their own computers... something to ponder on.

 

[raabscuttle]

So... How many times does it have to be mentioned? Apple does not build computers; they have not for a long time. The contract with the same companies that make HP, Acer, Dell, Toshiba, Sony, etc. (Quanta, Compal, etc, etc.). The laptop and desktop computer are commodity products - that is they are essentually the same on the inside, just the packaging and software varies.

So, maybe Apple is admitting here that they can't get OSX to run on sub-par hardware (afterall, the Atom processor was designed for MIDs and phones - not laptops; that is one reason that they have half the performance of a Celeron). Me, I cannot imagine OSX (or Vista) running well on any slow, pokey hardware that they stuff inside netbooks.