BlizzCon 2009: WoW Cataclysm Revealed

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[citation][nom]Ramar[/nom]The most important part of any MMO should be the COMMUNITY.[/citation]

Correct, fortunately for me, all the 12 year olds and the idiots with trashy PC's play WoW. So it allows me to enjoy the real games with the other adults and PC game Enthusiasts. I also love the people talking trash about Aion and then talk well about WoW. Aion has everything WoW has, and 100x more in graphics, gameplay mechanics, and PVP. Also claiming that Aion is running full of non-english speaking players is also retarded, because there are english american and Euro based servers. Why would anyone from Korea or China play on an American server? You retards make no sense.

And I mentioned Aion, but it's not the only MMO better than WoW by far. Just about any MMO that's come out since 2003 has been 100x better than WoW. Only reason why WoW has a huge community is for the reasons I stated above.

-It runs on any garbage PC
-Gameplay mechanics are simple enough for any child to understand.

Subscriber count does not = game quality.
 
[citation][nom]VioMeTriX[/nom] if it had some real action and maybe played like gta, prototype, crackdown, with some fps elements and multiple ways to interact....then id be hooked too...[/citation]

I'd suggest Mortal Online friend. Aion is a bit more on the traditional MMO side, with hotkeys that do abilities and such, just like EQ, WoW, DAoC, ect. Mortal Online is going to be an Action-PVP based MMO, where your success in combat relies on your personal skill to swing a sword or shoot a bow and such. It plays like a FPS, but has MMO elements of gear, skills, ect. Heavy PVP and player driven content. And AWESOME graphics. I'd say that when it comes out it will be not only MMO of the year, but maybe even game of the year. Check it out some time.
 
[citation][nom]dheadley[/nom]. Hell i let my 7 year old daughter sit on my lap and play him, not even knowing how to do a mutilation rotation. She would just run up to stuff and fight like a warrior and she still never died. [/citation]

ROFL, this proves my point exactly. When will people wake up? Thanks for this comment dheadley. Either your 7 year old is the offspring of Fatal1ty, or WoW is as childish of a game as I am making it out to be.
 
[citation][nom]Airborne11b[/nom]Sorry, but i'm going to respond to all you people who defended WoW at once.1. WoW is by far the most dumbed down game i've ever seen. 2. Aion is new and the engine (based on Crytek btw) is awesome. Warhammer PvP is 100x better than WoW, but the PVE is on the same level. and graphics are WoW-ish, but slightly better.3. There are plenty of way better MMO's out there but I wouldn't call them "failures" on their subscriber numbers. There are many factors that gives WoW more subscribers then other newer MMO's.-for one, new graphics and more complex game mechanics stress even top of the line PC's. VG:SoH is 100x more engaging (PVE Raid content is amazing) and has 1000x better graphics than WoW, but the problem with VG:SOH, and many other next gen games, is that only a small % of people can play them with good FPS, anyone's trash PC can run wow at max settings, but it takes a real enthusiest PC to run next gen MMO's. you lose 80% of your potential sub base right there.-and the next big factor imo, is the "Investment syndrome". So many people are stuck on WoW because of the time they invested in it. There are plenty of great games they would like to try, but they feel that they spent so much time in building up their character that it would be painful to let go. So as long as Blizzard keeps releasing content, they stick around.Lets face it, WoW is dated, (Had bad graphics even for the time when it released they were bad), the gameplay is simplistic and old, and just about any game out there is better.IMO... *EVE has best open PVP, but if you dont like sci-fi, it wont be the game for you.*Mortal Online is going to have the best graphics (and maybe best pvp) when it releases soon. and is fantasy MMO.*Aion's combat, pvp and graphics are very nice, and i've been playing the beta, it's a very good game.*VG:SOH has the most challenging raid content, and most over all PVE content and largest world, also has very nice graphics. *Con-Runs poor even on very high end PC, and though the graphics are great, they are not the best and it should run better*Those are my picks, but just about any game out would be 100x better than WoW. It's time to stop sucking on that baby pacifier known as WoW and move on to the big boy MMO's people. Upgrade your PC's, and get a real game pls.[/citation]

You sir just reflected there my mind on the matter better than I could have done myself.

I just don't agree with telling people what to do. If some like WoW, let them play it. The fact a game is old isn't a reason to stop playing it, that applies for any other games out there. There's plenty of very good old games out there that beats new ones in the same genre hands down. Deus Ex 1 is a good example of this. Neverwinter Nights 1 is another great example.

Where I agree is on how irrevelant all arguments WoW fans use to protect their beloved game are. It doesn't weight at all against the facts your enumerating there, minus the one about it being old. But yeah, graphics where outdated the day it came out, so imagine today. Fact is, as you stated, it's one of the main reason why it is so popular, it allows a bunch of people to run it. And let's face it, too much gfx in MMOs only brought problems so far in games adopting that approach. The fact the world is huge needs it to be toned down visually to obtain optimal gameplay performances.

Another fact is an MMO remains an MMO, it being WoW or VG: SoH or whatever. The underlying mechanics stay the same, and one may argue on how unhealty and time consuming those games can be for an human being. Not mensionning how generic and repetive those are.

Sorry for the grammatical errors within my text. English is not my first language, and I don't feel like passing my text through a corrector.
 
The only negative side about that game being old is how much Blizzard is still cashing in on it. Not only does it look bad to my eyes to still charge 15$/month for a game that old and still release one XP Pack after another instead of releasing a whole new game with updated technology, it also refrains them, in my opinion, to really put the effort deserved on their other IPs (Starcraft and Diablo). Look at all the delays, and some discutable moves they made towards those games. Mainly the "episodic" single player campaigns for SC2, the shift in artstyle of D3(mixed opinions) and the lack of LAN for both. The argument about them wanting to polish those two games optimaly for the reason of the delays would stand if they were not releasing a freaking WoW XP almost each years.
 
I enjoyed WoW...
Too much actually. Quit for my own good.

Also, all local shops in my city sold prepaid cards at $22 CND a month... that's about $265 a year, and for about 3 years (only went obsessive at the end though).

I've been weary ever since about any MMO, in the hope I don't get addicted again...


Please quit while you're ahead.

[citation][nom]xchrissypoox[/nom]I've played on private servers and they are missing features, you get booted every 15-30 minutes and the people suck on them (the ones I played).[/citation]

I played 1000 hours retail, 300 hours private. I loved private servers in comparison. You only went on shitty servers.
 
[citation][nom]Airborne11b[/nom]People still play this trashy old game? My god people upgrade already. There are way better MMOs out there. Aion is coming out soon, beta has been a LOT of fun. If Aion isn't your thing, go with anything but WoW. lol[/citation]
I've stopped playing wow about 2 years ago, then returned with WOTLK for 3 month, then again quit (lack of time).

But could you enlighten me, what "other, much better" MMOs are out there?
 
anamaniac.. mmo's are like a drug. I just stopped playing Guildwars a few months ago. Its amazing how you can just sit in front of a computer for hours on end and do so little.

As for the people complaining about wow: why do you care? If blizzard can make money on their "cash cow" it finances their other titles. If blizzard spent more money creating a new WoW.. which most likely wouldnt be as big of a hit.. they might delay SC and D3 more so then they have already. If Blizzard can continue to make money with minimal effort.. let them. As for the players: Perhaps they are content playing WoW. Not everyone shares the same interests.. we will play what we like.
 
I want to see Jumpgate Evoulations out now... Or at least GW 2.

After seeing the phail of free to play but pay to be leet game huxley (I was in CBT2), rappelez, flyforfun (yes, shoot me now, I tried it and was wtf is this crap), maple story (quit realizing this was 2d with random 10 year olds)...

And then the other stuff like eve (boring as hell), Dungeons and Dragons Online (you NEED some real life friends whom is willing to sink 2-5 hours day into this, why not just go wow and raid 5-mans like H ToC all day and you get the same thing with better experience...), Warhammer (buggy with combat that can't decide if it wants to be wow or diablo-esq action based, then after when it was patched, empty), guild wars (was fun, but then expansions started to feel less and less fresh, and then when GW2 was even rumored the new stuff stopped coming out...), and EQ / EQ 2 (both needs moar players..., and its sony that have been known to give in game captured data out for "studies")

I wish blizzard would stop dumbing the game down further tho...
 
Damn you Blizzard! Damn you and your exquisite, mind-numbing content! I know I have an addiction problem but, for some reason, I'm just thrilled by this announcement! I don't care much for the new races, but the rest is gold. I'll have to level a new char, yet, again...

For those of you bashing WoW, bash ahead. A game is a game, however crummy/good or succesful/obscure, it is, you still have the right to like it or hate it. I hate it because I love it so much!
 
You can't tell millions of people to move on, lol. They invested way too much into WoW, too much to quit. It would be like saying good bye to 1/3 of your life.

I played WoW for 1 year, then quit then a year later tried WoW private servers for a few months. It went well but lots of bugs. I quit then I tried Warhammer for a few months. It was a great game but it gets boring after lv 20 especially if you solo (I solo all the time because I can only play for 1 hour or 2 a day). Well I quit that now I play PC and Xbox360 offline games. It's nice since I can pause or save-quit anytime I want or needed elsewhere.

However, being the biggest MMO game (WoW), the new races and level caps are nice. But not as nice as flying mount in Azeroth. I still think they need to increase exp gain from level 1 to 60 (say, 200%) and 61-70 (say 150%) for new players to catch up. Better yet, have the ability of those with lv60+ a tool to create instant level 20 or 30 characters. That'll draw some quitters back in.
 
If you're going to play just to be top level in x number of hours, then you're wasting your time. Playing from level 1 to level whatever needs to be fun, so enjoy other aspects to any game other than just getting to top level as quick as you can. Open up, sheesh!
 
To those arguing that WoW is childish... try throwing your 7 year old into a 2k rated arena match and see how well he fares. Or try getting them through Ulduar hard modes and see if they last more then 5 seconds. The fact is that at its highest level WoW is a very technical and demanding game, and that is the most satisfying level of play. I’m sure that those of you bashing WoW have never experienced any of this, so really you have no place bashing a game that you have not experienced completely.
 
I always get amused when people who used to play a game talk trash about it once they quit, pretending they are better and have realized some revleation that all of the people still playing haven't yet.

Most of the people that bash WoW players for liking a inferior game, don't realize that people don't continue to play for the actual game itself. You see, most of the people that still play, do so because they enjoy playing with the friends they have made in the game or their RL friends that play with them. They don't play for "leet gear" or "uber pvp". The people that quit and bash WoW are the people who would hop guilds and backstab their "friends" in order to get that "uber new purple." Eventually they run out of people who want to play with them, get bored and quit. Thinking they were awesome at the game because they conqured end game content, all the while, missing the entire point of an MMO.

Aion's fate will be decided once it's released. Everyone is super excited for it, but it rings an all too familiar bell with me.
- "AoC will be awesome and will be the downfall of WoW. It has better gameplay and better graphics." AoC comes out and flops.
- "OMG WAR is everything that's good with WoW + more!!! It will be the end of WoW" WAR comes out and flops.

The only good thing that came of those games were ideas that WoW would later incorporate into WoW. The main problem is that games push to release before they are actually complete and then they fail to live up to the hype they built. Most people that play WoW aren't what the internet tough guys consider "elite" or "hard core". They are your average "joe newb" and probably weren't playing WoW the first few months when WoW would crash every day and servers were down for weeks at a time. They are spoiled with the fact that they never had to sit through a beggining phase of a game when the bugs are being ironed out. So they test new games out and find that they have a ton of bugs, their social ties are missing and the game has severe balance issues.

Bashing another game doesn't make you cool. Beacuse you play or don't play a certian game, doesn't make you cool. Playing FPS doesn't mean you're cooler than MMO players because you "have to aim". That's like comparing a basketball player to a football player. Two completely different skill sets. Same goes for RTS or TBS or any other type of game. Play what games you enjoy and stop thinking you're special because you like/dislike certian things.

FYI to you kids who "don't like what's popular or trendy". That's a trend/fad in itself.
 
But there are somethings that you have to admit:

You cannot have a stable community in most FPSes, where a name change is just a click away and you can use a list of pre-recorded sounds and text to express your self.

You cannot have balanced pvp in a MMO, or at least not yet, when things are not balanced and things are based on chance (if I use skill 1 10 times, the total result changes due to crits, misses, or resists, whereas if you hit you in the head with my deagle, you are dead, 10x out of 10x unless you get lagged out). But hey, they are damned fun when you are fighting with FRIENDS, bashing unknowns or the enemy.

You (usually) cannot have much attachment to your RTS characters since you are looking at them from about 100 feet and they are put to the slaughter every time.

You cannot invite another random person and expect them to like you simulation game (action-sim is another genera) like Microsoft Flight Simulator X (I think that is the only game bore me more than eve....)

There are others, but these is what I can think of right now.
 
[citation][nom]Bamslang[/nom]I always get amused when people who used to play a game talk trash about it once they quit, pretending they are better and have realized some revleation that all of the people still playing haven't yet. Most of the people that bash WoW players for liking a inferior game, don't realize that people don't continue to play for the actual game itself. You see, most of the people that still play, do so because they enjoy playing with the friends they have made in the game or their RL friends that play with them. They don't play for "leet gear" or "uber pvp". The people that quit and bash WoW are the people who would hop guilds and backstab their "friends" in order to get that "uber new purple." Eventually they run out of people who want to play with them, get bored and quit. Thinking they were awesome at the game because they conqured end game content, all the while, missing the entire point of an MMO.Aion's fate will be decided once it's released. Everyone is super excited for it, but it rings an all too familiar bell with me. - "AoC will be awesome and will be the downfall of WoW. It has better gameplay and better graphics." AoC comes out and flops.- "OMG WAR is everything that's good with WoW + more!!! It will be the end of WoW" WAR comes out and flops. The only good thing that came of those games were ideas that WoW would later incorporate into WoW. The main problem is that games push to release before they are actually complete and then they fail to live up to the hype they built. Most people that play WoW aren't what the internet tough guys consider "elite" or "hard core". They are your average "joe newb" and probably weren't playing WoW the first few months when WoW would crash every day and servers were down for weeks at a time. They are spoiled with the fact that they never had to sit through a beggining phase of a game when the bugs are being ironed out. So they test new games out and find that they have a ton of bugs, their social ties are missing and the game has severe balance issues. Bashing another game doesn't make you cool. Beacuse you play or don't play a certian game, doesn't make you cool. Playing FPS doesn't mean you're cooler than MMO players because you "have to aim". That's like comparing a basketball player to a football player. Two completely different skill sets. Same goes for RTS or TBS or any other type of game. Play what games you enjoy and stop thinking you're special because you like/dislike certian things. FYI to you kids who "don't like what's popular or trendy". That's a trend/fad in itself.[/citation]

There's bashing, like there's fair criticism. There's blind worshipping like there's fair praising. While you bring up some good points, you are also acting unnecessarily defensively, like almost everyone playing WoW, towards people criticizing that game. Your point about past WoW players who quited that may be blindy bashing that game also stands for people actually playing blindly protecting it.

It's not about being "cool" or not. It's not about it being popular to bash something successful. It's more about something that is that successful inevitably becomes annoying, more so when there's always a fanboy on your back telling to say no evil about their beloved game, to a point where it's clear their mind is biased. It's clearly patologic. The same phenomenen can be seen around consoles fanboyism, there's absolutely no logic around those behaviors.

Want to know the main reason why people are bashing on WoW? Simply because the majority of them are probabely people who played and enjoyed Warcraft, Diablo and Starcraft, but just can't swallow WoW, for obvious reason. And what Blizzard has done in the almost past 10 years? Nothing besides WoW reaching. This is the main reason for bashing Blizzard or WoW. I think this is justified.
 
@theholylancer

You can easily have a stable community in FPS games, though it can be difficult. Also, name changes are not always a click away. Look at Xbox live FPS. If you want a name change, you A. Pay to have it changed or B. Get a new account. I once played a smaller scale FPS called Legends of Might and Magic, made by 3DO. The company went under and all of the servers were removed. Though the community, the game lived on for quite some time though (multiple years). The community of gamers that played it (~200) even created a HQ website and had multiple tournements of all different scales. Clan matches were very common, and there were even clan standings. Though I agree, in most cases, it is difficult to establish a strong sense of community outside of your own guild in FPS games.

MMOs can easily be balanced for PvP. The only reason that they are not always done so properly is because of the simple fact that PvEers outnumber hardcore PvPers that REALLY care about PvP. If you look at WoW for example, that has drawn a large number of both groups, there are WAY more people that play for the PvE aspect than the PvP (granetd WoW PvP is lacking). In order to balance an MMO for PvP, you have to design the game to be soley PvP. Balancing for PvP is also very difficult. The only way to truely balance PvP at all levels, is to balance at the 1v1 level. Doing this creates very little distinction across races/classes, which most people find boring and is a major complaint of WoW PvP (every class has every ability now-a-days, no classes have their staple move).

You could also easily create attachement to RTS if you were to be able to level up your characters througout games. I would venture to say that a lot of people grew to love Illidan/Arthas or any of the other playable heroes through WC3. The thing is, this could cause balance issues when it comes to competitive play.

Anyway, I don't know who your post was directed at. I guess you were trying to say that every game is played differently, have different aspects that make them fun, and you shouldn't expect everyone to like the same thing?
 
[citation][nom]n3ard3ath[/nom]There's bashing, like there's fair criticism. There's blind worshipping like there's fair praising. While you bring up some good points, you are also acting unnecessarily defensively, like almost everyone playing WoW, towards people criticizing that game. Your point about past WoW players who quited that may be blindy bashing that game also stands for people actually playing blindly protecting it.It's not about being "cool" or not. It's not about it being popular to bash something successful. It's more about something that is that successful inevitably becomes annoying, more so when there's always a fanboy on your back telling to say no evil about their beloved game, to a point where it's clear their mind is biased. It's clearly patologic. The same phenomenen can be seen around consoles fanboyism, there's absolutely no logic around those behaviors.Want to know the main reason why people are bashing on WoW? Simply because the majority of them are probabely people who played and enjoyed Warcraft, Diablo and Starcraft, but just can't swallow WoW, for obvious reason. And what Blizzard has done in the almost past 10 years? Nothing besides WoW reaching. This is the main reason for bashing Blizzard or WoW. I think this is justified.[/citation]

You're right, there will always be bashing and fanboy worshiping. That doesn't mean that it is right or justifiable. They are both extremes of what normal people call criticism and praising. Granted, trolling on both ends is becoming the rule, rather than the exception these days.

Also, on a side note, I never claimed to play WoW. In fact, I haven’t played WoW in quite some time. I’ll probably check out the new expansion when it comes out, but doubt that I will keep playing for an extended period of time. Like many people, I grew bored with WoW’s remodeled bosses and reused fights. And the thing is, I wouldn’t consider responding to someone else’s bashings as “blindly protecting” something. I react the exact same way when people go on about how great and wonderful wow is. WoW hasn’t done a whole lot of new things. IMO most of WoW’s success comes from the fact that they take ideas that work from other games, and drop the things that don’t work. Some people call that “stealing” while others would call it “evolution”. A lot of “hardcore” gamers dislike the fact that Blizzard has catered to casuals so much in WoW (which is another stupid thing that “elite” gamers say).

I understand why people bash WoW, but I don’t feel it’s justified or even accurate. They attack WoW for the things they dislike about the game. Things that thousands, if not millions, of other people actually like about the game. They think because they dislike something, it is wrong. They also attack WoW because of Blizz business decision to milk it for the cash cow it is. There’s a saying that goes, if something isn’t broke, don’t fix it. If WoW is making a ton money, doesn’t it make sense to keep developing on it? It’s obviously not a flaw in the game that makes it so popular, nor is it a flaw in the game that’s at fault for other games flow development. The designers for WoW are a completely different group of people than those working on D3 or SC2.

IN FACT, one could argue that without WoW’s success, Blizzard would not have had the ability to tackle 3-4 different games at once. It is probably more BECAUSE of WoW’s that we will be seeing new titles of BOTH the Diablo and Starcraft franchise in the near future, and not just 1.

Hating something because others like it is about as illogical, if not more so, than loving something to the point of fanboism. The bashers and the fanboy worshipers are one in the same.
 
What I try to figure out is why people post on this to complain about WoW. There are still millions of people playing, and I don't think anyone (including myself and my 6 coworkers who play) is going to stop playing because someone says "I can't believe people play WoW, or pay for WoW, or OMG RPG's are teh fail, play FPS." And the other factor is, in all the MMORPG hating, how people don't think that the average WoW gamer doesn't play other games!? Half of my guild on US-Eitrigg (Pick Up Groups, first in server on progression till we died...) would play L4D several times a week, and we all played COD4 numerous nights, and STILL had time to clear everything before everyone else. Stop hating on the millions of people who play, go do something else and stop wasting your breath.
 
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